GUILTY OK - Christopher Lane, 22, Australian, slain in thrill killing, Duncan, 16 Aug 2013

[Ausgirl]

Ive only heard about one of the guys having something a pic with black power on it on one of his SM sites.

There was a couple of 'hate whitey' comments too - they were documented somewhere up-thread... I'd go hunt them down but it's really late here and I am severely lazy at this hour. I did see anti-white comments, though.

Maybe that one kid -is- racist, as well as stupid and violent. Doesn't mean he represents anyone but his own pathetic self in that regard. But I do believe he -is- a racist, from what I saw.

eta: and I don't mind learning about 'real' gang members vs these guys. I'm an Aussie, and I just don't know how things work in the USA. Learnin' is awesome.

 

[Brightbird]

I was thinking just earlier, and like burbqueen and Gardenlady say, it makes no sense that killing a random stranger would be a gang thing. Gangs have purpose and killing random people doesn't. No way would a 'real' gang get a member to kill someone with no benefit to the gang. I think they were a bunch of kids calling themselves a gang and taking their cues from gangsta culture, with no real idea what it's all about.

 

[burbqueen]

Can we get off the "what makes a real gangsta" baloney? The way I see it, a real person with his whole life ahead of him was gunned down by three teenage thugs. I don't really care whether some people consider them genuine gangbangers or not when the painful reality is that they are cold-blooded killers.

I agree, but it got started up thread about them being in a gang. To me it doesnt matter, but IMO some people want to blame something or have a reason besides they were bored. IMO they were driving around maybe high or drunk or something or even not and just wanted to shoot someone. It does happen. I can see how it can happen. When I was a teen I would fight, not random people of course, but pick fights. I was angry, bored, and a bit misguided. Now we got video games, TV shows and movies. Just like a video game where you shoot people. Teens just dont care.

 

[LambChop]

What exactly is a gang???

http://www.nij.gov/topics/crime/gangs-organized/gangs/definitions.htm

Essentially they are a threat to every citizen who has the right to walk down a street without the fear of violence. In the coming days I believe we will be hearing more and more about gangs and the effect they have on our young people with this trial and the one in Boston from a man who was suppose to be a role model for young men. jmo

 

[Jersey*Girl]

Thank you Elley for this link:
http://www.smh.com.au/world/chris-l...-father-who-called-police-20130822-2sdud.html

Chris Lane shooting a gang initiation, says father who called police
August 22, 2013 - 5:01PM
Nick O'Malley

Snipped:
Duncan, Oklahoma: Chris Lane was murdered as a part of a gang initiation, according to James Johnson, the father of a boy who was also allegedly targeted by the three youths accused of killing Mr Lane.

Police have not commented on the claim, though court documents confirm the accused were eventually arrested in front of the boy's home.

In their car, police say they found a shotgun and the .22-calibre revolver they believe was used to kill Mr Lane, and a cache of ammunition.

Mr Johnson told Fairfax Media that the three youths had been trying to recruit his 17-year-old son, C***s, into a gang, and that C***s had refused.

Snipped:
According to Mr Johnson, one of the boys, James Edwards, got out of the car and appeared to either stretch or reach down for something. Pretending to still be on the phone to C***s, Mr Johnson called police, who were on the scene within minutes.

Court documents filed by police confirm that Mr Johnson called police to tell them three armed youths were in front of the home at 7.05pm, some four hours after Mr Lane was shot dead, and that officers were dispatched to the car park where they arrested the three accused.

But the documents also show that police believe that the .22-calibre revolver they allege was used to kill Mr Lane was by then hidden in the car's air intake, while a second weapon, a shotgun, was disassembled.

"I don't think it was an initiation – I know it was an initiation, my son told me it was an initiation," Mr Johnson told Fairfax Media.

Since the murder and the arrests, Mr Johnson has sent C***s away for safety to a youth program.

 

[burbqueen]

IMO a gang is human nature. It is our nature to congregate. Whether it be good or bad. Gangs will never go away and will exist in some form many years after we are dead and gone. Gangs kill people everyday. Chris Lane's life is no more tragic than the thousands of bystanders and innocent people in the hood that die every year but no one reports it. NO one really cares.

Not trying to be snarky, but yes this is a tragedy this young man got killed and no I dont blame Australia at all from making those comments about the USA. Im not offended in the least. We have a very twisted culture where sex is taboo to the point of insanity, but violence, greed, selfishness is celebrated. I have to get mine and be famous and rich. Get rich or die tryin! We reap what what have sowed for so many years and now the fruit is bare.

If it was an initiation then which one was the intended to be put in? Im confused. If the guys son refused then why would the remaining 3 still shoot CL if they are already in the gang?? And where are these kids getting these guns!?!?!

 

[Softail]

Facebook page in memory of Christopher Lane. It is nice to see all of the support people are offering to his family and friends.

https://www.facebook.com/pages/RIP-Christopher-Lane/155307978006875

The whole thing is just so tragic and sad. This really didn't have to happen. :cry:

 

[Ausgirl]

I find it interesting that someone thought to post 'black on white' as a thread tag -- but didn't bother to add the victim's name. (It's there now though).

And with that thought. It guts me, even to look at a picture of that fine young man. Too sad, going to bed. Thanks for the info, though.

 

[defense101]

& this downplaying of crips is appalling. They are on our government's watch list for crying out loud.

And blaming this mentality on gangs is appalling IMO, bull pucky IMO to be able to destroy a life whether animal or human it has to be in you before that.

 

[Jersey*Girl]

I find it interesting that someone thought to post 'black on white' as a thread tag -- but didn't bother to add the victim's name. (It's there now though).

And with that thought. It guts me, even to look at a picture of that fine young man. Too sad, going to bed. Thanks for the info, though.

I'm not trying to be ignorant, but why is it acceptable to put black on white as a tag on this thread? That is so sad. I can't help it, it's so wrong.

 

[defense101]

Thank you Elley for this link:
http://www.smh.com.au/world/chris-l...-father-who-called-police-20130822-2sdud.html

Chris Lane shooting a gang initiation, says father who called police
August 22, 2013 - 5:01PM
Nick O'Malley

Snipped:
Duncan, Oklahoma: Chris Lane was murdered as a part of a gang initiation, according to James Johnson, the father of a boy who was also allegedly targeted by the three youths accused of killing Mr Lane.

Police have not commented on the claim, though court documents confirm the accused were eventually arrested in front of the boy's home.

In their car, police say they found a shotgun and the .22-calibre revolver they believe was used to kill Mr Lane, and a cache of ammunition.

Mr Johnson told Fairfax Media that the three youths had been trying to recruit his 17-year-old son, CJ, into a gang, and that CJ had refused.

Snipped:
According to Mr Johnson, one of the boys, James Edwards, got out of the car and appeared to either stretch or reach down for something. Pretending to still be on the phone to CJ, Mr Johnson called police, who were on the scene within minutes.

Court documents filed by police confirm that Mr Johnson called police to tell them three armed youths were in front of the home at 7.05pm, some four hours after Mr Lane was shot dead, and that officers were dispatched to the car park where they arrested the three accused.

But the documents also show that police believe that the .22-calibre revolver they allege was used to kill Mr Lane was by then hidden in the car's air intake, while a second weapon, a shotgun, was disassembled.

"I don't think it was an initiation – I know it was an initiation, my son told me it was an initiation," Mr Johnson told Fairfax Media.

Since the murder and the arrests, Mr Johnson has sent CJ away for safety to a youth program.

Now he sends him away, no signs previously??? So easy to go the gang route, means it was nothing you didn't see or takes away all fault IMO

 

[Jersey*Girl]

[/B]
Now he sends him away, no signs previously??? So easy to go the gang route, means it was nothing you didn't see or takes away all fault IMO

Huh? I thought this is a dad that is involved in his son's life? He said James Edwards changed about 6 months ago, something like that?

 

[Jersey*Girl]

And blaming this mentality on gangs is appalling IMO, bull pucky IMO to be able to destroy a life whether animal or human it has to be in you before that.

Totally agree.

 

[Karmady]

Huh? I thought this is a dad that is involved in his son's life? He said James Edwards changed about 6 months ago, something like that?

No, no. The man quoted in the article is Johnson's dad. The one the killers were coming for next. And to defense101's post, he DID know before that day and told his son to keep away from them. He called the police when he did because he found out they were seriously coming after his kid on THAT day. They were near his home in the parking lot of a church and Johnson told his dad they were coming for him.

 

[LambChop]

Huh? I thought this is a dad that is involved in his son's life? He said James Edwards changed about 6 months ago, something like that?

I believe the reference was to Mr. Johnson's son, CJ. At least I believe that is who Defense101 is referring to????

 

[Elley Mae]

:fence:

Waiting for answer to the black and white as a tag.

 

[Karmady]

And blaming this mentality on gangs is appalling IMO, bull pucky IMO to be able to destroy a life whether animal or human it has to be in you before that.

Speaking only for myself, I don't "blame" it on gang mentality. I just know that it IS gang mentality for a lot of them. And if they aren't that way when they start, they can easily become that way once they're in. jmo

 

[LambChop]

Speaking only for myself, I don't "blame" it on gang mentality. I just know that it IS gang mentality for a lot of them. And if they aren't that way when they start, they can easily become that way once they're in. jmo

They are a gang. The Federal definition is three or more who are associated. They qualify as a gang whether "other" gangs like it or not. Had they not been stopped they were planning to continue in their plans to kill others. jmo

 

[Gardenlady]

They are a gang. The Federal definition is three or more who are associated. They qualify as a gang whether "other" gangs like it or not. Had they not been stopped they were planning to continue in their plans to kill others. jmo

Well, from your link, we have this:

Defining "youth gangs"
The National Gang Center (which is cosponsored by the Bureau of Justice Assistance and the Office of Juvenile Justice and Delinquency Prevention) conducts the National Youth Gang Survey. The survey reports solely on youth gangs, which the National Gang Center describes as "a group of youths or young adults [the responding agency is] willing to identify as a 'gang.'"[3]
When they report to the National Youth Gang Survey, law enforcement agencies indicate that group criminality is of greatest importance in how they define a gang. The presence of leadership is of least importance.[4] Read more about defining gangs based on analysis in the National Youth Gang Survey.
Much of the research literature about gangs focuses primarily on youth gangs, as opposed to adult gangs. Researchers accept the following criteria for classifying groups as gangs:[5]

The group has three or more members, generally aged 12-24.
Members share an identity, typically linked to a name, and often other symbols.
Members view themselves as a gang, and they are recognized by others as a gang.
The group has some permanence and a degree of organization.
The group is involved in an elevated level of criminal activity.

Now, they fit one, and three, and you could make a case for two.

But four and five? I don't think they fit here.

There has to be more than just "and association of three people" to meet the definition of gang. Otherwise any three random people could make up a gang. I'd think that would be way too overly broad. :twocents:

 

[Karmady]

Well, from your link, we have this:



Now, they fit one, and three, and you could make a case for two.

But four and five? I don't think they fit here.

There has to be more than just "and association of three people" to meet the definition of gang. Otherwise any three random people could make up a gang. I'd think that would be way too overly broad. :twocents:

Having looked at most of their social media and that of their cohorts, it's clear that they really, really wanted to be legit crips and had at least some access to the real deal. For me, it doesn't really matter whether they were or they weren't except as it maybe pertains to their motivation. But mostly it's just a fact of the situation. I would say that illegal guns, stacks of hundred dollar bills, smoking weed on the daily and a juvenile rap sheet (verified for lilbuggy) is most definitely evidence of increased criminal activity. Especially when one is 15. And that's only the part that is available to the public from his own social media. jmo

eta: I guess I should add murder to the list of things evidencing increased criminal behavior -d'oh