OH - Pike County: 8 people from one family dead as police hunt for killer(s) - #22

[rsd1200]

Was there any DNA found? I don't remember any disclosure about this...thanks.

There's been no mention of any found however they did take the DNA of family members, I'm guessing to help rule out DNA at the scene, as belingong to family members.

 

[jpo74]

If the lights were on when they were found, it raises questions. My theory is that it was pitch black at the crime scenes at the time of the murders

If the murders happened at night, they perps had to have turn on the light to see to kill OR that they had that infared<sp> googles on

 

[Dr. Know?]

Going into the murders sort of blindly after moving years ago from OH & having family living near the murders, my first thought was could there have been a group outside maybe all talking, ganging up & fighting, having a bonfire etc...people over hanging out or everyone was outside at first. Still, not enough info but some to think about.

 

[Dr. Know?]

Could be like said before by many, someone(s) arrived, expected or unexpected, known to many of them. Anyway I cut it, I can't rule anyone out. Being or trying to be open minded, hurts. gar!

 

[Flatbush]

If the murders happened at night, they perps had to have turn on the light to see to kill OR that they had that infared<sp> googles on

There was a very clear full moon that night, they let their eyes adjust to that light, they knew their way around...I always thought that fit into their plan perfectly, sadly.

Sent from my VS810PP using Tapatalk

 

[Safeguard]

There's a sense of personal animosity on the part of LE towards all of the Rhoden family members that is inappropriate and unprofessional. As KR's daughter pointed out in the latest interview, these people weren't big time drug dealers. They were working 40-60 hrs a week in multiple jobs trying to make a living. They're the victims here, but the dead family members and their surviving family are being treated as if they're deplorable criminals.

rsbm
Absolutely. I agree. That's why CPS was able to take those babies and no one batted an eye. That was the the point I was making when I posted about the infant abductions. Not that the I thought the Rhodens were suspect. But someone in a position of authority, (or multiple people), down there Hates this family. And I personally think KR was killed simply because he would have known, instantly, who was behind the murders. jmo

 

[SerialGal]

Something I've thought about, and not been able to find an answer for, is whether or not KR was scheduled to be off work. We know DS has indicated he was supposed to be there to help work on cars but didn't show up. We've also learned that Kendra said she thought her dad was at work. I just wonder if the "working on cars" excuse (be it real cars or marijuana tending) was a part of KR's plan and did he take a vacation day from his job or did his job expect him to report that morning like usual? I've perused the media articles but haven't seen anything that referenced whether or not he had the day off, unless I missed it.

 

[glf]

Wow, lots of thoughts this morn! I have always been under the impression that Kenny had been at his current for quite a while. Does anybody know if it has ever been stated how long he had been at his job?
Like I said before, if I had been a relative on the scene early, I would have taken both babies, and bought bottles and formula, and hit the nearest second hand store for clothes before LE had a chance to even think about the situation.
I don't remember anything said about DNA evidence left behind, since all but one home where the murders occurred had multiple people living in them. Then, I'm sure they have DNA evidence from nearly every person who had visited the week prior. Lots of stuff to rule out before any correct statement could be made about DNA belonging to the killers being left behind.

 

[leelee114]

That occurred to me also. But they allowed FR's son's mother to keep him and HR's daughters dad to keep her. These two children were old enough to have potentially have told something or at least FR's son since he was there at the time. HR's daughter could have told about someone who was at DR's prior to her dad picking her up.

I am thinking that not allowing family access to these kids is more of a bargaining chip to put pressure on them to talk. It sure makes it seem like LE has zeroed in on family members as the perps doesn't it?

edited by me

With the two older children there would be no legal standing to take the children from a mother with primary custody of her child or in Sophia's case a father whose paternity was established as well as some sort shared custody. It isn't as cut and dry with the other two and I do agree that the kids are a bargaining chip as is the hold up with the estate. Hence I am 100% convinced that at least one family member was directly involved and at least one knows the truth. Reader's actions make me think either the one who knows the truth won't be able to stand the suffering caused by the custody anymore of the one who was directly involved will slip up because of their greed.

Have lots to catch up on though. Super shocked at how many times HG was shot.

 

[glf]

The maggots who killed this family are just that...MAGGOTS!

 

[RAISINISBACK]

It was in some earlier interviews that Leonard Manley and others spoke of how they were having problems settling the estates of the victims - paying off bills, etc. because they didn't have basic paperwork needed - eg birth certificates, health insurance, life insurance policies, bank account info, etc. When someone dies, all of their assets and accounts are frozen, but the bills keep coming in. It's basic stuff everyone has to go through when a relative dies. In probate court, you have to produce original documents for some of these things, not photocopies. These are not things people can "take care of" before they die. This is part of the normal legal process for dealing with someone's estate, even those who have a will, etc. Have you never helped settle an estate for a deceased loved one? I have, its a lot of paperwork.

It's not considered "accommodating" anyone. It's considered standard, ethical practice by LE, per the quote from the professor at John Jay College. But, of course, not all law enforcement agencies are ethical. In this case, there's nothing LE can't share with family WRT personal and financial legal documents. It's not needed for their investigation.

There's a sense of personal animosity on the part of LE towards all of the Rhoden family members that is inappropriate and unprofessional. As KR's daughter pointed out in the latest interview, these people weren't big time drug dealers. They were working 40-60 hrs a week in multiple jobs trying to make a living. They're the victims here, but the dead family members and their surviving family are being treated as if they're deplorable criminals.

I get the sense that everything LE is doing is a bargaining chip to get them to talk. I think it is a calculated move on the part of LE. Like seeing the kids, getting paperwork they need ect. Anything to put pressure on them. Like announcing the "big commercial grow" 48 hours into the investigation so donations to the family would dry up and rewards would be withdrawn. I cannot believe that LE and especially the AG of Ohio and the BCI would not know a small time grow from a huge commercial grow ("among the biggest we have ever seen" according to AG Dewine). Now we know according to the Sheriff and KR's daughter it was a few plants, barely even worth mentioning. I think it has all been a calculated and well thought out campaign by LE to put enough pressure on the families to get them to tell everything they know because as has been stated by LE many times, they believe some people in the family know more than they are telling. Whether that is true or not is a different story. Just saying.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

I have helped settle an estate and it was nothing close to the craziness that you describe, of course our particular family member had their affairs in order, and was not involved in illegal activities that required their property to be seized either.

I have been helping with my sisters estate. We couldn't find her insurance polices and my BIL had no idea how much she had or who she had them with. He didn't even know how much life insurance he had on himself or who with. He didn't know what bills they had or who they owed money to. In the 51 years they were married she had handled all the money and I don't think my BIL had ever signed a check or paid a bill in his life. So my other sister and I took over everything.

The first thing we did was have the man at the funeral home run her social security number and he came up with every policy she had and told us how much and what insurance company. I cancelled all her credit cards and requested duplicate statements for the last six months to make sure no policies were billing to a credit card. We found what bills she was paying by going to the bank and asking for her bank statements both checking and savings. We requested all records from the bank of CD's IRA's ect. All this took us a little over one week.

They can get certified copies of birth certificates from the state the victims were born in. They can get death certificates from the funeral home. They can get copies of deeds from the county clerk. They can request copies of car titles from the state. They can also get the name of the car insurance from there or just have LE run one of the license plates on one of the cars they drove. They can get copies of SSN#'s from the Social Security Administration. A CPA can request a transcript of tax returns from the IRS. The mortgage company can provide the name of the house insurance. Virtually every single important document can be gotten from one source or another.

If LM knows DR's birth date he can take a death certificate which can be gotten from the funeral home to the SS and get her SSN. From there he can set up an account with Credit Karma or some other credit checking site and find out who she owed money to. Every debt she ever had will be listed along with the name and address of the company she owed it to.

There is always a paper trail. It sounds to me like LM and the Rhoden families need to get a CPA to help them with the financial stuff.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

Just my thought, again, poor Kenny and laying alone for several hours longer than the rest. They thought he was at work so phoned his cellphone multiple times, why did no one actually contact his employer? Someone somewhere at his place of employment would've known he didn't show if he was suppose to be at an actual job! I still just can't seem to make any sense of that and the fact that he wasn't seen about until noon! If he had family in the vicinity, how did this get overlooked?

Regardless, to me it's pretty irrelevant, it just bothers me. I don't think this was done by any extended family members. I'm still leaning towards something more organized and professional.

Supposedly his friend BH worked with him. So why didn't they call the friend?

 

[RAISINISBACK]

Kendra said she tried to call him and thought he was at work b/c he didn't pick up. I don't recall if she called his place of employment to have him tracked down, or not. However, she later sent two people there to check on him (DS and another). Oddly enough DS did not mention that in any of his interviews. The thing that bothers me about this is that DS said he was to spend the night and help KR work on cars the next day, which leads me to believe that KR was going to take off work that next day. A day off from a job he had just started? At any rate, DS would have known this, so when Kendra, could not reach KR, that should have sent up a warning sign to DR specifically, that something could be up. They said that KR normally left by 4 a.m. for the drive to work. I'd really like to know what time DS left that night.

Why didn't DS mention that to KR when she told him to go check on her dad? Something just stinks about all that business with DS.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

rsbm
Absolutely. I agree. That's why CPS was able to take those babies and no one batted an eye. That was the the point I was making when I posted about the infant abductions. Not that the I thought the Rhodens were suspect. But someone in a position of authority, (or multiple people), down there Hates this family. And I personally think KR was killed simply because he would have known, instantly, who was behind the murders. jmo

His daughter said she received many texts and phone calls from him every day. If KR was that close to his kids then if he would have known instantly who the killer was I feel like his kids would know also. Parents may not tell small children things to protect them from being scared but they usually tell their grown kids everything and vice versa. KR has always been the odd man out in every scenario I have came up with. Just can't imagine any plausible theory where his death fits in.

 

[Betty P]

I get the sense that everything LE is doing is a bargaining chip to get them to talk. I think it is a calculated move on the part of LE. Like seeing the kids, getting paperwork they need ect. Anything to put pressure on them. Like announcing the "big commercial grow" 48 hours into the investigation so donations to the family would dry up and rewards would be withdrawn. I cannot believe that LE and especially the AG of Ohio and the BCI would not know a small time grow from a huge commercial grow ("among the biggest we have ever seen" according to AG Dewine). Now we know according to the Sheriff and KR's daughter it was a few plants, barely even worth mentioning. I think it has all been a calculated and well thought out campaign by LE to put enough pressure on the families to get them to tell everything they know because as has been stated by LE many times, they believe some people in the family know more than they are telling. Whether that is true or not is a different story. Just saying.

That may be true. But LE also has not offered them any kind of protection or security. If they know anything that might help the investigation, their own lives would surely be at risk.

I've just never seen any murder case handled this way. It's bizarre. That said, as an Ohio resident, it's not too unusual. Ohio's state LE apparatus has long been known to be authoritarian, inconsistent, unsympathetic and biased against those of little means or political influence.

I wish they would let the FBI take over this case, but, given the political situation, that's not likely to happen. More likely the case will go cold and will be swept under the rug after DeWine runs for governor.

 

[rsd1200]

Something I've thought about, and not been able to find an answer for, is whether or not KR was scheduled to be off work. We know DS has indicated he was supposed to be there to help work on cars but didn't show up. We've also learned that Kendra said she thought her dad was at work. I just wonder if the "working on cars" excuse (be it real cars or marijuana tending) was a part of KR's plan and did he take a vacation day from his job or did his job expect him to report that morning like usual? I've perused the media articles but haven't seen anything that referenced whether or not he had the day off, unless I missed it.

DS statements don't jive with Kendra's. Unless he's just making stuff up for the press.

'I was supposed to meet him the night before and go to work on some cars with him in the morning.
'When I didn't hear from him I went to the camper and it was unlocked and his truck was outside and I felt there must have been something wrong.
'It was the afternoon and he would normally be out working on cars at 5.30 am.' - DS
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-feet-shot-head-reveals-man-horror-scene.html

[FONT=&amp]After learning about the murders of seven people on Union Hill Road, near Piketon, he went to his cousin Kenneth Rhoden&#8217;s home. Stone said he was worried about his cousin&#8217;s safety. - DS
[/FONT]http://nbc4i.com/2016/05/05/pike-co...-cousins-body-calling-911-on-day-of-massacre/

[FONT=&amp]&#8220;We&#8217;re calling him. We&#8217;re leaving messages. He was supposed to be at work. Well, then, 12 o&#8217;clock came around, he was supposed to be on break. My dad never ignored me,&#8221; ~ Kendra recalled. She'd thought her dad was at his job in Columbus.[/FONT]
[FONT=&amp]Then, the family sent a friend and a Rhoden cousin over to check Kenneth&#8217;s home. The pair called Kendra&#8217;s aunt to tell her the news.
http://www.fox19.com/story/33438311...-investigators-amid-pike-county-investigation
[/FONT]

DS thinks KR is off work that day.
IIRC DS has never said that he heard it through Kendra. Iirc, he said he heard it on the news and tried to call KR, then became concerned. (I can't find that link at this time.)
DS said KR was usually up and working on cars by 5:30 a.m. Why would KR be usually out working on cars by 5:30 a.m. if he had a new job that he usually left for by 4:00 a.m.?
It's a family tragedy, that's one time you can call the employer to have a family member brought in out of the field or paged, etc...
I'm just wondering why, after KR repeatedly did not answer the calls to his phone, that no one, not even an older adult in the family, suggested to contact KR's employer.
DS knows that they have plans, supposedly hears the news, but doesn't go to check on KR, til almost 1:30 p.m., even after not being able to reach him via phone, and doesn't think to call his employer to see if KR decided to go to work, so he could tell him about the tragedy before he heard it leaked out on the news.
After finding KR, DS and the other guy, goes snooping around the property, finds a tray of plants, and THEN calls 911. Personally, I think that I'd have called 911 immediately upon finding my beloved friend and relative,then gone and sat in my truck til LE got there, instead of traipsing around the property.
None of DS statements makes sense to me. j.s.

 

[SerialGal]

DS statements don't jive with Kendra's. Unless he's just making stuff up for the press.

DS thinks KR is off work that day.
IIRC DS has never said that he heard it through Kendra. Iirc, he said he heard it on the news and tried to call KR, then became concerned. (I can't find that link at this time.)
DS said KR was usually up and working on cars by 5:30 a.m. Why would KR be usually out working on cars by 5:30 a.m. if he had a new job that he usually left for by 4:00 a.m.?
It's a family tragedy, that's one time you can call the employer to have a family member brought in out of the field or paged, etc...
I'm just wondering why, after KR repeatedly did not answer the calls to his phone, that no one, not even an older adult in the family, suggested to contact KR's employer.
DS knows that they have plans, supposedly hears the news, but doesn't go to check on KR, til almost 1:30 p.m., even after not being able to reach him via phone, and doesn't think to call his employer to see if KR decided to go to work, so he could tell him about the tragedy before he heard it leaked out on the news.
After finding KR, DS and the other guy, goes snooping around the property, finds a tray of plants, and THEN calls 911. Personally, I think that I'd have called 911 immediately upon finding my beloved friend and relative,then gone and sat in my truck til LE got there, instead of traipsing around the property.
None of DS statements makes sense to me. j.s.

You make very good points. I am inclined to agree that DS's statements do not add up.

 

[rsd1200]

I have been helping with my sisters estate. We couldn't find her insurance polices and my BIL had no idea how much she had or who she had them with. He didn't even know how much life insurance he had on himself or who with. He didn't know what bills they had or who they owed money to. In the 51 years they were married she had handled all the money and I don't think my BIL had ever signed a check or paid a bill in his life. So my other sister and I took over everything.

The first thing we did was have the man at the funeral home run her social security number and he came up with every policy she had and told us how much and what insurance company. I cancelled all her credit cards and requested duplicate statements for the last six months to make sure no policies were billing to a credit card. We found what bills she was paying by going to the bank and asking for her bank statements both checking and savings. We requested all records from the bank of CD's IRA's ect. All this took us a little over one week.

They can get certified copies of birth certificates from the state the victims were born in. They can get death certificates from the funeral home. They can get copies of deeds from the county clerk. They can request copies of car titles from the state. They can also get the name of the car insurance from there or just have LE run one of the license plates on one of the cars they drove. They can get copies of SSN#'s from the Social Security Administration. A CPA can request a transcript of tax returns from the IRS. The mortgage company can provide the name of the house insurance. Virtually every single important document can be gotten from one source or another.

If LM knows DR's birth date he can take a death certificate which can be gotten from the funeral home to the SS and get her SSN. From there he can set up an account with Credit Karma or some other credit checking site and find out who she owed money to. Every debt she ever had will be listed along with the name and address of the company she owed it to.

There is always a paper trail. It sounds to me like LM and the Rhoden families need to get a CPA to help them with the financial stuff.

I agree. I think it is more about them needing help in doing what you described, and in what our family did as well, when a loved one passes. Someone needs to point them in the direction, of the help they need, to process their family member's affairs.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

That may be true. But LE also has not offered them any kind of protection or security. If they know anything that might help the investigation, their own lives would surely be at risk.

I've just never seen any murder case handled this way. It's bizarre. That said, as an Ohio resident, it's not too unusual. Ohio's state LE apparatus has long been known to be authoritarian, inconsistent, unsympathetic and biased against those of little means or political influence.

I wish they would let the FBI take over this case, but, given the political situation, that's not likely to happen. More likely the case will go cold and will be swept under the rug after DeWine runs for governor.

I don't think LE would view they were in any danger if they believe the perps are family.

Then again the Sheriff told them to arm themselves. So maybe they think they can take care of themselves? That in it's self was odd if you ask me. I never heard of a Sheriff telling civilians to arm themselves. LE usually tries to discourage any additional violence. At least the ones I know would.

If the murders of the couple in KY and the 2 women from Waverly ar connected to this couldn't the FBI take the case on the grounds it could be a serial killer? Or have I been watching too much Criminal Minds on TV?