OH Pike Co., 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #59

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  • #561
I quit posting on this thread quite some time ago but do still follow along and a "like" just wasn't enough for this post... I love it!

@Caylee Advocate - you say things ohhh so eloquently! :D

Good point! Do keep in mind, however, if someone on a podcast reveals new or "inside" information about the case or evidence, it should be presumed unreliable because there is a gag order. If no one close to the case is discussing the details, there's no way for podcast hosts to access "inside" information.

Just a helpful hint. :)
 
  • #562
When AC and RS are discussing the video footage of Angela Wagner at Walmart, they mention that when Angela leaves the store, she's picked up by someone driving the black Ford Excursion. They mention that Angela previously owned a Ford Excursion, that it was titled in her name. So it makes you wonder who was picking her up when she went shopping for the killers' shoes at Walmart.

This was probably the same Ford Excursion that BCI tracked down and examined for evidence, now listed in the discovery documents. The same vehicle may have been used the night of the murders. JMO, Angela was probably driving it that night, too.
 
  • #563
Good point! Do keep in mind, however, if someone on a podcast reveals new or "inside" information about the case or evidence, it should be presumed unreliable because there is a gag order. If no one close to the case is discussing the details, there's no way for podcast hosts to access "inside" information.

Just a helpful hint. :)

This issue keeps appearing and we are all trying to keep up with the correct information.

What specific people do you think have a court ordered gag order?
 
  • #564
When AC and RS are discussing the video footage of Angela Wagner at Walmart, they mention that when Angela leaves the store, she's picked up by someone driving the black Ford Excursion. They mention that Angela previously owned a Ford Excursion, that it was titled in her name. So it makes you wonder who was picking her up when she went shopping for the killers' shoes at Walmart.

This was probably the same Ford Excursion that BCI tracked down and examined for evidence, now listed in the discovery documents. The same vehicle may have been used the night of the murders. JMO, Angela was probably driving it that night, too.

This was only 2 weeks before that night and I think they were all caught up in planning it and George and/or Jake went with Angela to do "murder errands" and
G & J didn't want to be seen on camera buying those shoes so Angela bought them alone while they "killed" time.

I do not believe Angela would buy those shoes with some "outsider" sitting in her car while she buys them.

Did you notice how they thought that not all of them would be arrested? I think it's likely they thought Angie would be the one not arrested and so it wouldn't matter if she goes in and buys murder shoes. They were not counting on leaving footprints.

Something went wrong at Chris's, he saw them coming, his cameras would still be up. Chris opened the door and confronted them and they started shooting because shell casings were on the porch and they found a bullet under the trailer.

I had said before that a bullet casing was under the trailer but it was an actual bullet.

They were so careful not to leave any evidence behind to connect them to the crime scenes but then ended up stepping in blood. Why?

Because when Chris confronted them they didn't have a plan for that, they were taken by surprise. So they got sloppy and ended up shooting all over the place, leaving blood all over then panicking and dragging his body.

2 Cents - Just my take on it
 
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  • #565
George's Bond Hearing
George Wagner request for bail denied after hearing reveals new details

Bloody shoe impressions on floor at Chris SR's = Starts at 1:12:40 = Photo

Angela in Walmart = Starts at 1:22:40 = Photo

Shell casing found in Frankie's and HG's bed in between where they were laying = Pause on 1:25:22 = Photo

The photo shows a blue gloved hand holding the casing, just the top is visible. Scheiderer describes it as a fired Remington 22 long rifle shell casing. The red background may or may not be their bed. I had thought before that this was their bed but now I see that it could just be they used a red background for the photo.

Dana floor plan = Starts at 1:26 = diagram not a photo.
In Dana's floor plan I could see the rooms outlined but could not read the writing that labels the rooms so you only get a very general idea.

Frankie floor plan = Starts at 1:25:44 = diagram not a photo.
I got a very good look at Franklie's floor plan by pausing a few different times. For example one pause shows the bedroom area, one pause shows the living room and kitchen area and pausing another time shows the bedroom attatched to the kitchen.

Very clear if you stop on it just right. A trick is to pause the video then slowly move your finger along the fast forward/rewind line because it brings up the exact frame. Also when you do that the pause icon in the middle of the video goes away. Keep finger pressed down.

You come in through the front door and next to the front door on the left is the couch. To the left is a kitchen with a table and the back door is off the kitchen. To the left of the kitchen on the far left side of the house is a bedroom with a closet. Between the kitchen and bedroom is a bathroom.

When you come in the front door there is a hallway directly to the right and the first door on the left is a very small bedroom then next to that is a bathroom and then next to the bathroom on the far right side of the house is Frankie's and HG's bedroom.

Walk into Frankie's bedroom and on the left wall is a crib, past the crib is the bed, the head of the bed is against the left wall. Frankie is on the side closest to the crib, HG on the side furthest away. It is such a simple sketch - no details - except the sketch makes it look like they are on their sides facing towards each other but this doesn't mean they actually were.

On the floor plan above HG it says her first and last name and on the floor plan below Frankie it says Clarence before it cuts off. Clarence is Frankie's given name.
Snipped by me...

"Shell casing found in Frankie's and HG's bed in between where they were laying = Pause on 1:25:22 = Photo

The photo shows a blue gloved hand holding the casing, just the top is visible. Scheiderer describes it as a fired Remington 22 long rifle shell casing..."

A shell casing for a 22 long rifle was found in FR and HHG's bed?

Wow, I don't see how shooting a rifle off in one room in a small trailer wouldn't wake up a sleeping child in the next room? As well as making that poor baby R cry and carry on waking his brother up.

Those fabricated maglite silencers were just for handguns right?
 
  • #566
This was only 2 weeks before that night and I think they were all caught up in planning it and George and/or Jake went with Angela to do "murder errands" and
G & J didn't want to be seen on camera buying those shoes so Angela bought them alone while they "killed" time.

I do not believe Angela would buy those shoes with some "outsider" sitting in her car while she buys them.

Did you notice how they thought that not all of them would be arrested? I think it's likely they thought Angie would be the one not arrested and so it wouldn't matter if she goes in and buys murder shoes. They were not counting on leaving footprints.

Something went wrong at Chris's, he saw them coming, his cameras would still be up. Chris opened the door and confronted them and they started shooting because shell casings were on the porch and they found a bullet under the trailer.

I had said before that a bullet casing was under the trailer but it was an actual bullet.

They were so careful not to leave any evidence behind to connect them to the crime scenes but then ended up stepping in blood. Why?

Because when Chris confronted them they didn't have a plan for that, they were taken by surprise. So they got sloppy and ended up shooting all over the place, leaving blood all over then panicking and dragging his body.

2 Cents - Just my take on it
Snipped by me...

"Something went wrong at Chris's, he saw them coming, his cameras would still be up. Chris opened the door and confronted them and they started shooting because shell casings were on the porch and they found a bullet under the trailer.

I had said before that a bullet casing was under the trailer but it was an actual bullet."

CC, I'm sorry I'm trying to catch up. A fired bullet was found under CRSR's trailer or a whole unfired bullet? TIA
 
  • #567
This issue keeps appearing and we are all trying to keep up with the correct information.

What specific people do you think have a court ordered gag order?

I'll go back to check the early hearings to verify Judge Deering's order.
 
  • #568
Jake - New Motion Hearing scheduled:

April 12th 2021
9:00 AM

Billy - Motion Hearing

April 5th 2021
1:30 PM

(underlined by me)
Niner's post says May 12 but yours says April 12. Which is correct?
 
  • #569
Snipped by me...

"Shell casing found in Frankie's and HG's bed in between where they were laying = Pause on 1:25:22 = Photo

The photo shows a blue gloved hand holding the casing, just the top is visible. Scheiderer describes it as a fired Remington 22 long rifle shell casing..."

A shell casing for a 22 long rifle was found in FR and HHG's bed?

Wow, I don't see how shooting a rifle off in one room in a small trailer wouldn't wake up a sleeping child in the next room? As well as making that poor baby R cry and carry on waking his brother up.

Those fabricated maglite silencers were just for handguns right?

LR refers to the bullet type. Not the gun type. The .22 caliper bullets come in short, long, and long rifle, or .22S, .22L, or .22LR. The casings are different length with different amounts of gun powder.
 
  • #570
(underlined by me)
Niner's post says May 12 but yours says April 12. Which is correct?

they just added that April 12th hearing - here's from the court site. And Thank You for pointing that out! I would have missed it - well maybe.... :)

Jake:

Docket:
03/15/2021
Judge: DEERING, RANDY D
Event: MOTION HEARING
Date: 04/12/2021 Time: 09:00 AM


Hearings:
04/12/2021 09:00 AM MOTION HEARING DEERING, RANDY D

05/12/2021 09:00 AM MOTION HEARING DEERING, RANDY D

08/30/2021 08:30 AM JURY TRIAL DEERING, RANDY D

link: https://www.pikecountycpcourt.org/e...RD-qNQSY43xELJ1s6wtXK54-Nm*7y31qW4i*oZalXPIOA
 
  • #571
they just added that April 12th hearing - here's from the court site. And Thank You for pointing that out! I would have missed it - well maybe.... :)

Jake:

Docket:
03/15/2021
Judge: DEERING, RANDY D
Event: MOTION HEARING
Date: 04/12/2021 Time: 09:00 AM


Hearings:
04/12/2021 09:00 AM MOTION HEARING DEERING, RANDY D

05/12/2021 09:00 AM MOTION HEARING DEERING, RANDY D

08/30/2021 08:30 AM JURY TRIAL DEERING, RANDY D

link: https://www.pikecountycpcourt.org/e...RD-qNQSY43xELJ1s6wtXK54-Nm*7y31qW4i*oZalXPIOA

Yes, Jake's defense team is churning up some disagreement that seems to be related to the prosecution's transcripts of digitally recorded evidence, I think? There's been a lot of fighting over that evidence, maybe they're picking some stuff out to publicly reveal to help their case or some they want to get thrown out.

IDK just guessing.
 
  • #572
LR refers to the bullet type. Not the gun type. The .22 caliper bullets come in short, long, and long rifle, or .22S, .22L, or .22LR. The casings are different length with different amounts of gun powder.
Ok but a long rifle shell can only be shot from a long rifle, correct?
 
  • #573
Ok but a long rifle shell can only be shot from a long rifle, correct?
Some pistols and revolvers are chambered for the .22 long Rifle round. Most of the non autoloading .22's chambered for .22LR may also fire the shorter .22long, .22 short, .22 bb cap and maybe others.
The autoloading type rifles and pistols depend on the power of the recoil or the expanding gas to operate the mechanism to eject the spent round and to 🤬🤬🤬🤬 the hammer to be ready to fire.
22 magnum and other similarly named ammunition will not operate in a .22 caliber firearm.
Those rounds are in a completely separate class. It will usually be embossed on the rifle or handgun as to the type(s) of ammunition the gun will handle.
 
  • #574
Now my opinion:

I cannot imagine a grown man purchasing and carrying a look/like .45 auto pistol chambered in a .22 caliber. Unless he had a specific reason to possess such an item. They are expensive and have limited use. They are as heavy and clumsy to handle as a real Colt 45 auto but fire a tiny round. Carry one of those to a bar or to show a group of your friends and they will laugh at you and call you things that you don't want to be called. It would be the exact opposite of what would happen if you had shown up with a real 45 auto.
 
  • #575
When’s next batch of court dates?

Also

what is wrong with AW where she has to go get medical treatment?
Let’s go baby when these trial starting and WHOS first????? It’s 2021 let’s do dis!! Les goooo
 
  • #576
This was only 2 weeks before that night and I think they were all caught up in planning it and George and/or Jake went with Angela to do "murder errands" and
G & J didn't want to be seen on camera buying those shoes so Angela bought them alone while they "killed" time.

I do not believe Angela would buy those shoes with some "outsider" sitting in her car while she buys them.

Did you notice how they thought that not all of them would be arrested? I think it's likely they thought Angie would be the one not arrested and so it wouldn't matter if she goes in and buys murder shoes. They were not counting on leaving footprints.

Something went wrong at Chris's, he saw them coming, his cameras would still be up. Chris opened the door and confronted them and they started shooting because shell casings were on the porch and they found a bullet under the trailer.

I had said before that a bullet casing was under the trailer but it was an actual bullet.

They were so careful not to leave any evidence behind to connect them to the crime scenes but then ended up stepping in blood. Why?

Because when Chris confronted them they didn't have a plan for that, they were taken by surprise. So they got sloppy and ended up shooting all over the place, leaving blood all over then panicking and dragging his body.

2 Cents - Just my take on it

CC, your right all but about the part of where you said the Wagners didn’t want to leave footprints, I really believe the exact reason the shoes was bought was to frame the Manleys family for the Rhodens murders, because the shoes where supposed to match one of the Manleys shoes, the footprints where left by the Wagners intentionally, JMO
 
  • #577
Let’s go baby when these trial starting and WHOS first????? It’s 2021 let’s do dis!! Les goooo

Jake Wagner's trial is first. It's scheduled for August 30, 2021 at around 8 or 9 am.
 
  • #578
Snipped by me...

"Shell casing found in Frankie's and HG's bed in between where they were laying = Pause on 1:25:22 = Photo

The photo shows a blue gloved hand holding the casing, just the top is visible. Scheiderer describes it as a fired Remington 22 long rifle shell casing..."

A shell casing for a 22 long rifle was found in FR and HHG's bed?

Wow, I don't see how shooting a rifle off in one room in a small trailer wouldn't wake up a sleeping child in the next room? As well as making that poor baby R cry and carry on waking his brother up.

Those fabricated maglite silencers were just for handguns right?

Snipped by me...

"Something went wrong at Chris's, he saw them coming, his cameras would still be up. Chris opened the door and confronted them and they started shooting because shell casings were on the porch and they found a bullet under the trailer.

I had said before that a bullet casing was under the trailer but it was an actual bullet."

CC, I'm sorry I'm trying to catch up. A fired bullet was found under CRSR's trailer or a whole unfired bullet? TIA

Ok but a long rifle shell can only be shot from a long rifle, correct?

The gun photo is just an example because photos help explain it. I am not saying that this is Jake's exact gun. (see attachment)

There is the:

Walter Colt 1911 Semi-Automatic Hand Gun

And then there is the:

Walter Colt 1911 Semi-Automatic LR (Long Rifle) Hand Gun - this is not a rifle it is a hand gun.
(See in attatched file below) Long Rifle just means the ammunition.

Long Rifle means 22 LR ammunition, it does not mean that the gun is a rifle.
LR (Long Rifle) means that it takes the LR (Long Rifle) AMMUNITION:

upload_2021-3-16_17-31-44.jpeg
22 Long rifle ammunition
  • upload_2021-3-16_17-31-44.png
    Wikipedia
Walther Colt 1911 A1 22 Rail Gun, .22 LR, 12 Rd.

A maglite suppressor can go on a hand gun or on a rifle. The Wagners used a 40 caliber, a 30 caliber that I think Dudly said is the Glock hand gun, and the Colt 22.
George bought a Glock and was known as a Glock man according to his uncle, Angie's brother CN.

Scheiderer said they found shell casings and "a bullet in the dirt under the house."
Only a fired bullet would have the force to go through the floor or skirting to get in dirt under the house.

Ask any questions. I am always happy to find answers by "transcribing" what Scheiderer said at George's Bond Hearing such as what he said about guns and ammo, how many casings and where were they found at the crime scenes and at 260 Peterson Rd., George's incriminating statements, I posted what he said about the silencer and the murder kit purchases.

WALTHER COLT 22 LONG RIFLE AUTOMATIC HAND GUN
 

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  • #579
Snipped by me...

"Something went wrong at Chris's, he saw them coming, his cameras would still be up. Chris opened the door and confronted them and they started shooting because shell casings were on the porch and they found a bullet under the trailer.

I had said before that a bullet casing was under the trailer but it was an actual bullet."

CC, I'm sorry I'm trying to catch up. A fired bullet was found under CRSR's trailer or a whole unfired bullet? TIA
We haven't seen/hear how far out the blood spatter was nearest that front door. IMO, if CSR was shot right at the front door BJM would've seen it right off and been alerted, but was not until she entered. Perhaps they forced their way further into the trailer once CSR opened the door. ???
 
  • #580
Ok but a long rifle shell can only be shot from a long rifle, correct?

No. Most semi-automatic guns, pistols or rifles, use the.22LR ammunition. The LR in .22LR has nothing to do with the type of gun it is used in...
 
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