NY NY - Sylvia Lwowski, 22, Staten Island, 6 Sept 1975 - #1

[Odyssey]

Thanks for the perspective on it-I have never submitted any possible matches, and thought that LE would be in charge of the submissions. So then, it is not possible that LE would have said something like-"don't bother checking that match because she is missing voluntarily", or something like that? I don't think I am asking that question right, but hopefully you know what I mean

She has a DNA sample on file, so I wouldn't think that anyone in LE is trying not to have her found. Of course, the DNA would have been collected (from a family member) more recently since DNA was not available in 1975.

The 'don't bother' attitude may have been from the officers in the 70's but the ones there today surely have to realize she's been missing for 37 years and take it a bit more seriously...

 

[epiphany]

Odyssey, given your deeper familiarity with the area, maybe you can help me with this. I remember class differences running pretty deep on SI, as distinguished by the neighborhood you lived in. If indeed SL and her BF/F went to different high schools, would Tottenville High School and Port Richmind represent different social classes at that time? It would be interesting to see a map of the different neighborhoods. I vaguely remember a more blue collar neighborhood being closer to the NJ side, on the inland portion of the island.

Re the part BBM (and a little OT), your recollection of this and epiphany's thoughts about the Geraldo expose of Willowbrook brought all of that back to me as well. The conditions at Willowbrook were dreadful.

BBM

Sylvia's address would be Great Kills neighborhood and fiancee's address would be Port Richmond (Port R. "Center" in engagement announcement---don't know if that is slightly different from Port R).

I don't know what the social/class distinctions would be, if any, between the neighborhoods in 1975, but what I did note is that both Sylvia and her fiance had/were attending private colleges.

Had one or both received scholarship monies to the private colleges they had attended or were attending?

Is one or the other from an upper middle income family?

From the PR info provided by Sylvia's mother, we learn she did not appear to be employed (in the event of repayment of any college loans).

True, both appear to have been commuter students, but attending private college even in 1975 was still much more expensive than a CUNY/SUNY selection.

Scholarships? Loans?

Or a combination of scholarship/s and loans for one or the other, or both?

Interruption of post-graduate education plans? Interruption of career goals? Desire to postpone starting a family due to begin repayment of loans for one or both private college educations?

 

[epiphany]

Other unanswered questions:

Ethnicity on PR: Germany
Father: unconfirmed life-long military man

-Did Sylvia have a Passport, and if so, was it missing or found in the home?

-It's SI, not Manhattan or parts of Brooklyn...Did Sylvia have a Driver's License? If so, was her driver's license with her, and therefore, missing?

 

[GoingByMyGut]

I, too, am in that age range (i was 55 years old last week)-NY and NJ both allowed drinking at the age of 18 for a while-think it stopped maybe around 1980 or so.
This should have been relatively easy for LE to figure out, if they were inclined to do so. It sounds like they considered this a case of "left voluntarily" and never looked at anything. Just the social security number alone-it is really impossible to function without one in a normal sense ( I know, it's possible to fly below the radar, but not optimally, and she is a college educated person who would likely want to have a bank acct, credit cards, and a house someday)

OT: I turned 57 last week, fellow Pisces Did we age on the same day? Mine was 3/13.

 

[GoingByMyGut]

Does anyone else think that if somebody left their family behind willingly, they might actually Google themselves to see what is out there about themselves? If she is out there somewhere, then she knows her family was looking for her. I don't know, but I do think she isn't out there, living her life.

Re the part BBM: Man, how sad would it be to do that and find so little -- and no one looking? Unless that's what she wanted ....

 

[GoingByMyGut]

One would think that by now there would be a few words in the official documentation about what her fiance stated the argument was about. That must have been told to LE, and to Sylvia's parents.

Wonder why that has been left out for so many decades. Interesting.

That makes me lean towards a possible pregnancy, but wonder why that would be withheld if something more sinister than she left on her own accord occurred.

I cannot discount that at this time without more info.

Re the part BBM: I could also see the mother being very embarrassed if the father kicked SL out. Dirty laundry -- big issue back then, esp. for immigrants (and I am not sure how to read that word "nativity" -- unless "native of"?). Sure, a pregnancy is as dirty as it gets, but I have trouble with a bio major getting pregnant twice. The pill was readily available by this time, if not from your family physician, that from a PP clinic.

 

[GoingByMyGut]

Some further observations after reading the excellent input from everyone, here. The fleshing out of this era and location are taking shape. Even though it doesn’t seem like this woman could still be alive, she well might be.

• Viet Nam American exit 1973-1975. -

• Drinking age- 18 in 1974, disco era in full swing but big clubs like Studio 54, Mudd Club, etc. opened in the late 70’s. -Dancing was big time fun back then.

• Roe vs Wade – 1973. Abortion is a still a hot bed of controversy, today but back then it was total heartbreak, compounded with shame decision. Could Sylvia’s first abortion compel her to become engaged to quell the “shame” of her family, and society’s shame? She was pregnant at the time of her disappearance? (Sorry if I am dense). This was a very confusing time for women, men, and especially traditional families. Things like living out of wedlock and abortion tore some families apart.

IMO -I feel a more filled out portrait of Sylvia’s family and friends will give some clues. (all imo)

• -Her father. Perhaps a really complex relationship here, drinking, inappropriate behavior at party is contrasted with disciplined, contained military training. Father is a military man. -Traditional family? -Strong feelings about counter culture? This divide was so great, some kids were excommunicated from their families if they didn’t ‘straighten up and fly right’.

• -Her mother. What was her relationship like with her mother? Could she talk to her mom about her troubles? Or was she passive in deference to her father? (My mother was my rock and as wild as I was back then I know I could never have broken her heart and run away, forever.)

• -Her brother, younger? Were they close? Dushi, how would one even go about inviting him to a WS discussion? I wouldn’t even know what to say?

• -Her friends. Could they help give a sense of Sylvia’s assertiveness or timidity? Would they protect her? In my short-term rebellious “run-aways”--afternoons, overnights, etc., my friends would never divulge my whereabouts!

• -Her fiancé. I was struck by the quoted language of his description of what happened that night to LE. Did he really talk like that? (“wuz, cuz”) It seems incongruous as he was a Music Ed. Major at NYU?

Sylvia was a beautiful woman in an era of free thinkers, new directions, philosophy and religion. Romance is everywhere. How did her fiancé handle the advances of other men?

I am pretty amazed at how many of us are in Sylvia’s age group. I remember those times as completely tumultuous and creatively brilliant. Those were the days….

I'm not sure it's relevant, but another milestone: 1972 = Title IX
My high school "birthed" girls' soccer and basketball teams overnight.

Re the part BBM: I remember an awful lot of this. My best friend was always fleeing her father's hand. And these crumbling relationships -- the gulf between old and new ways of thinking -- were the primary reason for the runaway culture.

 

[GoingByMyGut]

I was just thinking about other criminals, and being in the wrong place at the wrong time...a criminal named Richard Biegenwald ( referenced here by someone earlier in this case) had been paroled in June 1975. His victims had typically been from NJ, however, several of them had been buried in the yard at his mother's house on Clove Rd, Staten Island-in the Port Richmond section of Staten Island. Hard to tell distance ( length of time walking ), but it didn't seem all that far from fiance's parents' house on College Ave. I don't know how to post the map of Staten Island, though. Biegenwald died in custody in 2008, so no help there with this. All of the bodies attributed to him are identified, and none are Sylvia's, but what if there are more bodies that they never found?

Re the part BBM: Acc. to Richard Biegenwald - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia, "Biegenwald was released in 1974 for good behavior after 16 years imprisonment. ... Biegenwald worked odd jobs for the next three years and kept a low profile." This would actually put him in the ball field. Is your source for 1975 more definitive?

 

[GoingByMyGut]

I don't doubt the source but as you know, that is an opinion only

I expect family and friends have made up their minds because (A)they know more than we do so far or (B) they have had 38 years to think about this and based on opinion and personal feelings, have reached a conclusion. Not what is known but what is felt

I believe intuition is often a good tool

Re the part BBM: In my experience with my grandfather, you just have to let it go. Everyone finds a way of dealing with the unknown that they can live with day-to-day. I think that's what's behind my dad's "distance" about it. He found it easier to say, "If he's alive, and doesn't want to know me, I don't want to know him." In our case, we didn't know any more than anyone else; while some of us have theories we lean toward, not one of us feels it's concluded. Just some thoughts.

 

[GoingByMyGut]

Unfortunately, there are tons of old cases like this, and yes, it is heartbreaking!

I read some of the older threads (1920s, 1930s) this weekend and was surprised to see some of the later generations (like me) looking for family members they barely knew or didn't know. After a while, I just had to shut the computer down. Terribly sad. I can't think of the titles at the moment, but there is a set of two out-of-print books that detail "the missing" in America across time -- one volume for the east coast, another for the west cost. The numbers are staggering, and so many people never get resolution.

Here we go (thank you, Amazon wish list!):
Missing 411 West Coast --Missing 411-Western United States & Canada: Unexplained Disappearances of North Americans that have never been solved

Missing 411 East Coast--Amazon.com: Missing 411- Eastern United States: Unexplained disappearances of North Americans that have never been solved (9781468012620)

Interestingly, used versions are crazy expensive.

 

[Dushi]

Re the part BBM: In my experience with my grandfather, you just have to let it go. Everyone finds a way of dealing with the unknown that they can live with day-to-day. I think that's what's behind my dad's "distance" about it. He found it easier to say, "If he's alive, and doesn't want to know me, I don't want to know him." In our case, we didn't know any more than anyone else; while some of us have theories we lean toward, not one of us feels it's concluded. Just some thoughts.

I am sure her family has learned to deal with their loss
Its been a long time and as you say, we all find a comfort zone in a troubling situation

They did hire a PI, no clue what he may have found
Its apparent that someone out there cares as this thread has been brought back to life
I am glad someone cares..



AND a very happy belated birthday to JMoose and GBMG
The best is yet to come

 

[Saracen]

She has a DNA sample on file, so I wouldn't think that anyone in LE is trying not to have her found. Of course, the DNA would have been collected (from a family member) more recently since DNA was not available in 1975.

The 'don't bother' attitude may have been from the officers in the 70's but the ones there today surely have to realize she's been missing for 37 years and take it a bit more seriously...

But they would only re-open a case if requested to do so by the family i would imagine, and after all this time would they want that?..IDK

 

[Saracen]

OT: I turned 57 last week, fellow Pisces Did we age on the same day? Mine was 3/13.

Spring chickens all of you!:rocker:

 

[GoingByMyGut]

BBM

Sylvia's address would be Great Kills neighborhood and fiancee's address would be Port Richmond (Port R. "Center" in engagement announcement---don't know if that is slightly different from Port R).

I don't know what the social/class distinctions would be, if any, between the neighborhoods in 1975, but what I did note is that both Sylvia and her fiance had/were attending private colleges.

Had one or both received scholarship monies to the private colleges they had attended or were attending?

Is one or the other from an upper middle income family?

From the PR info provided by Sylvia's mother, we learn she did not appear to be employed (in the event of repayment of any college loans).

True, both appear to have been commuter students, but attending private college even in 1975 was still much more expensive than a CUNY/SUNY selection.

Scholarships? Loans?

Or a combination of scholarship/s and loans for one or the other, or both?

Interruption of post-graduate education plans? Interruption of career goals? Desire to postpone starting a family due to begin repayment of loans for one or both private college educations?

So ... another thing about the 1970s. It was the beginning of what's called the second wave of feminism. I sort of feel like our generation was stuck in a time warp between the 50s and today. For example, my mother wanted to me take typing as "job insurance," but my father told me not to or I'd always be "somebody else's secretary." (No problem, I had to "withdraw" from typing because I was failing -- I am a total spaz! Today I use my own hunt-and-peck method and can't look away while I type. F-D-S-A is the stuff of my nightmares!)

So, yes, the point, the point ... in a weird way, a lot of us went to college but never expected to actually work. Many women went to college to FIND a husband, yes, but that's not even what I mean. It was hard to envision raising kids while working because very few women had done it yet. So, being engaged could have had something to do with why SL wasn't working. Couples often planned to start a family right away, and many men didn't want their fiances/wives to work.

Sheez, I feel like my grandmother -- I used to look at her with such awe when she told me about gas lighting and the first cars! I had no idea we'd seen so much change ourselves! :what:

 

[GoingByMyGut]

But they would only re-open a case if requested to do so by the family i would imagine, and after all this time would they want that?..IDK

Aren't detectives sometimes assigned to just cold cases? Maybe it depends on resources and current crime rates? Maybe JMoose can weigh in, given her DH's occupation?

 

[Jmoose]

OT: I turned 57 last week, fellow Pisces Did we age on the same day? Mine was 3/13.

Yes!!! March 13th!

 

[Jmoose]

:what:

Re the part BBM: Acc. to Richard Biegenwald - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia, "Biegenwald was released in 1974 for good behavior after 16 years imprisonment. ... Biegenwald worked odd jobs for the next three years and kept a low profile." This would actually put him in the ball field. Is your source for 1975 more definitive?

I read several sources that said his actual release date was June 1975-parole hearing was, I think, in 1974.

 

[Jmoose]

So ... another thing about the 1970s. It was the beginning of what's called the second wave of feminism. I sort of feel like our generation was stuck in a time warp between the 50s and today. For example, my mother wanted to me take typing as "job insurance," but my father told me not to or I'd always be "somebody else's secretary." (No problem, I had to "withdraw" from typing because I was failing -- I am a total spaz! Today I use my own hunt-and-peck method and can't look away while I type. F-D-S-A is the stuff of my nightmares!)

So, yes, the point, the point ... in a weird way, a lot of us went to college but never expected to actually work. Many women went to college to FIND a husband, yes, but that's not even what I mean. It was hard to envision raising kids while working because very few women had done it yet. So, being engaged could have had something to do with why SL wasn't working. Couples often planned to start a family right away, and many men didn't want their fiances/wives to work.

Sheez, I feel like my grandmother -- I used to look at her with such awe when she told me about gas lighting and the first cars! I had no idea we'd seen so much change ourselves! :what:

Interesting- my sister-in-law went to college in 1969 in the first class of women at a newly coed Franklin and Marshall College, and never worked after graduation (raised 4 children and not interested in working). I went to the same college 8 years later and did work, at least until I had my 2nd baby, then went back to work years later (2 jobs!) I wonder if working was in her plan-info from her surviving family members might be helpful.

 

[Jmoose]

Aren't detectives sometimes assigned to just cold cases? Maybe it depends on resources and current crime rates? Maybe JMoose can weigh in, given her DH's occupation?

I don't know if, in Staten Island, they would have resources that they could devote to just cold cases these days. My policeman works in a busy ( crime-wise) city outside of NYC, and they definitely do not have those kind of resources. NYC may, though

 

[Odyssey]

But they would only re-open a case if requested to do so by the family i would imagine, and after all this time would they want that?..IDK

With the parents deceased, the family would only consist of the brother, as far as I know. I don't know anything about the brother or his situation, and I don't want to judge him, he may have his own problems in life or maybe pushed it out of his mind, who knows...

That is what bothers me the most about this case, it seems that nobody is looking... nobody asking if anyone's seen her... nobody memorializing her... it's like the MP report and an engagement article are the only evidence that she ever existed..