OH Pike County: 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested#47

[Fletcher73]

So was the piece of bedding that Leonard Manley spoke about being taken from a bedfast person, the pillowcase after all?

Haven't read yet what the item was. Such a strange thing to take in a raid - I thought it had to be related to the patient's DNA or the material itself.

I speculate the item was the thick padding used to cushion a patient - which could possibly be used as packing in a homemade silencer.

 

[sunshineray]

I was just reading RN's indictment. For count #1 it uses the language (paraphraseing) accused, in facilitating a fraud did unlawfully forge, to wit, a custody document, without the other person's authority, to wit, HMR,...so that it purports to be genuine when it's actually spurious, or to be the act of another who did not authorize that act...

Count #2 and #3 goes on to use the exact same language for JW and his brother GW4, so saying that JW and GW4 did NOT authorize RN to draw up the forged documents.

Would they, being written in the indictments as victims of fraud, be required in any way to appear, participate at her trial to say yeah I knew nothing about these, that's not my signature, i did not tell her to do this for me? Her indictment, in counts 2 & 3 have the W brothers listed as the victims of her fraud.

It's like the state of Ohio is saying to them, ok you knew nothing about these frauds your grandmother did in your name? Ok, well we will be charging her on your behalf.

How the heck is RN's trial supposed to proceed without their testimony of her doing these felonies without their knowledge, fraudulently? Can the W brothers even be supenaed to testify? The way it's written it has nothing to do with the R murders and stands on it's own as crimes against JW and GW3.

Am I understanding this correctly?

 

[sunshineray]

After watching this video, I am almost certain, IMOO, that someone in the same household probably heard the shots but maybe it wasn’t heard outside. It strengthens my opinion that CRjr most likely was aware of what was happening. BR may have heard something and perhaps AW tried to cover his ears. JMOO.

These are manufactured silencers too. W's were homemade so the shots could have been louder. Watching that video just makes me ill, thinking about not only the horror of the victims but of the survivors, the children.

 

[sunshineray]

Haven't read yet what the item was. Such a strange thing to take in a raid - I thought it had to be related to the patient's DNA or the material itself.

I speculate the item was the thick padding used to cushion a patient - which could possibly be used as packing in a homemade silencer.

Watching that silencer video, the guns smoking and setting off detectors in the home, makes you wonder though. I had to use those pads with my Dad during hospice and the material inside could probably help in muffling sound but would surely catch on fire. As far as taking a family members other bedding to use during these crimes, wouldn't that risk DNA being left behind that could implicate?

 

[GoBuckeyes]

The vests were not purchased until after the crimes so no they weren’t not used

Since the plates are replaceable, and the receipts have yet to be verified, we can't be certain if they were or weren't worn during the murders.

 

[GoBuckeyes]

Why wouldn’t she? She was afraid for her son.
Billy will say he got that tattoo on his trigger finger because he was afraid and didn’t want people to mess with him. He tried to act mean and intimidating and in fact wanted people to think he did it so they would stay away from him. He got that tattoo out of nothing but fear and to act tough. The boondocks video clip the sane reason. He wanted people including LE to think he did it

Why would he want LE to think he did it? Curious about your line of thinking on that aspect. TIA

 

[Johnny B Bad]

He didn’t hear or see nothing or he would not be alive today.

The child was 3 years old, don’t you think maybe aunt Angela sat with him and got him back to sleep and if the child did say something all Angela would have to say that he dreamed she was there do to what went on, Remember, the Wagners already had set the crime scene up to frame the cartel, the Manley and who ever Fredericka told LE the killers were, her word against a 3 year old dream. JMO

 

[Fletcher73]

The child was 3 years old, don’t you think maybe aunt Angela sat with him and got him back to sleep and if the child did say something all Angela would have to say that he dreamed she was there do to what went on, Remember, the Wagners already had set the crime scene up to frame the cartel, the Manley and who ever Fredericka told LE the killers were, her word against a 3 year old dream. JMO

ETA - searched some news stories because I thought BR had mentioned seeing Ninjas at his house, but I must've misread.

 

[ColMustard]

Since the plates are replaceable, and the receipts have yet to be verified, we can't be certain if they were or weren't worn during the murders.

Maybe those spots on the BPVs are damage from bullets, so the original plates would show damage also, therefore needing replaced.

 

[Ann99]

There was a news article, iirc, where BR mentioned ninjas were in his house - it may have been a follow-up article about a year after the murders.

Ninjas dress in black from head to toe.
I am 99% sure that the Wagners dressed in black from head to toe that night.

 

[ColMustard]

I doubt he would know them. They probably didn't even know he was there, curled up on that couch, possibly under a blanket, in the dark. If they didn't see him, I'd bet money they spoke freely.

Edit: If he was awake, he'd know who it wasn't, too.

Per a news article, he plays Fortnite. If he played back then, he knew to lay low when enemies are nearby.

 

[ColMustard]

There was a news article, iirc, where BR mentioned ninjas were in his house - it may have been a follow-up article about a year after the murders.

I recall an article stating CR2? ... reported people dressed in black lurking near her house, after the murders.

 

[Fletcher73]

Ninjas dress in black from head to toe.
I am 99% sure that the Wagners dressed in black from head to toe that night.

There's a photo where GW4 and JW have hair dyed black about a week after the massacre.

 

[Fletcher73]

I recall an article stating CR2? ... reported people dressed in black lurking near her house, after the murders.

Maybe that's the article I read. Creepy enough - but after family tragedy - horrible.

 

[NWLady]

There must be something that was on the interview that the prosecutors think they can get admitted and that won't be dismissed as inflammatory. I agree with you. It's possible it could be direct evidence against an accused.

This isn't directed at you, but rather just jumping off your post. This might seem like a stupid question and it probably is a stupid question, but I am going to ask anyways. Is everything listed in discovery actually used at trial? For an example, all the phone records of numerous invidiuals listed in discovery does that mean those are all pertinent to the case and will be used at trial, or does the discovery just contain lots of information that prosecutors/LE/BCI obtained during the course of their investigation, but is not necessarily information that will be useful/used during trial?

Thanks in advance for any input regarding this.

 

[NWLady]

Also possible he's alive today because he was hidden away for quite a while.



True, he must have said something that was incriminating against the W's. He may not have been able to describe who the killers were or LE would have arrested the Wagners much sooner. Right?



Yes, it was creepy. I was referring to the recent renovations done there to make it like a spa room. I think some of the dust was spackle or drywall dust, indicating some of the construction was recent or no one had bothered to clean it up afterwards. The BPVs, etc. appeared dirty.

BBM

Respectively Betty, I have to disagree with this part, as there are articles even at about the 2 year date after the murders (with Google search of B's mother's name) where little B's name is brought up and where she mentions how he still lives in fear and also I remember at one time on social media, pictures of B at his dad's grave. So, it's JMO but it didn't seem as if she was trying to keep him out of the spot light and/or refuse to do newspaper interviews, etc.

ETA: I should not have said I disagree with you Betty, as you did put "possible" but I was more so just throwing out my thoughts on little B in the media per his mother, etc. Sorry, if that came out as defensive, as it was not meant that way.

 

[sunshineray]

I recall an article stating CR2? ... reported people dressed in black lurking near her house, after the murders.

Yes her Mom called the cops to come about it. IIRC

 

[ColMustard]

Yes her Mom called the cops to come about it. IIRC

Yes, and I think their mailbox was destroyed also. ?

The articles may have contained some subterfuge, so the killers could believe they weren't seen or recognized.

Smith/Mundt Act was repealed in 2012 (?), so news articles can now be all fantasy, and many are.

 

[sunshineray]

This was interesting. Looking back over old articles and the CG's one from July 2016 "Hate seeing my daughter cry" whete JW talks about setting up the fund still has the,
"But Wagner picked her up a day earlier than normal: "I reckon we missed it by just hours."
but now all mention of the checking newborn KR's toes at the hospital for the W family trait and if I'm not the father I'd still want mandatory visit rights is all gone.

So article has kept the part the W's publically disclaimed and gotten rid of JW explaining how he thinks he's somehow entitled to have mandated time with another man's child. Hummm wonder what's up with that? I can guess but I won't.

Rhoden case: 'Hate seeing my daughter cry'

 

[Tiff23fr]

This was interesting. Looking back over old articles and the CG's one from July 2016 "Hate seeing my daughter cry" whete JW talks about setting up the fund still has the,
"But Wagner picked her up a day earlier than normal: "I reckon we missed it by just hours."
but now all mention of the checking newborn KR's toes at the hospital for the W family trait and if I'm not the father I'd still want mandatory visit rights is all gone.

So article has kept the part the W's publically disclaimed and gotten rid of JW explaining how he thinks he's somehow entitled to have mandated time with another man's child. Hummm wonder what's up with that? I can guess but I won't.

Rhoden case: 'Hate seeing my daughter cry'

It is in a different article:
And there is nothing Wagner would like more, he said, fondly recalling how he pulled the tiny sock off her itty, bitty foot shortly after she was born on April 17. He was checking for a hammer index toe: A Wagner family trait.

He's almost sure, he said, that he saw that bend. It's the hope he holds onto these days.

But if he isn't Kylie's dad, and if the courts deem another man suitable to care for her, he will step aside -- at least partially.

"I'm not going to take her," Wagner said. "But I will want mandatory visitation in order to see her regularly."

Pike County: 'That's all we've got left. Just those kids.'