NV - 59 Dead, over 500 injured in Mandalay Bay shooting in Las Vegas, 1 Oct 2017 #2

[Gooddeeds]

From my understanding, which could be wrong of course, he had one on a food cart outside his room, and then others inside his room.



http://abcnews.go.com/US/las-vegas-massacre/story?id=50246458


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***possibly monitoring approaching LE coming to his room***
That takes effort, and grandiose plans. In the event someone approached his room, let’s say housekeeping...who knows what he had planned for various possible scenarios. Scary!!!

 

[Mellowmelly]

I'm so sorry for the needless loss of life, my thoughts are with the victims loved ones. This tragedy reminds me of a film I once watched, many years ago , too long ago for me to remember the name but it was at some kind of sports stadium , presumably a baseball game and a man just starts randomly firing a gun at the spectators, it was a chilling film. What happened in Las Vegas is so similar it makes me wonder could this have been a kind of copycat of the film ? . My theory is, he's lost everything and he's planning to end it all but decides he's going to take many people with him. He's clearly a very psychopathic creature and it makes me wonder if his girlfriend knew what he was planning, hence her leaving the country.

 

[Springrain]

Here are some articles about what to do in the case of an active shooter. Please keep this all in mind. It could be anyone that gets in harm's way.

http://publicsafety.med.miami.edu/em...active-shooter

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graph...activeshooter/

https://sofrep.com/active-shooter/

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/san-ber...ter-protocols/

http://www.businessinsider.com/what-...hooter-2016-11

 

[Only4Justice]

I don't think it's possible with 100% guarantees. If this killer had died just five years earlier, if he'd been run over by a truck last week, we'd never have known he would do this.

I think the most that can be done is risk assessments with tendencies, but not guarantees. Perhaps 1 in 1000 of a certain type might follow through, others might want to but won't do it, others will end up in prison younger in life for another crime and won't ever have the opportunity or they will get out and gravitate to a different crime that will either kill them or leave them locked up again, never having committed the mass murder.

But the vast majority would 'settle' for satiating their appetite in some other way, as I surmise this murderer used hunting for years to satiate his appetite.

We've also got different types of mass killers, even if you break them down into categories with similarities in each category, I believe there's more than one category.

The category I would currently put this murderer into, I would say commonalities would likely be indifference to the suffering of others, hurting animals with indifference to their pain and even enjoyment of that pain. They may learn that they shouldn't show the enjoyment and try to keep that inside. For this one I think hunting has been a good cover for him, it's something where it wouldn't be abnormal to show pleasure at the kill and pride at ones skills. Aside from animals, probably indifference to the suffering of humans, starting young with siblings and young playmates, and sometimes causing them pain, though they may learn to do the causing out of sight and it might be that another playmate/sibling would run out of the room crying but not want to explain what happened?

Whether it leads to mass murder or serial murder, or not, I would consider that a very problematic 'psychopathy' that could easily end up festering and escalating in future.

I think the key might not be so much a total focus on those who do end up as mass or serial murderers but finding the types and then looking at what happens to those who don't....what happens in their lives and their dealings with people? Are they more prone to forming abusive relationships (psychological or physical abuse) when they form relationships. We know this one has 2 ex-wives. There are other 'types' who probably won't form close relationships that lead to marriage, though, so every serial/mass murderer won't have commonality with all others. And then you have things like political terrorism (race, religion, etc) and they will likely have quite different backgrounds and minds.

Perhaps it's possible to intervene and prevent some of those bad relationships by educating everyone to the signs to look out for so that spouses can avoid...but they might not see the signs until after the actual marriage, and then it can be hard to get out quick enough. I think a lot of the parents will make excuses for the children who show the signs.

And I don't know that this murderer's type is curable.

If I had a child that showed no empathy to living beings (animal or human) I would be extremely concerned and I would want them to see a child psychologist, but I don't think there's always a cure for it, I think in some cases the individual might just learn covering tactics.

Thank you for this insightful post. [emoji177]


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[coffeeandacig]

Exactly. People just love conspiracy theories. If windows aren't broken on the 4th floor, then nobody was shooting through those windows.

People could have seen reflections in the windows of those white hot brass coming down from above.
No one has mentioned tracer bullets being used...but they too would illuminate the floors below.

And a question...
Has anyone seen anything in MSM about a machine shop being found yet on any of his properties to modify to fully automatic?

 

[Gooddeeds]

She was not a POI in the actual shooting. They ruled her out early on after confirming her whereabouts. She is a POI in relation to things before the shooting... because of everything they have found in the car and house(s). jmo

-Do you mean *not a POI* as far as her not being there shooting along side him? If LE was specific on that I missed it.

 

[Mellowmelly]

I would not be surprised if Stephen Paddock is an injustice collector. That is what characterizes rampage killers and terrorists. of course this is too early to tell. We should hear more in the coming days.

Dr. Mary Ellen O'Toole was on television. She stated that Stephen Paddock likely planned it for a while.

The Dangerous Injustice Collector: Behaviors of Someone Who Never Forgets, Never Forgives, Never Lets Go, and Strikes Back!
http://online.liebertpub.com/doi/pdf/10.1089/vio.2014.1509

Psychology of Terrorism - National Criminal Justice Reference Service
https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/nij/grants/208552.PDF

On Wound Collectors
https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/spycatcher/201509/wound-collectors

Murderous Envy
https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/keeping-kids-safe/200905/murderous-envy

Injustice Collectors
http://www.psybersquare.com/family/family_injustice.html

1.) Injustice Collectors are convinced that they are never wrong. How is it possible that they are never wrong? It is simple: They are always right.

2.) Injustice Collectors never apologize. Ever. For anything.

3.) Injustice Collectors truly believe that they are morally and ethically superior to others and that others chronically do not hold themselves to the same high standards as the injustice collector does.

4.) Injustice Collectors make the rules, break the rules and enforce the rules of the family. They are a combined legislator, police, and judge and jury of

5.) Injustice Collectors never worry about what is wrong with themselves as their "bad list" grows. Their focus is always on the failings of others.

6.) Injustice Collectors are never upset by the disparity of their rules for others with their own expectations of themselves.

7.) Injustice Collectors rationalize their own behavior with great ease and comfort.

Here are more with 20 characteristics
http://www.lisaescott.com/forum/2009/11/25/are-they-injustice-collector

Characteristics of Injustice Collectors

1. Injustice collectors are never wrong. How is it possible that they are never wrong? It's simple: They are always right.

2. Injustice collectors never apologize. Ever. For anything.

3. Injustice collectors truly believe they are morally and ethically superior to others and that others seem incapable of holding themselves to the same high standards as the injustice collector does.

4. Injustice collectors make the rules, break the rules and enforce the rules of the family. They are a combination of legislator, police, judge and jury to those they consider their subjects. They forever banish from their kingdom any subject they deem disloyal, and only grant clemency if there is sufficient (in their eyes) contrition.

5. Injustice collectors never worry about what is wrong with them as their "bad" list grows. Their focus is always on the failings of others.

6. Injustice collectors are never troubled by the disparity between their rules for others and their own expectations of themselves. Injustice collectors rationalize their own behavior with great ease and comfort.

7. Injustice collectors have an external orientation; the problem always exists in the world, outside of themselves, and in their view, the world would be an acceptable place if their rules and standards were followed at all times.

8. Injustice collectors do not have a capacity for remorse, empathy or guilt.

9. Injustice collectors scoff at the idea of therapy, therapists, self-help books, and other tools used by people who struggle to live with them.

10. The phrase "walking on eggshells" describes life with an injustice collector.

11. The IC (injustice Collector) will prey upon your weaknesses to frame all issues in their terms.

12. IC's will always cry foul when you are 'mean' to them and accuse you of being nasty when you are confronting them with their negative behavior.

13. They are titanically insecure and cannot trust anyone. All relationships they have, even with their own parents and children and trustless and must be reinforced by subordination over and over.

14. They can only strengthen relationships through imprisoning their mates and banning behaviors and other relationships. Friends and family are a huge threat to the IC.

15. They must repetitively revisit situations where you service them, give in to them and agree with them. They will over time shrink your world to a small plot of empty activities that only they like. They are terrified of travel, meeting new people, understanding new concepts and paroling you from any punishment they have previously 'convicted' you of.

16. They do not care about you at all, they care about aggrandizing themselves with you as an assistant producer.

17. They will occasionally do something for you, but if you are not completely brainwashed, it will be a negative experience for you in the end. Example is throwing you a birthday party. I guarantee you will not have fun at your own party.

18. They will force you to choose between them and other things you like or love. The more you choose them, the more they will make you choose them over and over. They do not understand the concept of loyalty at all.

19. Hypocrisy is their modus operandi for debating and arguing with you. Everything they say about you is true about them. (aka Projection) It makes it so you try to 'win' fights by getting them to agree with you, which they never can because their whole position is false.

20. Your life will disappear into their lives. Your hopes and dreams will fade, even in your own mind. You will eat what they want, you will watch what they want on TV, you will vacation where they want, or not at all.

Identifying The Next Mass Murderer—Before It’s Too Late
https://www.psychologytoday.com/blo...ntifying-the-next-mass-murderer-it-s-too-late

On June 17, 2015, according to authorities, Dylann Storm Roof (link is external) walked into the Emanuel
African Methodist Episcopal Church in Charleston, South Carolina, sat down, and after an hour or so allegedly shot three men and six women, attending a bible study class. Immediately people began to take sides, and not just about the gun debate. Was this an act of terror? Was this a hate crime? Was this a “lone wolf?” Was this a conspiracy? On and on. What is interesting as well as frustrating is that none of these terms serve a useful purpose.

Four years ago, on July 22, 2011, Anders Behring Breivik set off a bomb near the government headquarters of the Labor Party in Oslo, Norway; after which he proceeded to the secluded island of Utøya, where he methodically killed, with a high powered rifle, 65 plus children attending a youth event. Does it matter if we call Anders Behring Breivik a terrorist, mass murderer, or a lone wolf? Not really, only one thing matters: how did he become this way, and were there signs that could have prevented this horrendous tragedy?

Once again we face a mass murder (FBI defined as 4 or more) and we need to get past the debate over the nomenclature (terrorist, extremist, mass murderer, lone wolf, genocide, etc.)—that serves no prophylactic purpose. When it comes to Dylann Storm Roof, Anders Behring Breivik, the Boston Marathon Bombers, or the likes of Theodore John "Ted" Kaczynski known as the UNABOMBER, and Timothy McVeigh, it’s not what we call them, the issue is: could we have prevented their acts? The answer is yes. And yet, we seem to be incapacitated when we hear the term “lone wolf” or “solo terrorist” as if we were describing a demon beyond our capability to identify and stop.

From the article.
Narcissistic Traits
Paranoid Ideation
Passionate Hatred
Wound Collectors
Communication
Violence as Magic
Isolation
The Lethal Cocktail
Acting Out

Examples Of Injustice Collector
Andrew Kehoe
Charles Whitman
Jim Jones
James Huberty
George Hennard
Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nichols
Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold
Osama bin Laden
9/11 Terrorists
Seung-Hui Cho
Anders Breivik
Adam Lanza
Tamerlan and Dzhokhar Tsarnaev
Aaron Alexis
Elliot Rodger
Vester Flanagan
Chris Mercer
Omar Mateen

They are mostly mass killers and terrorists. There are plenty of non-mass killers or killers who target a person they know who are injustice collectors.
Gertrude Baniszewski
John Wayne Gacy
David Berkowitz
Betty Broderick
Dora Cisneros
Lori Drew
Jodi Arias
Casey Anthony
Yoselyn Ortega
Michelle Carter

It is too early to know if Stephen Paddock was a chronic complainer.

Websleuth Radio Interview Tina Meier
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/websleuths/2013/09/30/tricias-true-crime-radio-adult-cyber-bullying

Starting at the 20:40 mark from September 2013 Websleuths Radio Interview. Tina Meier, Megan Meier's mother, is describing Lori Drew as a very talkative person who complained nonstop. She is described as a very unhappy and bitter person in a unhappy marriage. Drew wanted everyone to know her plight and suffering in life. Meier's description of Drew is typical of an injustice collector. Meier's description of Drew probably describes Stephen Paddock. Meier's description describes Omar Mateen, Mohamed Atta, Osama bin Laden, Mohamed Lahouaiej Bouhlel, Elliot Rodger, Adam Lanza, Eric Harris, Andrew Kehoe, Vester Flanagan, Yoselyn Ortega, and Jodi Arias. We should hear more about him later in the coming days.

Elliot Rodger: An Analysis
https://schoolshooters.info/sites/default/files/rodger_analysis_2.0.pdf

From the article.
Beyond his entitlement, lack of empathy, and sadism, Rodger was also what the FBI report on school shooters labeled an “injustice collector.” This was described as follows: “The student nurses resentment over real or perceived injustices. No matter how much time has passed, the “injustice collector” will not forget or forgive those wrongs or the people he or she believes are responsible” (O’Toole, 2000, 17). Rodger went through life accumulating a sense of having been wronged by women; he nursed his resentment until it drove him to murder. Such resentment appears to be a product of his narcissism — as he was quoted above, “How dare they” not give him the love and adoration he deserved.

A typical Narcissist, it's scary to think about as there are so many of them about.

 

[rsd1200]

The Mandalay Bay should expect a lawsuit very soon, If people think that the Kennecka Jenkin's case warrants one, this certainly does.

Shooter had cameras OUTSIDE of room to film LE responding according to Sheriff Lombardo as well as inside his room. How could they be that inept not to see him putting up cameras outside of his room with all the surveillance that exists in Las Vegas.

I don't think that the KJ case warrants a law suit, fwiw, but SP didn't hang cameras all throughout the hotel. He sat one on a dining cart, outside of his room, from what I've read in the media. He was in a suite, that encompassed a corner of that floor of the hotel, ad had two entrances to himself, and a third entrance across from him was a staircase. Who is going to notice a food cart sitting there? I never do. The motel was probably pretty empty with 20k+ people at a concert below. He probably ordered a meal earlier, and then rolled the empty cart out into the hall, after putting a wifi cam on it, right before he began shooting, so he could see when LE got close. He filmed himself shooting too. The hotel had no way of stopping him from doing either of those things.

http://dfw.cbslocal.com/2017/10/03/vegas-gunman-camera/

 

[popsicle]

[video=twitter;915337288049217536]https://twitter.com/fox6now/status/915337288049217536[/video]

 

[barcode]

I don't think that the KJ case warrants a law suit, fwiw, but SP didn't hang cameras all throughout the hotel. He sat one on a dining cart, outside of his room, from what I've read in the media. He was in a suite, that encompassed a corner of that floor of the hotel, ad had two entrances to himself, and a third entrance across from him was a staircase. Who is going to notice a food cart sitting there? I never do. The motel was probably pretty empty with 20k+ people at a concert below. He probably ordered a meal earlier, and then rolled the empty cart out into the hall, after putting a wifi cam on it, right before he began shooting, so he could see when LE got close. He filmed himself shooting too. The hotel had no way of stopping him from doing either of those things.

http://dfw.cbslocal.com/2017/10/03/vegas-gunman-camera/

Yeah I agree if that is the case, I have at least three links that say plural, cameras outside of room, so yeah if it does only turn out to be one in a foodcart, I agree, also I do not think a LS is warranted in KJ's case.

The gunman who attacked a Las Vegas country music festival installed cameras outside his hotel room, including at least one in a room service cart, to watch for the approach of police officers, Clark County Sheriff Joe Lombardo said Tuesday.

 

[popsicle]

[video=twitter;915320381250183169]https://twitter.com/NBCNightlyNews/status/915320381250183169[/video]

 

[MissNightshade]

Has anyone posted his suicide photo yet? My data has slowed down and I can't check previous pages. I have the photo. Is it against group rules to post that kind of gore in here?

 

[popsicle]

[FONT=&quot]Authorities are investigating whether Stephen Paddock rented several units at a luxury high-rise overlooking a bigger music festival the weekend before he slaughtered concert-goers outside a Las Vegas casino, a law enforcement source told NBC News.

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]...the condo complex overlooked the main stage for the three-day Life is Beautiful festival held Sept. 22-24 and featuring big musical names like Chance the Rapper, Lorde and Wiz Khalifa. An estimated 50,000 fans attended each day.

link[/FONT]

 

[rsd1200]

What exactly is normal? If being not highly social isn't normal, then a lot of people aren't normal. Vast majority of them won't go on killing rampages.

That was the point I was trying to make but probably didn't. I'm not a social butterfly but don't dislike being with friends, or going out w/my better half. I'm what is called an extroverted introvert. I have to recharge my batteries, alone, after socializing. I might be seen as outside the norm by others, but I just as well may see some of them as outside the norm too. It's all about perspective. It doesn't mean we are all going to turn out like SP.

 

[popsicle]

Has anyone posted his suicide photo yet? My data has slowed down and I can't check previous pages. I have the photo. Is it against group rules to post that kind of gore in here?

I don't think so but I have seen it. The face picture, right?

 

[rsd1200]

-My thoughts on the GF and LE. They may have *strategically* said ‘not a POI’. I can’t imagine they would rule ‘her’ out that quickly being as she is in a live-in relationship with him and an employee of the Mandalay. In addition to the cards he used in her name, funds going overseas to her, and the amount of items found at the shared home (s). In my opinion, at this point in time she is clearly a POI regardless if she ultimately is or isn’t.

I agree. They want her to come back. Nothing says she has to come back here.

 

[FlossyMay]

I would suggest posting a link with a warning. I think giving people a choice whether they want to see it is the best way to go for something like that. (My quote thingie is acting up again....sorry.)

 

[Spice]

Hilarious coming from a MSM outlet where so much fake news starts. Absolutely hilarious.

The Washington Post is hardly fake news. It is considered a more than reputable journalism source. Believing that a reputable MSM such as the Washington Post is what enables fake news and misinformation to spread, which creates chaos, paranoia, and sadly a misinformed public. Which is not hilarious. It's actually really dangerous. But Okay.

IMO

 

[enelram]

I agree. They want her to come back. Nothing says she has to come back here.

evening news just said "the FBI has said they are making sure she gets on a plane to come back to Vegas on Wed."
Sounds like she may have an FBI escort or two.
My guess this is why she's now called a POI, she may not have been too co-operative to return otherwise. Just reading between the lines here.

 

[bears10]

I’m not sure if this has been posted before but earlier someone asked what his federal job was. Apparently he worked for USPS and the IRS.

https://www.google.com/amp/nypost.c...iller-once-worked-as-a-mailman-irs-agent/amp/