OH Pike Co., 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #57

[Loomis124]

Double post deleted

 

[Cool Cats]

At least two were from what was said in GWIV’s hearing. Drill bits were bought for to different calibers.

First "murder kit" purchase 2-26-16 from:

Invoice from Tactical Innovations Inc. Billed to Jake Wagner 260 Peterson Rd. Colt numerex 1911 thread adapter thread protectors for 1 quantity Colt nunerex 1911. 22 Long Rifle.

Other purchases made after that:

Maglite flashlights generic versions.

Many parts for suppressors for 2 different caliber guns were purchased based on the instructions of how to make these that the Wagners used. Evidence shows they were purchasing items to make suppressors for both a 22 caliber long rifle and a 40 caliber gun.

Drill bit size diameters compared to the caliber of the guns, shows suppressor items being bought for both a 22 and 40. (Jake's 22 and GW4's 40 Glock opinion)

Early April 2016 a Google search was done on Angie's laptop that is registered to Jake, BCI thinks Angie and Jake both looked things up on this laptop plus that GW4 likely sometimes did as well but there is no proof to show GW4 did.

The search was for a a solvent trap/catcher and is a firearm barrel cleaning accessory that can catch cleaning solvent but can easily be turned into a suppressor.

These supplies were bought on line with Jake's rewards card but they also went to local auto parts stores and using cash bought 10 freeze plugs that suppress sound,
SKS Magazine, SKS ammo for a 30 caliber gun, masks, bug detector - counter surveillance items, brass catcher, AKS Mag big nuts, other nuts, AR15 is mentioned.

Here is how they linked the suppressor found in the Wagner's well to the Wagners:

The aluminum maglite flashlight tube that was found in the Wagner well in their barn, was fashioned into a suppressor. The serial number proves the maglite was bought while the Wagners were living there, on 260 Peterson Rd., because they recovered the serial # which proves the maglite flashlight - turned suppressor - was manufactured in January 2016. No one but the Wagners lived there at that time so the point is that it wasn't thrown into the well by the previous owners.

They also found that the suppressor was fired at least once and the bullet strike inside contained some of the parts the Wagners purchased on line.

All the items they bought on line, in stores, Glock 40 off Facebook, all the items they used Jake's rewards card for and used cash for etc... all this, plus the 1911.22 gun, 40 Glock, shoes, etc... everything GONE, unaccounted for, disappeared. None of this was recovered according to testimony at the hearing.

Buying all this is evidence plus the fact that they can't account for any of it is circumstantial evidence in my opinion. Why did the Wagers buy all this stuff? Why is all this stuff gone?
What is the defense's answer? No answer yet.

(Special Agent Scheiderer's cross examination testimony from my notes of the hearing. These are just notes, not all word for word, not perfect.)

 

[Loomis124]

Question: If evidence is sealed, it would not have been disclosed at
GW4'S last hearing, correct?

 

[Cool Cats]

Question: If evidence is sealed, it would not have been disclosed at
GW4'S last hearing, correct?

Right. It's sealed to keep it from being revealed to the public. Like you see all these Motions and Journal Entries listed for GW4 on the Court Docket that we can read but we can't see these 2 sealed Motions and these 2 sealed Journal Entries.

06/30/2020 ENTRY -- THE ENVELOPE TO WHICH THIS JOURNAL ENTRY IS ATTACHED CONTAINS 2 MOTIONS AND 2 JOURNAL ENTRIES FILED UNDER SEAL WITH THE JUDGE OF THIS COURT ON JUNE 30, 2020;

IT IS ORDERED THAT THE CLERK OF COURTS SHALL HOLD THE CONTENTS OF THE ENVELOPE UNDER SEAL, AND THAT THE ENVELOPE SHALL NOT BE OPENED AND THE CONTENTS OF THE ENVELOPE SHALL NOT BE DISCLOSED, EXCEPT UNDER ORDER OF THIS COURT OR UPON THE ORDER OF A COURT OF JURISDICTION SUPERIOR TO THIS COURT

 

[Cool Cats]

********* RED ALERT *********

WAGNER, IV, GEORGE WASHINGTON

09/17/2020

MOTION TO WITHDRAW AS COUNSEL FOR DEFENDANT FILED Attorney: KNIGHT, CHARLES H

 

[NotHammerToed]

********* RED ALERT *********

WAGNER, IV, GEORGE WASHINGTON

09/17/2020

MOTION TO WITHDRAW AS COUNSEL FOR DEFENDANT FILED Attorney: KNIGHT, CHARLES H

The plot thickens.

 

[Loomis124]

Right. It's sealed to keep it from being revealed to the public. Like you see all these Motions and Journal Entries listed for GW4 on the Court Docket that we can read but we can't see these 2 sealed Motions and these 2 sealed Journal Entries.

06/30/2020 ENTRY -- THE ENVELOPE TO WHICH THIS JOURNAL ENTRY IS ATTACHED CONTAINS 2 MOTIONS AND 2 JOURNAL ENTRIES FILED UNDER SEAL WITH THE JUDGE OF THIS COURT ON JUNE 30, 2020;

IT IS ORDERED THAT THE CLERK OF COURTS SHALL HOLD THE CONTENTS OF THE ENVELOPE UNDER SEAL, AND THAT THE ENVELOPE SHALL NOT BE OPENED AND THE CONTENTS OF THE ENVELOPE SHALL NOT BE DISCLOSED, EXCEPT UNDER ORDER OF THIS COURT OR UPON THE ORDER OF A COURT OF JURISDICTION SUPERIOR TO THIS COURT

So...even if guns were found,
Scheiderer couldn't tell the truth.

 

[Cool Cats]

So...even if guns were found,
Scheiderer couldn't tell the truth.

The defense knows what is under seal being kept away from the public. If guns were found and that information was being kept under seal then the defense would know not to ask that direct question because then the entire public would know.

If the defense asked it anyway it would be up to Canepa to object, and ultimately up to the Judge if Scheiderer could answer. Scheiderer could not reveal sealed information without the Judge's OK.

This is opinion only but one reason I think this is because of what happened at the hearing. Scheiderer was asked a question and he wasn't comfortable in answering the question so Judge Deering gave him official permission to answer the question. Then Scheiderer answered it.

 

[Myland]

Jmo I don’t know anything about guns even though there is many in my home, but why does it say 1911.22 long rifle. I thought rifle was a long gun.

 

[Loomis124]

The defense knows what is under seal being kept away from the public. If guns were found and that information was being kept under seal then the defense would know not to ask that direct question because then the entire public would know.

If the defense asked it anyway it would be up to Canepa to object, and ultimately up to the Judge if Scheiderer could answer. Scheiderer could not reveal sealed information without the Judge's OK.

This is opinion only but one reason I think this is because of what happened at the hearing. Scheiderer was asked a question and he wasn't comfortable in answering the question so Judge Deering gave him official permission to answer the question. Then Scheiderer answered it.

Which question was that?

I watched the whole thing again today, and the only thing I heard brought up to the Judge by the Defense was permission for Scheiderer to speak about the wiretaps.

Also, all search warrants and findings are under seal.

 

[Cool Cats]

Which question was that?

I watched the whole thing again today, and the only thing I heard brought up to the Judge by the Defense was permission for Scheiderer to speak about the wiretaps.

Also, all search warrants and findings are under seal.

Thanks, I couldn't remember what the line of questioning was, but you say wiretaps. Scheiderer is smart, making sure he can answer a certain line of questioning by getting the Judge's OK.

 

[Johnny B Bad]

Which question was that?

I watched the whole thing again today, and the only thing I heard brought up to the Judge by the Defense was permission for Scheiderer to speak about the wiretaps.

Also, all search warrants and findings are under seal.

Loomis
Please go to 42:18 and listen to when GW4s attorney ask about the 22 and you will see that the prosecution has the 22 pistol, JMO

 

[Johnny B Bad]

So if George Wagner iv attorney Knight with draws from the case, is that a mistrial for GW4????

 

[ColMustard]

Jmo I don’t know anything about guns even though there is many in my home, but why does it say 1911.22 long rifle. I thought rifle was a long gun.

.22 long rifle - .22 is the caliber, long rifle refers to the length of the bullet cartridge, has more powder in it.

.22 cal used to come in .22 short, .22 long, and .22 long rifle, but I haven't seen shorts or longs in decades.

.22 long rifle will work in most handguns. There's also a .22 magnum that's even longer yet, and there's a pocket revolver that will shoot those.

See if this pic works:

From the left, .22 Short, .22 LR, .22 Winchester Magnum Rimfire, and .22 Hornet

 

[Caylee Advocate]

Jmo I don’t know anything about guns even though there is many in my home, but why does it say 1911.22 long rifle. I thought rifle was a long gun.

Rule of thumb..... all rifles are long guns but all long guns are not rifles.

 

[ColMustard]

So if George Wagner iv attorney Knight with draws from the case, is that a mistrial for GW4????

Make me think the attorney doesn't want to proceed with a not guilty plea.

 

[Loomis124]

So if George Wagner iv attorney Knight with draws from the case, is that a mistrial for GW4????

Lol, George wishes.

 

[Loomis124]

Thanks, I couldn't remember what the line of questioning was, but you say wiretaps. Scheiderer is smart, making sure he can answer a certain line of questioning by getting the Judge's OK.

The defense attorney is who brought it to the Judge's attention.

 

[OhioBlues]

Jmo I don’t know anything about guns even though there is many in my home, but why does it say 1911.22 long rifle. I thought rifle was a long gun.

The main differences between rifles, shotguns, and handguns are their barrels, their intended targets, and the type of ammunition used.

• Rifle
  • The rifle has a long barrel with rifling and thick walls to withstand high pressures. Rifling puts a spiral spin on a bullet fired from a rifle, increasing accuracy and distance.
  • Rifles are typically used for firing at stationary targets.
  • The bore of a rifle barrel is made for only one specific caliber of ammunition.
• Shotgun
  • The shotgun has a long barrel and usually has a smooth bore to reduce friction. The barrel’s walls are thinner due to reduced pressures. If a shotgun is designed to fire slugs, it might have a rifled barrel.
  • Shotguns are typically used for shooting at moving targets in the air.
  • The bore of a shotgun barrel is made for only one specific gauge of ammunition.
• Handgun
  • The handgun has a short barrel with rifling and thick walls to withstand high pressures. Because of the short barrel, extra care must be taken to control the muzzle of a handgun. Like the rifle, rifling in the handgun puts a spiral spin on a bullet when fired, increasing accuracy and distance.
  • Handguns are typically used for firing at stationary targets.
  • The bore of a handgun barrel is usually made for only one specific caliber of ammunition.

Glossary
caliber
Diameter of the bore of a rifle or handgun as measured from land to opposite land on rifled barrels and the designation for the size of ammunition for different bores
rifling
Spiral grooves cut into the bore of a firearm barrel together with the lands—the ridges of metal between the grooves; rifling makes a bullet spin in flight, increasing accuracy and distance

Differences Between Rifles, Shotguns, and Handguns

 

[Loomis124]

.22 long rifle - .22 is the caliber, long rifle refers to the length of the bullet cartridge, has more powder in it.

.22 cal used to come in .22 short, .22 long, and .22 long rifle, but I haven't seen shorts or longs in decades.

.22 long rifle will work in most handguns. There's also a .22 magnum that's even longer yet, and there's a pocket revolver that will shoot those.

Yes, I totally agree. After researching and listening to the hearing four times, it's more about the size of the bullet than the size of the gun.

Definition of BALLISTICS