NV - 59 Dead, over 500 injured in Mandalay Bay shooting in Las Vegas, 1 Oct 2017 #9

[canadiangirl]

I'm pretty sure that dust is from the breaching explosive used to blow open that door. Though it still remains unclear why that door needed to be breached.

That's my thoughts too. You can see the dust on the floor

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[dizzychick]

Well, there's usually a bit of a jerk when you put a gun in your mouth. The report did mention the bullet trajectory, cannot remember exactly the track and I'm trying to bore my way out of it having not fully digested it.. I am nowhere near complete - I don't know what the questions are, exactly.
But theres loads of info on forensic websites on the varieties of body movements following self inflicted head shots via the oral cavity..
It can be answered by googling likely outcome of bullet path as described in report.
it cannot be guessed though.

would you expect to see clean bullet casings on top of that old dried blood clot? Sorry for the visual ...just seems fishy to me like the cops were not careful walking around the crime scene and may have kicked the shells? That will be the excuse if they are called out on it.

 

[CoolJ]

BBM
Clark County Coroner, John Fudenberg

Compare the 1st leaked photo to those in the 81 page FIT report. Is that really SP in both? :thinking:

Was John Fudenberg a close friend of Paddock? How could he identify the body?

 

[dizzychick]

a hotel is so sophisticated it can tell when deadbolt locks are engaged or disengaged but they failed to install cameras in the hallways of each floor leading to the rooms? bull malarkey

 

[canadiangirl]

a hotel is so sophisticated it can tell when deadbolt locks are engaged or disengaged but they failed to install cameras in the hallways of each floor leading to the rooms? bull malarkey

Haha this is my thoughts too. Remember questioning the cameras? No cameras in the hallways. Too expensive

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[kittythehare]

Kitty I haven’t been able to keep up with your questions to us directly, but I want to so bare with me until I can. In regards to the one on how we feel about the report-I agree the report is detailed and scripted well as far as documentation. Then I come back to the point of Accuracy. I’m stuck...how can it be viewed as a job well done when there are missing pieces...key pieces...and conflicting accounts? I’m not asking you to agree with me, I am writing out loud to myself.

Fair enough..
There are missing pieces. this is true. but we were told it was incomplete as well as know it is incomplete.
For a start, this is only the police report.. there are about 100 other reports to follow.. every relevant body must make a full report..
It is missing vital elements, for a police report..
what time was LE informed, by the hotel that there was an emergency.
Who made the 999 call and was it recorded?
who called emergency medical services/
who else was informed.
what time were they informed and how did their various duties progress and what problems did they experience gaining access to victims?
We know the numbers of the dead.. we also know that lay people did a lot of the first aid work that night.
We do not know who was saved or who perished as a result of the medical attention they did or did not receive that night.

We know parts of the report were redacted, parts withheld- warrants-10 pages..pending a federal investigation.

common sense would dictate that if the feds didn't get it in 4 months, they never will and it may actually be a red herring..

However if the investigation is something like an Intl paedo ring, 4 months is not excessive.

I think it may be a mistake to be comparing the leaked photos, which caused chaos, with the photos in the report..

The photos in the report, particularly of Paddock tell us nothing, out of focus and with poor enough colour reproduction.

i think the call time to instigate the major emergency plan is being fudged to benefit the hotel group.
I'm not sure which other aspects are inaccurate.. only that some conflict with early information we received.

In the report it states that Campos informed hotel that he had been wounded. In one of two calls he made to them. So they knew, yet he remained on watch.. it was hotel that stopped his interview with Hannity and Co.. he was ready to go on.

This led to him being regarded in many circles as a suspect.
The final report will have many thousand photographs..

 

[kittythehare]

would you expect to see clean bullet casings on top of that old dried blood clot? Sorry for the visual ...just seems fishy to me like the cops were not careful walking around the crime scene and may have kicked the shells? That will be the excuse if they are called out on it.

I'd expect to see it on 4chan and alex jones and crap sites like that who are hungry to upset as many people as possible. Fact is that from actual photos in report, there is little to be seen at all..

We have not been informed who leaked the photos or who took them.. or who had access or how long after the event they were taken. none of them were timestamped. Likewise we do not know what time Paddock's body was removed from room, though there seems to be no good reason to obscure that information either.

 

[CARIIS]

Haha this is my thoughts too. Remember questioning the cameras? No cameras in the hallways. Too expensive

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yet in the report they carry on in detail about all his trips with bags to his room!! what is it 26000 hours of video after 4 months of their are no cameras anywhere.

This is about so much more than lawsuits its a huge entity -- cost of doing business.

This is big political evil terror mobster corrupt sleazy --racketeering at its finest.

 

[kittythehare]

Well, it's good to hear that he also thinks Paddock acted alone. I agree with most of what he said. I did have to LOL at the interviewer who asked him if he thought Antifa was involved. :facepalm: Was that really a theory? I've been to some rallies myself, but can assure you I'm not associated with a terrorist group.

that's always a theory.. hashtag blame antifa. I am antifa - I am anti fascism.
Thousands and thousands of people are antifa, but they are not militant groups operating under the umbrella of antifa.. and are not considered terrorists.

 

[CARIIS]

That's my thoughts too. You can see the dust on the floor

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the insane part is heavy things on top of the dust in a lot of places -- staged -- and badly!!

 

[CARIIS]

BBM
Clark County Coroner, John Fudenberg

Compare the 1st leaked photo to those in the 81 page FIT report. Is that really SP in both? :thinking:

play around with Fudenberg on line - a sleazy politician just like sheriff.

he has been breaking laws -- hiding stuff gotten in trouble has stuff going to the supreme court of the usa cause of his junk

he is a politician and not a certified anything he is a politician just like lombardo this is sleazy stuff !!!

he is elected also

 

[CARIIS]

People on the ground reportedly smelled a strong odor of gunpowder so it must have been strong wherever the shooter was.

Does it even make sense that there was a strong smell of gunpowder, what was it , 1000 ft away?

It makes sense with snipers at 20 feet above ground!!!! From 3000 feet and 32 floors up kinda a stretch!!!!

 

[cujenn81]

Fair enough..
There are missing pieces. this is true. but we were told it was incomplete as well as know it is incomplete.
For a start, this is only the police report.. there are about 100 other reports to follow.. every relevant body must make a full report..
It is missing vital elements, for a police report..
what time was LE informed, by the hotel that there was an emergency.
Who made the 999 call and was it recorded?
who called emergency medical services/
who else was informed.
what time were they informed and how did their various duties progress and what problems did they experience gaining access to victims?
We know the numbers of the dead.. we also know that lay people did a lot of the first aid work that night.
We do not know who was saved or who perished as a result of the medical attention they did or did not receive that night.

We know parts of the report were redacted, parts withheld- warrants-10 pages..pending a federal investigation.

common sense would dictate that if the feds didn't get it in 4 months, they never will and it may actually be a red herring..

However if the investigation is something like an Intl paedo ring, 4 months is not excessive.

I think it may be a mistake to be comparing the leaked photos, which caused chaos, with the photos in the report..

The photos in the report, particularly of Paddock tell us nothing, out of focus and with poor enough colour reproduction.

i think the call time to instigate the major emergency plan is being fudged to benefit the hotel group.
I'm not sure which other aspects are inaccurate.. only that some conflict with early information we received.

In the report it states that Campos informed hotel that he had been wounded. In one of two calls he made to them. So they knew, yet he remained on watch.. it was hotel that stopped his interview with Hannity and Co.. he was ready to go on.

This led to him being regarded in many circles as a suspect.
The final report will have many thousand photographs..

The 911 calls are something I haven't thought about until now (which surprises me). IIRC, at least a portion of the initial 911 calls have been released fairly quickly for every other mass shooting in recent history. I know that I remember hearing he calls for the Colorado movie theater shooting and the shooting at Pulse not long after they occurred. There was even a good amount of LE body camera footage released after the shooting at Pulse. As far as I know, there hasn't been a single 911 call released in regards to this shooting though. Does anyone know for sure?


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[kittythehare]

yet in the report they carry on in detail about all his trips with bags to his room!! what is it 26000 hours of video after 4 months of their are no cameras anywhere.

This is about so much more than lawsuits its a huge entity -- cost of doing business.

This is big political evil terror mobster corrupt sleazy --racketeering at its finest.

wheres the evidence? Anybody can say anything about anything but without digging out the actual evidence from reputable sources it is only talk.

This looks to be the handiwork of a complete nutjob, without rhyme or reason..
Nothing that suggests otherwise has a solid base on reality.
It simply does not pan out as a working theory because it lacks substantiation..

There is no reason to believe that anybody but deranged Paddock did this for his own warped reasons. The dead are dead and the wounded and traumatised remain wounded and traumatised, many possibly without recourse to legal or financial assistance. To pursue their questions, get answers.. know what went wrong with the management of an event of that size to the extent that that qty of hardware was permitted entry to a high up hotel room where it's operator was free to carry out a mass murder, apparently without a political motive, so it cannot be classed as terrorism.

Could more people have been saved?
What circumstances were responsible?

It's an awful awful thing to take in and difficult to integrate.. the slaughter of innocents and innocence..
PULSE, by contrast was handled so much better that there is no comparison..

 

[mpnola]

the insane part is heavy things on top of the dust in a lot of places -- staged -- and badly!!

Wait... what heavy things were on top of dust in a lot of places? I must have missed that. If you remember where you saw that, I would like to see.

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[kittythehare]

I have a question.
we need the forensics on the glass.

Were the holes in the windows made in stages or did the first bust of the glass with whatever implement or methodology was used create the holes we see in all the photos?
I want to see the autopsy of his lungs.
and figure out whether he stopped shooting because the fumes killed him or exacerbated an existing medical or allergic condition?

Were there any reports of him sticking his head out the broken window for air?
How much ventilation would the broken windows provide for the smoke and fume filled room? enough to alleviate his rapidly progressing distress or not enough to do anything at all?
Need Paddock's autopsy.. concerned to see a tweet earlier from doug poppa stating he had asked the coroner for it and was given no information and that is the protocol the coroner will be adapting, until he says different..

I appreciate there are zillions of civil cases going on but I fail to see why they should serve to seal information that should be available to all and sundry. They should have no effect whatsoever on the investigation or the manner in which information is being dissiminated.(spell it?)
It looks very much as though they are..

 

[kittythehare]

The 911 calls are something I haven't thought about until now (which surprises me). IIRC, at least a portion of the initial 911 calls have been released fairly quickly for every other mass shooting in recent history. I know that I remember hearing he calls for the Colorado movie theater shooting and the shooting at Pulse not long after they occurred. There was even a good amount of LE body camera footage released after the shooting at Pulse. As far as I know, there hasn't been a single 911 call released in regards to this shooting though. Does anyone know for sure?


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I don't know for sure but I know and discussed extensively in the early threads about how important that time was in a major disaster plan.. And Sheriff Lombardo balked at giving that information at every turn.
They cannot even contemplate ever completing a final report until that time, hour minute and second is stamped everywhere loud and clear.. from it stems all subsequent actions.
A highly funded sWAT team or a bit of a swat team took over an hour to get onsite.
That is not reassuring information for the general public and if there are anomalies, that department will find themselves shredded.
BUT, if it is a thing that Paddock knew it would take that long, how did he know?

 

[canadiangirl]

wheres the evidence? Anybody can say anything about anything but without digging out the actual evidence from reputable sources it is only talk.

This looks to be the handiwork of a complete nutjob, without rhyme or reason..
Nothing that suggests otherwise has a solid base on reality.
It simply does not pan out as a working theory because it lacks substantiation..

There is no reason to believe that anybody but deranged Paddock did this for his own warped reasons. The dead are dead and the wounded and traumatised remain wounded and traumatised, many possibly without recourse to legal or financial assistance. To pursue their questions, get answers.. know what went wrong with the management of an event of that size to the extent that that qty of hardware was permitted entry to a high up hotel room where it's operator was free to carry out a mass murder, apparently without a political motive, so it cannot be classed as terrorism.

Could more people have been saved?
What circumstances were responsible?

It's an awful awful thing to take in and difficult to integrate.. the slaughter of innocents and innocence..
PULSE, by contrast was handled so much better that there is no comparison..

IMO he did not act alone. I don't know the details of course but I just have a nagging feeling it's not just some lone nut job as you put it.

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[CARIIS]

listening to poppa

amazed it seems so many think the report was this awesome thing

I think tho it is cause of my infatuation with reading for 4 decades, all the NTSB reports!

There reports are reports!!!

WIth zero agenda!!

 

[kittythehare]

IMO he did not act alone. I don't know the details of course but I just have a nagging feeling it's not just some lone nut job as you put it.

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I honestly cannot see a situation where the entire fBI would put their reputations on the line to protect any other interest, government or otherwise.
The entire report would have to be a lie.
That would be the highest scale of collusion possible among state and semi-state bodies.
And the payoff is way too miniscule for a collaboration on this scale.

It is possible. anything is possible in these days of convoluted reality and nothing should surprise us..

It's easy to talk about this when I don't consider the 58 dead bodies of people intending to return home after a great gig..
when I do I am overcome with an awesome feeling of outrageous raw grief..
I think we are all in a state of chaos again, as a result of this mass execution by somebody who decided he had the right and the wherewithal to JUST DO IT!

I don't know where to go with this discussion any more.. it's a vast field and will go on for years.

If we take our starting point as The Report.. and analyse it thoroughly with copy paste of the bits we are discussing, maybe we can reach a coherence?
A judge needs to decide, it's possibly in the next week, whether it will be permitted to withhold the affidavits on the strength of the alleged ongoing federal investigation
In 2 months, allegedly, fBI may be ready to indict or charge person 2 ..
That takes us into April
Mr Coroner may or may not decide to release Paddock's full autopsy report with photographs/or diagrams..
I cannot, for the life of me imagine what is causing the delay in this.. and I already read all the conspiracy sights claiming Paddock is alive nad they autopsied the wrong man and pointing to a disparity in his height from his driving license. I think I read this one originated from 4chan.. who prey on human misery like vicious vultures