OH Pike County: 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested#45

[Tiff23fr]

If this was their thinking, it sounds like in OH it "may" be filed with the court for safe keeping. I'm not a lawyer but that makes it sound like standby guardian docs are not REQUIRED to be on file in advance.

D) The writing containing the nomination of a person to be the guardian of the person, the estate, or both of one or more of the nominator's minor or incompetent adult children under division (A) of this section may be filed with the probate court for safekeeping, and the probate court shall designate the nomination as the nomination of a standby guardian.

Were these to go in Chris's safe? Just an added thought...
IF this was their approach, who the heck figured all this out in advance? AW???

 

[Dudly]

I am not sure that honest to goodness, legally documented, court approved joint custody of SW was ever established. It has been established that HMR and JW had a visitation system which was referred to as "joint custody", but IMO there was nothing on file with the court truly establishing joint custody in the eyes of the law.

IMO, the key phrase here in the title of all three alleged forged documents is "in the event of my death". IMO, they knew HMR would be killed. So they forged papers to be 100% sure custody of SW would automatically go to Jake at the time of HMRs death. However, also IMO, they forged papers to give AW custody of SW and GR4's son if JW or GW4 were killed or incapacitated in the process of committing the murders. ** IMO, they were covering all their bases to make sure the W4 as a family got everything they wanted in the end, no matter what the cost.

**ETA: IMO, this also would explain why there is no alleged forged papers for GW4's ex-wife. They are only listed for HMR, JW and GW4. GW had full custody, established in court. Therefore, he had the right to name anyone he wanted to take is son if he died. Since there was no formal custody agreement on file with the court, HMR truly had sole custody of SW. So they had to have papers passing SW to JW in the event of HMR's death, and then a second set of papers passing SW to AW in the event of his death. (ETA a second time, correcting AW's initials.)

Nothing so far has been shown that a legally binding agreement was made between HMR and JW. I don't recall the name, but even an attorney's name was given sometime by someone. It was said that he did not respond to questions asked of him about that agreement... So, as far as we know, it is hearsay at most...

 

[Dudly]

My fil had to have a relative appointed over some things, due to being physically incapacitated, so, unable to do some things on his own. We got someone from the courthouse to run out and stamp what he needed. Refused to take a dime, but she had to see him physically sign the document, and he couldn't physically get to the courthouse.

A Notary has to see the person sign a document to notarize it. It is very safe bet to say RN did not see HMR sign any papers...

 

[Dudly]

That's pretty much what my better half does. He takes care of all of that these days. It's all in my old office... somewhere, away from ME. I could wreak havoc on his system in a matter of minutes.

I use the pile file system and can never find anything back again...lol

 

[rsd1200]

If this was their thinking, it sounds like in OH it "may" be filed with the court for safe keeping. I'm not a lawyer but that makes it sound like standby guardian docs are not REQUIRED to be on file in advance.

D) The writing containing the nomination of a person to be the guardian of the person, the estate, or both of one or more of the nominator's minor or incompetent adult children under division (A) of this section may be filed with the probate court for safekeeping, and the probate court shall designate the nomination as the nomination of a standby guardian.

Were these to go in Chris's safe? Just an added thought...
IF this was their approach, who the heck figured all this out in advance? AW???

Edit:
In 21 States and the District of Columbia, the parent may nominate a standby guardian through a written designation that is signed by two witnesses. The nomination must be affirmed by filing a petition prior to or after the triggering event and by attending a court hearing following the event.5

5 California, Colorado, Connecticut, Florida, Georgia, Hawaii, Illinois, Indiana, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Minnesota, New Mexico, New York, North Carolina, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Tennessee, Virginia, West Virginia, and Wisconsin
--------------------------------------------------

Activating the Standby Guardian’s Authority
A triggering event is what must occur to activate the standby guardian’s authority. Twenty-one States, the District of Columbia, and the Virgin Islands define this event as the parent’s death, mental incapacity, or physical debilitation. 8 In seven States and the District of Columbia the parent must provide consent when physical debilitation is the triggering event.9 Nine States and the District of Columbia require that an attending physician document the incapacity or debilitation.10 In eight States, the parent’s consent alone is sufficient to activate the guardianship.11 Unless I read the fine print wrong, Ohio is not one of those states in 8-11.

Edited.

Here's a lot more info than I had time to read;

https://www.childwelfare.gov/pubpdfs/guardianship.pdf

 

[rsd1200]

I use the pile file system and can never find anything back again...lol

I hear ya Dudly! That only works w/laundry for me!

 

[Myland]

Hacking can be as simple as using someone's password without their permission, to gain entry to their computer or phone, etc... If they have it written down, beside the computer, and you use it without their permission, that can be hacking. It's unauthorized access to their data. If they can show that someone was logging into the Rs/HHGs accounts, from another site, that could be one way to prove it (each computer has it's own unique address).

Jmo It is odd the state says the hacking started (was it back in 2014) long before murders, with people in relationships sharing passwords with permission to sm accounts and other passwords what would the state use to prove hacking other than the IP address. Maybe they have them logged into Dr or Cr acccounts. Jmo or a message saying stay off my account Jmo

 

[Tiff23fr]

Edit:
In 21 States and the District of Columbia, the parent may nominate a standby guardian through a written designation that is signed by two witnesses. The nomination must be affirmed by filing a petition prior to or after the triggering event and by attending a court hearing following the event.5

5 California, Colorado, Connecticut, Florida, Georgia, Hawaii, Illinois, Indiana, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Minnesota, New Mexico, New York, North Carolina, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Tennessee, Virginia, West Virginia, and Wisconsin
--------------------------------------------------

Activating the Standby Guardian’s Authority
A triggering event is what must occur to activate the standby guardian’s authority. Twenty-one States, the District of Columbia, and the Virgin Islands define this event as the parent’s death, mental incapacity, or physical debilitation. 8 In seven States and the District of Columbia the parent must provide consent when physical debilitation is the triggering event.9 Nine States and the District of Columbia require that an attending physician document the incapacity or debilitation.10 In eight States, the parent’s consent alone is sufficient to activate the guardianship.11 Unless I read the fine print wrong, Ohio is not one of those states in 8-11.

Edited.

Here's a lot more info than I had time to read;

https://www.childwelfare.gov/pubpdfs/guardianship.pdf

Imagine that for a triggering event.
All of these thoughts are just speculation in my mind of course. It does however make sense if your plotting what they are accused of.

 

[NWLady]

A Notary has to see the person sign a document to notarize it. It is very safe bet to say RN did not see HMR sign any papers...

Even at our local bank in our small town, the person that notarizes things for us, her and I went to school together from K thru 12 (which was many years ago) and she still requires our ID's every time she notarizes something for us.

 

[Loomis124]

All FW needed to do was go to My eBay and click on her Purchase History. All of her purchases are there, along
with the date of purchase, cost, seller's name, item's picture, description and eBay item number. This information
is retained for years. JMO... FW is not being truthful and has much to hid...Again, JMO.

Great to hear from you! Your post is total truth, as always. Much respected. And yes, agree that FW has much to hide..IMO. I'm a true Realist. Can't help it.

I'm just in awe of how ignorant FW and her counsel are in terms of how broad and wide the evidence is in this case. Such as...if FW could look her own records up so easily, Investigators have 100 times her ability to find where all her purchases were manufactured, the dates, and every person that ever touched them. JMO

 

[Loomis124]

Even at our local bank in our small town, the person that notarizes things for us, her and I went to school together from K thru 12 (which was many years ago) and she still requires our ID's every time she notarizes something for us.

And don't forget...the Notary signs her name, too!

 

[Loomis124]

I thought she said outside the four corners of the document.

She sure may have, Raisin. I'd need to go back and listen. TY

 

[Loomis124]

JMO, because they planned to kill Hanna Rhoden and didn't want an expensive legal battle to gain full custody. That's what ended up happening with Jake giving an interview, his Go Fund Me campaign to help with legal costs, etc. Apparently, they decided not to risk presenting the forged guardianship papers.

I think the papers were found at one of the searches. JMO

 

[Loomis124]

She sure may have, Raisin. I'd need to go back and listen. TY

I just went back and checked. "We need to look AT all four corners of the indictment," Canepa said.

 

[Loomis124]

So how did the prosecution get the forged papers?

IMO, they were found in one of the searches. But not revealed in Discovery yet.

 

[Betty P]

Jmo It is odd the state says the hacking started (was it back in 2014) long before murders, with people in relationships sharing passwords with permission to sm accounts and other passwords what would the state use to prove hacking other than the IP address. Maybe they have them logged into Dr or Cr acccounts. Jmo or a message saying stay off my account Jmo

Wouldn't they be able to tell that if they had access to the cell phones and computers, etc. of both the hacker and the hackee? If JW, for example, was the hacker, they would have gained access to his accounts, cell phone, etc as well as that of Hanna.

All it would take would be for JW to ask Hanna to share her password for her cell phone and/or laptop or tablet. Given they were together for so many years, it's likely she shared this information. Same for social media accounts.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

Even at our local bank in our small town, the person that notarizes things for us, her and I went to school together from K thru 12 (which was many years ago) and she still requires our ID's every time she notarizes something for us.

I know what you mean. I had to ask my brother for his ID to file his taxes. He was like " You have been around me since you were born and you still don't know who I am?" lol

 

[Betty P]

All FW needed to do was go to My eBay and click on her Purchase History. All of her purchases are there, along
with the date of purchase, cost, seller's name, item's picture, description and eBay item number. This information
is retained for years. JMO... FW is not being truthful and has much to hid...Again, JMO.

Same with PayPal. You can go back and view details of transactions for all prior years. It's not that difficult to do.

 

[Tiff23fr]

I think the papers were found at one of the searches. JMO

It's all so possible.
Given what we have heard they began planning late 2015/early 2016. I wonder if as April rolled around they realized, they risked S going into foster until custody was completed if her and Jake had nothing legal on paper. As a last minute idea to remedy the possibility AW did these on April 3. Maybe a way to make it seem not specific to S, she had one done for B as well.
Don't know.. just tossing it out as a possibility.

 

[Loomis124]

Jmo I think Capena wants to verify the authenticity of the receipts. I didn’t hear her say fake. The state needs time to verify Jmo

Look at Synonyms and Antonyms of "not authentic." One is "fake."

Definition of INAUTHENTIC