GUILTY NV - Tammy Meyers, 44, fatally shot at her Las Vegas home, 12 Feb 2015 - #4

[sonjay]

You know what has been nagging me-- the whole idea that RM said TM used to tell EN to pull up his pants.

What business was of her to tell him that? (If it is true)...

That strikes me more as something that RM would have said to EN. Or at least something that he would have wanted to say.

 

[sonjay]

To me that makes sense for it to be BM or KM's train of thought, but not TM. TM would either want to keep the house guarded or have everyone get in the car and abandon the house. Leaving your house with your teenage daughter inside seems like a way to put the daughter's life in danger as they could storm and overpower a single individual. A home is far more defensible than a car, especially if the home is two story, where three people would be hard to defeat inside versus a car challenging with three people. The only possible reason I could somewhat see for the action would be if TM said to call the police to the house rather than the allegation that she stopped the police from being called. I think whatever threat was made wasn't considered that dangerous, so they didn't see themselves in danger once they got armed but were surprised at getting fired upon. I really question if it was TM that was involved in this rather than BM/KM.

Yes yes yes. Leaving KM alone at the house would have been a very bad idea if TM actually thought EN was a threat. Especially if TM knew that EN was the person she was in the altercation with.

I still don't believe that's what happened. But if that is what happened, then TM demonstrated monumentally bad judgment in taking Brandon to go out and hunt down EN, and also monumentally bad judgment in leaving TM at home alone.

 

[SStarr33]

You know what has been nagging me-- the whole idea that RM said TM used to tell EN to pull up his pants.

What business was of her to tell him that? (If it is true)...

Sometimes when people care about a person, they tell them when they are being foolish.

 

[SStarr33]

That strikes me more as something that RM would have said to EN. Or at least something that he would have wanted to say.

How do you know what TM would say?

 

[SStarr33]

As a mother, with a son and a daughter, I can say that the story as told above, makes ZERO sense to me. If someone threatened to kill my daughter, NO WAY would I send her into the house, to stay all alone, while I took my son AND THE WEAPON< away from the home. That makes no sense. You would want to stay and protect your child, not leave her alone, unarmed, and then not even contacting police, and/or other family to come be with her.

It just does not ring true to me. Also, the motivation for her to go out and 'hunt' the road rager down. It makes no sense to go take a weapon and seek out a RANDOM angry driver. Why not let it go if they do not know you or where you live?

The only way it makes sense to me is if they DID know who the 'rager' was and they DID know they were vulnerable at home. Which we eventually found out was the truth of the situation.

How do you know she was all alone in the house?

 

[sonjay]

Sometimes when people care about a person, they tell them when they are being foolish.

And then they tell their son to get his gun to help hunt the person down.

 

[sonjay]

I think the majority of folks want nothing to do with vile, nasty internet people.

But anyways, from what we know, Brandon was ashamed of what happened that night--I can totally understand. I just can't get behind the hate crowd.

How do you know Brandon was ashamed of what happened?

 

[sonjay]

EN chased them to their house then murdered Tammy and attempted to murder Brandon. He unloaded 22 rounds and he is a cold blooded killer.

How do you know EN chased them?

How do you know he murdered Tammy?

How do you know he attempted to murder Brandon?

How do you know he unloaded 22 rounds?

How do you know he is a cold blooded killer?

 

[JaimeInLA]

From the Complaint:
"Brandon said he told his mother to come in the house and call the police, but she told him no come with me or I'll go by myself."
That alleged statement from the mother is beyond Dirty Hairy, particularly if she meant she a 44 year old non physically imposing woman was going to go back out there alone and unarmed (or even armed if she intended to take BM's gun) against an unknown number of passengers in the Audi, with at least the driver being a physically imposing 6' 180 pounds male about half her age where she wants to take the car on with the police expressly not supposed to protect her home or herself. That alleged statement from TM could be true, but would be an awfully extreme action for a mother to do with the intent of going on the hunt and not protecting the home. On the other hand it makes a bit more sense if this was actually the attitude of a male in their 20s. The family actually touts about how she had been a nurse (not like an Iraq vet with war experience) and nurturing, which that image may well be the correct one but would totally contradict her being someone who thinks they could single-handedly hunt down and take on potentially a car full of armed gangsters half her age with police expressly not to be there for the confrontation. Also BM is the owner of the gun, not TM or RM, which points to TM either being wholly uninvolved or duped into whatever involvement she had plus that wasn't her normal car that she drove.

I can think of one way that TM might possibly say those things. This is purely theory, and not meant to disparage TM. So I will just say in general terms that when people are using cocaine, they feel overly confident, arrogant, invincible, and justified. When people are using meth they get aggressive. They feel larger and more powerful than they really are. Again - I have no knowledge that TM ever did either drug. I'm just throwing it out as a possible reason why a mother would act so out of character and so un-motherish.

 

[sonjay]

That is expressly denied in the Criminal Complaint. EN is not alleged to have been the driver by any of the accounts.

To get back to discussing the actual case, this statement by SpanishInquisition is interesting. This could have interesting implications for the defense.

EN was a passenger. He told his friends he was a passenger, and the Meyerses have said it was the passenger who shot at them.

Let's think about that for a minute.

Let's say the Audi, driven by someone other than EN, turned onto Mt. Shasta in pursuit of the Meyers car. EN didn't follow the Meyerses to their cul de sac; the Audi driver did, and EN was just along for the ride.

Now, we already know that the Meyers, in their car, searched for, found, and then chased the Audi. And we already know that Brandon had pointed his gun at the Audi earlier, at the first shooting scene. So EN had good reasons to think that Brandon was a threat. He wasn't just being paranoid.

Now let's suppose that EN says that Brandon fired first at the cul de sac, or at least that Brandon pointed his gun first.

And let's supposed that EN further says that he opened fire in self defense after Brandon pointed his gun at the Audi or fired at the Audi.

We only have Brandon's word for it that the Audi fired first. And we know that Brandon has trouble telling the story correctly.

It starts to look a lot like legitimate self-defense.

If EN had been the driver, I would say that once the Meyers car left and headed home, that incident was over, and EN became the aggressor when he followed the Meyers car into their cul de sac. But since EN was a passenger in the Audi, I have to question whether he could legally be faulted for the Audi's pursuit/following of the Meyers back to their cul de sac. EN could have been begging the Audi driver to knock it off and take him home.

IMO. JMO. MOO MOO.

 

[SStarr33]

And then they tell their son to get his gun to help hunt the person down.

People do stupid things. She paid with her life for her stupidity.

 

[SStarr33]

How do you know Brandon was ashamed of what happened?

That might not be the exact word his dad said, but it was guilty or ashamed or something like that.

 

[SStarr33]

How do you know EN chased them?

How do you know he murdered Tammy?

How do you know he attempted to murder Brandon?

How do you know he unloaded 22 rounds?

How do you know he is a cold blooded killer?

Because that is what he told his friends.

 

[sonjay]

People do stupid things. She paid with her life for her stupidity.

How do you know Tammy did anything stupid?

 

[sonjay]

That might not be the exact word his dad said, but it was guilty or ashamed or something like that.

How do you know dad was telling the truth about that?

 

[sonjay]

Because that is what he told his friends.

How do you know he was being honest in what he told his friends?

How do you know his friends were being honest in what they told police?

 

[JaimeInLA]

You know what has been nagging me-- the whole idea that RM said TM used to tell EN to pull up his pants.

What business was of her to tell him that? (If it is true)...

We aren't allowed to talk about what is on Bob's FB, but go read through his posts if you haven't yet. It REALLY helps to explain his personality a lot. It's possible TM shared the same, um, let's call them, extreme opinions. Or it's possible Bob just made that up when describing what TM might say to a kid she was mentoring. Once you understand his way of thinking, that comment makes a lot more sense.

I hope that's all ok to say. I tried not to be specific!

 

[sonjay]

Because that is what he told his friends.

He told his friends "I'm a cold blooded killer"? Link, please.

 

[SStarr33]

How do you know Tammy did anything stupid?

Seems pretty clear to me YMMV.

 

[SStarr33]

How do you know dad was telling the truth about that?

It makes sense. Just using more logic.