GUILTY NV - Tammy Meyers, 44, fatally shot at her Las Vegas home, 12 Feb 2015 - #5

[sonjay]

Her boyfriend is EN's friend. He likely shares friends with EN or their friends share friends. And KK isn't all that and a bag of chips if she picked this boyfriend who hangs out with EN. Plenty of decent college educated girls end up trashy guys. It's notable her boyfriend wasn't chosen to testify at the Grand Jury. I suspected from the start they used KK only because she is a more presentable witness.

I got the impression that KK is more EN's friend than ZA is. It was KK that EN texted that he to come over that night. She testified they were good friends and "really close," and that she was "actually a customer of his" at one point. She testified "I'd pick him up during the week, we'd hang out." She testified that he would confide in her about his personal life. She testified that he texted her regularly. She testified that the text that night was unusual because he (EN) usually knows what days KK isn't at work and it was "weird" that he texted her on a work night. She testified that she saw him several times a week and almost every weekend and had a sister/brother type of relationship with him.

It sounds to me like KK and EN were indeed close friends. She wasn't friends with EN just because ZA was; she was friends with EN independently of her boyfriend. JMO.

I would agree they probably used KK for the GJ because she's a better witness. Or maybe because was more likely to word things in a way that the DA wanted the GJ to hear.

 

[PaperDoll]

But the neighborhood probably wasn't the driver's neighborhood. EN said he knew a short cut, but that doesn't mean the driver followed his instructions accurately.

OMG! I just realized. They were on Alta when EN said that he knew a shortcut. Per the warrant they went the way of Alta. So taking the short cut and making a left at the END of the street would have taken them to his house, but the Audi driver must have turned down Mt. Shasta.

None of this---even the explanation given in the GJ testimony---doesn't explain the Audi being seen going East on Cherry River in the video though. Hmm..... Unless the Audi driver missed the turn onto Carmel Peak for the short cut and they had to loop around as a result.

The shortcut would be, when they left the 1st shooting scene, right on Alta, right on Carmel Peak, left on Mt. Shasta. The longer way, which may be the way they actually went, would be right on Alta, right on Cimarron, right on Cherry River, right on Carmel Peak, right on Mt. Shasta. Had they taken the short cut, they would be arriving at Mt. Shasta almost the same time as the Meyers arrived.

 

[SpanishInquisition]

Truly truly truly a WTF moment.

This could also be why RM is upset as the DA did a lot of dictating as to what to say while LE went out of their way to undermine KM saying there was any accidents and that was against their own witness.

 

[Miss Muffet]

I also got that LE/DA didn't really want to know the answers. Like with the EN threats from 'Stan' they searched their police reports and couldn't find that EN had called the cops to report it and other than that couldn't figure out who it was. Reading it I just the impression that they didn't really want to figure out who EN thought was threatening him and they tried to downplay it as not being true by saying that EN never called the cops about it, which I thought was lame considering that the Meyers didn't call in the alleged death threat either. Stan Selig has already come out of the woodwork saying that EN had problems with his children, so I wonder if the cops ever bothered to talk to Stan about EN.

I think it's clear LE was only interested in arresting EN anyway they could once they had KK as a witness. I also think after she called the police, they might have asked her to talk to EN again and ask questions like "what type of car was he in." Because KK says EN said it was a silver four door Audi in the warrant. I always thought it was a weird piece of information for EN to relay to friends while talking about being in a shootout.

 

[SpanishInquisition]

I would be very surprised if EN got turned around in his own neighborhood. In fact, and without going back to read the GJ Statement, I thought either EN or the driver said they knew a "short cut" to the street? I would have to go back and read it again to be sure :blushing:.

He said they continued westbound and he
said that he couldn't believe they were driving past his
house. His house is further to the west on Cherry River
than Carmel Peak. So they turned around and they came
back and he said "I know a left turn, a shortcut to get
to my house," something to that effect.

 

[Miss Muffet]

ETA: KK said she was a "customer" of EN, lol.

KK is a customer of EN? Funny! I can't wait until I can read this pdf!

 

[sonjay]

Can the grand jury testimony be used in court? Can EN's lawyer ask BM why he stated he kneeled down in his original testimony?

BM was under oath when he testified to the GJ. I'm pretty sure that his GJ testimony can (and will) be used during his trial testimony.

The relevant portion of Nevada's hearsay rules. BBM.
https://www.leg.state.nv.us/NRS/NRS-051.html

NRS 51.035  “Hearsay” defined.  “Hearsay” means a statement offered in evidence to prove the truth of the matter asserted unless: 1.  The statement is one made by a witness while testifying at the trial or hearing;
2.  The declarant testifies at the trial or hearing and is subject to cross-examination concerning the statement, and the statement is:
(a) Inconsistent with the declarant’s testimony;
(b) Consistent with the declarant’s testimony and offered to rebut an express or implied charge against the declarant of recent fabrication or improper influence or motive;
(c) One of identification of a person made soon after perceiving the person; or
(d) A transcript of testimony given under oath at a trial or hearing or before a grand jury; or


Meaning, when you testify to something under oath at a trial or GJ that's not hearsay. And it can be used in court. The Claus Bros. will have a lot of fun with KM's & BM's GJ testimony.

 

[SStarr33]

Elaborate, please.

http://www.mynews3.com/media/lib/166/1/8/3/183997e6-0122-44f7-99b5-c23203a0e717/030515Nowsch.pdf

 

[Miss Muffet]

I wonder if EN said he did a drug deal with one or more of the Meyers that night and the detective left that part of the hearsay confession. There hasn't been an explanation for why EN was at that park at night for so long, so there was probably some drug deal that you'd think LE/DA would want to bring up to paint EN even worse, but that they just left it at EN hanged at night in the park alone for a long time for no reason seems strange. I wonder if the detective intentionally kept it out about any drug deal with the Meyers because it would have undermined the Meyers claims of not really knowing EN.

EN said he had plans with a couple of girls, but he cancelled because he didn't want them to get hurt if someone was coming to hurt him. That's how he could have ended up there longer than he planned to be there. He passed up quite a few rides because he was afraid to leave the park until the buick was gone.

 

[SStarr33]

Can the grand jury testimony be used in court? Can EN's lawyer ask BM why he stated he kneeled down in his original testimony?

I've not seen a ton of trials, but in the few I have seen it has been used every time.

 

[SpanishInquisition]

Her boyfriend is EN's friend. He likely shares friends with EN or their friends share friends. And KK isn't all that and a bag of chips if she picked this boyfriend who hangs out with EN. Plenty of decent college educated girls end up trashy guys. It's notable her boyfriend wasn't chosen to testify at the Grand Jury. I suspected from the start they used KK only because she is a more presentable witness.

I don't know that they're friends. I think EN was her boyfriends' dealer and then when she got him for a boyfriend EN became her dealer as well (she says in her testimony that EN had been her dealer), which she became closer to EN than her boyfriend had as even though her boyfriend had known him twice as long they weren't nearly as close.

 

[Miss Muffet]

If EN didn't know he was shooting at the Meyers, then the Meyers, IMO wouldn't be out looking for him in the parking lot. This tells me there may have been a driving lesson after all. Why would the Meyers be in the parking lot when EN saw them the first time? If the Meyers were looking for EN, then I would think EN would know it was them driving. Make sense? I don't think many people in that neighborhood owns a older dark green Buick. EN and the Meyers do not live far from each other at all, they live very close...

Right. I'd like to write out a scenario for each.

I still believe there was a driving lesson and an earlier encounter with the car. I'm not going to derail the thread by arguing with others who view it as all lies though. To me, the earlier incident makes more sense how they ended up chasing the car than the idea that they started the night to settle some dispute we have no evidence from either side existed. It would be in EN's best interest if he said the M's had threatened him, they were involved in an ongoing dispute, recent dispute, or a dispute erupted that night. But EN doesn't say ANYTHING to indicate those things. As a result, I see no rational reason to jump to that conclusion aside from the rumor the mother bought drugs from EN. Well, KK bought them too apparently. And we have to keep in mind that the man who spread the rumor about KM and drugs is the very same man who has been threatening EN. As a result, I doubt his credibility.

 

[PaperDoll]

Right. I'd like to write out a scenario for each.

EN said he was meeting two girls that night but called it off in case something was going to go down and he didn't want them involved. So, it sounds to me EN was very paranoid that someone was out to get him and for what reason I don't know but I really would think he would know who owns the Buick, or at least wonder if it was the Meyers car..

 

[Hiandmighty]

This could also be why RM is upset as the DA did a lot of dictating as to what to say while LE went out of their way to undermine KM saying there was any accidents and that was against their own witness.

Yes. Seems like LE left it open about how much (if any) the meyers were "responsible" for what happened. Possibly they are investigating any under story.

 

[SStarr33]

He went out of his way to explain to the GJ that when BM said "Bent down. Knelt down" he meant "leaning back." Let's take a look:

Q. After you saw the flashes, what did your mother do as far as operating the car?
A. When the flashes started appearing she knelt down, same as I.
Q. I'm sorry, you did what?
A. Bent down. Knelt down.
Q. Bent down inside the car?
A. Yes.
Q. For the record, ladies and gentlemen, Brandon is describing leaning back in the car seat.
A. Leaning back.

This is very much a "huh? WTF?" point in the transcript for me.

Kneeling down in the floorboard makes more sense than leaning back. I don't get it.

 

[Hiandmighty]

http://www.mynews3.com/media/lib/166/1/8/3/183997e6-0122-44f7-99b5-c23203a0e717/030515Nowsch.pdf

Are you pointing out the swearing in to tell the truth?

Why did the siblings get such a small detail different about whether BM was a resident of the house?

One says he was. One says he wasn't. Who lied?

 

[Miss Muffet]

I got the impression that KK is more EN's friend than ZA is. It was KK that EN texted that he to come over that night. She testified they were good friends and "really close," and that she was "actually a customer of his" at one point. She testified "I'd pick him up during the week, we'd hang out." She testified that he would confide in her about his personal life. She testified that he texted her regularly. She testified that the text that night was unusual because he (EN) usually knows what days KK isn't at work and it was "weird" that he texted her on a work night. She testified that she saw him several times a week and almost every weekend and had a sister/brother type of relationship with him.

It sounds to me like KK and EN were indeed close friends. She wasn't friends with EN just because ZA was; she was friends with EN independently of her boyfriend. JMO.

I would agree they probably used KK for the GJ because she's a better witness. Or maybe because was more likely to word things in a way that the DA wanted the GJ to hear.

I'm going to have to review all of that later when I have time. Thanks for sharing that.

Since she remained friends with him even after college and moving up in the world, it's still possible they shared some friends or their friend shared some friends. I think some of their circles could have overlapped--at the very least KK introducing her friends to be EN's customers.

 

[sonjay]

I still believe there was a driving lesson and an earlier encounter with the car. I'm not going to derail the thread by arguing with others who view it as all lies though. To me, the earlier incident makes more sense how they ended up chasing the car than the idea that they started the night to settle some dispute we have no evidence from either side existed. It would be in EN's best interest if he said the M's had threatened him, they were involved in an ongoing dispute, recent dispute, or a dispute erupted that night. But EN doesn't say ANYTHING to indicate those things. As a result, I see no rational reason to jump to that conclusion aside from the rumor the mother bought drugs from EN. Well, KK bought them too apparently. And we have to keep in mind that the man who spread the rumor about KM and drugs is the very same man who has been threatening EN. As a result, I doubt his credibility.

And to me, it makes more sense that the Meyerses took BM's gun and went hunting for EN, than to believe that a 15-year-old girl's very first ever driving lesson was at 11pm to practice parallel parking, and that on the way home from the driving lesson they had a road rage incident with some random driver (who was not EN and was not EN's Audi-driving friend), and that when they went out looking for the road rage driver they happened to encounter instead the local drug dealer who just happened to think that someone was out to get him that night.

But I won't derail the thread by arguing with others who think KM is a paragon of truthfulness about that night. I'll just state outright what I believe, which is that there was no driving lesson and no road rage that night.

 

[PaperDoll]

He said they continued westbound and he
said that he couldn't believe they were driving past his
house. His house is further to the west on Cherry River
than Carmel Peak. So they turned around and they came
back and he said "I know a left turn, a shortcut to get
to my house," something to that effect.

Was he talking about the Buick driving past his (EN's) house, or was the Audi driving past EN's house? Ok I'm not quite sure now where EN lives, I thought it was on the same side of the street as the park, and if so he is only a few houses down from that and the Meyers would not have actually past EN's house to get to Mt. Shasta because Mt. Shasta and Carmel Peak is the beginning of where the park starts, or ends depending on what direction you are coming from.

 

[SpanishInquisition]

1. EN completely confessed to police which is why his attorneys are bringing up the pot smoking prior to arrest. Unless the defense comes up with a way to get the confession thrown out or that following someone to their home could be SD (LOL), he will take a plea if offered.

I don't see how that confession proves M1, so I don't see a reason to deal. EN said he couldn't understand why they drove by his home and then when he got on Mt Shasta he saw multiple people in the car and what looked like someone running in to get even more weapons. EN is saying he saw at least three people with his confession. I don't think EN's confession is a slam-dunk for the prosecution, particularly if there's any video footage from the school, etc. that undermines the prosecution claims. EN had a far more clear level of escalation (hide, get in the car, flee, brandish while fleeing and then shooting and then driving back when car drove by home) than the Meyers while the Meyers seemed to escalate things far quicker and be the aggressors.