OH Pike County: 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested#41

[rsd1200]

If they were wearing body armor they probably just walked right in. If they had on Kevlar sleeves a dog attack wouldn't hurt them. One could have contained the dog while the other shot.

JMO

If a dog that is a trained to guard, went after someone, they'd just latch on to your hand, or leg, anything they can. They'd not give up til their owner called them off. Brownie was probably not specifically trained, but he may have been territorial. Even on the chance they had kevlar sleeves, if 60 sum odd # of teeth and hair hits you when you open that door, you're probably going down, and the owner is probably waking up. JMO, the dogs had to be okay with at least one of them, or the dogs weren't as bad as folks made them out to be, and either could be true, or both.

 

[MittenScarpetta]

If a dog that is a trained to guard, went after someone, they'd just latch on to your hand, or leg, anything they can. They'd not give up til their owner called them off. Brownie was probably not specifically trained, but he may have been territorial. Even on the chance they had kevlar sleeves, if 60 sum odd # of teeth and hair hits you when you open that door, you're probably going down, and the owner is probably waking up. JMO, the dogs had to be okay with at least one of them, or the dogs weren't as bad as folks made them out to be, and either could be true, or both.

Let me try to explain this better because I think maybe I’m not explaining correctly.

My dogs are familiar with certain people, like most of our dogs are. But if someone shows up to my house at night or early morning when it’s dark, my dogs will alert me, despite who it is. The dogs can’t see who is outside in the dark and would bark. I hope that makes a sense. My biggest question is why wouldn’t KR’s dog have alerted him that someone was outside. Dogs have great hearing and will bark at most things that they hear that are out of the normal. Maybe I’m overthinking it. I just feel like that dog should have alerted Kenny and I don’t understand why he didn’t grab his gun, said to be right above his head.

Something isn’t right there IMO. I’ve long thought KR was killed first, for a few reasons, but that also doesn’t fit with the preliminary autopsies that said Chris was the first victim.

 

[Betty P]

BUT, if KR was asleep, how did anyone get in the camper without alerting the dog? A dog’s instincts are to bark when someone arrives and before they enter the home. Doesn’t it seem like the dog would have barked alerting KR to someone at his home?

And if the W’s were visiting the animal while KR was at work, wouldn’t KR’s security cameras have shown him that?

Per the Daily Mail article, KR's cameras were inside the camper, so might not have recorded someone outside. Even though KR slept with Brownie inside at night, he probably left him tied up outside during the day when he was at work. JMO

Security cameras set up inside home of Ohio massacre victim could have helped identify killers | Daily Mail Online

 

[Cool Cats]

BUT, if KR was asleep, how did anyone get in the camper without alerting the dog? A dog’s instincts are to bark when someone arrives and before they enter the home. Doesn’t it seem like the dog would have barked alerting KR to someone at his home?

And if the W’s were visiting the animal while KR was at work, wouldn’t KR’s security cameras have shown him that?

Good questions. My 2 Cents......

First, the Wags would not need to sneak over to Kenny 's to get to know brownie because the Wagners could manufacture a ton of reasons why they needed to stop by and see Kenny. They all have known each other for years.

Secondly, even if the Wags stopped by uninvited and were seen on camera they could easily make up an excuse as to why they stopped by. Again, the Wags and Rhodens have been around each other for years.

As for Brownie alerting Kenny on the night of the murders, that runs on the same principle. Even if Kenny had time to wake up and see the shooter, he would know who it is and not feel threatened.

The killer could say "Hey Kenny don't shoot! It's me Jake, this is an emergency can we step inside and talk."

Because all the Rhodens knew their killers, it was easy for the killers to get in.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

Let me try to explain this better because I think maybe I’m not explaining correctly.

My dogs are familiar with certain people, like most of our dogs are. But if someone shows up to my house at night or early morning when it’s dark, my dogs will alert me, despite who it is. The dogs can’t see who is outside in the dark and would bark. I hope that makes a sense. My biggest question is why wouldn’t KR’s dog have alerted him that someone was outside. Dogs have great hearing and will bark at most things that they hear that are out of the normal. Maybe I’m overthinking it. I just feel like that dog should have alerted Kenny and I don’t understand why he didn’t grab his gun, said to be right above his head.

Something isn’t right there IMO. I’ve long thought KR was killed first, for a few reasons, but that also doesn’t fit with the preliminary autopsies that said Chris was the first victim.

He may have grabbed his gun and even got off a couple of shots. He may even have hit one of them. But if they were wearing body amour it may not even have knocked them down. Unless it was a big caliber gun it probably didn't. Something like a .22 or .32 handgun probably didn't even slow them down. A .44 might knock them down if one was hit, but I think there was two of them so the other one shot Kenny.

I think they yanked the door open and went on in before Kenny could get awake good.

The dog may have known one or both of them very well and didn't attack or stopped the attack quickly because he smelled a familiar human.

JMO

 

[RAISINISBACK]

Good questions. My 2 Cents......

First, the Wags would not need to sneak over to Kenny 's to get to know brownie because the Wagners could manufacture a ton of reasons why they needed to stop by and see Kenny. They all have known each other for years.

Secondly, even if the Wags stopped by uninvited and were seen on camera they could easily make up an excuse as to why they stopped by. Again, the Wags and Rhodens have been around each other for years.

As for Brownie alerting Kenny on the night of the murders, that runs on the same principle. Even if Kenny had time to wake up and see the shooter, he would know who it is and not feel threatened.

The killer could say "Hey Kenny don't shoot! It's me Jake, this is an emergency can we step inside and talk."

Because all the Rhodens knew their killers, it was easy for the killers to get in.

Good theory. If, as has been rumored, Kenny never locked his door at night, it would have been a piece of cake for them to pulled that off.

JMO

 

[rsd1200]

Let me try to explain this better because I think maybe I’m not explaining correctly.

My dogs are familiar with certain people, like most of our dogs are. But if someone shows up to my house at night or early morning when it’s dark, my dogs will alert me, despite who it is. The dogs can’t see who is outside in the dark and would bark. I hope that makes a sense. My biggest question is why wouldn’t KR’s dog have alerted him that someone was outside. Dogs have great hearing and will bark at most things that they hear that are out of the normal. Maybe I’m overthinking it. I just feel like that dog should have alerted Kenny and I don’t understand why he didn’t grab his gun, said to be right above his head.

Something isn’t right there IMO. I’ve long thought KR was killed first, for a few reasons, but that also doesn’t fit with the preliminary autopsies that said Chris was the first victim.

There's the possibility that KR was killed first, or that whoever killed him, called and asked if they could run by and pick something up, he lets them in, they kill him. edit: They could have meant between CR1 & GR, maybe?

Two of my dogs will bark no matter who pulls in, or in what, or what time of day. If they hear it they're barkin'. There's certain vehicles that my Rott has learned and she doesn't really pay any attention to them, not when the friends, in them, come to the door, nor does she bark much. If she emits a low growl, that's when I take notice. Probably, like us, KR knew Brownie's little quirks and if he was awakened by them, thought it was someone that he knew by the way he barked, or sat next to the door.

KR was likely either first, or last. If last, they started this earlier in the night than I thought (unless KR was taking off the next day, and they knew that).

 

[OhioBlues]

Per the Daily Mail article, KR's cameras were inside the camper, so might not have recorded someone outside. Even though KR slept with Brownie inside at night, he probably left him tied up outside during the day when he was at work. JMO

Security cameras set up inside home of Ohio massacre victim could have helped identify killers | Daily Mail Online

I hard a hard time believing that article is accurate about them being inside. How would he know that the police or thieves etc were coming onto his property (or grow ops) if the cameras were on the inside?

I would put the cameras outside to watch for others. JMO.

 

[MittenScarpetta]

There's the possibility that KR was killed first, or that whoever killed him, called and asked if they could run by and pick something up, he lets them in, they kill him. edit: They could have meant between CR1 & GR, maybe?

Two of my dogs will bark no matter who pulls in, or in what, or what time of day. If they hear it they're barkin'. There's certain vehicles that my Rott has learned and she doesn't really pay any attention to them, not when the friends, in them, come to the door, nor does she bark much. If she emits a low growl, that's when I take notice. Probably, like us, KR knew Brownie's little quirks and if he was awakened by them, thought it was someone that he knew by the way he barked, or sat next to the door.

KR was likely either first, or last. If last, they started this earlier in the night than I thought (unless KR was taking off the next day, and they knew that).

That’s a great point that maybe the prelim autopsies meant Chris was the first killed between him and Gary. I personally do believe Kenny was killed first, not last, but that’s JMO.

I also do believe KR was scheduled to work that Friday, but again that’s JMO from observations over the past almost 33 months, along with statements made by DS & KR2 in their interviews.

 

[Cool Cats]

Let me try to explain this better because I think maybe I’m not explaining correctly.

My dogs are familiar with certain people, like most of our dogs are. But if someone shows up to my house at night or early morning when it’s dark, my dogs will alert me, despite who it is. The dogs can’t see who is outside in the dark and would bark. I hope that makes a sense. My biggest question is why wouldn’t KR’s dog have alerted him that someone was outside. Dogs have great hearing and will bark at most things that they hear that are out of the normal. Maybe I’m overthinking it. I just feel like that dog should have alerted Kenny and I don’t understand why he didn’t grab his gun, said to be right above his head.

Something isn’t right there IMO. I’ve long thought KR was killed first, for a few reasons, but that also doesn’t fit with the preliminary autopsies that said Chris was the first victim.

If your deeply asleep and your dog starts barking, it still takes what, 2 minutes? To wake up and try to think straight?

This happened SO fast that even if Brownie was barking the killer could step into that camper in 20 seconds.

Kenny was laying in bed with a gunshot in his right eye. He was up on a bunk, his head had to be turned towards the killer or else Kenny would have been shot in the back of the head or in his temple/behind ear.

I think Brownie was starting to wake him up and he turned his head towards the noise and as he was facing the killer, the killer shot him.
....My 2 Cents..........

 

[MittenScarpetta]

Good theory. If, as has been rumored, Kenny never locked his door at night, it would have been a piece of cake for them to pulled that off.

JMO

IMO, none of them locked their doors. Based off of BJM’s statement about Chris’ door being locked and then she goes on to say that Frankie’s door was locked too. That “too” at the end of her comment made me believe she wasn’t expecting FR’s door to be locked. JMO, but they all felt safe in their homes. 3 of the locations were close to eachother with other family members living on UHR as well. The R’s were also hunters and we can probably assume at least 3 locations had guns inside (we know KR had a gun at the head of his bed). IMO, being a gun owner offers more protection than locking a door at night. Especially in a small, country town where people feel relatively safe in their own homes. All JMHO.

“She then went to the next trailer to alert her nephew Frankie Rhoden that she had found his father dead.

But his front door was locked, too.”

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ks...-those-babies-in-there&contentId=63-187063385

 

[Sleuthinsleuther]

There's the possibility that KR was killed first, or that whoever killed him, called and asked if they could run by and pick something up, he lets them in, they kill him. edit: They could have meant between CR1 & GR, maybe?

Two of my dogs will bark no matter who pulls in, or in what, or what time of day. If they hear it they're barkin'. There's certain vehicles that my Rott has learned and she doesn't really pay any attention to them, not when the friends, in them, come to the door, nor does she bark much. If she emits a low growl, that's when I take notice. Probably, like us, KR knew Brownie's little quirks and if he was awakened by them, thought it was someone that he knew by the way he barked, or sat next to the door.

KR was likely either first, or last. If last, they started this earlier in the night than I thought (unless KR was taking off the next day, and they knew that).

You can’t call and ask to come by because that leaves a trail on your phone records. You’d want to stay completely free of communication that close to the murders

 

[OhioBlues]

There's the possibility that KR was killed first, or that whoever killed him, called and asked if they could run by and pick something up, he lets them in, they kill him. edit: They could have meant between CR1 & GR, maybe?

Two of my dogs will bark no matter who pulls in, or in what, or what time of day. If they hear it they're barkin'. There's certain vehicles that my Rott has learned and she doesn't really pay any attention to them, not when the friends, in them, come to the door, nor does she bark much. If she emits a low growl, that's when I take notice. Probably, like us, KR knew Brownie's little quirks and if he was awakened by them, thought it was someone that he knew by the way he barked, or sat next to the door.

KR was likely either first, or last. If last, they started this earlier in the night than I thought (unless KR was taking off the next day, and they knew that).

My guess is that they started out from FWF and KR was first because he was so close. If it went sideways they could have scampered back to FWF behind those gates. My guess is that he was not meeting anyone either. Personally, it would seem better to try to deal with one person and see how that went before you went in to homes with multiple people inside.

If it had gone sideways with him and they didn't go to UHR, would CR even know the motive or the killers?

JMO.

 

[Dudly]

A lot of times, guardian dogs, like Pitts, Dobies, and Rotts, won't bark, they'll just nail ya if you're already inside their turf. If KR slept with his door unlocked, it's possible that only the W who knew KR, and Brownie, the best, (JW), strowed right up inside there, and killed him before KR fully woke. The dog was probably very confused by the "bang" but wouldn't associate it with the "friend" harming his master, like he would if it were a physical altercation. Then again, maybe DS stretched the truth. Maybe the LEOs just asked him to hold Brownie back to keep him out of the way and that got a little stretched...? They had zero trouble with CR1's dogs, and none with DR's either. I think they knew JW so well that the dogs had no idea what was going on.

I've heard all my life to not worry much about a barking dog but be very afraid of one that does not bark. I've seen them quietly wander around to get behind you and start coming toward you. Brownie's reputation may have been exaggerated to make people less likely to come around when KR was not home. Hard to say what is what with that dog....

 

[MittenScarpetta]

Delete, ws posted same post 2x

 

[Dudly]

I hard a hard time believing that article is accurate about them being inside. How would he know that the police or thieves etc were coming onto his property (or grow ops) if the cameras were on the inside?

I would put the cameras outside to watch for others. JMO.

Cameras could be inside pointing out windows. It makes it more difficult to avoid them.

 

[MittenScarpetta]

My guess is that they started out from FWF and KR was first because he was so close. If it went sideways they could have scampered back to FWF behind those gates. My guess is that he was not meeting anyone either. Personally, it would seem better to try to deal with one person and see how that went before you went in to homes with multiple people inside.

If it had gone sideways with him and they didn't go to UHR, would CR even know the motive or the killers?

JMO.

Interesting. It makes you wonder if the three homes on UHR were hit simultaneously. Two at Dana’s and one each at CR1’s and FR’s. To eliminate risk of getting caught, it seems hitting all three homes at the same time would lower the risk of getting caught. JMHO.

 

[MittenScarpetta]

If your deeply asleep and your dog starts barking, it still takes what, 2 minutes? To wake up and try to think straight?

This happened SO fast that even if Brownie was barking the killer could step into that camper in 20 seconds.

Kenny was laying in bed with a gunshot in his right eye. He was up on a bunk, his head had to be turned towards the killer or else Kenny would have been shot in the back of the head or in his temple/behind ear.

I think Brownie was starting to wake him up and he turned his head towards the noise and as he was facing the killer, the killer shot him.
....My 2 Cents..........

Would they have to be a pretty good shot to hit him once in the eye in an (assumingly) dark camper? Or would they have had to have been fairly close to him to shoot him under those circumstances? I’m not familiar with the range needed for that type of shot. I’m a gun owner but if I were to encounter someone in my home breaking in, I’m aiming for the chest. So, I don’t understand the logistics of shooting someone in the eye I guess. Hope that makes sense.

 

[bowler]

IMO, none of them locked their doors. Based off of BJM’s statement about Chris’ door being locked and then she goes on to say that Frankie’s door was locked too. That “too” at the end of her comment made me believe she wasn’t expecting FR’s door to be locked.

 

[bowler]

Has it been said if they would normally be up and getting ready or already gone?