OH - Pike County: 8 people from one family dead as police hunt for killer(s) #21

[grow73]

Norway is pretty quiet. It ranks at the top spot on the Unesco index for wealth and quality of living, it's the last place I would imagine.

Just shows craziness happens in the best of places and probably in the best families too

It's quiet, but we had Anders Behring Breivik a few years back, and he ruined our innocence. Our neighbour Sweden has bigger problems with crime, organized and other, and there's no reason to think Norway won't see the same in the future. We also have a very high OD death rate by Europeian standard, and it has been that way for years.

 

[jk204]

It's quiet, but we had Anders Behring Breivik a few years back, and he ruined our innocence. Our neighbour Sweden has bigger problems with crime, organized and other, and there's no reason to think Norway won't see the same in the future. We also have a very high OD death rate by Europeian standard, and it has been that way for years.

Good to read you again Grow73. I thought of you when I wrote it.

 

[grow73]

Good to read you again Grow73. I thought of you when I wrote it.

Thank you, I'm still here every day, frustrated with he lack of progress and all out of ideas. :gaah: So glad you guys are keeping this thread alive.

 

[rsd1200]

Not at all, I understand. I have visited 30. Some places have issues you just can't compare. However it's interesting to reflect on things we take for granted in our culture. It's often by looking out that we understand what's going on inside.

I would say that when it comes to organized crimes, or mass shootings or family crimes, it's pretty much the same in USA, Canada and European States. Except for crime rates and access to weapons.

I put these 4 posts up today to demonstrate that:
1) when AG says multiple killer, we dont really know what he means. He may have prosecuting tactics we don't see
2) the assumption that one single killer can't do this alone is wrong
3) the assumption a family member wouldn't kill a brother or a sister is also wrong
4) this case is not necessarily very different from all the other mass shooting that occur in the USA. Like all the others, it's not motivated by common sense

Cheers JK

I'm a believer that there were at least two people.
A single killer, I could see, if it were all in one home, yes. I just don't see it in this case. I believe there would at the very least, have to be one other person assisting. I could be wrong. It's happened before.
Fratricide is as old as Cain and Able but, there's at least one sibling, in this scenario, who I just don't think has it in him, nor had a reason, to commit murder.
I personally don't see "common sense" at play in any murder. The assailants, however, have their justifications. Whether it is revenge, saving their own hide, greed, envy, anger, etc... However, it is different. When it was released on the networks, I remember them saying that nothing quite like this had been in the news in decades. I've not been able to find another family annihilation quite like it, nor one where the assailant(s) didn't either commit suicide, or were not caught shortly thereafter. I've not found one where someone has gone down a road, entered four homes, all of relatives, and murdered everyone in each home, and disappeared into the night. The location of the homes helped them to do so, but they apparently left little evidence or they'd have been caught by now. Four homes. Eight people. All owners of firearms, I'm guessing, and most likely adept with them. I'm no idiot, but, I'm sure I'd have left SOMETHING behind. Unless, I either already knew how to pull it off, w/o leaving evidence, or I had planned this for weeks, if not months. I mean meticulously planned, and researched how to pull it off. This was no spur of the moment thing. The average Joe Blow could not just walk in there and do this w/o leaving evidence, unless they were smart enough to know what to do, or research what to do, to get by with it. I'm honestly very surprised that an arrest wasn't made within the first couple of weeks.

 

[rsd1200]

I looked up Ohio statutes on false alibis. That was a mistake! I got a lot of junk, aka lawyer jargon that if I read thru it, I would probably feel like throwing something!

It's basically considered perjury. A person convicted of perjury under federal law may face up to five years in prison and fines.

 

[Canaille]

I'm a believer that there were at least two people.
A single killer, I could see, if it were all in one home, yes. I just don't see it in this case. I believe there would at the very least, have to be one other person assisting. I could be wrong. It's happened before.
Fratricide is as old as Cain and Able but, there's at least one sibling, in this scenario, who I just don't think has it in him, nor had a reason, to commit murder.
I personally don't see "common sense" at play in any murder. The assailants, however, have their justifications. Whether it is revenge, saving their own hide, greed, envy, anger, etc... However, it is different. When it was released on the networks, I remember them saying that nothing quite like this had been in the news in decades. I've not been able to find another family annihilation quite like it, nor one where the assailant(s) didn't either commit suicide, or were not caught shortly thereafter. I've not found one where someone has gone down a road, entered four homes, all of relatives, and murdered everyone in each home, and disappeared into the night. The location of the homes helped them to do so, but they apparently left little evidence or they'd have been caught by now. Four homes. Eight people. All owners of firearms, I'm guessing, and most likely adept with them. I'm no idiot, but, I'm sure I'd have left SOMETHING behind. Unless, I either already knew how to pull it off, w/o leaving evidence, or I had planned this for weeks, if not months. I mean meticulously planned, and researched how to pull it off. This was no spur of the moment thing. The average Joe Blow could not just walk in there and do this w/o leaving evidence, unless they were smart enough to know what to do, or research what to do, to get by with it. I'm honestly very surprised that an arrest wasn't made within the first couple of weeks.

BBM

In the last few days trying to find a link of what I thought I heard or read, I've seen more remarks that the murders were "a sophisticated operation" and were pre planned.

kind of gives me far fetched ideas, like, did the killer wear something that left no fibers? Is there such a thing that won't leave some trace fiber?

Since it's believed that the killer knew the layout of the homes, etc., could the killer (over a period of time) have taken clothes, gloves, etc. that belonged to the family and worn them during the murder, so as to reduce the chance of leaving behind fibers, etc. from their own clothes?

 

[jk204]

I'm a believer that there were at least two people.
A single killer, I could see, if it were all in one home, yes. I just don't see it in this case. I believe there would at the very least, have to be one other person assisting. I could be wrong. It's happened before.
Fratricide is as old as Cain and Able but, there's at least one sibling, in this scenario, who I just don't think has it in him, nor had a reason, to commit murder.
I personally don't see "common sense" at play in any murder. The assailants, however, have their justifications. Whether it is revenge, saving their own hide, greed, envy, anger, etc... However, it is different. When it was released on the networks, I remember them saying that nothing quite like this had been in the news in decades. I've not been able to find another family annihilation quite like it, nor one where the assailant(s) didn't either commit suicide, or were not caught shortly thereafter. I've not found one where someone has gone down a road, entered four homes, all of relatives, and murdered everyone in each home, and disappeared into the night. The location of the homes helped them to do so, but they apparently left little evidence or they'd have been caught by now. Four homes. Eight people. All owners of firearms, I'm guessing, and most likely adept with them. I'm no idiot, but, I'm sure I'd have left SOMETHING behind. Unless, I either already knew how to pull it off, w/o leaving evidence, or I had planned this for weeks, if not months. I mean meticulously planned, and researched how to pull it off. This was no spur of the moment thing. The average Joe Blow could not just walk in there and do this w/o leaving evidence, unless they were smart enough to know what to do, or research what to do, to get by with it. I'm honestly very surprised that an arrest wasn't made within the first couple of weeks.

I agree on the planning but It's frequent in mass murders. Did they leave something? We dont know. May be. As I said before if they are regulars of the home, it's going to be a hard to prove it's related to crime. And as you said, it's so remote. No witness either.

4 locations? We're talking about 2 locations which are neighbors, another one 1 mile down the road. KR is further. But he is also in an area close to other members. I don't find this exceptional for a family drama. I find it more odd for a business hit.

However I do wonder about the car? Can a killer do 8 without leaving any trace in his car? I can imagine the cars of several persons of interest have been searched.

This is where I have an issue with the theory of the close family member. This is where the scrap derby ride becomes handy. LoL!

 

[Canaille]

And how does one define a sophisticated murder? Seems to me that would vary?

 

[glf]

I have serious doubts that the killers wore any of the victims clothing. They could have worn coveralls, tho. I too, believe ALOT of planning was necessary to get eight people. And I still believe more than one person was involved. It seems like too big of a risk for one person to feel they could do something like this alone without getting killed themselves.

 

[rsd1200]

BBM

In the last few days trying to find a link of what I thought I heard or read, I've seen more remarks that the murders were "a sophisticated operation" and were pre planned.

kind of gives me far fetched ideas, like, did the killer wear something that left no fibers? Is there such a thing that won't leave some trace fiber?

Since it's believed that the killer knew the layout of the homes, etc., could the killer (over a period of time) have taken clothes, gloves, etc. that belonged to the family and worn them during the murder, so as to reduce the chance of leaving behind fibers, etc. from their own clothes?

I think that whoever did this had been in the homes before. Their dna leavings may have even been inter-mingled w/the deceased's. They could have been regulars at the homes. As for the layouts of the homes, most trailers are pretty standard. Especially single-wide. If they'd been in the homes a couple of times or hundreds of times it wouldn't take much to figure out the layout and use the internet to figure out how to quietly get inside. They could use the internet to watch their patterns. All of the family seemed to live their lives out loud on the internet w/the exception of GR, CR1 and KR. It's not that hard to track the whereabouts of folks these days. I am stunned at the number of folks who post pics of everywhere they are at while on vacation, or out to eat, or at the movies, and have zero safeguards on their FB. I don't do it and I've got mine locked down pretty darn tight. They could have researched the most common clothing to wear, most common firearm, it's all out there within a couple of keystrokes.

 

[rsd1200]

I agree on the planning but It's frequent in mass murders. Did they leave something? We dont know. May be. As I said before if they are regulars of the home, it's going to be a hard to prove it's related to crime. And as you said, it's so remote. No witness either.

4 locations? We're talking about 2 locations which are neighbors, another one 1 mile down the road. KR is further. But he is also in an area close to other members. I don't find this exceptional for a family drama. I find it more odd for a business hit.

However I do wonder about the car? Can a killer do 8 without leaving any trace in his car? I can imagine the cars of several persons of interest have been searched.

This is where I have an issue with the theory of the close family member. This is where the scrap derby ride becomes handy. LoL!

No, it is still four separate households that they broke into. It would be like combining my family members together b/c they happen to live directly across the road from one another. It's still two separate households, with separate risks, that they are breaking into. I lived within seeing distance of four of my relatives, at one point, all of us in three separate homes, on the same road. For someone to have broken in, to murder all eight of us, would have been a pretty, for lack of a better word, ba!!sy, thing to do. All of us had firearms and dogs too. I don't want to shoot anyone but you break in on me at 1 or 2 a.m. and I think you're gonna kill me, it's likely that I'm gonna try to shoot you first. So the assailants had to be super quiet. I know every creak in my childhood home's floor. I was able to get out of that home in the middle of the night and back in, in the early morning hours, before my parents woke up, and they don't know to this day that I was out rambling the countryside.

 

[rsd1200]

And how does one define a sophisticated murder? Seems to me that would vary?

I agree. Just look at how they define "sophisticated" marijuana grow sites...

 

[jk204]

No, it is still four separate households that they broke into. It would be like combining my family members together b/c they happen to live directly across the road from one another. It's still two separate households, with separate risks, that they are breaking into. I lived within seeing distance of four of my relatives, at one point, all of us in three separate homes, on the same road. For someone to have broken in, to murder all eight of us, would have been a pretty, for lack of a better word, ba!!sy, thing to do. All of us had firearms and dogs too. I don't want to shoot anyone but you break in on me at 1 or 2 a.m. and I think you're gonna kill me, it's likely that I'm gonna try to shoot you first. So the assailants had to be super quiet. I know every creak in my childhood home's floor. I was able to get out of that home in the middle of the night and back in, in the early morning hours, before my parents woke up, and they don't know to this day that I was out rambling the countryside.

I agree. One more reason to think it's family. Who else can just walk in and have people stay in bed. -"Who is it?" -"It's just me".

 

[AF555]

Forgive me for asking...I'm new here and haven't been able to read all threads yet. I am wondering the following:

What caliber weapon was used, and were there multiple guns used or all same gun?

I've been reading about the Kenton County, Ky couple who also were murdered execution style. Have they released any real info about any ties to this case yet?

Also, the Minford murders near that town...are those connected to this case? Seems like a very similar killer and MO.

 

[glf]

Forgive me for asking...I'm new here and haven't been able to read all threads yet. I am wondering the following:

What caliber weapon was used, and were there multiple guns used or all same gun?

I've been reading about the Kenton County, Ky couple who also were murdered execution style. Have they released any real info about any ties to this case yet?

Also, the Minford murders near that town...are those connected to this case? Seems like a very similar killer and MO.

We do not know what size or types of weapons were used. The only thing we do know is Gary Rhodes's dad was told there were two different size casings found in the house that Gary died in. We have speculated about possible links to the other two cases you mentioned, but nobody is certain if any connection has been made thru LE discussions. This case has been so tight lipped, all we have been able to do is discuss different ideas we have and play connect the dots without any numbers! Plz read the threads from the beginning. I know it's a lot to read, but very interesting, and worth your time.

 

[glf]

Forgive me for asking...I'm new here and haven't been able to read all threads yet. I am wondering the following:

What caliber weapon was used, and were there multiple guns used or all same gun?

I've been reading about the Kenton County, Ky couple who also were murdered execution style. Have they released any real info about any ties to this case yet?

Also, the Minford murders near that town...are those connected to this case? Seems like a very similar killer and MO.

We do not know what size or types of weapons were used. The only thing we do know is Gary Rhoden's dad was told there were two different size casings found in the house that Gary died in. We have speculated about possible links to the other two cases you mentioned, but nobody is certain if any connection has been made thru LE discussions. This case has been so tight lipped, all we have been able to do is discuss different ideas we have and play connect the dots without any numbers! Plz read the threads from the beginning. I know it's a lot to read, but very interesting, and worth your time.

 

[amauet1]

Maybe they used a stun gun, or bound them so they couldn't move? The evidence of that would be in the autopsy reports. Speaking of which, weren't they supposed to start mediation on that on Sept 13th? I haven't any idea how long that takes, but it would be nice to know if it's in progress.

 

[AF555]

We do not know what size or types of weapons were used. The only thing we do know is Gary Rhoden's dad was told there were two different size casings found in the house that Gary died in. We have speculated about possible links to the other two cases you mentioned, but nobody is certain if any connection has been made thru LE discussions. This case has been so tight lipped, all we have been able to do is discuss different ideas we have and play connect the dots without any numbers! Plz read the threads from the beginning. I know it's a lot to read, but very interesting, and worth your time.

I'm in the process of reading them all now. I couldn't hold out on asking about this til I was finished. Thank you!

 

[rsd1200]

I agree. One more reason to think it's family. Who else can just walk in and have people stay in bed. -"Who is it?" -"It's just me".

Yeah, but unless it was one of my kids, or my own parents, "just me" wouldn't have cut it. I may be different than folks ya'll know, but extended family and friends never just run in and out of our homes all hours of the day and night. I'd be on the defensive if it were someone other than someone who actually lived with me, who called back "just me". People are funny. They don't take kindly to folks creeping into their homes at night, no matter who they are. I might have crept in and out of my own home, and it could've gotten me shot looking back as an older adult, but I'd never think to just go strollin' into some other family member's home. My Momma would've jerked a knot in my tail. Maybe things were more free-wheelin' with the Rhodens but obviously HR's most current bf was not permitted to spend the night there, and that appeared to be CH. If so, he'd have been deceased.

 

[Jax49]

Forgive me for asking...I'm new here and haven't been able to read all threads yet. I am wondering the following:

What caliber weapon was used, and were there multiple guns used or all same gun?

I've been reading about the Kenton County, Ky couple who also were murdered execution style. Have they released any real info about any ties to this case yet?

Also, the Minford murders near that town...are those connected to this case? Seems like a very similar killer and MO.

BBM The story below was linked earlier, but it gives a good indication of the situation regarding the KY murders.

http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/local/2016/09/06/reunion-one-more-loss-for-family.html#

Then, just two weeks ago, a Columbus television station aired a story that said a prosecutor in Kenton County, Kentucky, (just across the river from Cincinnati) told a reporter there “were similiarities” between a drug-related double-homicide in Elsmere, Kentucky, on April 5 and the Rhoden homicides two weeks later.Other media outlets picked up the story, and the implication that there could be a connection spread quickly. Once again, Tony said, the family found themselves wondering if there was any truth to the rumors. There wasn’t.
Rob Sanders, attorney for Kentucky’s 16th Judicial Circuit in Kenton County, told The Dispatch that the only similarities were generic — the two victims in Kentucky had been shot to death and four children in the home at the time went unharmed. Investigators there were in contact early on with the Pike County team simply to make certain nothing was being overlooked, he said.
“Many, many crimes have similarities, but for anyone to suggest that generic similarities equal a connection would be irresponsible and wrong,” he said.