GUILTY NY - Karina Vetrano, 30, jogger found murdered, Queens, 2 Aug 2016 #5 *First trial MISTRIAL*

[hawkshaw]

Two videotaped confessions

TWO confessions. I didn't know that. If you don't get it right the first time try try again. Deliberations in first trial don't seem to be going your way call a mistrial try again.

 

[hawkshaw]

I am sure if I talked with Chanel I could have got him to admit to the murder of JFK. I'm serious.

 

[Fred52]

The totality of the evidence...facts don't care about your feelings.

 

[Fred52]

Yes I believe a dim-witted homicidal maniac while punching a woman repeatedly in the face while injuring his hand would notice that he had broken Karina Vetrano's teeth..

 

[epiphany]

I am sure if I talked with Chanel I could have got him to admit to the murder of JFK. I'm serious.

Could you get him to admit to sexually assaulting her?

LE couldn't. IMO, he's got plenty of Mamma and sexual issues

 

[hawkshaw]

FYI, I don't wish to get into a pissing match with you guys because I appreciate your input in these cases. I am concerned enough to go out on a unpopular limb to suggest the guy might be innocent.

My philosophy is very simple: The Bad should be convicted and punished for an appropriate. sentence. The innocents should be protected from over zealous prosecutors. The more horrific is the truly guilty are allowed to be free, in some cases kill again. That is unacceptable and it happens throughout the United States, not just NY in far too many cases.

 

[Fred52]

I think you're picking the wrong case to fight for here. The evidence is overwhelming.

 

[Rocky1]

IMO the case stinks. The strongest piece of 'gut evidence ' for guilt is the ABC videotape in the above post where Chief Boyce tells us he is absolutely convinced Lewis is guilty. While I never had the pleasure of working with/for Chief Boyce I believe him to be a man of high reputation whose opinions should be taken seriously. I am certain he knows many things that weren't testified to, or written about in any newspaper. I give that statement by the Chief great weight, but I am not convinced.

I take you back more than 50 years ago when a dimwitted man named George Whitmore from Brooklyn gave detectives a 30 odd page confession saying he killed two career girls in Manhattan. I still remember the then Chief of Detectives holding up the head of Whitmore for the cameras and saying: " We got the right man!. That case was known as the Wylie-Hoffert murder case which became the pilot show for the long running Telly Savalas series. When the case was moved to founManhattan the late-great Manhattan DA Frank Hogan felt something was wrong with it and assigned a bright ADA Mel Glass to re-investigate the case. Glass found the real killer, a guy named Robles, and subsequently convicted him of those murders. Recriminations against those that solved the case lingered on for years and those that found the real killer suffered for their role in exonerating an innocent man and bringing a guilty man to justice. That case dwarfed the publicity the Vetrano case received in the media.

Are you suggesting that Chief Boyce was convinced that Lewis did it, yet he held back on producing evidence showing that he did?

 

[Rocky1]

The ONLY thing we really know about DNA is what they told us. There was one case in Illinois (?) where a man was convicted of murder. The DNA of another man was found on the body, not the DNA of the convicted. When the prosecutor was confronted with the evidence she said who is to say the semen donor wasn't strolling by the crime scene, found the body, and had sex with it. The wrongful convicted was released and the real killer was arrested - but not without a fight by the AG.

Then there is the classic case of Jeffrey Deskovic. Arrested and jailed for a murder rape. The problem then is his DNA didn't match. He got convicted anyway. Google him - it is a compelling story. Spent 16 years in jail and ran out of appeals. Begged the DA ( Judge Jeanine) to re-visit the DNA because of the vast advances in the science. She told him to get lost. A new DA takes over and she runs it. Jeffrey is out of jail in a couple of months. The real killer is identified and arrested, convicted, but not before he killed again !

Then there is the case of a fellow named Capozzi from Buffalo. Now that should be a movie and the DA should have been prosecuted and put in jail. The Buffalo PD detectives were the heroes in that case. The DA tried to get some of them fired.

I question the DNA as well. I question the defense and the reasonable doubt they raised by saying that Karina may have obtained his DNA from the pizza shop.
If this is true, perhaps you can explain why just Lewis' DNA, and only Lewis' DNA was found on her body if she sat in a booth where many others sat?
If the defense thought that LE was lying about finding his DNA on her, and perhaps it was DNA from someone other than Lewis, then why didn't they bring that up? Do you think maybe they had the DNA results showing it was Lewis'?

 

[Rocky1]

I have been told the judge on the case is the most reversed judge in NYC. If true, I think we can say it means the entire NYS. If that is true ( and I don't know it for a fact) then it makes one wonder why would you pick such a judge to try such an important case? And please don't tell me the pick was random.
You pick such a judge to make sure you get the desired results. When it seems like you aren't getting what you want the judge can always call a mistrial.

<modsnip>

Perhaps you can tell us exactly who picks the judge to in your words to "try such an important case to get the desired results?"
What makes you think that this case is more important than another?

 

[Rocky1]

I have been told the judge on the case is the most reversed judge in NYC. If true, I think we can say it means the entire NYS. If that is true ( and I don't know it for a fact) then it makes one wonder why would you pick such a judge to try such an important case? And please don't tell me the pick was random.
You pick such a judge to make sure you get the desired results. When it seems like you aren't getting what you want the judge can always call a mistrial.

<modsnip>

Are you under the assumption that if a judge reverses a verdict, then that's the final decision? It's not.
When a judge rules "Judgement Not Withstanding The Verdict" (non obstante veredicto) in most cases it will be appealed by the prosecution.
Judges will only reverse a verdict if there was not enough evidence to convict, or if the jury didn't follow the law.
This was not a bench trial. This was a trial by jury, therefore I don't follow how a judge could give someone the desired result they want? It is the jury that is the trier/finder of fact. not the judge.
The judge did not declare a mistrial in this case.

 

[bears10]

Who still uses the term hooker? Anyway, certain threads on WS give me a bad vibe, and this is one of them. It’s not a pissing contest of who “knows” who and who heard what about who involved in the case. A young woman was murdered. Geez.

 

[hawkshaw]

Are you suggesting that Chief Boyce was convinced that Lewis did it, yet he held back on producing evidence showing that he did?

NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! i am suggesting that in any such large investigation many items of possible incriminating information come to the detectives that can't be used. But it could be information that would convince the investigators of the guilt of the accused. From all that I heard of Chief Boyce is that he is a Most Honorable Man,

 

[hawkshaw]

Who still uses the term hooker? Anyway, certain threads on WS give me a bad vibe, and this is one of them. It’s not a pissing contest of who “knows” who and who heard what about who involved in the case. A young woman was murdered. Geez.

Would you feel better if said Sex Worker or Sex Therapist. Geeeez. I am sure you would react the same way if prostitute was used.

 

[hawkshaw]

Are you under the assumption that if a judge reverses a verdict, then that's the final decision? It's not.
When a judge rules "Judgement Not Withstanding The Verdict" (non obstante veredicto) in most cases it will be appealed by the prosecution.
Judges will only reverse a verdict if there was not enough evidence to convict, or if the jury didn't follow the law.
This was not a bench trial. This was a trial by jury, therefore I don't follow how a judge could give someone the desired result they want? It is the jury that is the trier/finder of fact. not the judge.
The judge did not declare a mistrial in this case.

I AM TALKING ABOUT REVERSALS ON APPEAL.

 

[Rocky1]

I have been told the judge on the case is the most reversed judge in NYC. If true, I think we can say it means the entire NYS. If that is true ( and I don't know it for a fact) then it makes one wonder why would you pick such a judge to try such an important case? And please don't tell me the pick was random.
You pick such a judge to make sure you get the desired results. When it seems like you aren't getting what you want the judge can always call a mistrial.

<modsnip>

Okay. In the above post, you said "You pick such a judge to make sure you get the desired results."
Again, I ask, who is "you"? It's not the Prosecution, it's not the Defense, it's not Lewis' Mother, and seeing as you can't reverse a decision on an acquittal, it wouldn't be the Vetranos'. So who?
It's the Chief Administrator that picks the judge, and yes it is on a random basis.


PART 200. Uniform Rules For Courts Exercising Criminal Jurisdiction | NYCOURTS.GOV

Part 200. Uniform Rules For Courts Exercising Criminal Jurisdiction.
Section 200.11 (subsection c)

(c) Assignment of actions to individual assignment judges. Except as provided in subdivision (b) of this section, upon commencement of a criminal action in the superior court, the action shall be assigned to a judge by the clerk of the court in which it is pending pursuant to a method of random selection authorized by the Chief Administrator. The judge thereby assigned shall be known as the "assigned judge" with respect to such action and, except as otherwise provided in subdivision (d) of this section, shall conduct all further proceedings therein.

 

[Rocky1]

I AM TALKING ABOUT REVERSALS ON APPEAL.

This judge will have nothing to do with reversing the verdict on appeal. The next appeal process would be decided by a panel of 5 judges.
Can you explain your post about this judge being known as "the most reversed judge in NYC" and how that would matter in the appellate process?
Can you explain your post about how "the judge (singular) can always claim a mistrial" in the appellate process when there are 5 judges?

 

[hawkshaw]

My /name is HAWKSHAW, not Jor-El. Had I been the latter I would have summonsed you all to where I summonsed my son Kal-El to impart all the knowledge I accumulated over the past 77 years to some of you folks that seem to be interested in how the system really works.

 

[hawkshaw]

Who still uses the term hooker? Anyway, certain threads on WS give me a bad vibe, and this is one of them. It’s not a pissing contest of who “knows” who and who heard what about who involved in the case. A young woman was murdered. Geez.

Why don't you just look up the definition of "hooker" and "prostitute" in the dictionary before getting all PC on me. Calling someone a hooker/pros is not my judging the individual. Using such words cut to the chase about what we are trying to say.

 

[hawkshaw]

Okay. In the above post, you said "You pick such a judge to make sure you get the desired results."
Again, I ask, who is "you"? It's not the Prosecution, it's not the Defense, it's not Lewis' Mother, and seeing as you can't reverse a decision on an acquittal, it wouldn't be the Vetranos'. So who?
It's the Chief Administrator that picks the judge, and yes it is on a random basis.


PART 200. Uniform Rules For Courts Exercising Criminal Jurisdiction | NYCOURTS.GOV

Part 200. Uniform Rules For Courts Exercising Criminal Jurisdiction.
Section 200.11 (subsection c)

(c) Assignment of actions to individual assignment judges. Except as provided in subdivision (b) of this section, upon commencement of a criminal action in the superior court, the action shall be assigned to a judge by the clerk of the court in which it is pending pursuant to a method of random selection authorized by the Chief Administrator. The judge thereby assigned shall be known as the "assigned judge" with respect to such action and, except as otherwise provided in subdivision (d) of this section, shall conduct all further proceedings therein.

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