GUILTY OH - Pike Co, 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #68

[Betty P]

I have no clue what you mean. He was not driving the red truck at the time of the murders. You do not need to search any photos for me. I know which truck he was driving the day of the murders.

Sorry, misread. I agree, it was not the same truck. I stated that previously, too. I have 2 other people talking to me while I'm trying to read this thread.

I'm out of here!

<modsnip -no link>

 

[Johnny B Bad]

They took him in for questioning the day the murders were discovered. They confiscated his truck, etc. They did the same to his sister, BJM. Recall that's one of the reasons Len Manley was so upset in those first interviews - his daughter, son in law and grandkids had all been killed and BCI was trying to blame it on his son and daughter. SMH.

The only thing James Manley and his sister did that day was discover the bodies at the 3 Union Hill Rd murder sites. After calling 911 BJM called either Leonard or James. They took off, Len told James to go to Dana's and Len went to BJM, who was at Frankie's.

James walked in and knew they were all dead (most likely a lot of blood there). He walked back out the door, heard the sirens and ran down the driveway to flag one of the BCI agents driving by. They pulled in Dana's driveway, found the bodies and started questioning James. There was something about him asking to move his truck because he didn't want it to be part of the crime scene. He needed it to go to work. He parked it on the road and then they impounded it and took him in for questioning. IIRC, James was cutting wood back then. If he didn't work, he didn't get paid.

They did NOT take any of the Wagners into custody.

The detailed timeline at the first page of this thread has details about the time from him getting the word, going to Dana's, flagging down cops and cops calling in report from Dana's. I had to do that because so many people here at WS, in this thread, kept going over and over that incident trying to find a way to blame James Manley.

James Manley son worked for the EMS in that area he was a EMT, he was also with JM that day the bodies where found, JMO

 

[Piffcat]

Why do you think that GPS tracker was on his truck. There were probably some on other vehicles that we just never learned about.
I think they thought they had some intel about something relating to the truck or to him, but later found out they had incorrect information.

the wagners murder plan heavily depended on pegging the manleys as the murderers. executing their family member wasnt good enough for the wagner crime family, they made sure to twist the proverbial knife. although this is strictly imo the text message activity at 2 am night of the murders between jw and jm is what spurred the suspicion publicly. we know unauthorized facebook logins were used in this crime conspiracy. from my understanding facebook messenger is more reliable then text messaging in this area of ohio service wise. it would fit right in with the mo if this text was part of a pattern of corrupt activity we saw with angela monitorning hanna mays accounts. the facebook message could have been manipulated or intentionally misleading.
other manley related wagner murder plan elements-
purchasing of specific shoes worn by leonard manley to be worn on night of murder
information provided on bjm including her involvement in caring for marijuana grow
knowing that bjm would discover the bodies
whatever bogus info fw and rest of wagner provided to the police.
social media manipulation by aw

so in grand total heres what the wagners took from manley/rhoden/gilleys
8 lives
7 parents
5 orphans
jm bail money, his job, his public reputation
bjm put thru lie detector test and horrible press coverage

 

[Dudly]

I disagree, but I have a lot of other stuff to do right now, so don't have time to search all the old photos. Sorry!

The two trucks were different colors. The one at DR’s house was gray, I think, the other with the GPS tracker was red.

 

[Betty P]

The two trucks were different colors. The one at DR’s house was gray, I think, the other with the GPS tracker was red.

Thanks, Dudly. If you read farther down, I corrected myself. I thought CO was saying they were the same truck. My mistake. Most sincere apologies to all.

 

[Betty P]

the wagners murder plan heavily depended on pegging the manleys as the murderers. executing their family member wasnt good enough for the wagner crime family, they made sure to twist the proverbial knife. although this is strictly imo the text message activity at 2 am night of the murders between jw and jm is what spurred the suspicion publicly. we know unauthorized facebook logins were used in this crime conspiracy. from my understanding facebook messenger is more reliable then text messaging in this area of ohio service wise. it would fit right in with the mo if this text was part of a pattern of corrupt activity we saw with angela monitorning hanna mays accounts. the facebook message could have been manipulated or intentionally misleading.
other manley related wagner murder plan elements-
purchasing of specific shoes worn by leonard manley to be worn on night of murder
information provided on bjm including her involvement in caring for marijuana grow
knowing that bjm would discover the bodies
whatever bogus info fw and rest of wagner provided to the police.
social media manipulation by aw

so in grand total heres what the wagners took from manley/rhoden/gilleys
8 lives
7 parents
5 orphans
jm bail money, his job, his public reputation
bjm put thru lie detector test and horrible press coverage

Excellent post, piffcat!

I hadn't heard about the shoes Angela purchased being copies of LM's shoes. Sounds like something she would do. If GW4 put on those shoes knowing why his mother purchased them, that makes him extremely complicit in the conspiracy. They're definitely on the road to perdition after that.

As for the rumors about BJM on social media being involved in the grow op, it was being posted constantly here in the first weeks and months. We know LE didn't reach out to interview the Wagners in those early days, so all the Wagner lies came from them calling the tip line. JMO

The Wagners more active on social media (Jake, Angela, GW4) went online and began amplifying the same lies they were reporting to the BCI tip lines. Not all of their work here on WS survived. Most of it was deleted by Mods.

 

[Betty P]

Part of it is in that MSM article that was just recently posted, so take what you wish as gossip. Much information is not and has not ever been in court or in the media.

Not surprising that GW4's attorneys knew they could get the Cleveland Plain Dealer to run with bad information in violation of Judge Deering's gag order. It's one reason why that paper has such low readership.

If they're trying to get the trial moved up to this jurisdiction, it will be interesting. JMO, it won't end the way they hope.

 

[Cool Cats]

Haven't heard any of that in the video from the court hearings, nor from any attorneys, nor from news media coverage.

Sounds like a lot of gossip.

The only things in MSM about it are:

1.) George didn't shoot anybody.

2.) George wasn't suppose to go with Billy and Jake to commit the murders but went out with them at the last second.

3.) George went along to protect Jake from Billy.

4.) George tried to talk the Wagners out of committing the murders.

5.) “It’s our argument that George never had the specific intent to kill,” his attorneys said.

This is stuff Canepa said the defense was cherry picking out of Jake's Proffer. The defense is trying to minimize George's involvement but that is

IMPOSSIBLE TO DO BECAUSE HE WAS AT THE CRIME SCENES.

All the jury has to believe is that George was at one of the murder scenes that night and he will get convicted of murder.

Why George was there doesn't matter. He was there, guilty as charged.

Pike County slayings: Attorneys clash over death penalty in suspect’s murder charges

Judge refused to dismiss aggravated murder charges against eldest Wagner son in Pike County massacre

 

[Dudly]

Off topic but of interest. Tonight on HLN, the Delphi murders will be on in two parts.

 

[Betty P]

The only things in MSM about it are:

1.) George didn't shoot anybody.

2.) George went along on the murders at the last minute.

3.) George went along to protect Jake from Billy.

4.) George tried to talk the Wagners out of committing the murders.

5.) George had no intent to commit murder.

This is stuff Canepa said the defense was cherry picking out of Jake's Proffer. The defense is trying to minimize George's involvement but that is

IMPOSSIBLE TO DO BECAUSE HE WAS AT THE CRIME SCENES.

All the jury has to believe is that George was at one of the murder scenes that night and he will get convicted of murder.

Why George was there doesn't matter. He was there, guilty as charged.

Even the defense admits that Jake implicated George in the murders.

Pike County slayings: Attorneys clash over death penalty in suspect’s murder charges

Man still facing death penalty in 8 murders as brother says he didn't kill anyone

Thanks for your input, CC. I understand.

Recall, though, AC was very careful with her wording. She said the attorney was cherry picking his words while she was arguing to the judge that the attorney was not allowed to say those things in court. Judge Deering agreed and told him to stop it. He specifically chastised him for trying his case in the media.

In court, the only claims he managed to get out before Judge Deering and AC cut him off was his claim that Jake said GW4 didn't kill anyone. Therefore, some of the items you mention above from the PD article have been repeated to a news reporter in violation of the Judge's gag order. Truth be told, we don't know where some of that information comes from. Let's go over it (Bolded part is my response):

1.) George didn't shoot anybody. (This was the only claim GW4's attorney got out in court. AC says it was cherrypicked information from the beginning of Jake's confession interview)

2.) George went along on the murders at the last minute. (This was not in the last pre-trial hearing. No idea where this information is from)

3.) George went along to protect Jake from Billy. (This was not in the pre-trial hearing. No idea where this information comes from)

4.) George tried to talk the Wagners out of committing the murders. (This was not in the pre-trial hearing. No idea where this information comes from).

5.) George had no intent to commit murder. (This was not in the pre-trial hearing. No idea where this information comes from).
​

I'm not sure which is worse - the attorney violating the gag order or the PD reporter stating it all as fact without checking. To me, that indicates the PD reporter didn't even attend the pre-trial hearing, but instead wrote the article from a phone call, text or email from the attorney. JMO


Here's a link referencing Judge Deering placing a gag order on GW4's case

Rhoden family massacre: George Wagner IV pleads not guilty to 22 counts

As for the part about shoes, that wasn't mentioned in the pre-trial hearing

Here's a link to that pretrial hearing a month ago. The part referenced where AC argues and Judge Deering agrees starts around 13:33

 

[Cool Cats]

Thanks for your input, CC. I understand.

Recall, though, AC was very careful with her wording. She said the attorney was cherry picking his words while she was arguing to the judge that the attorney was not allowed to say those things in court. Judge Deering agreed and told him to stop it. He specifically chastised him for trying his case in the media.

In court, the only claims he managed to get out before Judge Deering and AC cut him off was his claim that Jake said GW4 didn't kill anyone. Therefore, some of the items you mention above from the PD article have been repeated to a news reporter in violation of the Judge's gag order. Truth be told, we don't know where some of that information comes from. Let's go over it (Bolded part is my response):

1.) George didn't shoot anybody. (This was the only claim GW4's attorney got out in court. AC says it was cherrypicked information from the beginning of Jake's confession interview)

2.) George went along on the murders at the last minute. (This was not in the last pre-trial hearing. No idea where this information is from)

3.) George went along to protect Jake from Billy. (This was not in the pre-trial hearing. No idea where this information comes from)

4.) George tried to talk the Wagners out of committing the murders. (This was not in the pre-trial hearing. No idea where this information comes from).

5.) George had no intent to commit murder. (This was not in the pre-trial hearing. No idea where this information comes from).
​

I'm not sure which is worse - the attorney violating the gag order or the PD reporter stating it all as fact without checking. To me, that indicates the PD reporter didn't even attend the pre-trial hearing, but instead wrote the article from a phone call, text or email from the attorney. JMO


Here's a link referencing Judge Deering placing a gag order on GW4's case

Rhoden family massacre: George Wagner IV pleads not guilty to 22 counts

As for the part about shoes, that wasn't mentioned in the pre-trial hearing

Here's a link to that pretrial hearing a month ago. The part referenced where AC argues and Judge Deering agrees starts around 13:33

Thanks for information.

Well this is a fine kettle of fish. We have a MSM article that states this as it's source:

In documents filed last week, defense attorneys cited Jake Wagner’s confession. They said it...

This makes it sound like the reporter may have read the actual Motion Document but we don't know for sure.

Hummm....

What Document would it be? Maybe this one?

01/10/2022 MOTION NO. 80 DEFENDANT'S MOTION TO SUPPRESS TESTIMONY OF JAKE AND ANGELA WAGNER AND TO DISMISS THE DEATH SPECIFICATIONS

Information from Motions can be reported on, the Motion goes under seal if the Judge wants a gag order on it, but yeah, the attorneys can't discuss the Case in the media. They try to get information out in the Hearings and Motions not sealed.

George:

12/22/2021 ORDER TO SEAL TWO MOTIONS AND 2 JOURNAL ENTRIES FILED -- ALL FILED UNDER SEAL

 

[Betty P]

Thanks for information.

Well this is a fine kettle of fish. We have a MSM article that states this as it's source:

In documents filed last week, defense attorneys cited Jake Wagner’s confession. They said it...

This makes it sound like the reporter may have read the actual Motion Document but we don't know for sure.

Hummm....

What Document would it be? Maybe this one?

01/10/2022 MOTION NO. 80 DEFENDANT'S MOTION TO SUPPRESS TESTIMONY OF JAKE AND ANGELA WAGNER AND TO DISMISS THE DEATH SPECIFICATIONS

Information from Motions can be reported on, the Motion goes under seal if the Judge wants a gag order on it.

George:

12/22/2021 ORDER TO SEAL TWO MOTIONS AND 2 JOURNAL ENTRIES FILED -- ALL FILED UNDER SEAL

Is anyone still getting copies of the court filings?

I hope this attorney is sanctioned for all his unprofessional and illegal activities. I'm not familiar with any other cases where a defense attorney pulled these kinds of stunts, but JMO, he and his partner remind me of OJ Simpson's "Dream Team" and their stunts.

I wonder how much longer it will be before Judge Deering slaps him with contempt of court?

 

[Cool Cats]

Since it is in MSM I think I can post about it.

Why would George need to protect Jake from Billy?

Did Billy want to kill Chris but didn't trust Jake to keep quiet about it?

Why want to harm your own son - maybe because he could send you to prison?

That ship has sailed.

 

[Betty P]

Since it is in MSM I think we can discuss it.

Why would George need to protect Jake from Billy?

Did Billy want to kill Chris but didn't trust Jake to keep quiet about it?

Why want to harm your own son, because he could send you to prison?

That ship has sailed.

That really sounds like a crock of bull----.

It's an excuse made up to make George 4 look innocent. Billy barely has two brain cells to rub together. He enjoyed himself that night. They all did. If George 4 felt any remorse, he would have called the BCI tip line. Even today, he shows no remorse. He only shows angry contempt for the victims and their families.

ETA: Wouldn't it be interesting to watch all 4 of them together for a family meeting right now? I think they would all be friendly to each other while angrily plotting against the Judge, AC, DeWine and the rest.

 

[Dudly]

Since it is in MSM I think I can post about it.

Why would George need to protect Jake from Billy?

Did Billy want to kill Chris but didn't trust Jake to keep quiet about it?

Why want to harm your own son - maybe because he could send you to prison?

That ship has sailed.

Could it be that GWIII was going to off JW and make it look like he did a murder/suicide so the rest would not get accused???

 

[Cool Cats]

That really sounds like a crock of bull----.

It's an excuse made up to make George 4 look innocent. Billy barely has two brain cells to rub together. He enjoyed himself that night. They all did. If George 4 felt any remorse, he would have called the BCI tip line. Even today, he shows no remorse. He only shows angry contempt for the victims and their families.

ETA: Wouldn't it be interesting to watch all 4 of them together for a family meeting right now? I think they would all be friendly to each other while angrily plotting against the Judge, AC, DeWine and the rest.

Ha! Said like someone who wants George convicted yesterday.

Could it be that GWIII was going to off JW and make it look like he did a murder/suicide so the rest would not get accused???

Wow, to make it look like it was Jake and Jake alone. Chilling for a father to be like this. Then Angie and Billy would apply for custody as next of kin not needing Jake to get custody.

To pin it on Jake or he didn't trust Jake or both.

They were in an angry frame of mind that night, would have to be full of rage, likely heated words were said to each other.

If Jake did say in his Proffer that George only went to protect Jake from Billy it could still be a lie to minimize George's involvement but it just doesn't matter even if true. The reason George went doesn't matter, just that he went. He was there.

It's my belief that as long as the jury believes he was at the crime scenes, at at least one crime scene, he will be convicted of all 8 murders and get what we all have been waiting years for: LWOP.

I don't think a jury will care if he went at the last second or went to protect Jake or didn't shoot or tried to talk them out of it or didn't intend to kill anyone. All that has to happen is:

1.) The jury believes that he was there.

2.) He knew the murders were going to happen that night.

3.) He never did anything to stop it - of which he could have easily done that night.

Defense:

George was at the crime scenes of 8 murders but never really intended to kill anyone so he isn't guilty of murder.

No intent = should be acquitted of 8 murders.

I have prime swamp property to give away if a jury acquits George of murder.

 

[IType]

Since it is in MSM I think I can post about it.

Why would George need to protect Jake from Billy?

Did Billy want to kill Chris but didn't trust Jake to keep quiet about it?

Why want to harm your own son - maybe because he could send you to prison?

That ship has sailed.

GW4's comment about always getting them in trouble comes to mind--maybe BW felt the same way. If BW has in fact killed before, getting this troublesome child out of the way might not be such a stretch. Jmo

 

[Betty P]

GW4's comment about always getting them in trouble comes to mind--maybe BW felt the same way. If BW has in fact killed before, getting this troublesome child out of the way might not be such a stretch. Jmo

If Billy and George were opposed to Jake's plan, they would not have gone through with it. They went because they wanted to. They killed members of the Rhoden family because they wanted to kill them.

Jake didn't force them to do anything. Neither of them has demonstrated an ounce of regret, sadness or sympathy for their victims. Instead, they're full of anger every time they appear in court. They're angry that they were caught. The lives of the Rhodens meant nothing to them.

 

[IType]

Could it be that GWIII was going to off JW and make it look like he did a murder/suicide so the rest would not get accused???

IMO it's a definite possibility.

Not meaning to be cruel here, but the W's are involved in raising livestock. When there is a runt or sickly animal on the farm that won't prosper the bottom line, you remove them from the equation--either by hauling them off to the sale barn ASAP or destroying them.

Again, sorry for being blunt but I could honestly see BW seeing JW as nothing but a troublesome runt. All jmo

 

[Betty P]

Ha! Said like someone who wants George convicted yesterday.



Wow, to make it look like it was Jake and Jake alone. Chilling for a father to be like this. Then Angie and Billy would apply for custody as next of kin not needing Jake to get custody.

To pin it on Jake or he didn't trust Jake or both.

They were in an angry frame of mind that night, would have to be full of rage, likely heated words were said to each other.

If Jake did say in his Proffer that George only went to protect Jake from Billy it could still be a lie to minimize George's involvement but it just doesn't matter even if true. The reason George went doesn't matter, just that he went. He was there.

It's my belief that as long as the jury believes he was at the crime scenes, at at least one crime scene, he will be convicted of all 8 murders and get what we all have been waiting years for: LWOP.

I don't think a jury will care if he went at the last second or went to protect Jake or didn't shoot or tried to talk them out of it or didn't intend to kill anyone. All that has to happen is:

1.) The jury believes that he was there.

2.) He knew the murders were going to happen that night.

3.) He never did anything to stop it - of which he could have easily done that night.

Defense:

George was at the crime scenes of 8 murders but never really intended to kill anyone so he isn't guilty of murder.

No intent = should be acquitted of 8 murders.

I have prime swamp property to give away if a jury acquits George of murder.

George did more than just show up that night. He helped plan it, he bought supplies for silencers. He was involved at every phase.