OH - Pike Co - 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue - 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #81

[pittsburghgirl]

Oh wow so Angela is taking the stand! I am not sure if they are on break first or if she is on the stand now.

I agree. I think without hearing the questions and his answers, it's hard to say what we would have picked up on as far as facial expressions, how long it took to respond, if he appeared to be thinking or if he was trying to avoid questions, etc. That really matters I think in this type of testimony. It did seem he was minimizing George's role, but we knew this from what AC said also. It didn't benefit him to lie, but trying to make George's role seem less than the others could possibly make Jake feel better about testifying against him.

As I've thought more about what Jake remembers about his relationship with Hannah. What we thought were lies very well could be his recollection of how things were. That doesn't mean he's lying. I think it very well could be how his brain remembers it so he can live with himself. What we might have said no way to, he may have told himself things like she didn't care about Sophia possibly getting molested so he could justify it in his mind.

I just don't see why he would agree to a deal where part of it is testifying truthfully, tell them where those guns were (that no doubt helped their case), and then lie on the stand, putting DP back on the table for him. Why take the deal in the first place then?

My own thought is that he's like every domestic abuser ever. It's never his fault so he will remember what Hanna did to cause him to kill her.

 

[CIA Team Member]

https://twitter.com/CFranciscoWCPO

Angela started testifying at 11:15. She came in with her long brown hair down, wearing the jail jumpsuit. She was very soft spoken. George looked down at his paper mostly as she spoke. His mom took one good look his way during testimony, but she mainly looks at the prosecutor.

She started out saying yes she is guilty of helping prepare for the murder spree and helping cover it up. She said "My husband, Billy, and my sons, Jake and George" were also involved.

Then, prosecutors asked her to go back to when the children were young. She said Billy taught the boys to steal. She said she and Billy taught the boys how to destroy property for insurance money. She said they burnt down two homes, a semi and a garage for insurance money.

She said her half brother helped them wreck George's truck for insurance money.

She said the family would pool financial resources together. She could use Jake and George's credit cards but said she's always ask first. (this could relate back to those credit card bills that show George's card was used to buy gun silencer supplies)

If you recall, George's ex-wife, Tabitha, told jurors the Wagners isolated her from her family after she gave birth to their son. She said she had to fight to escape after Angela threatened to shoot her. Today, Angela gave her side of the story.

She said Tabitha made the choice to stop associating with her family because she was molested as a child and Tabitha's mother didn't report it. Angela said the day Tabitha ran off, Tabitha "...had an episode... She was screaming, yelling hitting the walls.”

Angela said, "George was trying to calm her down." She said Tabitha was demanding Angela hand her over the baby. Angela said she told Tabitha, "No. I'll give you your baby when you calm down." Finally, Angela said she screamed, "Just give me a gun. I'm fed up with this.”

Angela told jurors she was just trying to scare Tabitha into calming down. She said Tabitha ended up running away. George and Tabitha divorced. George got full custody. Tabitha got supervised visits.

She moved on to how she met Hanna Rhoden, Jake's girlfriend. She said they all met at the fair. Hanna was 13. Jake was 17. They dated. That progressed to pregnancy. That's when we took a break for lunch.

So, CN lied under oath about the car accident.
Also, how do you include yourself in that scheme and not think about getting seriously hurt/dead? Jeesh.

 

[arielilane]

As one does. Threatening gun violence has such a calming effect during heated moments.

Can you hear my eyes rolling? We're just getting started and I'm furious already. All three young women were threatened with violence to keep them in line. Please oh please let the jury see this clearly.

IMO, the jury will see through her lies.

 

[KYboy]

So, CN lied under oath about the car accident.
Also, how do you include yourself in that scheme and not think about getting seriously hurt/dead? Jeesh.

He lied if you believe AW. If where lying, could this cancel her plea deal?

 

[arielilane]

Prosecutors asked her to highlight the childhood Jake and George experienced; she described how Billy had taught the boys to steal when they were young, and how they both taught Jake and George how to destroy property for insurance money. She said the Wagner family burned down two different homes, a semi truck and a garage, collecting the insurance money from each.

Angela also said her half-brother, Chris Newcomb, helped Jake and George crash George's truck to collect insurance money; when Newcomb testified, he denied knowing that Jake was going to crash the truck, telling the jury that he'd been seriously injured in the crash and nearly died.

The Wagners also pooled all their finances together, Angela confirmed. The prosecution has asked several different witnesses, from Jake to BCI agents who analyzed the family's financial records, about the family's entangled purchases and bank accounts. Angela said she was able to use credit cards in George and Jake's names, but she insisted she always asked her sons first.

Angela then had her chance to describe her side of the family's contentious relationship with Tabitha, George's ex-wife. She told the jury Tabitha was the one who made the decision to stop associating with her own family, because of the abuse she'd endured as a child; Tabitha previously testified that she'd been unallowed to leave the Wagner family's home or to speak with her family, until the night she fled.

The day Tabitha fled, Angela said her son's then-wife "had an episode … she was screaming, yelling, hitting the walls."

George tried to calm Tabitha, according to the defendant's mother, but Tabitha was demanding she be given her son — which Angela said she refused to do unless Tabitha calmed down.

"Just give me a gun," Angela told the jury she'd screamed. "I'm fed up with this."

Tabitha said that's when she ran, because she assumed Angela's next move would be to retrieve "whichever gun they chose" and use it to hurt or kill her. Angela claimed she was just trying to scare Tabitha into calming down.

In the end, Tabitha fled and she and George were divorced; George got full custody of their son, Bulvine, and Tabitha was permitted supervised visits with the family present, Angela said.

Next, Angela moved on to describe how she met Hanna May Rhoden at a county fair, when Hanna was just 13 and Jake was 17. The pair dated, Angela said, and eventually Hanna became pregnant.

Before Angela could testify further, court broke for lunch.

Pike County murder trial: Angela Wagner called to stand, opted out of recording

The mother of a man accused of killing eight people in Pike County in 2016 entered the courthouse Tuesday, but opted out of being recorded by the media, so her testimony won't be broadcast.

www.wcpo.com

 

[justtrish]

IMO, the jury will see through her lies.

I am not sure she's lying though. In her mind (key here) that might very well be why she wanted to get a gun. It doesn't make logical sense to those of us that don't do crap like this, but just like Jake stating his side and it sounds crazy.. she in her mind thinks getting a gun will show Tabatha she has to calm down? So I think the jury will see how messed up this family was, not that she is lying, but that she has no idea how to actually calm anyone down, no idea how to give someone space and let them have their own thoughts/feelings, she has to tell them how to feel, what is going on and how to live.

 

[arielilane]

No tweet updates from https://twitter.com/jamespilcher or https://twitter.com/Angenette5
at this time.

 

[justtrish]

RE: CN lying. I think it's all in how the questions are asked. I'll go back and listen again, but I recall when asked if the accident was intentional, he said "not on my part". I don't recall if they asked him if he knew they were going to wreck the car for insurance money. Sometimes the way questions are asked is how the get around things like this. I know CN admitted to plenty of things that don't look good for him. I don't feel he went up on the stand to lie. It's possible he was around for talks about wrecking the truck would fix their problem, but who would want to be a passenger in a truck that is going to be wrecked for insurance money? Just sounds absurd. (but I guess so does most things in this trial..lol) Maybe it wasn't supposed to be such a big wreck?

 

[Pru2U]

IMO, the jury will see through her lies.

@arielilane I don't know how Hannah Hazel & Rhode families are staying composed. I'm teared up & shaking, I'm so angry right now. The men did the murdering but this woman was at the core, driven by a lifetime of jealousy and anger in her heart. She nurtured & manifested it into her family's core.

 

[Lilttledoggie]

RE: CN lying. I think it's all in how the questions are asked. I'll go back and listen again, but I recall when asked if the accident was intentional, he said "not on my part". I don't recall if they asked him if he knew they were going to wreck the car for insurance money. Sometimes the way questions are asked is how the get around things like this. I know CN admitted to plenty of things that don't look good for him. I don't feel he went up on the stand to lie. It's possible he was around for talks about wrecking the truck would fix their problem, but who would want to be a passenger in a truck that is going to be wrecked for insurance money? Just sounds absurd. (but I guess so does most things in this trial..lol) Maybe it wasn't supposed to be such a big wreck?

He did say, “not on my part.” At the time I found that to be an odd answer.

 

[arielilane]

This is how he looks at her as she testifies.

https://twitter.com/CFranciscoWCPO

 

[Pru2U]

I am not sure she's lying though. In her mind (key here) that might very well be why she wanted to get a gun. It doesn't make logical sense to those of us that don't do crap like this, but just like Jake stating his side and it sounds crazy.. she in her mind thinks getting a gun will show Tabatha she has to calm down? So I think the jury will see how messed up this family was, not that she is lying, but that she has no idea how to actually calm anyone down, no idea how to give someone space and let them have their own thoughts/feelings, she has to tell them how to feel, what is going on and how to live.

Yes, it's her twisted version of the truth. The family chose vitriol & violence as their favorite tools to get what they wanted. This goes to the family "always yelling" EA described & Hanna mentioned in her tweets. A volatile & violent family. Nurtured by Angela. Makes me physically ill.

 

[Skully67]

Are we back from lunch yet?

 

[Betty P]

So, CN lied under oath about the car accident.
Also, how do you include yourself in that scheme and not think about getting seriously hurt/dead? Jeesh.

Or Angela and Jake are lying. Given a choice, I'll go with the one who didn't plan and carry out a murder spree. I thought the same thing at first, then reconsidered. They knew he was badly injured, so the only way to avoid guilt is to pretend he was in on it.

@Skully67 No, I'm on WCPO live feed and its still on hold.

 

[Pru2U]

Are we back from lunch yet?

I have Law & Crime and also WCPO pulled up. The courtroom hasn’t come on either screen yet

 

[Betty P]

Ok, all caught up for today. Thanks arielalane and others who have been posting the Twitter coverage! Hope I'm done with doc appts for a while.

 

[Pru2U]

Or Angela and Jake are lying. Given a choice, I'll go with the one who didn't plan and carry out a murder spree.

CN evaded a yes or no question with his answer. It would be petty to charge him. Of course, if the state loses, they might get a little petty.

I do think he was a player in more than one of their reindeer games though. (stealing but NOT the murders.) I also think Angela involving their mother really ticked him off.

 

[ColMustard]

https://twitter.com/ToddDykesWLWT

Angela Wagner started testifying at approx. 10:15 this morning. The jury just took a lunch break at around 12:30.

Angela looked somewhat frail and was typically soft spoken. She's wearing a drab jail uniform. Angela glanced in George's direction when she sat down to testify. If George looked at his mom, it was only for a second or two.

Much of the 1st half of Angela's testimony focused on past misdeeds before the 2016 #PiketonMassacre. She talked about how she, her husband & sons, Billy & George, committed insurance fraud by burning houses - and how the three men stole fuel semi-trailers.

Before the jury went to lunch, Angela testified about George's marriage and divorce to Tabitha Claytor & the little boy the couple had. She was in the middle of talking about murder victim's Hanna May Rhoden's pregnancy when prosecutor Angela Canepa suggested taking a break.

Hanna Rhoden and Jake Wagner had a daughter together. Jake testified last week in #GeorgeWagnerIV's murder trial that concerns about the little girl's safety (and fears about sexual violence) spurred the tragic deaths of 8 members of the Rhoden family in April 2016.

See what I mean?

How many here would describe broad black and white stripes as "drab"?

 

[Betty P]

CN evaded a yes or no question with his answer. It would be petty to charge him. Of course, if the state loses, they might get a little petty.

I do think he was a player in more than one of their reindeer games though. (stealing but NOT the murders.) I also think Angela involving their mother really ticked him off.

Yes, I remember him being visibly upset about his mother being involved and indicted for forgery, etc.

I don't think the state would charge him if so. It's probably past the statute of limitations. The testimony he gave against GW4 was very good, detailed and sincere. He helped them a lot. I can't imagine someone voluntarily putting themselves in such a dangerous situation.

 

[Pru2U]

Are we back from lunch yet?

@Skully67 they are back now.