NY - Karina Vetrano, 30, found murdered, Queens, 2 Aug 2016 #3

[MzOpinion8d]

I'm glad we cleared that up. I think it's important for both cases.

I'm wondering how LE normally reacts to early indications of a serial killer? I think it speaks volumes that LE stated the cases don't appear to be linked but never officially ruled it out.

Really wondering what the protocol is with LE in these situations.


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Lately, it seems like the protocol for LE in so many cases is "Deny, Minimize, Ignore". Sigh....

 

[runfar262]

Family DNA Searches Seen as Crime-Solving Tool, and Intrusion on Rights
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/27/nyregion/familial-dna-searching-karina-vetrano.html?_r=0

Mr. Vetrano's Go Fund Me update that this story was on the front page of the New York Time. I sincerely admire his tireless efforts.

 

[msphilosopher]

Lately, it seems like the protocol for LE in so many cases is "Deny, Minimize, Ignore". Sigh....

That's what I thought but wasn't sure. I'm surprised so many dismiss the idea so quickly...

 

[DeDee]

Nancy Grace podcast with Karinas father 1/24/17-posted about on go fund me page

http://www.crimeonline.com/2017/01/...g-her-body-his-personal-struggle-for-justice/

Oh, my. I didn't realize that it was five long hours later after KV left at 5:30 to when PV located his daughter. He said that rigor had stiffened her body.

Every time I hear the story from the father it just breaks my heart. I can't imagine anyone losing their child like that and then finding them. He is a strong man. To have this kind of grief and still such a fighter. My stepmother lost her daughter and she didn't have the fight in her.... it was just all too much and it wasn't bringing her back. I really admire this mans strength. Praying for justice.

PV adored his daughter very much. He states in the NG interview that they were best of friends. They were very close. Mr. V feels he has nothing to live for except to find her killer. It is an all-consuming cause that haunts him day and night.

I signed the petition at the link in hopes that Mr V wins the familial DNA testing issue.

mocity, for the rest of my life, I feel that I may be as useful as an empty ink pen if my baby girl was murdered. May Mr V keep the fire burning for Justice for his lovely Katrina.

 

[Mainely16]

Oh, my. I didn't realize that it was five long hours later after KV left at 5:30 to when PV located his daughter. He said that rigor had stiffened her body.



PV adored his daughter very much. He states in the NG interview that they were best of friends. They were very close. Mr. V feels he has nothing to live for except to find her killer. It is an all-consuming cause that haunts him day and night.

I signed the petition at the link in hopes that Mr V wins the familial DNA testing issue.

mocity, for the rest of my life, I feel that I may be as useful as an empty ink pen if my baby girl was murdered. May Mr V keep the fire burning for Justice for his lovely Katrina.

Agree very much. I also think that many dads feel there is a lifelong "protection" clause when they become a parent to a female child. It doesn't matter age or strength. For example, I am 45 and my always "got it all under control," protective dad is now 80. He has Parkinson's and a few other conditions, including some dementia onset. One of his greatest pains is that he is no longer able to "protect" his daughters as he used to... ..physically, emotionally, financially...While I am thankful he knows his limitations, it also is something that drains him. As my sister and I struggle with different things, he feels at such as loss because he doesn't have the resources to fix anything for us. Now, he needs our protection. It's not a fun thing to go through. Time is an enemy, indeed.

Aside from being protective of Karina, Papa V's career was based around protection, too...being there for those in need of help and rescue. So, it's a bit of a double whammy. I think what's carrying him through is the search, the determination, the fight and the promise to his family and Karina to get this beast off the streets. All other feelings bubbling beneath that layer likely cannot be accessed now, which is positive and negative. When you're that attached to the fight, you recoil from grappling with your vulnerability. You're not building skills that will help you live with such a loss.

I have a friend whose son was killed by a drunk driver. The killer escaped custody and fled...remaining on the lam for 2 years. My friend contributed every minute over the 2 years to finding the guy, and due partly to his efforts (keeping the case alive), the guy was spotted overseas somewhere. He's now in jail and the trial will commense soon. That's all great, but now my friend has all this time on his hands. His "purpose" now is unclear to him. He hasn't started to heal and, IMO, will need professional support that, due to his unwillingness to feel vulnerable, he'll likely not try to get.

It's all so very sad. Why is life so darn painful, sometimes?

(I do not know the family...just sharing based on my own experiences.)

 

[Evey]

That's what I thought but wasn't sure. I'm surprised so many dismiss the idea so quickly...

I agree it's weird to me that people dismiss it. Let's make an official list of everything in common. There's the so close to their parents home(first the dads then the moms) pretty young brunettes with long hair and could be sisters in some photos both I guess surfed in the same area near where KV was killed someone mentioned both were jogging and into fitness and seem like avid runners. Both raped and strangled(I know they don't mention it much in newer articles) both in secluded wooded areas in the day around the same time I believe. Not a far distance apart by vehicle within a week of each other. Both put up a big fight showing likely the guy was big and strong cause he somehow subdued them but likely they put up a fight in both cases. Now it's weird that they're vague about VM cause at first rape and strangled are mentioned but now not so what if they don't want us to panic which is why they haven't released if the DNA matches or its a serial killer? I see no reason to keep it secret if it doesn't match. We don't know how VM was raped but articles seem to state that KV was raped in both places but we don't know about VM. Maybe the fire and lack of clothes found(that we know of) is part of his new evolving thing. I don't believe either murder is a first and don't know if I think ally bruger is related but there's a lot in common in these two cases so why everyone dismisses it is beyond me. I wonder they likely had the same friends somewhat and wonder if they'd ever met. Perhaps the killer saw them both where they surf or in the train since it sounds like both regularly took the train and I assume the same? Weird also is that they both had food with their dads after arriving on whatever public transit. I toss around the idea that the killer saw them both there and I personally believe it's the same guy and the cops don't want to start panic until they're for sure and maybe it takes more than one to be labeled serial killer or maybe they don't want the killer suspecting they've figured it out. They also both blogged or something right?or were both big on social media for awhile?

 

[Evey]

Wait they found her five hour sleep later? Is there anything else we don't hear in articles mentioned? Cause they always make it sound like he found her within an hour or so. And if he went out looking did he look in that area and she wasn't there for some weird reason? I feel that would be mentioned but in those five hours wouldn't he have looked there?

 

[Dollcat]

I believe they took DNA from her nails, neck area and cell phone. I could be mistaken but I recall reading something that stated there was no semen. The DNA obtained was from her giving one hell of a fight.


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No sperm? Didn't we see somewhere that KV had been raped 2x? Even if perp had "performance" issues, there would be DNA.

 

[Inthedetails]

No sperm? Didn't we see somewhere that KV had been raped 2x? Even if perp had "performance" issues, there would be DNA.

IIRC, there was no sperm, which leads me to think she was raped by an object. Please correct me if I am recalling incorrectly,

 

[Dollcat]

Wait they found her five hour sleep later? Is there anything else we don't hear in articles mentioned? Cause they always make it sound like he found her within an hour or so. And if he went out looking did he look in that area and she wasn't there for some weird reason? I feel that would be mentioned but in those five hours wouldn't he have looked there?

I thought PV found her a couple hours after she left not five?? Anyone have a link? TIA

 

[chewymolasses]

She was found around 10pm that night. PV knew the area she was in and had went, but she was dragged roughly 15 feet from path. I think it was reported NYPD used her cell phone ping to help locate area.

 

[msphilosopher]

I doubt they know each other, as it's a big city. And I'm sure that would have been mentioned by now from mutual friends.

If the cases are related, I'm guessing that they frequented the same places either a coffee house, shopping stores, gym, bars, etc..

 

[liz b.]

I thought PV found her a couple hours after she left not five?? Anyone have a link? TIA

Going from memory : Mr/ V. did not find her when he went looking. He said that he became increasingly concerned when K. didn't answer his phone calls or texts. He contacted a neighbor of his who is a LE official. They pinged her phone. I also read that they flew a police helicopter over the area, and saw K.'s body. Mr. V. found her.

 

[Lauranyc83]

Familial DNA solves cold case in Los Angeles. I really hope they accept this in NY.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.in...dopt-divisive-dna-match-technique-to-find/amp

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[msphilosopher]

Familial DNA solves cold case in Los Angeles. I really hope they accept this in NY.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.in...dopt-divisive-dna-match-technique-to-find/amp

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Crossing fingers! lease:

 

[Evey]

No sperm? Didn't we see somewhere that KV had been raped 2x? Even if perp had "performance" issues, there would be DNA.

Condoms would fix that and I wanna say I in thought I read something about finding one near so idk but yea raped both ways

 

[Evey]

I thought PV found her a couple hours after she left not five?? Anyone have a link? TIA

I am pretty sure I even remember seeing the story inn tv in the day because she left to go jog earlier so maybe Nancy grace or whoever the podcast someone posted was of just had it wrong cause I can't for the life of me remember ever seeing anything seeming remotely more than a few hours of that. It always was made to sound like she was found quickly and if she wasn't then did someone take her away and bring her back and stage it? Because if I was her dad I would go straight to that area while calling her phone that should likely been ringing

 

[DeDee]

I am pretty sure I even remember seeing the story inn tv in the day because she left to go jog earlier so maybe Nancy grace or whoever the podcast someone posted was of just had it wrong cause I can't for the life of me remember ever seeing anything seeming remotely more than a few hours of that. It always was made to sound like she was found quickly and if she wasn't then did someone take her away and bring her back and stage it? Because if I was her dad I would go straight to that area while calling her phone that should likely been ringing

I posted the NG podcast link, Evey. It is an interview with Mr V. He tells his story in great detail. Here is the link again since you obviously missed listening to it the first time. http://www.crimeonline.com/2017/01/...g-her-body-his-personal-struggle-for-justice/

Mr V sat down and ate dinner after KV left for her run. He did not leave his home until about 6:30. These are facts.

 

[LovelyB]

I posted the NG podcast link, Evey. It is an interview with Mr V. He tells his story in great detail. Here is the link again since you obviously missed listening to it the first time. http://www.crimeonline.com/2017/01/...g-her-body-his-personal-struggle-for-justice/

Mr V sat down and ate dinner after KV left for her run. He did not leave his home until about 6:30. These are facts.

Thanks for the link... I may have missed listening to that, too. I am unclear as to the timeline between her being missing and found.


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[DeDee]

Thanks for the link... I may have missed listening to that, too. I am unclear as to the timeline between her being missing and found.

You are welcome. Cliff notes version:

KV goes running at 5:30.
Mr V is home, his back aches, he watches the 6 o'clock news and calls KVs phone 3 different times. When the news ends at 6:30, he leaves the house to go look for his daughter. There is a search due to KVs father;s connections within LE. It was complicated but he found her as just as liz b. opined by 10:30pm.

It was getting dark. The tall grass PV walked with dread 15' from the jogging path then, walking up on his lovely daughter now battered and bruised and horrifically raped is all he sees. He likley fell to his knees pleading for mercy. It may requiring Mr V seeing a lovely photo or memory of her a hundred times to erase one second of the horror experienced.

I like Mr V. He reminds me of Fred Goldman, father of good-looking son Ron Goldman. Mr Goldman sought and fought for justice at every chance he could to restore a beloved memory to RG even before OJ was found not guilty.

The find me app is a great tool however, if it runs on the GPS, then it shows the appx area of the location of the phone. For instance, it may indicate your phone is at Red Nose Park but it doesn't show you that it is on the merry-go-round at the Red Nose Park. Although, IT is getting better with every week. Phone Pings can travel as far as 20 miles for a tower and will be within 3' of the location of the device.

They found where her phone last pinged and searched from there. This was a slow, methodical process as most SARs are.