NV NV - Steven T. Koecher, 30, Henderson, 13 Dec 2009 - # 3

[paris_paris]

ITA paris! I really don't think the importance of the phone pings - times and locations - can possibly be overstated.

If Steven actually showed up in Vegas on Saturday night - 12/12 - we have about 11 1/2 hours unaccounted for before he showed up in that video.

Isn't this a pretty standard investigative tool for LE these days? Why hasn't this been done?!?!?!

Steven's phone dialed his voicemail on Monday. The day after he was seen on video. That's why I think it's so important. It could have been him calling his voicemail, or someone who had stolen it.

 

[believe09]

So where do we think Steven was sleeping on the night or early morning of 12/12-12/13?? It may have been in his car-but it was some place where he could use his shaving kit and get cleaned up for his appt because he doesnt look like he slept in his clothes in the video...although maybe I really cant tell if he does.

 

[Fairy1]

Sorry guys - no trip to the RV park today. It's been raining all day and there's flooding all over town. Thought it best to get my booty home ASAP.

I wanted to clarify my thinking with regard to the FLDS theory. I know they would not be recruiting males. I'm all to familiar with the Lost Boys - teenagers who have been banished so the old pervs can have their pick of the young girls. Oh jeez - don't get me started!!!!

Anyhoo. Back around the time Warren Jeffs was arrested and again when the compound down in TX was raided, there was a lot of speculation that the factions up in Hilldale and Colorado City had businesses here in Vegas and that they were using their young males as cheap labor (construction is what I recall). Maybe swjaxon can help me out here - I don't recall seeing a lot of press on this subject though I, personally, was fit to be tied.

With regard to a Steven connection, I was thinking more along the lines that they may have wanted him to oversee their business interests here to sort of blur the lines and keep the heat off of them directly.

I know it's far-fetched. Just trying to think outside the box.

 

[Fairy1]

So where do we think Steven was sleeping on the night or early morning of 12/12-12/13?? It may have been in his car-but it was some place where he could use his shaving kit and get cleaned up for his appt because he doesnt look like he slept in his clothes in the video...although maybe I really cant tell if he does.

That's the million dollar question! It's only a two hour drive, so if Steven needed to be here for a 12 noon appointment, he could easily have left at 7 or 8 AM Utah time on Sunday and made it here in plenty of time to freshen up and get to his appointment. If he came the night before, there had to have been another reason. IMO.

 

[swjaxon]

Anyhoo. Back around the time Warren Jeffs was arrested and again when the compound down in TX was raided, there was a lot of speculation that the factions up in Hilldale and Colorado City had businesses here in Vegas and that they were using their young males as cheap labor (construction is what I recall). Maybe swjaxon can help me out here - I don't recall seeing a lot of press on this subject though I, personally, was fit to be tied.

With regard to a Steven connection, I was thinking more along the lines that they may have wanted him to oversee their business interests here to sort of blur the lines and keep the heat off of them directly.

No speculation on that. It's absolutely true. Link Link But I know they wouldn't use outsiders to run their businesses. They're very savvy with this sort of thing and small businesses are their bread and butter.

 

[renn3434]

GW was there for Steven in the first days after he went missing.
GW gave an interview, he is seen posing with Steven's missing flier in
front of Steven's house.
GW may well know more than he has said so far.
But, he may have told all he knows to Steven's family and the police.

There are secrets in every family, with every person, as we all are aware.
Some of those secrets are not earth shattering, but would we want everyone to know them.

IMO

Until the family says that they are happy with GW and his anwers I think he should be looked at a little closer.

 

[liz b.]

SWJaxon,
Well no, it's not a coincidence that the two men were both on video. Rather it's that they could both be observed moments before they vanished. That in itself is uncommon, I believe. In Steven's case, I've always thought that he was familiar with that location. He didn't turn his head, or look around him at all ; I think most people in an unfamiliar area would do those things. He looks to walk purposefully towards something.Or someone. Much the same as Trevor Morse, who was walking up and down waiting, until he looked up, seemed to see someone,and walked of the frame.
And,sad to say, so far both of these men surely have vanished. Not anything to identify either man has turned up.Neither one of them has shown up at a friend's or family member's house, contrite or otherwise. They may or may not have been lured, but you have to admit , it's a mystery.

 

[laytonian]

So where do we think Steven was sleeping on the night or early morning of 12/12-12/13?? It may have been in his car-but it was some place where he could use his shaving kit and get cleaned up for his appt because he doesnt look like he slept in his clothes in the video...although maybe I really cant tell if he does.

Based on what WE know:
I think there's a good chance he slept in his own bed.
Just because the neighbor saw him leave, doesn't mean he didn't come back

Or...he could have pulled in to the parking lot at a casino, and used the men's room for clean-up.

 

[Fairy1]

No speculation on that. It's absolutely true. Link Link But I know they wouldn't use outsiders to run their businesses. They're very savvy with this sort of thing and small businesses are their bread and butter.

JNJ - that's the one I remember. Thank you!

I'm sure you're right about the outsiders - I know how wary they are. I wish the authorities here could find a way to shut them down. Makes me sick to think they're using their own children to make money.

But I digress......sorry.

 

[believe09]

No speculation on that. It's absolutely true. Link Link But I know they wouldn't use outsiders to run their businesses. They're very savvy with this sort of thing and small businesses are their bread and butter.

note to self, file SWJAXON away as a contact for questions on other LDS cases!!!!!!!!!

 

[Fairy1]

Based on what WE know:
I think there's a good chance he slept in his own bed.
Just because the neighbor saw him leave, doesn't mean he didn't come back

Or...he could have pulled in to the parking lot at a casino, and used the men's room for clean-up.

You are absolutely right. But this is why the pings are so important. If they indicate that he WAS in Vegas on Saturday night or the wee hours of Sunday morning, where was he and what was he doing?

Also - swjaxon is absolutely right about surveillance cameras being everywhere here. They really are and it's just a way of life for us. Frankly, I find it rather comforting.

He's also right about there being a million other places in Las Vegas for a car to be abandoned where it wouldn't raise any red flags for possibly weeks. Either Steven was in Sun City on purpose and ran up against the wrong person or persons, or he wanted the car to be discovered sooner rather than later. Then again, there are many, many other neighborhoods in the city where that could have been accomplished. He didn't need to go all the way out to SC for that.

 

[Fairy1]

SWJaxon,
Well no, it's not a coincidence that the two men were both on video. Rather it's that they could both be observed moments before they vanished. That in itself is uncommon, I believe. In Steven's case, I've always thought that he was familiar with that location. He didn't turn his head, or look around him at all ; I think most people in an unfamiliar area would do those things. He looks to walk purposefully towards something.Or someone. Much the same as Trevor Morse, who was walking up and down waiting, until he looked up, seemed to see someone,and walked of the frame.
And,sad to say, so far both of these men surely have vanished. Not anything to identify either man has turned up.Neither one of them has shown up at a friend's or family member's house, contrite or otherwise. They may or may not have been lured, but you have to admit , it's a mystery.

The thing about Trevor that I find concerning is that he was said to have possibly been carrying a firearm. There must have been a reason for that. I'm not saying that HE was up to no good - but it seems to me he may have had reason to believe whoever he was meeting was. And the fact that he hasn't been seen since seems to support that theory.

 

[laytonian]

note to self, file SWJAXON away as a contact for questions on other LDS cases!!!!!!!!!

LDS or FLDS?

 

[laytonian]

Naegle's going to be feeding me as many answers as she can, over the next few days.

She won't have much time tonight, and she'll be accompanying the family to Vegas this weekend. They'll be checking out IHOP and some other things.

She'll be checking in here OR via email, if they have wifi at the hotel.

So far, she says the answer is "I don't know" to a lot of things.

They don't know what LE is doing with the passport (so I advised her that they should check with LE before doing anything with the State Department).

The gist is that they're trying to figure out what LE may know, and that's not being shared with them. It's understandable on both sides.

ANYWAY - as she feeds me a bit more, I'll start updating the Q&A.

 

[laytonian]

The thing about Trevor that I find concerning is that he was said to have possibly been carrying a firearm. There must have been a reason for that. I'm not saying that HE was up to no good - but it seems to me he may have had reason to believe whoever he was meeting was. And the fact that he hasn't been seen since seems to support that theory.

It doesn't mean much, out this way, really.

Nevada, like Utah and other western states, is conservative and has an "open carry" law. It's almost a rite of manhood to own a gun, and it's legal to walk around with one in a holster on your hip. Clark County is apparently "grandfathered" and guns must go through registration - which may explain why it's suspected he had one with him.

We own guns ourselves, but we don't take 'em to Costco.
But it's common to see them there.

 

[Fairy1]

LDS or FLDS?

I'm quite sure that should be FLDS.

 

[Fairy1]

It doesn't mean much, out this way, really.

Nevada, like Utah and other western states, is conservative and has an "open carry" law. It's almost a rite of manhood to own a gun, and it's legal to walk around with one in a holster on your hip. Clark County is apparently "grandfathered" and guns must go through registration - which may explain why it's suspected he had one with him.

We own guns ourselves, but we don't take 'em to Costco.
But it's common to see them there.

I don't know anyone who carries a gun on their person without thinking they're going to need it. Just my take.

 

[swjaxon]

SWJaxon,
Well no, it's not a coincidence that the two men were both on video. Rather it's that they could both be observed moments before they vanished. That in itself is uncommon, I believe. In Steven's case, I've always thought that he was familiar with that location. He didn't turn his head, or look around him at all ; I think most people in an unfamiliar area would do those things. He looks to walk purposefully towards something.Or someone. Much the same as Trevor Morse, who was walking up and down waiting, until he looked up, seemed to see someone,and walked of the frame.
And,sad to say, so far both of these men surely have vanished. Not anything to identify either man has turned up.Neither one of them has shown up at a friend's or family member's house, contrite or otherwise. They may or may not have been lured, but you have to admit , it's a mystery.

I totally admit it's a mystery, but I don't believe there is any connection between the two cases. I believe Steven was caught on this camera by sheer happenstance. If that's the case, then the connection is absolutely coincidental.

 

[Fairy1]

Naegle's going to be feeding me as many answers as she can, over the next few days.

She won't have much time tonight, and she'll be accompanying the family to Vegas this weekend. They'll be checking out IHOP and some other things.

She'll be checking in here OR via email, if they have wifi at the hotel.

So far, she says the answer is "I don't know" to a lot of things.

They don't know what LE is doing with the passport (so I advised her that they should check with LE before doing anything with the State Department).

The gist is that they're trying to figure out what LE may know, and that's not being shared with them. It's understandable on both sides.

ANYWAY - as she feeds me a bit more, I'll start updating the Q&A.

Disappointing. Hopefully over the next few days, the "I don't knows" will become answers we can use!

 

[webrocket]

The thing about Trevor that I find concerning is that he was said to have possibly been carrying a firearm. There must have been a reason for that. I'm not saying that HE was up to no good - but it seems to me he may have had reason to believe whoever he was meeting was. And the fact that he hasn't been seen since seems to support that theory.

I realize the discussions get intermingled at times, but does this not belong on Trevor's thread?