Found Alive NY - CS, 9, last seen 6:15pm at Moreau Lake State Park, Gansevoort, 30 Sep 2023 *arrest* #3

[MAHBOOBOO]

My view on them not following him...

This isn't 1988. Men don't kidnap little girls and hold them for ransom in America anymore, too easy to get caught during the ransom negotiation/transaction with the advances in technology. Unfortunately there's only one reason strange men kidnap children in America these days and it's for SA. So no one would expect the kidnapper to drive by the child's house after they've kidnapped the child for the purpose of SA.

IMO the only reason LE was watching the house was in case the child came home or was allowed to come home, especially with the family deciding to wait at their campsite. Therefore a random guy dropping off what is probably just another sympathy card would hardly be suspicious.

 

[kittythehare]

Agree with you... these people saying that it's "good" LE waiting and didn't pull him over or question him or apprehend him are making a lot of assumptions about how that would have gone, and if he DIDN'T have his fingerprints on the note, she may be dead right now. I'm not sure if it's even been confirmed they got his plate number?

We're talking about a mega multi agency successful hostage retrieval..
this is a minor detail, irrelevant in the big scheme of events.

Certain media will always push minor details because they perceive police criticism as klik bait.

It's not even important.

 

[NeverPersonal]

LINK
<modsnip - unnecessary> There will be criticism of the police and rightfully so. Criticism of such a job is necessary.

Despite the probable urge to unmask Ross immediately, Giacalone said, there were likely pressing considerations about preserving evidence and the possibility of dangerous accomplices to consider as well.

“Even when the police do everything right, they are wrong,” he lamented to Fox News Digital.

“Policing must be very easy since everyone on the internet can do it.”
“If you stop every individual that shows up, and the suspect does show up and sees the cops there, you spook him,” he said.

“Sometimes it’s better to be lucky than good.”

BBM - who says that...

 

[Sundog]

LINK
<modsnip - unnecessary> There will be criticism of the police and rightfully so. Criticism of such a job is necessary.


BBM - who says that...

Criticism may be necessary, but so is defending the actions of LE <modsnip>

 

[JerseyWasHome2]

I'm glad to see the park is reopening tomorrow. To me this indicates, I hope, that they are certain he acted alone and that a second person isn't still on the loose.

 

[shetalksinstereo]

OCT 5, 2023

Moreau Lake State Park reopens following missing girl ordeal

GANSEVOORT, N.Y. — Moreau Lake State Park reopened on Thursday, three days after 9-year-old Charlotte Sena was found safe following her alleged kidnapping over the weekend at the campground there. …

www.saratogian.com

[...]

According to a press release from the Office of Parks, Recreation and Historic Preservation, to ensure safety and offer peace of mind for visitors and campers after the past weekend’s events, Moreau Lake State Park is reopening with:

• Increased Park Police and New York State Police patrols throughout the park

• Installed new security cameras in time for the holiday weekend

• Increased presence of Park Rangers

Furthermore, in consultation with Park Police, the OPRHP said it will conduct a thorough review of the incident as the investigation continues to develop. OPRHP will continue to identify any areas where the agency can make improvements to provide safe and enjoyable recreational and interpretive opportunities for all New York State residents and visitors.

I am happy to hear this news about increased security measures! At least something positive can come out of all this! I hope that safety and security measures are reviewed and implemented at all state parks. At least there will be some deterrent.

 

[Sheila Terranova]

My view on them not following him...

This isn't 1988. Men don't kidnap little girls and hold them for ransom in America anymore, too easy to get caught during the ransom negotiation/transaction with the advances in technology. Unfortunately there's only one reason strange men kidnap children in America these days and it's for SA. So no one would expect the kidnapper to drive by the child's house after they've kidnapped the child for the purpose of SA.

IMO the only reason LE was watching the house was in case the child came home or was allowed to come home, especially with the family deciding to wait at their campsite. Therefore a random guy dropping off what is probably just another sympathy card would hardly be suspicious.

Hmmm…I think dropping a note at 4 am would raise eyebrows. A bit curious.

 

[NeverPersonal]

Hmmm…I think dropping a note at 4 am would raise eyebrows. A bit curious.

Right? I mean, <modsnip: not LE friendly> a man dropping off a note in the mailbox of this family at 4am is worth physically following IMO but the opinions of the public on the investigation do not matter, as the cops like to drive home in the article quoted above by the NY Post

 

[Trebor5591]

Agree with you... these people saying that it's "good" LE waiting and didn't pull him over or question him or apprehend him are making a lot of assumptions about how that would have gone, and if he DIDN'T have his fingerprints on the note, she may be dead right now. I'm not sure if it's even been confirmed they got his plate number?

I've seen nothing to say they had the plate number. But maybe they did....if not, it was a bungle for certain!

LINK

 

[cvaldez1975]

My view on them not following him...

This isn't 1988. Men don't kidnap little girls and hold them for ransom in America anymore, too easy to get caught during the ransom negotiation/transaction with the advances in technology. Unfortunately there's only one reason strange men kidnap children in America these days and it's for SA. So no one would expect the kidnapper to drive by the child's house after they've kidnapped the child for the purpose of SA.

IMO the only reason LE was watching the house was in case the child came home or was allowed to come home, especially with the family deciding to wait at their campsite. Therefore a random guy dropping off what is probably just another sympathy card would hardly be suspicious.

perps are actually known to be hanging around trying to get info. but i mostly agree.

 

[Flamingomom]

I’ m not from the area where this crime took place. I’m wondering how often do kidnappings take place here? How familiar would the local police force be with investigating a kidnapping? Would it be a reasonable expectation for the officer watching their house to know what to look for and to react according to certain protocol? Would they place an experienced officer at the site of CS’s home or a rookie who just started? Would this be an important posting or something assigned to an employee just in case someone shows up, maybe to prevent burglary or vandalism by those who know the house is empty?

 

[Joe Friday]

My view on them not following him...

This isn't 1988. Men don't kidnap little girls and hold them for ransom in America anymore, too easy to get caught during the ransom negotiation/transaction with the advances in technology. Unfortunately there's only one reason strange men kidnap children in America these days and it's for SA. So no one would expect the kidnapper to drive by the child's house after they've kidnapped the child for the purpose of SA.

IMO the only reason LE was watching the house was in case the child came home or was allowed to come home, especially with the family deciding to wait at their campsite. Therefore a random guy dropping off what is probably just another sympathy card would hardly be suspicious.

When Israel Keys kidnapped Samantha Koenig he demanded a ransom. He even drove to the house she was living at, which I believe was her fathers house, to locate her debit card which she must have told him was in her boyfriends pickup truck parked in the driveway IIRC.

The most bizarre part about the ransom demand was he propped up her dead body and took a picture of her face with a current newspaper to make it appear that she was still alive at that date in time.

IK also sexually assaulted Samantha so his real motive for kidnapping her was likely sexual and he probably thought if he could get some money out if it, all the better.

 

[shetalksinstereo]

I’ m not from the area where this crime took place. I’m wondering how often do kidnappings take place here? How familiar would the local police force be with investigating a kidnapping? Would it be a reasonable expectation for the officer watching their house to know what to look for and to react according to certain protocol? Would they place an experienced officer at the site of CS’s home or a rookie who just started? Would this be an important posting or something assigned to an employee just in case someone shows up, maybe to prevent burglary or vandalism by those who know the house is empty?

I live in another part of NYS, but am pretty familiar with this area and it is very very rare! The local police would not be adept with investigating a kidnapping, which is why they bring in NYS Police and the FBI. I would like to think that any time a child is missing, that someone of authority would be posted at the home in case the child returned on their own, etc. The parents were still at the campground. I don't know how they would determine the amount of experience of the officer for the home watching duty though.

 

[Vaderman]

I can't believe this case went from ecstatic enthusiasm for a job well done in the police miraculously, with low expectations, finding her alive and it's now moved on to criticizing the police for botching things.

She was found. Alive. Within two days.

 

[CMarie613]

View attachment 451649

Moreau Lake State Park reopens with new safety guidelines in place after kidnapping

The park temporarily closed after the incident. It has now implemented new guidelines to enhance visitor safety.

westchester.news12.com

Great, now every state park

 

[CMarie613]

I’ m not from the area where this crime took place. I’m wondering how often do kidnappings take place here? How familiar would the local police force be with investigating a kidnapping? Would it be a reasonable expectation for the officer watching their house to know what to look for and to react according to certain protocol? Would they place an experienced officer at the site of CS’s home or a rookie who just started? Would this be an important posting or something assigned to an employee just in case someone shows up, maybe to prevent burglary or vandalism by those who know the house is empty?

I’m from the area, it’s pretty rare. Over the last 30 years I can recall missing people but no abductions that I’m aware of…besides CS

 

[CMarie613]

I can't believe this case went from ecstatic enthusiasm for a job well done in the police miraculously, with low expectations, finding her alive and it's now moved on to criticizing the police for botching things.

She was found. Alive. Within two days.

I mean it wasn’t botched. Did it take 12 additional hours to conjure up a fingerprint from 20 years ago? Yes. But she was found alive, and she’s back home with her family, and he’s in jail. It was a success.

 

[katydid23]

disagree 100%. How would LE know his fingerprint would be on the ransom note? How did they know his fingerprint would be on record from 25 year old DUI?

They didn't even know there was a ransom note until after he had driven away. There were people driving past the house all night, so are they going to chase and arrest every car?

If not so, CS could be dead by now and this whole event a tragedy.

If they had followed him with lights flashing it could have been a bigger tragedy. Maybe he has an accomplice that could have grabbed her from the cabinet and taken off with her. All he'd have to do is call the accomplice from his car while being chased.

They were all very lucky.

It was more than luck. They had hundreds of LEOS from all agencies working fervently trying to track this guy fdown.

Whoever was staking out the S house failed miserable in a huge opportunity to free her 12 hours earlier by capturing the perp when he showed up at 4:20 AM to deliver the "ransom note". JMO

It's more complicated than that^^^. If someone has a child hidden away, you cannot just chase them down or you can lose the child forever.

However the following story presents a different point of view--essentially is says there was a steady stream of visitors (although it doesn't say how many) who were visiting the home to offer comfort to the family and so the trooper thought nothing of it when someone dropped by an envelope in the S’s mailbox at 4:20 AM.

So if that is true, then the officer did a great job of recognising that this car was different from the rest. IMO

LINK

 

[JennieM]

Craig N. Ross Jr. court date moved to November​

But preliminary hearing would not be necessary in town court if the case is presented to a grand jury before then and Ross is indicted​

BALLSTON SPA — Craig N. Ross Jr., the suspect in the kidnapping of a 9-year-old girl from Moreau Lake State Park Saturday, has had a preliminary hearing scheduled for Friday moved to November.

Saratoga County District Attorney Karen A. Heggen said Thursday that the hearing scheduled for Friday in Milton Town Court, where Ross lives, has been moved to 11:30 a.m. Nov. 21.

Ross, 46, was charged with first-degree kidnapping after police matched a fingerprint he allegedly left on a ransom note with one obtained during a 1999 Saratoga Springs drunken driving arrest. Police have said the note was left in the parents' mailbox in the town of Greenfield at 4:20 a.m. Monday.

The preliminary hearing, however, would not be necessary in town court if the case is presented to a grand jury before then and Ross is indicted, which would move the case to Saratoga County Court.

[…]

https://www.timesunion.com/news/article/craig-n-ross-jr-court-date-moved-november-18409277.php?IPID=Times-Union-news-spotlight

 

[imstilla.grandma]

Overall, I think very positively on law enforcement. Their swift and professional response ensured the safe return of an endangered young girl to her family