Identified! NY - Mount Vernon, WhtFem 51UFNY, 18-25, Left Near Junkyard, Feb'88 - Veronica Wiederhold

[rats]

I'm glad they're taking a look at Tina. I wasn't sure if they run fingerprints like they do DNA. Like I posted before, I couldn't find much on her. Do you know when she was submitted?

She was submitted February 16th by Jess, apparently. Detective DiMase told us he would look into her back in March.

 

[Alleykins]

Hm. Does it usually take this long to match fingerprints?

 

[carbuff]

Hm. Does it usually take this long to match fingerprints?

It can, for a variety of reasons. Since there are several names on his list, he might be checking them one at a time and just not to her yet. This would be especially true if he's not exclusively assigned to cold cases.

Depending on department expertise and staffing, he probably has to wait for the fingerprint expert to have free time for a cold case, or if their are questions, they might have to send it to a state lab or the FBI for further input.

If they think they have a tentative match, they'd probably want to try to confirm it with DNA or further investigation, and since Tina's DNA is still in process, they might have to wait on that. If they did get a match, they would also need to notify next of kin and continue the death investigation. In older cases, that's often reason to keep the ID private, since identifying the victim can lead straight to the murderer.

So basically waiting doesn't mean much.

 

[Alleykins]

Thanks for the info, Carbuff. I was just wondering if fingerprints were automatically run like DNA is in CODIS, if both sets were in AFIS. Of course, we have no idea if each set of print is in the same database, but if they were, wouldn't this have already been done? I think Tina was added to NamUs last year, I just figured they would have run them then.

 

[carbuff]

Thanks for the info, Carbuff. I was just wondering if fingerprints were automatically run like DNA is in CODIS, if both sets were in AFIS. Of course, we have no idea if each set of print is in the same database, but if they were, wouldn't this have already been done? I think Tina was added to NamUs last year, I just figured they would have run them then.

I imagine it was automatic, but sometimes the automatic answer is a "not sure" for various reasons, and most LE agencies seem to want to double check. I guess my conclusion from the cases that I've followed is that Namus is not as automatic as they would like to think

 

[Al Ka]

AL Ka, who was the MV cop who was shot on that day? I didn't see this in the paper. I went to the library yesterday and looked for articles on our girl. I found one, which I posted on the FB page. Mysteriously, the Feb. 15th edition of the paper was missing entirely.

It was new Police Officer Edward Byrne. He was shot over a week later, 26th Feb 88.

I hope you do not mind, I am reposting the news article that you have located on microfilm (bless) so all can read it.

https://www.facebook.com/MountVerno...41829.841395542643916/922720131178123/?type=3



Article say that her body was "sprawled besides old abandoned dishwashers, ovens and other machinery"... really sad

Maybe my eyes deceive me but I do not see bump on her forehead on crime scene photo. If that is correct than bump probably came from autopsy as previously suggested?

edit: Apologies for article looking microscopic here, still have to figure out how to post pics to appear in normal size.

 

[Roselvr]

Thanks for the info, Carbuff. I was just wondering if fingerprints were automatically run like DNA is in CODIS, if both sets were in AFIS. Of course, we have no idea if each set of print is in the same database, but if they were, wouldn't this have already been done? I think Tina was added to NamUs last year, I just figured they would have run them then.

I'm not sure how finger prints are run, we have to remember that just because a NamUs profile says some are available, they may not be in the same places to be compared.

It was new Police Officer Edward Byrne. He was shot over a week later, 26th Feb 88.

I hope you do not mind, I am reposting the news article that you have located on microfilm (bless) so all can read it.

https://www.facebook.com/MountVerno...41829.841395542643916/922720131178123/?type=3

View attachment 96131

Article say that her body was "sprawled besides old abandoned dishwashers, ovens and other machinery"... really sad

Maybe my eyes deceive me but I do not see bump on her forehead on crime scene photo. If that is correct than bump probably came from autopsy as previously suggested?

edit: Apologies for article looking microscopic here, still have to figure out how to post pics to appear in normal size.

It's interesting they estimate her being 25, had long blond hair. I don't consider her hair long. It is shoulder length.
The bumps are usually from the ME peeling the skin down. I can't believe the NCMEC recon has the bump showing. I wonder how many photos they had to work with. Probably not as many as Carl lol

After uploading the pic, preview your post, you'll see the image. I right click it, open in new tab then grab the image URL. If you quote my post, you'll be able to see the IMG code.

 

[Alleykins]

Excuse me, I'm exhausted and just bursting with stupid questions today. :blushing:

I think its thought provoking. I call it mad genius eace::rockon:

 

[Alleykins]

I'm not sure how finger prints are run, we have to remember that just because a NamUs profile says some are available, they may not be in the same places to be compared.

I think you're right. Both cases were probably entered either before AFIS or on the cusp of its widespread use, so who knows what's been digitized yet. I read it came on line about the end of the 80s then picked up steam.

 

[LilacStar79]

The skull is usually cut across the forehead. After the autopsy, the scalp is usually loosely stitched back together. The skull, because it's not glued together, can shift, causing a bump under the skin.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

 

[FiveFelines]

The skull is usually cut across the forehead. After the autopsy, the scalp is usually loosely stitched back together. The skull, because it's not glued together, can shift, causing a bump under the skin.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

That's what I suggested upthread, but Carl said the bump was visible in the crime scene photo prior to autopsy (I personally don't see it).

 

[jessr927]

It was new Police Officer Edward Byrne. He was shot over a week later, 26th Feb 88.

Officer Byrne was NYPD though, not MVPD. He was killed in Jamaica, Queens, NY

Article say that her body was "sprawled besides old abandoned dishwashers, ovens and other machinery"... really sad

That really depressed me.

Maybe my eyes deceive me but I do not see bump on her forehead on crime scene photo. If that is correct than bump probably came from autopsy as previously suggested?

I do not see it either.

 

[kat913]

Pretty bold to drop her body where 2 german shepherds are guarding!! Must have made noise! Who would do that? Maybe someone was familiar with that area and those dogs?

 

[jessr927]

Kat - someone whose appearance would not be unusual to those dogs...

 

[DogRescuer]

The Olympics reminder gave me an idea.
Could she have been an athlete from behind the Iron Curtain that tried to defect but got caught? If she were a figure skater that might explain her grooming, and if she were trying to seek asylum, her country of origin might not have reported her missing to save face.

As someone who lived behind the Iron Curtain in 1988, I respectfully disagree that this is a plausible scenario.
First, the curtain had thinned out considerably by then. By the following year, it had already fallen.
Second, even decades earlier, when it was much thicker, one of the few things through which people stuck in communist countries were able/allowed to express their national pride, was sports. An Olympic athlete doesn't just vanish without anyone in the country noticing.

 

[Alleykins]

As someone who lived behind the Iron Curtain in 1988, I respectfully disagree that this is a plausible scenario.
First, the curtain had thinned out considerably by then. By the following year, it had already fallen.
Second, even decades earlier, when it was much thicker, one of the few things through which people stuck in communist countries were able/allowed to express their national pride, was sports. An Olympic athlete doesn't just vanish without anyone in the country noticing.

Nadia Comanici defected in 1989.

 

[catherine.]

Jess, I just wanted to say thank you and tell you how much Detective DiMase and your work is appreciated! Glad to hear he is a good looking guy lol.



Has anyone brought up the theory that she may have been left as some form of warning/threat to someone who worked where she was dumped?

 

[DogRescuer]

Nadia Comanici defected in 1989.

Yes, and people knew about it. That was the point I was trying to make. That Olympic athletes don't disappear without anyone noticing it just because they are not "reported missing." That didn't happen behind the Iron Curtain in 1988 either.

 

[jessr927]

You are too sweet. I have a friend who will be posting more flyers for me this week (he's out of work at the moment - I can only do it on weekends).

LOL Yes, DiMase is very cute; my 60 yr old mother has the hots for him!

Someone had brought up the theory of our girl being left as a warning - cannot remember who, but it was on WS so if we scroll back we can probably find it. I'm iffy on that. On one hand, I could see it, because there was & is so much mob activity down there. On the other hand, it just doesn't sit with me right.

Jess, I just wanted to say thank you and tell you how much Detective DiMase and your work is appreciated! Glad to hear he is a good looking guy lol.

Has anyone brought up the theory that she may have been left as some form of warning/threat to someone who worked where she was dumped?

 

[kat913]

It would seem a serial killer...imo....because of posing and strangulation (not manual) and binding. But I may read too much and have an imagination!!