NV NV - Steven T. Koecher, 30, Henderson, 13 Dec 2009 - #11

[laytonian]

They also have a page of services available,Three do window cleaning, and a home based business I found that
does photography. ( pg 57)

http://www.sca-hoa.org/picture/may_spirit_fnal.pdf

Are you thinking he went there, to interview with one of them -- or that he had found a job working for them that weekend? He didn't have any supplies with him, so I'd think it would have to be a job app.

The window washing places:
Two of them aren't anywhere near where the car was parked.
The other is an unlisted phone number.
The photographer's address is in Henderson, but far from SCA.

Ads looking for housesitting or pet sitting might have attracted him.

:banghead:

 

[RubyRed]

Laytonian, Are you referring to the Grapevine Photography on pg 31.

The window cleaning on pg 57, they list phone numbers, where is the unlisted one?

I was just pointing out some of the businesses that advertise for that area. At this point just grasping at straws on why Steven was in the area.

http://www.sca-hoa.org/picture/may_spirit_fnal.pdf

 

[laytonian]

Laytonian, Are you referring to the Grapevine Photography on pg 31.

Yeah; the link I entered shows their address. If you map it, the location is north of I-215 and not in SCA. Unless the guy hasn't changed his website for years.

The window cleaning on pg 57, they list phone numbers, where is the unlisted one?

The third. When you google the first two phone numbers, you see the addresses and can map them.

I was just pointing out some of the businesses that advertise for that area. At this point just grasping at straws on why Steven was in the area.

http://www.sca-hoa.org/picture/may_spirit_fnal.pdf

Me, too. Just brainstorming to see if I can trigger some of my own brain cells. What are we MISSING?

 

[fasteddy4]

Yes, I know, I know, I've been gone for a while. But, if I don't have anything to add that is a new thought or provocative, I just read and don't post. So, I have a something new:

Did any of you catch the show, "Hannibal Unmasked", on MSNBC last night. I would never usually watch that station and that I was home on a Saturday night watching MSNBC is a true indication of my geekdom but there were a couple things that caught my ear that went along with this case.

If you don't know the show, it covers the case of the killer Scott Kimball and how he murdered three young women and an older guy. You all might remember it because he was married to the mother of one of the young women he killed. He was a real piece of. . .. He finally got caught and some of the remains of these women were found and identified. He is in jail now. He totally fooled the FBI to get out of jail by saying he would be a confidential informant. But, he made everything up and the FBI actually went to certain extents to cover this up.

There was something about the entire story that reminded me of Steven's situation and disappearance. Granted, it was three women instead. But, in one case, the girl told her father that she was going with friends to Mexico to explore caves. Instead, and this was not figured out until she disappeared that really she had gone with this Kimball guy and were kiting checks and running up her dad's credit all over Colorado and Utah. Finally, Kimball got tired of her and murdered. But, this was a young girl who was involved with criminals, guys in jail, and her father did not even know. She was totally living a double life.

(For the record, I know how everyone. . .family, PI, friends, etc. . .says Steven would never be mixed up in anything illegal. That's what the family members were saying in this show and we have heard it all before. I think facts would bear out that a majority of people who disappear are wrapped up in something illegal or they know somebody who is.)

Likewise, another of the girl's that Kimball murdered, the one whose mother he married, looked like she had cleaned her act up after being involved in drugs. But, she seemed to be on the right path but she also got involved with Kimball as well and died. In the third woman's case, she was involved was a guy in jail who knew Kimball. Kimball hunted her down. Had a relationship with her and killed her eventually. Her body has never been found.

What I am getting at here is that Kimball was a smooth talker, and I don't just mean with these young women. He fooled the FBI, one of the murdered girl's mothers, and many others just because he had the gift of BS. Like I said, these were three women so it's a bit different. But, these women managed to get themselves involved with some pretty bad lowlifes because these women were desperate and the guy was a smooth talker.

It just seemed similar to Steven's case. "Good guy". Trying to get on the right path. Traveling around a lot, like the one girl was. Parents not suspecting anything other than he was a good guy. Too trusting. Not telling people where he was. Then totally disappearing.

And in Kimball's case, it took them four years to put it all together.

If you haven't seen the show or don't know about it, you should look it up. On top of everything else, Kimball disposed of the bodies in the National Parks of Utah.

A couple more points: Was Steven's car locked when they found it? Maybe that's been stated but I forget. Does that car have a keylees remote or would you have to put the key in the lock to lock and unlock, like old school cars?

Something else: Has anybody checked to see if there were any notable crimes in Overton, Ruby Valley, etc. the days that Steven were in those towns? I am NOT saying Steven did anything. But, I got to thinking that the day he went to Ruby Valley he might have gone to the friend's house because he was killing some time while waiting for somebody else to do something. Like he drove somebody there and waited while they did something. Same thing in Overton. And it could be the reason he left that party early as well. He might have gotten a text that he needed to go.

I also saw in the paper about the body in the motel and the suicide in Sun City Anthem. Bodies in hotels hardly phase me anymore since a bell hop once told me that I would not believe how many suicides occur in Vegas hotels on a daily basis. It would blow me away he said.

 

[Fairy1]

Hi eddy! Great to "see" you!

I'm very familiar with the Kimball case. In fact, I think there's a thread here somewhere on him. He's chilling and I believe he would have continued killing anyone who ever got in his way. A true sociopath, IMO.

 

[rd_jfc]

The closest RTC bus stop is about five miles north: the weekday 110 (Eastern Blvd route) that only goes so far as Horizon Ridge @ Eastern.
RTC Route 110 and here's the map showing where the car was, versus the end of the weekday 110 route.

Did he walk five miles and try to catch the bus the next morning (about the time his phone checked the voicemail?) It could be a possibility. He could easily have found an RTC transit route flyer. But walking five miles, after heading the wrong way up EL, seems kinda odd.


If a taxi was arranged, he wouldn't have had to walk that far to meet it. They come right to the address you specify.

What brand of copy place is that, that has mailbox services? Did you check to see what their requirements (ID, prepayment, etc) were for renting a PO Box?

Taxis are pretty expensive. Doesn't make any sense to me to park his car in about the deepest point in a suburb subdivision to walk out to go somewhere else. He couldn't have had too much money left, especially in refusing to use money from his family. If you take a bus after walking fivemiles, it's still only a slight delay in the inevitable.

The places that rent out PO boxes photocopy your id and keep it on record.

rd

 

[laytonian]

Yes, I know, I know, I've been gone for a while. But, if I don't have anything to add that is a new thought or provocative, I just read and don't post. So, I have a something new:

Did any of you catch the show, "Hannibal Unmasked", on MSNBC last night. I would never usually watch that station and that I was home on a Saturday night watching MSNBC is a true indication of my geekdom but there were a couple things that caught my ear that went along with this case.

If you don't know the show, it covers the case of the killer Scott Kimball and how he murdered three young women and an older guy. You all might remember it because he was married to the mother of one of the young women he killed. He was a real piece of. . .. He finally got caught and some of the remains of these women were found and identified. He is in jail now. He totally fooled the FBI to get out of jail by saying he would be a confidential informant. But, he made everything up and the FBI actually went to certain extents to cover this up.

There was something about the entire story that reminded me of Steven's situation and disappearance. Granted, it was three women instead. But, in one case, the girl told her father that she was going with friends to Mexico to explore caves. Instead, and this was not figured out until she disappeared that really she had gone with this Kimball guy and were kiting checks and running up her dad's credit all over Colorado and Utah. Finally, Kimball got tired of her and murdered. But, this was a young girl who was involved with criminals, guys in jail, and her father did not even know. She was totally living a double life.

(For the record, I know how everyone. . .family, PI, friends, etc. . .says Steven would never be mixed up in anything illegal. That's what the family members were saying in this show and we have heard it all before. I think facts would bear out that a majority of people who disappear are wrapped up in something illegal or they know somebody who is.)

Likewise, another of the girl's that Kimball murdered, the one whose mother he married, looked like she had cleaned her act up after being involved in drugs. But, she seemed to be on the right path but she also got involved with Kimball as well and died. In the third woman's case, she was involved was a guy in jail who knew Kimball. Kimball hunted her down. Had a relationship with her and killed her eventually. Her body has never been found.

What I am getting at here is that Kimball was a smooth talker, and I don't just mean with these young women. He fooled the FBI, one of the murdered girl's mothers, and many others just because he had the gift of BS. Like I said, these were three women so it's a bit different. But, these women managed to get themselves involved with some pretty bad lowlifes because these women were desperate and the guy was a smooth talker.

It just seemed similar to Steven's case. "Good guy". Trying to get on the right path. Traveling around a lot, like the one girl was. Parents not suspecting anything other than he was a good guy. Too trusting. Not telling people where he was. Then totally disappearing.

And in Kimball's case, it took them four years to put it all together.

If you haven't seen the show or don't know about it, you should look it up. On top of everything else, Kimball disposed of the bodies in the National Parks of Utah.

Excellent scottleekimball.com website.

The Book Cliffs area, north of Moab. If you've driven along I-70 in Utah, they're the the cliffs that follow you on the north side of the road.

A couple more points: Was Steven's car locked when they found it? Maybe that's been stated but I forget. Does that car have a keylees remote or would you have to put the key in the lock to lock and unlock, like old school cars?

It was locked when it was found. Naegle didn't know if Steven's Dad already had a key and brought it with him, or if they found it in Steven's room in St George.

Don't know about the type of lock.

Something else: Has anybody checked to see if there were any notable crimes in Overton, Ruby Valley, etc. the days that Steven were in those towns? I am NOT saying Steven did anything. But, I got to thinking that the day he went to Ruby Valley he might have gone to the friend's house because he was killing some time while waiting for somebody else to do something. Like he drove somebody there and waited while they did something. Same thing in Overton. And it could be the reason he left that party early as well. He might have gotten a text that he needed to go.

I haven't. Maybe someone else has? I only checked to see what had gone on in the SCA area.

Ruby Valley is an area, and is part of two different counties (Elko and White Pine). It's a beautiful ranching area, but "there's no there" there. KWIM? It's miles to anything; I'm not even sure there's any businesses. The small town of Wells is kinda shady. I see no way to check crimes in Elko County.

About all he'd have time to do, is drop something (or someone) off ... or pick them up. He was apparently alone when he was at the N home, although I doubt they checked the trunk of his car.

I also saw in the paper about the body in the motel and the suicide in Sun City Anthem. Bodies in hotels hardly phase me anymore since a bell hop once told me that I would not believe how many suicides occur in Vegas hotels on a daily basis. It would blow me away he said.

That's probably why we hear no more about most of them, although the motel case did indicate something was suspicious.

 

[rd_jfc]

(bbm)

It's a fact that he left St George the night before?

Can you reveal your source for that fact?

All we've previously known, is that he pulled out of his driveway about 10:30pm. We haven't known (as a fact) that he actually left St George at that time. It's even possible he went to buy some milk and came back home.



We don't know when he put the coats into the car; they could have been there from the Ruby Valley trip, which would require he pull over and snooze at least once.

We have speculated prior to this, that perhaps the landlord had locked him out of the house, explaning him leaving after a few minutes at the house and taking nothing with him except what he already had in the car.

That's pretty good speculation. But the family was able to get in and get his car keys, etc. Landlord maybe unlocked without letting anyone know he had locked Steven out?

That would be totally against what SK said (to his father?) about arranging to catch up on rent in January.

If the neighbor saw the car come at 10 and ho at 10:30, it's likely they would have noticed it had returned again.

rd

 

[rd_jfc]

...and knowing the answer to a lot of intrusive questions, really doesn't open the mystery box or explain anything.

Maybe we should take the opposite tack. Instead of getting bogged down in details, we should look at it simply:

He had some debt.
Each job since the SL Tribune was lesser than the previous job.
He wasn't able to find the "right" girl to marry and start a family with.
He had a tense phone conversation with his father about owing rent.
He was active in his religion, including going to the temple on Dec 9th.
His sister talks to him that same day, but he doesn't mention a trip.
He drove to Ruby Valley NV to see a woman he knew lived/worked in SLC.
His long-time best friend texts him, but he doesn't respond.
His sister talks to him, but he doesn't mention where he is.
His mother deposits money to help with rent. It's unused.
He's back in St George, passing out window washing flyers.
Next day, he drives south on I-15 at least to Overton, maybe further.
Does a bit of shopping, returns to his apartment, leaves again. Returns???
Next day, he tells church friends he won't be at church 'cos he's in Vegas.
Security videos show his car driving towards a cul de sac, then him walking away.

If you knew NOTHING more than that, what would be your theory?

Or maybe starting at the very beginning:

A young man parks his car in a Henderson NV neighborhood, walks away, and is never seen again.

Most people would conclude he had something to hide about what he was up to and was up to no good, running away, or suicide.

Speaking of intrusive, it is true that as an adult he has every right to just walk away (although not change his identity), and barring any evidence of crime, police would not subpoena potential email accounts such as gmail and yahoo to find out who he may have been communicating with before he disappeared, so my suggestion will never happen.

If he hadn't offered to turn around and return for church services later in the day, I would say pretty complete washing of hands of his life.

rd

 

[rd_jfc]

Maybe Steven had a poor credit score and had to have a co signer for the apartment and that was his dad. That would explain why he was called when rent/utilities were not paid.

There almost always is request for emergency contact # which doubles as contact when renter can't be reached for rent.

rd

 

[Fairy1]

I don't think Steven would have taken his keys with him if he hadn't planned on returning to his car.

 

[laytonian]

That's pretty good speculation. But the family was able to get in and get his car keys, etc. Landlord maybe unlocked without letting anyone know he had locked Steven out?

That would be totally against what SK said (to his father?) about arranging to catch up on rent in January.

I just found something that I guess we've all overlooked -- and maybe it's not THAT important, but still:

"That's DH, he was trying to work with Steve and Steve had paid a little bit, he had been paying some part of the utilites to help keep them on. And making promises and plans to catch up the rent. " StillLooking on WS, 21 Jan 2010

(BBM)

If the neighbor saw the car come at 10 and ho at 10:30, it's likely they would have noticed it had returned again.

rd

Only if he stayed up all night, watching what went on across the street

 

[laytonian]

If he hadn't offered to turn around and return for church services later in the day, I would say pretty complete washing of hands of his life.

rd

...and maybe he'd still be around, if GW had chewed on him a bit about where he was, what he was doing, and why he was going to miss church because of it.

Sometimes, if someone's in a funk, knowing that they're wanted and needed could make all the difference.

I'm not entirely sure he was committed to whatever he planned to do, which could explain why he waited until noon to start walking.

IF he had a noon appointment, he'd have been late to arrive.

 

[Fairy1]

...and maybe he'd still be around, if GW had chewed on him a bit about where he was, what he was doing, and why he was going to miss church because of it.

Sometimes, if someone's in a funk, knowing that they're wanted and needed could make all the difference.

I'm not entirely sure he was committed to whatever he planned to do, which could explain why he waited until noon to start walking.

IF he had a noon appointment, he'd have been late to arrive.

It wouldn't surprise me much if he were late for an appointment, but you're right about him not seeming 100% committed to whatever he was doing.

 

[laytonian]

It wouldn't surprise me much if he were late for an appointment, but you're right about him not seeming 100% committed to whatever he was doing.

Remember gsmith talked about how Steven was late for the wedding?

I wouldn't think a late appointment was odd, except for him sitting in the car for those five minutes....and then walking away right at noon.

It's like the appointment was with himself, and he was deciding whether to keep it.

 

[carbuff]

Remember gsmith talked about how Steven was late for the wedding?

I wouldn't think a late appointment was odd, except for him sitting in the car for those five minutes....and then walking away right at noon.

It's like the appointment was with himself, and he was deciding whether to keep it.

It does kind of seem like that. Or that he had something to do in the car -- gathering stuff he was taking, putting aside things he was leaving, or whatever.

 

[carbuff]

<snipped>
I also saw in the paper about the body in the motel and the suicide in Sun City Anthem. Bodies in hotels hardly phase me anymore since a bell hop once told me that I would not believe how many suicides occur in Vegas hotels on a daily basis. It would blow me away he said.

Thanks for all that information -- interesting insights.

Earlier, when I was looking at Las Vegas area UIDs and missing to see if there was a pattern Steven might fit into, I ran across an article that had the number of suicides in the Vegas area -- it's an incredible number. People do come to Vegas to kill themselves, and not just after bad luck gambling. People come with the intention of doing themselves in. It's like that whole "what goes down in Vegas, stays in Vegas" becomes a mantra for hiding forever and never having to go back to your problems.

 

[carbuff]

Most people would conclude he had something to hide about what he was up to and was up to no good, running away, or suicide.

Speaking of intrusive, it is true that as an adult he has every right to just walk away (although not change his identity), and barring any evidence of crime, police would not subpoena potential email accounts such as gmail and yahoo to find out who he may have been communicating with before he disappeared, so my suggestion will never happen.

If he hadn't offered to turn around and return for church services later in the day, I would say pretty complete washing of hands of his life.

rd

It could have been one of those polite offers, too, where you can say it because you know the other person isn't gong to take you up on it.

 

[Sin City]

At the moment my thoughts are going over JZs use of SK's cell phone. Did SK tell his family that JZ used it to call his own family in Las Vegas? If this is the case I wonder if the PI has spoken to these family members of JZ, or the owners of the telephone numbers JZ did call from SK's cell phone.

I guess what I'm getting at is did JZ just tell SK he was calling family, and the calls were actually something hinky? This would mean some BG (bad guy) would be able to contact Steven via his cell phone. Did SK know something he shouldn't know due to JZ's phone calls on his cell phone?

Or were the phone calls on SK's cell phone actually made by himself, and he stated JZ used his cell phone to cover-up something? Who knows!

And, JZ doesn't have a pre-paid cell phone? Considering someone on WS mentioned he may have distributed narcotics one would think that JZ would need a cell phone to conduct business. Maybe JZ wasn't involved with any hinky business, and just didn't have any type of cell phone? He did have a job, so why didn't he pay rent either?

I only have questions it seems.

 

[rd_jfc]

It does kind of seem like that. Or that he had something to do in the car -- gathering stuff he was taking, putting aside things he was leaving, or whatever.

Also I'm wondering about the happenstance of noon, like laytonian says, almost like an appointment with himself he wasn't sure he was going to keep.

For one thing, what are the odds of pulling in to a place like that end of street cul-de-sac just five minutes before an appointment. I'm sure the surveillance cameras guy would have looked at the tapes for that day and have seen if he had circled in front of his house earlier.

So noon may be just totally random. Although I have to admit sitting there until noon to get out doesn't seem very random. Pardon me for not searching on this, but how close to noon was it? (seconds, a minute before or after, on the dot?)

And agreed, you don't sit there for five minutes and get out of the car at noon for a noon appointment at some address he was walking to.

On the other hand, I don't believe if someone planned this and told him to come to an address that they would leave the car there close to the address.

However, what if someone said I will pick you up on Evening Lights at noon? There's a place to park at EL and SS? Then you would wait until noon, looking out your rearview mirror, and get out at noon and walk to the street to look for the vehicle coming. Maybe he thought the real estate SUV was the vehicle.

I don't know how he would be told this with no phone call except in person, don't have any idea why someone would pick such an obscure place to tell him to wait for the person, but that's the only way I see him getting out of the car precisely at noon and disappearing from Evening Lights Street.

rd