GUILTY OH - Barb Williams for child abuse, Hancock County, 2014

[blue22]

Some teachers have problems with mental illness as well. I know some wonderful teachers and I had some growing up who helped me a lot in life. But there were abusers as well. Even a principal.

Shoot, we had a long time teacher here, who killed a child in a hit and run a few years ago. She went and taught at school the next day. She wasn't caught until a while after.

I know there are great teachers out there, but I think in this current system...they are few. I can think about my whole life in public school (I was in a top 5 district in the state, at the time. I don't know where they hover now.) and I had TWO good teachers. The others fell much closer to the ill prepared and incompetent. The way the teachers union works, it's nearly impossible to fire sub-par teachers. I think they are becoming the majority now, which scares me. The likelihood of a child getting one of the great teachers, is so slim.

 

[human]

Shoot, mwe had a long time teacher here, who killed a child in a hit and run a few years ago. She went and taught at school the next day. She wasn't caught until a while after.

I know there are great teachers out there, but I think in this current system...they are few. I can think about my whole life in public school (I was in a top 5 district in the state, at the time. I don't know where they hover now.) and I had TWO good teachers. The others fell much closer to the ill prepared and incompetent. The way the teachers union works, it's nearly impossible to fire sub-par teachers. I think they are becoming the majority now, which scares me. The likelihood of a child getting one of the great teachers, is so slim.

At one time, teachers were not allowed to be married. That was the best deal of all. 24/7 could be given to the classroom.

Now teachers have families and they buy things with their own money for their classrooms as there is not enough money. They work on evenings and weekends at home doing schoolwork.

They worry about the children they have in their classroom. And we read about teachers who gave their lives or stopped a shooter in their school.

They go with the band or cheerleaders to team sports on weekends and evenings.

They buy food, clothes, and give money for school trips for students.

Are there bad ones out there? Yes. For sure, Just like there are fund managers who steal money from their clients and leave them destitute, super markets that color their rotten meat to sell it, drug companies that sell drugs that they know are killers. And so on and on.

Engage with your child's teacher as a partner. If that is not working, get a different teacher. If that is not possible, discuss strategies with your child. Unfortunately, they will be dealing with all kinds of people through out life.

My granddaughters had a teacher who I truly thought was mentally ill. My niece had the same teacher this year for her daughter and absolutely loved her. We all don't have the same outlooks.

But abusing a child like that teacher did is not OK for any situation.

Maybe a high school student beating another one?

 

[human]

Here is one way that things could change in schools

http://acestoohigh.com/2012/04/23/l...oach-to-school-discipline-expulsions-drop-85/

 

[screecher]

Why wasn't Barb Williams arrested????

http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2014/05/calif_mom_arrested_for_grabbin.html#incart_river

 

[human]

Why wasn't Barb Williams arrested????

http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2014/05/calif_mom_arrested_for_grabbin.html#incart_river

I have no idea what the laws are in Ohio.

I hope that LE is reviewing all info in order to arrest her with the proper charges.

Who knows? Most of us cannot understand how she would not be arrested and charged with something.

 

[killarney rose]

I have no idea what the laws are in Ohio.

I hope that LE is reviewing all info in order to arrest her with the proper charges.

Who knows? Most of us cannot understand how she would not be arrested and charged with something.

Why?because all we know about the situation is what we have seen on a video(and that is certainly incriminating). We don't know the entire story.

Most members here are ready to string the teacher up.a couple of us feel she lost it after a trying year with a child who wouldn't obey the rules.

Reality is most likely that the truth is somewhere in the middle. She most likely doesn't deserve to be arrested. But she also most likely needs to face some action on her job, most likely she needs to retire at this point. She doesn't, IMHO need to be in the classroom anymore.

If there is evidence supporting charges and arrest, she will be charged and arrested. If not, she won't.but what does not need to happen is a witch hunt.

 

[human]

Why?because all we know about the situation is what we have seen on a video(and that is certainly incriminating). We don't know the entire story.

Most members here are ready to string the teacher up.a couple of us feel she lost it after a trying year with a child who wouldn't obey the rules.

Reality is most likely that the truth is somewhere in the middle. She most likely doesn't deserve to be arrested. But she also most likely needs to face some action on her job, most likely she needs to retire at this point. She doesn't, IMHO need to be in the classroom anymore.

If there is evidence supporting charges and arrest, she will be charged and arrested. If not, she won't.but what does not need to happen is a witch hunt.

As a retired teacher, I feel sympathy for teachers because of criticism that is absurd and degrading. Won't go into all of that.

The boy in the video is a tiny child. She is a grown woman. If he was beating another child, maybe I could see it, but not really.

I think it is telling that a fellow teacher reported it. That implies to me that this behavior on the teacher's part is nothing new. OF course, I am only guessing on that.

Once again, I think the administration has some explaining to do

 

[gitana1]

Why?because all we know about the situation is what we have seen on a video(and that is certainly incriminating). We don't know the entire story.

Most members here are ready to string the teacher up.a couple of us feel she lost it after a trying year with a child who wouldn't obey the rules.

Reality is most likely that the truth is somewhere in the middle. She most likely doesn't deserve to be arrested. But she also most likely needs to face some action on her job, most likely she needs to retire at this point. She doesn't, IMHO need to be in the classroom anymore.

If there is evidence supporting charges and arrest, she will be charged and arrested. If not, she won't.but what does not need to happen is a witch hunt.

Witch hunt implies mass hysteria and unfounded allegations. We don't need any other "part of the story" than what we have seen. An educator, entrusted with the care of children, put her hands on a child who is three times smaller than her, in a violent manner. No amount of "provocation" mitigates against such an assault.

Here is the law that covers this educator's actions. Note that under section (C) (1) (d) it could be considered a fifth degree felony: codes.ohio.gov/orc/2903.13
http://www.criminaldefenselawyer.co...fense/violent-crime/ohio-assault-battery-laws

Historically, there have been special rules, written and unwritten, regarding violence against children in our society. For some reason, even though they are much smaller and more dependent emotionally and mentally than adults, there is a pervasive attitude in our society that violence against kids is not as bad as violence against adults.

Thus, in Ohio, domestic violence and child endangerment laws expressly exclude parents and guardians (not school teachers), from using corporal punishment, even if, in some cases, it leaves marks.

Yes, the law in Ohio does not exclude this woman from criminal liability for her actions here. However, underlying attitudes might.

If this was a videotape of this woman doing the very same thing against an elderly man, there would be no one defending her. If this was a videotape of a large man doing this very same thing against a smaller woman, there would be no one defending him.

If this was a videotape of a woman doing this to another woman who had been in the first woman's face, screaming vile things and jabbing her finger in her face (eg. recent case occurring on Dancemoms), there would be multiple people screaming that despite any and all provocations, putting one's hands on another person is chargeable assault.

But we see the same thing happening to a baby at the hands of a much larger adult? It is a "witch hunt" if people demand her arrest.

This makes no sense to me.

 

[screecher]

Why?because all we know about the situation is what we have seen on a video(and that is certainly incriminating). We don't know the entire story.

Most members here are ready to string the teacher up.a couple of us feel she lost it after a trying year with a child who wouldn't obey the rules.

Reality is most likely that the truth is somewhere in the middle. She most likely doesn't deserve to be arrested. But she also most likely needs to face some action on her job, most likely she needs to retire at this point. She doesn't, IMHO need to be in the classroom anymore.

If there is evidence supporting charges and arrest, she will be charged and arrested. If not, she won't.but what does not need to happen is a witch hunt.

BBM

Yeppers. We all saw the video. We all saw what she did. Excepting when she dragged the kid into a blind spot. Still want to know if she was asked what happened while there and if not, why the hell not? She assaulted a little boy. Committed an illegal act. No different than the mother in the link. She was arrested

To second bold. What shouldn't be happening is Barb Williams and others like her, losing it because their job is too stressful for them. I'm hoping these educators know enough how to take care of themselves when thy feel they are 'losing' it. Gah.

Children are maimed, beaten and murdered Every. Single. Day. Because people 'lose' it.

 

[gitana1]

I totally agree, chaotic. It seems like most of the public is unaware of what things look like if they don't get to watch them on video.

I don't know what precipitated this incident, but that's how kids are dealt with in my experience who do things like purposely push other kids off play equipment, or continuously leave the classroom while the teacher is ordering them not to leave the classroom, or throw someone's lunch in the toilet, etc. This is how they're dealt with - and I honestly think that's not a bad way to deal with a kid in serious discipline cases like the above.

If this was for no reason whatsoever, I agree that the teacher should be let go.

It seems odd that you can't learn the circumstances.

It is never a good way to deal with a kid in serious discipline cases, to grab him or her by the neck, or yank them up in the air forcing their neck to flop backwards or to hit a wall. Such could lead to serious, permanent injury. Anyone who believes this is appropriate discipline of a child should never be around children.

 

[killarney rose]

All these responses are exactly what I meant. SMH...people ready to string her up w/o knowing the entire story. The video while showing she is clearly in the wrong, is only part of it. Hopefully the school administrators as well as LE are thoroughly investigating the entire incident before proceeding........backing,away once again.

 

[AnaTeresa]

All these responses are exactly what I meant. SMH...people ready to string her up w/o knowing the entire story. The video while showing she is clearly in the wrong, is only part of it. Hopefully the school administrators as well as LE are thoroughly investigating the entire incident before proceeding........backing,away once again.

What more do you need to know? Even if this child was hell on wheels in the classroom - there's still no call for her actions that we see on the video. She is an adult. He is a very small child. Anyone who can look at that video and think that there might be some justification for her actions greatly concerns me.

 

[JeannaT]

It is never a good way to deal with a kid in serious discipline cases, to grab him or her by the neck, or yank them up in the air forcing their neck to flop backwards or to hit a wall. Such could lead to serious, permanent injury. Anyone who believes this is appropriate discipline of a child should never be around children.

If you're suggesting that I think this is the perfect way to deal with a child, you've misunderstood me.

Years ago I trained volunteers who would be working in a mentor type program with elementary kids, and taking them out in public where sometimes, with this population, you DO have to grab and restrain them. I taught them if you have to restrain a child, grab them by one forearm - and ONLY one forearm - because that way you can't possibly shake them, even accidentally. You can only hold them in place to keep them from running off or speak directly in their face at their level.

I certainly understand the danger of a person's neck flopping back like that.

I also don't believe she had any intention of injuring that child.

Have you seen parents react if they've been searching frantically for a child and then when they finally find them? If the child is as old as that one, it's usually a rageful response from worry and caring.

We don't know how long this child had been gone, or where in the school building she finally found him. Her reaction of anger is typical, in my opinion, although the physical grabbing and lifting of him was very inappropriate and dangerous.

I get the feeling, though. I have a wanderer and it's hard not to pinch their little head off when you finally find them safe.

 

[screecher]

All these responses are exactly what I meant. SMH...people ready to string her up w/o knowing the entire story. The video while showing she is clearly in the wrong, is only part of it. Hopefully the school administrators as well as LE are thoroughly investigating the entire incident before proceeding........backing,away once again.

BBM

What rest of the story? What would excuse, mitigate a criminal act?

 

[MyBelle]

All these responses are exactly what I meant. SMH...people ready to string her up w/o knowing the entire story. The video while showing she is clearly in the wrong, is only part of it. Hopefully the school administrators as well as LE are thoroughly investigating the entire incident before proceeding........backing,away once again.

Are you kidding? The rest of the story is irrelevant. May I supply the rope? If I see an adult do this to a child, I'll call 9-1-1. The school should have called 9-1-1.

This wasn't an isolated incident. It was escalating. She was out of control.

The tragic death of baby Cash Bell could have been prevented if only a preschool had contacted authorities. Instead of reporting a child care teacher to police after she was witnessed abusing children, the center fired her and that was it. Because they failed to report the abuse, the teacher got a job as Cash's nanny. She tossed him down a flight of stairs. When his parents got to the hospital and were told the true extent of his injuries, the baby's father vomited. Cash was removed from life support five days later while in his mother's arms. Nanny was convicted and faced 20 years to life. She received 70 years to life. I think if stringing her up was an option, the Judge would have used it.

No excuse for violence upon a child by a teacher.

JMO

http://www.omaha.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20140311/NEWS/140319667/1707

 

[believe09]

Respectfully, there is nothing more to the story imo except what happened to the little boy after she followed him into the bathroom. I will read back and see if there is any additional information regarding it.

I cant imagine any exigent circumstances here that would justify this, excuse this or even adequately explain it.

 

[JeannaT]

[modsnip]

You don't even know what population I'm referring to. Reread, please.

The whole point of that paragraph was to defend myself against the idea that I have no idea how to properly restrain a child, or that I don't understand you shouldn't whip a child's neck back.

*peace*

On second thought, I think a teacher or other volunteer responsible for a group of elementary school children out in public HAS to be told a proper restraint. You get kids in fights, you get kids who are trying to run in traffic, you get kids who are throwing rocks at other kids or stuff like that. You have to be told how to handle that to keep them, and others, safe. You can't just stand there and say now Pete, please stop doing that this instant. Physical intervention is a tool you have to know how to use, even if you use it rarely in groups of mainstream kids, if you are the one in charge of the group.

 

[JeannaT]

Uhh, a certain population of people DO LACK civility and self control!

People with emotional or cognitive disorders, personality disorders, traumatic brain injury DO lack those things. And you have to be prepared to face that in the least injurious way.

Similarly, kindergartners often also lack self-control. It's about being immature. They often lack self-control and civility, as a normal part of maturing.

And you have to be able to deal with a kid who picks up a rock and threatens to throw it at another kid.

 

[MissJ]

Even in a psych hospital you can't restrain just anyone....so use of the word "restrain" is odd to me. JMO.

 

[JeannaT]

No, you can't restrain "just anyone". There are specific procedures and policies in place for when restraints are appropriate, by whom, and for what behaviors and lengths of time and who needs to be present and notified.

I don't work in that field anymore so I'm sure they've changed. The population I worked with wasn't in a psyche ward, but rather, in the public in public settings where it was necessary to know how to physically hold a kid in place. Like a mother would, actually, when warranted. It's sort of irrelevant, really, to this discussion.

This is really a rabbit trail. The whole thing is, when you are in charge of a kinder class I'm sure there are specific ways that you are allowed to restrain children who are temporarily a danger to themselves or others.

And the whole point of this very long rabbit trail is, if you have to hold a kinder child in place it's best to hold them by one forearm.

I certainly didn't expect this to go on and on with that observation -