NY NY - Sylvia Lwowski, 22, Staten Island, 6 Sept 1975 - #1

[Jmoose]

Originally Posted by rosemadderlake View Post
bbm: I wonder if at the time of the police report filing they were asked if any publicity was generated? Or, is that stating the wishes of the parents?


So now I am wondering, there should be two sets of parents concerned here. The fiance's parents, this was their future daughter-in-law. This surely had to be big news in social circles, local businesses, etc. on SI.

I think so, too-why is there nothing?

 

[rosemadderlake]

I think so, too-why is there nothing?

No publicity. bbm: That is the million dollar question...

 

[epiphany]

Originally Posted by rosemadderlake View Post
bbm: I wonder if at the time of the police report filing they were asked if any publicity was generated? Or, is that stating the wishes of the parents?



Sometimes publicity has the opposite effect of the desired intention. Drive her further away?

So now I am wondering, there should be two sets of parents concerned here. The fiance's parents, this was their future daughter-in-law. This surely had to be big news in social circles, local businesses, etc. on SI.

BBM

Don't mean to sound harsh, but ultimately would rest upon Sylvia's family, and LE depending upon who Sylvia was and what info LE may or may not have been privy to about her family dynamics.

Son isn't missing. No grandchild involved. Fiance's family>less at stake.

 

[epiphany]

I just found Sylvia's father's WWII enlistment record - he was born in 1914 (died 1993), was living in New Jersey in 1942 and is listed as "Single, with dependents."

Does that mean he had children from another marriage prior to WWII?

I wonder if he met Sylvia's mother while stationed in Germany, where they stayed for awhile and had Sylvia. Her mother was born in 1927 (died 2007) so she was 13 years younger than him and was only 15 when he enlisted...

Most interesting to say the least.

 

[epiphany]

What was the relationship between the two families like (between the parents of the young adults)?

After all, their young adult children are engaged to be married. A ring has been given, and an announcement placed in the local paper.

Sylvia's father, a life-time military man, was a chef (considered rumor---unconfirmed by a verified insider or link).

Upon the exodus to SI, many had the opportunity to establish new businesses of their own: restaurants, bars, etc.

Wonder where Sylvia's father may have been employed as a chef, and whether or not the families were connected in other ways, too?

 

[rosemadderlake]

Originally Posted by rosemadderlake View Post
bbm: I wonder if at the time of the police report filing they were asked if any publicity was generated? Or, is that stating the wishes of the parents?

Sometimes publicity has the opposite effect of the desired intention. Drive her further away?

So now I am wondering, there should be two sets of parents concerned here. The fiance's parents, this was their future daughter-in-law. This surely had to be big news in social circles, local businesses, etc. on SI.
BBM

BBM

Don't mean to sound harsh, but ultimately would rest upon Sylvia's family, and LE depending upon who Sylvia was and what info LE may or may not have been privy to about her family dynamics.

Son isn't missing. No grandchild involved. Fiance's family>less at stake.

bbm: Yes, agreed. Mother stated Sylvia was depressed and had a fight with fiance on PR. We are told she was not speaking to her father for three days prior. --And additionally, the unknown pieces?

But if she sincerely went missing, her future family would be heartbroken, too? The fiance would be racked with guilt for having had a fight with her and heartbroken, too? That night created a whole new set of dynamics.

 

[Dushi]

Originally Posted by rosemadderlake View Post
bbm: I wonder if at the time of the police report filing they were asked if any publicity was generated? Or, is that stating the wishes of the parents?

Sometimes publicity has the opposite effect of the desired intention. Drive her further away?

So now I am wondering, there should be two sets of parents concerned here. The fiance's parents, this was their future daughter-in-law. This surely had to be big news in social circles, local businesses, etc. on SI.
BBM




bbm: Yes, agreed. Mother stated Sylvia was depressed. She was not speaking to her father and had a fight with her fiance. --And additionally, the unknown pieces?

But if she sincerely went missing, her future family would be heartbroken, too? The fiance would be racked with guilt for having had a fight with her and heartbroken, too? That night created a whole new set of dynamics.[/QUOTE]



I think that would be an accurate assumption

An engaged couple are making plans to spend their lives together
The loss of a partner should be heartbreaking
A life altering event

 

[Jmoose]

BBM

Don't mean to sound harsh, but ultimately would rest upon Sylvia's family, and LE depending upon who Sylvia was and what info LE may or may not have been privy to about her family dynamics.

Son isn't missing. No grandchild involved. Fiance's family>less at stake.

Fiance's family did have much less at stake, unless they cared deeply about her. The dynamics between all involved, as you said, are ultra important here

 

[Jmoose]

I just found Sylvia's father's WWII enlistment record - he was born in 1914 (died 1993), was living in New Jersey in 1942 and is listed as "Single, with dependents."

Does that mean he had children from another marriage prior to WWII?

I wonder if he met Sylvia's mother while stationed in Germany, where they stayed for awhile and had Sylvia. Her mother was born in 1927 (died 2007) so she was 13 years younger than him and was only 15 when he enlisted...

Are dependents only children? Could he have been supporting his parents, for example?

 

[epiphany]

One cannot force others to behave nor act in a certain manner then, as now. So it was left to those who loved her most deeply to take action.

It is NYC and 1975, not during the 50s or even 60s.

And as posted above, exactly who may have last spotted Sylvia on the 7th of September? Could have been as early as just after midnight, etc. on the 7th. And if so, where?

ETA: NamUs states went to movie w/fiance on the Sept. 6th, but was last seen on Sept. 7: 18:30

 

[epiphany]

I just found Sylvia's father's WWII enlistment record - he was born in 1914 (died 1993), was living in New Jersey in 1942 and is listed as "Single, with dependents."

Does that mean he had children from another marriage prior to WWII?

I wonder if he met Sylvia's mother while stationed in Germany, where they stayed for awhile and had Sylvia. Her mother was born in 1927 (died 2007) so she was 13 years younger than him and was only 15 when he enlisted...

Pertinent to Sylvia's family dynamics, as well as lack of publicity, usually expected info/basic facts available or known about a missing college-educated 22yo in 1975 NYC, etc.:

What was the date of Sylvia's parents' marriage?

 

[Jmoose]

One cannot force others to behave nor act in a certain manner then, as now. So it was left to those who loved her most deeply to take action.

It is NYC and 1975, not during the 50s or even 60s.

And as posted above, exactly who may have last spotted Sylvia on the 7th of September? Could have been as early as just after midnight, etc. on the 7th. And if so, where?

I know I put the discrepancy out there, but I wonder if it is correct? If it is, then it's certainly significant. I hate it when I chase something, only to find out that it was nothing! There is such a lack of details here ad I wonder if we will be able to fill in any of the blanks?

 

[Jmoose]

I was looking at the actual police report, and it looks to me like the report originally says that she was last seen on 9/7 at 6:00pm, but it looks like somebody wrote over the date, and same with the date of the report-could be the officer who took the report messed up the dates or somebody went back and changed them later. I don't think she was reported to have been seen after the fiance said she left the car.

 

[epiphany]

I was looking at the actual police report, and it looks to me like the report originally says that she was last seen on 9/7 at 6:00pm, but it looks like somebody wrote over the date, and same with the date of the report-could be the officer who took the report messed up the dates or somebody went back and changed them later. I don't think she was reported to have been seen after the fiance said she left the car.

NamUs states Sylvia went to see a movie w/fiance on Sept. 6.

Yet, NamUs: Sylvia was last seen on Sept. 7 @ 18:30 (6 PM).

Date Info Entered on NamUs was in 2010. May have previously withheld the info. about where she was seen and by whom. Unsure who though. Could have been withheld by anyone: family, LE, witness, etc. Could be error. No verification---can only speculate.

Movie was a little on the early side, IMO, for engaged young adults on a Saturday night.

Then, there's the PR, as you say...

 

[Jmoose]

NamUs states Sylvia went to see a movie w/fiance on Sept. 6.

Yet, NamUs: Sylvia was last seen on Sept. 7 @ 18:30 (6 PM).

Date Info Entered on NamUs was in 2010. May have previously withheld the info.

Movie was a little on the early side, IMO, for engaged young adults on a Saturday night.

Then, there's the PR, as you say...

The NamUs report is what originally made me say "What"? I don't know if there was actually any new info, or if there was just some confusion with the police report, because if you look at the actual report, it looks like the date last seen was 9/7/1975, at 6:00pm. Then it looks like somebody changed it to 9/6/1975, which makes more sense because that was Saturday. Not that you can't go to the movies on a Sunday night, but...

 

[epiphany]

The NamUs report is what originally made me say "What"? I don't know if there was actually any new info, or if there was just some confusion with the police report, because if you look at the actual report, it looks like the date last seen was 9/7/1975, at 6:00pm. Then it looks like somebody changed it to 9/6/1975, which makes more sense because that was Saturday. Not that you can't go to the movies on a Sunday night, but...

Sylvia leaves family home with fiance in car early Saturday evening, 9/6/1975.

Unconfirmed/Not Verified: Fiance arrives at Sylvia's home at about 10:30 PM to say they had an argument AND/OR to speak to her, perhaps, thinking she may have returned home.

Unconfirmed/Not Verified: Mother drives around searching for Sylvia on the 6th after fiancee's visit. Father remains home at this time. BF does not search.

Mother arrives at local precinct (Was Father with her?) to report daughter missing the following day, 9/7---(Written over, as well.) sometime before 5 PM. Det. Lennon "will not handle case at 4:45 PM."

NamUs June 2010: Discrepancies about when last seen...

Easy enough to correct with NamUs, OR

Was Sylvia reportedly last seen on 9/7 @ 6 PM by some unreported/unidentified person...Possibly became known and/or recorded after Mother left the precinct?

Creative Liberty: I Dunno.

 

[epiphany]

Notice Sylvia Lwowski's birthday will be in a few weeks...April 28.

Let's Go! Let's Go!

Post to the thread enough, and hoping that will inspire an old friend or two to step aboard and join us! Stranger things have happened.

I don't know why, but I am hoping for a girlfriend. A different perspective. That's the way it was back then...in the boroughs. GFs remember things like that: a friend's BD you came-of-age with in the old days, in the old neighborhood even though you may not have heard from them in years...you don't forget. Do you?

 

[epiphany]

No sisters. There must have been a soon-to-be maid of honor, a bridesmaid or two.

Engagement announcement in paper, marrying on the earlier side of age-range for college-educated female, still living at home...not "moved in" with BF...

Did she usually return home each night to the parents home? Did she have to?

Many of us did not come home every night in those days, and at a much younger age than 22!

 

[epiphany]

NamUs generated report dated June 2010 actually indicates she was last seen a half-hour later, not 6 PM:

6:30 PM (18:30) on Sept. 7, 1975
That's full 30 min after hour indicated on the PR.
2 discrepancies.

https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/case_report_html/7574

 

[epiphany]

I mention her GFs because there's no sister available to cover for her, IF necessary, so-to-speak. She's 22 and seemingly living up to "expectations." Engagement announcement in media, going to legally marry, attended college, living at home, expected to sleep home each night, etc...

Where did the couple go when they wanted to be alone...any GFs on their own? renting their own places, in/out of borough?