OH - Pike Co - 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue - 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #75

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  • #681
A
I never mentioned a mistrial. I just stated what I saw and why I knew Parker did what he did.

I have been here from day one and have always believed all 4 of the W's were guilty. I still fervently believe Angie was at the crime scenes that night doing her part no matter what her and Jake say. I think they cooked that Angie stayed home to watch the kids that night story up while they were in AK. I think she was right there in the thick of it with those women's hunting boots on micromanaging every little move to make sure they did exactly what she told them to do. We all know how controlling she is, so I find it very hard to believe she just patiently waited at home for them to return. Not freakin' likely. I am still praying for a guilty conviction for George. But I am a call it like I see it person. If AC is not getting the job done in my opinion, I am going to call it.

JMO
And especially when they were gone for so many hours without contact ( they left all the phones at home), I can see her getting anxious and loading those sleeping babies up and going to see what’s taking so long. After a couple of hours passed I bet she thought something had gone wrong and just could not help herself. My opinion.
 
  • #682
I can see her slipping them benadryl or some other type meds to make them sleep
 
  • #683
Why did they wait so long to search the Wagner properties?
Why wait until they moved out?
Why not get a warrant when Jake refused to give the phone?
Why when they interviewed Billy in the car, did they not ask more about Jake? Billy ran that whole interview.
Taking phones after a year? many people get new phones all the time. Why wait a year?

I find it so annoying that after a year, they got good photos of the empty property.

Were they afraid of them? Or just incompetent.

I had the Wagner's on my radar almost from day one. To me, the timing, new baby, was critical and completely glaring.
I think Billy Had his own additional motive here. Money business deals, something. He did mention the 20k that was owed him.

I do see the confusion as the Wagner's skillfully manipulated social media and threw blame everywhere else.
They need an award for that.

the interior decorating. :rolleyes:
its because of our bloated justice system providing ample "protections" under the constitution. these days defense lawyers will fight any evidence that is not a video of the person committing the murder. everything can be explained away using 1 in a million alternate theories when the common sense tells you someone is hiding something or lying. the wagners were just "good country people" according to many locals or in a larger sense conservative values. in itself having lots of guns, losing phones, etc is not illegal. the lawyers will use fragmentation approach to question each explainable piece of the crime into obvlivion until the big obvious exclamation point gets blurred. g4 lawyer is example of what is wrong nwith our "justice" system
 
  • #684
its because of our bloated justice system providing ample "protections" under the constitution. these days defense lawyers will fight any evidence that is not a video of the person committing the murder. everything can be explained away using 1 in a million alternate theories when the common sense tells you someone is hiding something or lying. the wagners were just "good country people" according to many locals or in a larger sense conservative values. in itself having lots of guns, losing phones, etc is not illegal. the lawyers will use fragmentation approach to question each explainable piece of the crime into obvlivion until the big obvious exclamation point gets blurred. g4 lawyer is example of what is wrong nwith our "justice" system
Today is a perfect example. Prosecution presents lots of evidence of the financials of this family and the defense says oh did you look at every paper? Even the these tax returns.. read the cover page.. oh and this has zero to do with these crimes. Nothing at all, but it was a big huh?
 
  • #685
I was thinking about the family sitting round the table taking a vote on whatever issue. Did the outcome have to be unanimous, or was it majority rules? What if it was a tie? Did Angela have the deciding vote? What if, (not saying it happened) but what if George voted NO?
They planned these murders for months but he didnt have the guts to inform LE. He didnt save his family from themselves. I couldnt live with myself knowing what he knew and did nothing to stop it. He may or may not have voted no but a saint he is not, IMO.
 
  • #686
You're not required to present a passport if you have the enhanced drivers license that can be used instead. Either is accepted.
Correct, for Land or Sea crossing only. Arriving into Canada by Air requires a passport.
 
  • #687
Late getting here this morning - had to watch Formula One qualifying... :)

But not too many tweets...


for Friday, Oct. 7th:

James Pilcher
@jamespilcher
Return from break. Going over notes that Angela took about Sophia and alleged incidents regarding Hanna Rhoden etc. Then a custody document written up between Hanna and Jake - Julia Eveslage says same font as Jake's resume.

Love notes from Hanna to Jake ... plus other miscellaneous items.

Shows pictures from Walmart showing Angela leaving store with shoes and getting into family vehicle

Walmart1.jpg Walmart2.jpg Walmart3.jpg

Cross went over several documents including George IV's tax return bill, and calendar information. Now recalling BCI agent Jon Jenkins to the stand.


BCI agent Jon Jenkins returned to the stand - he went to another Walmart on the day of the search to match the SKU numbers from the receipt. Were for that same style matching the crime scene size 10.5 and 11, also matching the size. We're done for today.





link: https://twitter.com/jamespilcher
 
  • #688
I gather they will NOT be in court on Monday, 10/10 - Indigenous People's Day?

I did not see anything on James' tweets. Anyone? TIA! :)
 
  • #689
I gather they will NOT be in court on Monday, 10/10 - Indigenous People's Day?

I did not see anything on James' tweets. Anyone? TIA! :)
I'm not sure what Monday is Niner, sorry. I know UK special days and that's it lol.
 
  • #690
Subpoena and Motion for testimony from Alaska


CHRIS GRAVES

A couple new filings from #pikeCounty today related to defense witnesses. A subpoena and a request to allow a witness to testify remotely from Alaska.
 
  • #691
Hey yall from across the pond,.me too, but court is adjourned until 0800 EST, Tuesday. Cheers!!!
 
  • #692
  • #693
Because attacking the witness is all they have.
They planned these murders for months but he didnt have the guts to inform LE. He didnt save his family from themselves. I couldnt live with myself knowing what he knew and did nothing to stop it. He may or may not have voted no but a saint he is not, IMO.
This is where all those random bits of testimony come together. Recall Tabatha, when George was taking her away from the family (whether to see a doctor or to get away, period) and they're stopped at the end of the driveway--and he goes back home. Tabatha gets no treatment. Status quo re-established. She told him she wanted her own home, not a big ask for a new wife and mother. And weirdly enough, I think George "loved" her as much as he could love anyone beyond his family of origin. And still he didn't help or save her.

That's how a lot of the evidence will be interpreted and put in context at closing. Homeschooling is normal. Insisting that undereducated ma/grandma does the homeschooling, not advisable and a bit off. A sort of red flag for abuse. Having a custody clause with "right of first refusal" back to the other parent--normal and pretty common (meaning that if the parent with custody that week needs a sitter, the other parent has first refusal). Having a custody order forbidding babysitters other than the parents or the grandmothers--not normal. (What about aunts, uncles, cousins, siblings? And why is a teenage babysitter trusted by the motheraa problem once the kiddo is a toddler?). Co-mingling financials like insurance, cell phones, car titles, etc. is very common. Having that arrangement co-exist with controlling adult married children's sex lives is pretty much unheard of, bizarre, cult-like.

It's not going to be each of these points taken separately. It's going to be the totality of it once Angela and Jake testify to how the family operates. If the jury understands that all George had to do to be found guilty on most charges is buy equipment, including vehicles, participate in disabling cameras and jamming signals, and be a lookout while carrying a weapon (which Jake has already testified to), he's going down for 8 counts of aggravated murder and conspiracy. If he was in one of the buildings carrying a weapon, that's aggravated burglary with a weapons charge.

One thing the state has done well is to paint George with the same domestic abuser brush as they do Jake. He beat Tabatha with a belt, hit her in the face, and stood by while his mother tried to kill her. Then they concocted false charges to muddy her reputation and make them seem the victims, all the while trying to get her to move back. We see the Wagners assuming full control of Tabatha's son, down to not allowing her visitation. We see in the calendars Angela documenting things Hanna does that Angela sees as bad parenting or child abuse even thought there is shared custody to bolster her custody case to take Sophia 100% time. The prosecution has linked these two women, paralleling the linking they did themselves in their discussions on Facebook, Tabatha warning Hanna not to sign any papers. Juries don't "unhear" things. Tabatha told the defense that she didn't go to Alaska because she didn't want to be shot. Hanna tells TC's mother "they'll have to kill mer first. Hanna ends up shot, along with her whole family. Our own WS visceral reaction is thank God TC did not take her son with her. Tie Tabatha and Hanna and you've tied George and Jake to what their mother's sick needs.

And that's before the state links the casings from the crime scenes, the firing pin, and the guns together. George will be found guilty. And all these small "gotcha" moments will not be remembered the way the jury remembers how Jake positioned dead mothers so that newborns and small babies could nurse. It's not this pile of evidence; it's how that pile of stuff is part of a larger, understandable and monstrous story. Just my opinion.

Edited to add: The last couple of days have shown us, and the jury, how not smart the Wagners are, keeping all of this stuff that ties them to the murders. This trial is the latest "not smart" maneuver; if George really didn't shoot anyone, he should have taken a plea. He might have gotten life with a chance of parole after 30 or 40. He's young enough that he might see daylight again. But no--big man who wanted to attack LE and the governor thinks he can get away with multiple murder. And with this trial, there is always the chance that Jake the liar gets caught in a lie and whoops! the death penalty is back on the table. The whole thing is not smart. Like George.
 
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  • #694
I may be totally wrong about edls. I was thinking id real when i responded. I dont know if id real and edl are one and the same.
They're the same.
 
  • #695
Near the end of the day when he asked her if she examined every document in that tub. She said yes. Not trying to split hairs with you here, but my ears always perk up at the mention of tax returns so I paid close attention. Plus I know the law. When she saw those big white envelopes addressed to George from an accounting firm with tax years stamped on them she should have just threw them back in the tub without pulling the papers out and looking at them before she went through the proper channels.

Of course no federal judge is going to give them a subpoena to look at tax returns unless the crime involves something to do with federal income taxes, like tax fraud or tax evasion. So she wasn't going to get to look at them anyway unless George told her she could.

What do you want to bet that Parker and Nash have been sitting on this information for months waiting to see if AC or BCI would notice? Parker looked like he could barely contain his self when AC finished direct without clarifying that BCI, AC herself or Ms. Eveslege did not examine George's tax returns. He practically ran to the witness chair. lol

JMO
This is kind of a damned if you do, damned if you don't for LE. The investigators have to look in the tubs, the baskets, all the random places Wagners tossed their stuff because they are looking for evidence of the conspiracy and the murders. The tax envelope itself is not a problem; there might not have been a tax document inside. Not all of mine are in their original envelopes from my tax guy. The question is whether anyone "looked at" or examined the returns. That should have been an easier problem to avoid.
 
  • #696
This is kind of a damned if you do, damned if you don't for LE. The investigators have to look in the tubs, the baskets, all the random places Wagners tossed their stuff because they are looking for evidence of the conspiracy and the murders. The tax envelope itself is not a problem; there might not have been a tax document inside. Not all of mine are in their original envelopes from my tax guy. The question is whether anyone "looked at" or examined the returns. That should have been an easier problem to avoid.
That would have been an easy problem to clear up if the prosecution or even the defense would have asked straight forward questions like did you read George's tax return. The defense didn't want things cleared up, he wanted it to appear that this agent was shady and he was trying to confuse everyone and draw attention to a red herring.

If there is any issue with those that came and searched looking at a tax document, then I'd say that is a different matter and not relevant to this case. I also feel there has to be some level of professional courtesy to law enforcement when doing searches. Like you said you have to verify something very damning isn't in a folder labeled tax documents and addressed to George. So peaking in, see it's tax documents and moving on should not be criminal. If that is the case then criminals could hide whatever they wanted inside folders labeled tax documents.
 
  • #697
when the arrests came i wondered where all these intricate details of the murder conspiracy came from. i figured it was wiretaps, local talk or evidence left at the scene. i never considered these idiots just left all types of murder accessories in their belongings and ditched them at someone elses place! wow i am so thankful the wagners are just so damn stupid. complete tunnel vision as far as the plan and getting away with it. almost like there was an expiration date on danger. once they didnt arrest them those first 6 months they seem to have wayyyyy overshot how safe they were.

even though physical evidence directly to the murder was taken care of- the searches confirmed for leo they had the right people. and that is what solved this case. to be so sure these waste of life family members committed this atrocity. listening to all the lab tecs/cops etc , they identify themselves by which scene they worked and it seems very personal to them. bad as the descriptions and pictures testimony the people who lived and breathed that day are warriors.

this crime so evil it really shows the positive side of law enforcement. murder police. they are the ones who wouldnt stop until they had these scum. every single piece of evidence they created destroying 8 lives should be gone over- it all matters.
outside of the mafia this may be the largest civilian murder conspiracy indictment of the 21st century . its a blueprint of success. to have almost no physical evidence or informants within the group- all they way to all the physical weapon evidence, vehicles, and angela jake flipping- far as conspiracy goes that is a grand slam.
 
  • #698
I'm listening again to the Piketon Massacre Podcast episodes from after Jake and Angela took a deal. On the episode Wagner v Wagner, they have played recording from the bond hearing I believe it was that George's lawyers requested after Jake took the plea. I believe it was Agent Scheiderer being questioned and he said they had 100 days of recordings of George. Total 8,000 recordings of the family. So that must be the truck they bugged. 100 days. I bet a lot was said. He did say, well George didn't confess but he made statements. They never said what those statements were, but I can't wait to hear that. It must be coming up soon!

When asked from the discovery list was there anything that caught his eye, the guy said yes one thing. There was a trash pull June 5, 2017. I wonder if that was in Alaska once they arrived there? Maybe seeing what they threw out? In the podcast the person being interviewed said trash pulls are often for some type of DNA, but we know they don't have DNA so would they be looking for something in their trash?
 
  • #699
Well they had to travel through Canada to get to Alaska. I've only been to Canada once, long ago, to Niagara Falls and we just had to show our, then filled out by pen, driver's licences to get in and out, back in the early 70's. I'm sure crossing the border changed drastically since 911. Does Canada require passports now?
I don't know if this was answered yet, but you can enter Canada with what is called an Enhanced Licence, or a Passport. So, not necessarily your regular run of the mill Drivers Licence, but a "Enhanced" more expensive License. (If you don't have a Passport.) If I recall correctly, mine cost 90.00 and extra documents, as an upgrade at renewal time.The kids can enter with Birth Certificates.
 
  • #700
I'm listening again to the Piketon Massacre Podcast episodes from after Jake and Angela took a deal. On the episode Wagner v Wagner, they have played recording from the bond hearing I believe it was that George's lawyers requested after Jake took the plea. I believe it was Agent Scheiderer being questioned and he said they had 100 days of recordings of George. Total 8,000 recordings of the family. So that must be the truck they bugged. 100 days. I bet a lot was said. He did say, well George didn't confess but he made statements. They never said what those statements were, but I can't wait to hear that. It must be coming up soon!

When asked from the discovery list was there anything that caught his eye, the guy said yes one thing. There was a trash pull June 5, 2017. I wonder if that was in Alaska once they arrived there? Maybe seeing what they threw out? In the podcast the person being interviewed said trash pulls are often for some type of DNA, but we know they don't have DNA so would they be looking for something in their trash?
Trash Pull and a few incriminating starements.

Canepa said there are wiretap recordings catching George speaking to Jake about them being in trouble, and that Jake should have smashed his laptop and thrown away his phone.

It won't be hard for the State to prove that George was going along with his family's Murder Conspiracy. They have 8,000 recordings of interest. Remember these few quotes from George?

Incriminating statements:

1.) If they have the gun they have the silencer. (After Scheiderer sent George Jake's phone photo of Jake holding his colt 22.)
2.) I told you to get rid of your phone. (After Scheiderer sent photo of Jake holding his colt 22.)
3.) We have a family emergency. (After Scheiderer sent photo of Jake holding his colt 22.)
4.) Don't come down here ( to Billy - we have company. (BCI was at Peterson Rd.)
5.) Jake's always getting us in trouble over some woman.
6.) I want to bash Scheiderer's face in.
7.) Make Reader pay make DeWine pay - violent tendencies Scheiderer said.
8.) We're being bugged don't say anything till we get home.
9.) I bought a night scope.
10.) I bought a Captain America mask.
11.) Making fun of Jake's religion many times = they don't celebrate Halloween so what was the mask for?
12.) Those not arrested will break the others out of jail.
13.) We will take revenge against anyone who goes against us.

Canepa said in her closing argument at the Bond Hearing that George's buying a night scope made it convenient to shoot people in bed in the middle of the night.

Canepa & Scheiderer at George's Bond Hearing

Angela Wagner | PDF March 20th 2019 Angela's Discovery

Trash pull from Days Inn
 

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