OH Pike County: 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested#40

[pepper 34]

You very well could be right. I've thought about that, but, the way they did the AK thing was really hodge podge, and then, after seeing the interview dates, I believe the dream of a beloved vacation spot, became a forced reality. As in, we're getting out of Dodge. Out of site, possibly out of mind. Then they came back in early spring of 2018. So either they didn't like it there, after all, or they couldn't make a go of it, which leads me back to FW not funding their every whim, nor their getaway.

Yes, I agree that an early move to Alaska was forced upon them but they still could have had a more leisurely plan in the works earlier in time. If they were able to erect those barns / out buildings on the property, for example.... that might not mean they were settling in at all. They may have finagled some deal where they got the materials very cheaply (gee, how could they manage to do that?) ...and yet it would make for a higher profit when selling the property. They may have been investing in the place so they could sell at a big enough profit to make Alaska a reality by their own planned-out time table iow... and then got whipped into chaotic, confused and messy moving day action after they came under the old laser focus.

 

[Trudie]

Matters not, they can bring charges whether the mother is deceased or alive. It's very possible that they might could have brought charges against HMR's parents, had they been alive. I don't think there is a parental consent clause, in any state with consent laws, so, if that be the case for OH, a parent who gives consent to their minor, could be prosecuted for child abuse.

They could do the math in family court, prior to HMR's death. She got pregnant with S, around six weeks prior to age of consent, (around mid - Feb, 2013), after a relationship that started 8/27/2010, according to HMR's Twitter feed. As far as we know, that's the only time they had relations, well, til he thought he might be K's father. I'm not saying that it was the only time, but it's the only time that we have proof.

Is a doctor not required to report pregnancy of a minor?
Or the hospital that delivers the child?

 

[Trudie]

Yes, I agree that an early move to Alaska was forced upon them but they still could have had a more leisurely plan in the works earlier in time. If they were able to erect those barns / out buildings on the property, for example.... that might not mean they were settling in at all. They may have finagled some deal where they got the materials very cheaply (gee, how could they manage to do that?) ...and yet it would make for a higher profit when selling the property. They may have been investing in the place so they could sell at a big enough profit to make Alaska a reality by their own planned-out time table iow... and then got whipped into action after they came under the old laser focus.

Did they ultimately sell at a loss? If you know. Tysm

 

[Trudie]

Matters not, they can bring charges whether the mother is deceased or alive. It's very possible that they might could have brought charges against HMR's parents, had they been alive. I don't think there is a parental consent clause, in any state with consent laws, so, if that be the case for OH, a parent who gives consent to their minor, could be prosecuted for child abuse.

They could do the math in family court, prior to HMR's death. She got pregnant with S, around six weeks prior to age of consent, (around mid - Feb, 2013), after a relationship that started 8/27/2010, according to HMR's Twitter feed. As far as we know, that's the only time they had relations, well, til he thought he might be K's father. I'm not saying that it was the only time, but it's the only time that we have proof.

So I don’t have to read the 23 count, again, can you kindly remind me, what the charge is? 3-4 felony, I think? Time/punishment?
WiFi acting up and is S L O W. Tysm

 

[Trudie]

Matters not, they can bring charges whether the mother is deceased or alive. It's very possible that they might could have brought charges against HMR's parents, had they been alive. I don't think there is a parental consent clause, in any state with consent laws, so, if that be the case for OH, a parent who gives consent to their minor, could be prosecuted for child abuse.

They could do the math in family court, prior to HMR's death. She got pregnant with S, around six weeks prior to age of consent, (around mid - Feb, 2013), after a relationship that started 8/27/2010, according to HMR's Twitter feed. As far as we know, that's the only time they had relations, well, til he thought he might be K's father. I'm not saying that it was the only time, but it's the only time that we have proof.

I’ve wondered if CPS opens a case in situations like this?

Too much info on this topic for a tired brain to absorb.

 

[Gracie55]

Good to know about trips to Alaska. That answered a question I had. (When did the first, serious plan to move to Alaska come up? We can't possibly know that answer... but the answer is important imo.) If Hanna thought a real plan to go to Alaska was in the works, that could be exactly why trouble came up between Hanna and Jake over S even though they had been on friendly terms up until recently (reportedly.)
#1) Hanna had rejected Jake as husband material already...
...and #2, Jake might have been asking Hanna to sign at least shared custody of S over to him so he could take her along to Alaska on a trip the next time the Wags went.
It doesn't matter if that is required legally or not... he could have told Hanna it was required. He could have told her any number of lies. Hanna may have decided that was too risky. He might take S and go to Alaska and then she'd have trouble getting S back if he decided to stay. Iow... she could lose all control of her own child and it would take a lot of money to get S back again and it could feasibly take years. Custody horror stories are notorious, imo... such things can happen. I have wondered if the W's didn't begin planning to move to Alaska in the near future back while the R's were still alive. If so, Hanna might have begun to see Jake in a whole new light as someone who was plotting against her to take her child away from her and she planned to fight it all the way.
(No more "nice getting along" anymore at all.)
JMO.

HR seemed pretty determined to be the one who got to say who the daddy would be with Kylie. It seems in character she would want to control Sophie's visitations and AK would be out of the question. Maybe when she decided CH would be K's daddy she intended he "father" S as well and stated as such. That could induce JW into rage. IMO.

Two young couples sharing a house can create tension. Add another generation and it could become toxic. IMO of course. But think of it!

No surprise the girls both left. Predictable in my opinion.

HR had a mind of her own and just got her license. Freedom. Maybe she spends more time at home.

JW expected a subservient attitude and she upped and left. He's enraged. He was after all a W. The Prince and the peasant girl. IMO. (Of course there's not a feudal class system in the good old U S of A.)

Untenable she call the shots. How dare this commoner try to threaten a W.

But he had indeed committed a crime in the creation of the child in question. How to get around that? IMO

HR wouldn't knuckle, so he tried to manipulate the situation with forged documents. This girl not only spurned him, she threatened his relationship with his daughter. In his mind the subterfuge was excusable. IMO

JW gets concerned. HR had moved back into a crowded, oh so very very crowded situation in that trailer. With S. It couldn't be good, not his daughter. IMO

The grandfolks predictably got involved. Business ventures played into it somewhere. Money. Fights ensued and the elder's rage level rivaled JW's anger. Or exceeded. IMO

DR moved with HR and CRJR into the new place trumping the JW's best reasons to demand custody. Much confusion in that time, moving, childbirth, new home purchase.

Did something else happen to tip the balance into the rage needed to murder? I guess the truth will come out. I hope.

 

[rsd1200]

So I don’t have to read the 23 count, again, can you kindly remind me, what the charge is? 3-4 felony, I think? Time/punishment?
WiFi acting up and is S L O W. Tysm

Here ya go. I separated the pages out to find things easier;

 

[MittenScarpetta]

I see it differently because I think it all started and ended with Jake. I see those big smiles as a way to manipulate the judge who is now the most important person in his life after his attorneys. I see it as trying to curry favor with the judge so maybe his sentence is lighter or he can get extra favors.

I think Jake manipulated his entire family to get them all to do this. I think he used the Clarence R issue to do that along with other things. But it was all about Jake who was furious Hanna left him and wanted to see her dead before her being happy with another man.

That statement of Fred's about Jake having nothing to do with it makes me think that as far as the family is concerned it is still all about Jake.

He is a psychopath IMO.

JMO

Makes sense

 

[Trudie]

Powerful post, a jury should focus on your point of "It is also an indication that all 4 of the W's walked (or planned to) on the property in commission of their attack." Was having a hard time with who killed whom, this would really prove, to me, all four planned the murders. All equally guilty.

Is purchase of 4 pairs of shoes confirmed?
Sorry. I only recall “specific”. Tysm

 

[Charliegizmo49]

This Bump didn’t it come from the website that shut down.

This is not something I did. Have to check this.

 

[Charliegizmo49]

This Bump didn’t it come from the website that shut down.

I don’t know. It’s been years since I looked at that site. I thought it rather profane.

 

[Trudie]

Why didn't he just go to court and get custody then? Father's are allowed to want joint custody, or custody. He was basically already enjoying joint. If he were grandmother's pet, then she could front him the money, it's not that expensive, and if he'd done it prior to the move, to the new trailer, there's a good chance he'd won, joint, if not primary, custody, if he'd dropped a dime on the grow ops. They were all living on the same strip of CR1's land, in the one trailer that went to FR. Children under the age of 13, get the courts attention. Not as much at 13 or older unless there is physical/sexual abuse. That was the way to go about vengeance. Shut down their op, and try to get custody of S. I don't think that JW manipulated G3. I think that G3 may have been the driving force, b/c the Rs had something over on the Ws, or business bridges got burned and all was not copacetic afterwards. I keep thinking about the undercurrent of drugs. Saying custody plays a role, may just be LE's way to calm the public til that "undercurrent" comes out.

What if G4 blamed HMR for breaking up his marriage? HMR got wheels and Ls around Nov 2014, (Twitter ) and it wasn't much longer after that til both girls were gone.

What if CR1 had dirt on the Ws , and that kept JW, from going to court? What if it was bad enough to make them want to kill them all, so it never got out?

If they were really worried about getting all who knew stuff, they'd have killed LM too. He ran his mouth, 100 mph, from day one. Within 48 hours, he told reporters of at least 4-5 different folks who may have reason to kill the family.

I can’t even conceive of a child (or 2) having such manipulation, control & authority over their family. (I guess I was a “firmer” parent). I wonder, at what age, did AW turn the “household” over to the boys, allowing them to call the shots ? (Pun unintended).

IMO, neither J or G3 are ultra sophisticated. They are not inner city boys. Being home schooled, I picture them very isolated, spending countless hours with their animals. Now, I’m curious what their curriculum consisted of.

MOO

 

[pepper 34]

Did they ultimately sell at a loss? If you know. Tysm

Yes, they did take a loss. We had the information up here while we were discussing the red paint job. Some land was sold separately and then the house with it's own piece of land. IIRC they bought the whole package for the high 170's and sold in the 150's. With the address, I can look up the exact figures though.
ETA: Did they take a loss when you figure in the piece of land they sold separately? I honestly don't remember.

 

[rsd1200]

I can’t even conceive of a child (or 2) having such manipulation, control & authority over their family. (I guess I was a “firmer” parent). I wonder, at what age, did AW turn the “household” over to the boys, allowing them to call the shots ? (Pun unintended).

IMO, neither J or G3 are ultra sophisticated. They are not inner city boys. Being home schooled, I picture them very isolated, spending countless hours with their animals. Now, I’m curious what their curriculum consisted of.

MOO

I can't see it either. I don't even really know what goes on in my kids' relationships unless they just decide to tell me something. I don't want to know. If one of mine said they were fixin' to kill their ex, and would I help, I'd say, Surely you jest, and if you are, don't talk like that, and if you aren't, WTH is wrong with you?!?!

 

[Trudie]

Yes, they did take a loss. We had the information up here while we were discussing the red paint job. Some land was sold separately and then the house with it's own piece of land. IIRC they bought the whole package for the high 170's and sold in the 150's. With the address, I can look up the exact figures though.
ETA: Did they take a loss when you figure in the piece of land they sold separately? I honestly don't remember.

Pepper, tysm. I don’t want you to look stuff up for me, lol. I’m just having some wifi issues, making a search all but impossible & is more than irritating. Iirc, they broke about even With the parcel sale. IMO, of course.

 

[pepper 34]

So I don’t have to read the 23 count, again, can you kindly remind me, what the charge is? 3-4 felony, I think? Time/punishment?
WiFi acting up and is S L O W. Tysm

Felony in the 4th degree. Knowingly had... unlawful sexual conduct with a minor over 13 years and under 16 years of age. (paraphrased)

 

[pepper 34]

Pepper, tysm. I don’t want you to look stuff up for me, lol. I’m just having some wifi issues, making a search all but impossible & is more than irritating. Iirc, they broke about even With the parcel sale. IMO, of course.

That would make sense. I was about to ETA the fact that splitting up the property helped even out the sale a bit. I think the parcel was about a 70 acre area... the house sold in the 150's so that was a wise thing to do, I think.
Maybe the figures in the link will help.
Check out the home I found in Peebles
Date Event Price Price/Sq Ft Source
02/20/2017 Price Changed $100,000
02/17/2017 Price Changed $155,000
09/26/2016 Listed $108,000
08/19/2016 Price Changed $270,000
08/13/2016 Listed $260,000

 

[Trudie]

I can't see it either. I don't even really know what goes on in my kids' relationships unless they just decide to tell me something. I don't want to know. If one of mine said they were fixin' to kill their ex, and would I help, I'd say, Surely you jest, and if you are, don't talk like that, and if you aren't, WTH is wrong with you?!?!

And, not just kill an ex, but 7 more. Maybe even additional victims if so many planned to spend the night & for reasons, did not.

Maybe JW wanted custody in the weeks/months prior to the murders to already have S (legally), so he wouldn’t have to deal with the court after the fact. IF he knew the massacre date was approaching?!? This would make it seem custody was part of the issue. But, he may have been concerned she would be hurt, or worse.

 

[Gracie55]

You very well could be right. I've thought about that, but, the way they did the AK thing was really hodge podge, and then, after seeing the interview dates, I believe the dream of a beloved vacation spot, became a forced reality. As in, we're getting out of Dodge. Out of site, possibly out of mind. Then they came back in early spring of 2018. So either they didn't like it there, after all, or they couldn't make a go of it, which leads me back to FW not funding their every whim, nor their getaway.

Hadn't both AW and GW111 recently lost a father. I'd imagine they were needed by their moms.

Maybe they'd let their guard down enough to feel safe coming around thinking if LE had evidence they'd already have been arrested.

 

[Trudie]

Completely agree. Jake is not naive and has not been sheltered. He manipulates
and destroys. JMO. He is incapable of loving another human being. It is an
act that he has mastered.

HMR was just a young girl that he thought he could control. As she grew, things
were changing. No longer was she willing to settle for less than an equal loving
relationship. Jake was spreading lies and untruths about the Rhodens. Jake would
not allow HMR to completely sever the relationship. JMO.

Grandpa & Grandma Wagner had enough influence to allow their grandson to
further his actions against the Rhodens. After all, Jake is entitled. JMO.

Who did JW manipulate?