GUILTY OK - Christopher Lane, 22, Australian, slain in thrill killing, Duncan, 16 Aug 2013

[Cappuccino]

You can't just go by the skin tone.

Colour me confused then, (pardon the pun).

 

[Jersey*Girl]

The pic I saw on fb last night was no bi-racial person, he was as white as me and I'm Irish. Either that pic is wrong or the media have got it wrong again, normally I'd doubt the facebook post but with this case, who knows?

I believe he's bi-racial Cap.

 

[Gardenlady]

It's important bc if its supposed to be so offensive and racially charged, then every person using it should be treated equal. Personally I don't use the word. I never have. I know many people that do - all races and for various intentions. So if a group as a whole use that word, then another group using that word shouldn't lose their jobs over that so called right.

The only way to fight racism is by treating everyone equal.

In viewing the twitter profiles and Facebook pages, there's a lot of hate comments. Several of the perps and their friend used that word throughout their entire profiles, nobody ever said anything. Then all hell breaks loose when people start calling them that same name that they themselves have used repeatedly in text. Now it's even worse bc people are threatening to kill them. It's sick. Absolutely sick.

Everything's gone to hell in a handbasket. :scared:

Use of the word is hotly debated within the black community. I think it's an argument that whites have no business interfering in, since they were the community that imposed the word on the black community in the first place.

Outsiders to a community have no standing to tell a certain segment of the population how they should feel about something, how they should react to something, or how and when to get over/past something.

For the record, I am no fan of the "gangsta" culture - but would also recommend that folks who are so up in arms about this culture do some reading about how hip hoo/rap was appropriated by wealthy (and white-dominated) corporations, and the rise of "gangsta" rap and culture. Also, take a look at who buys and supports much of the music/clothing/jewelry/tickets (hint: they're from the burbs).

 

[Sonya610]

The so-called white suspect doesn't look Caucasian to me. Are there any photos of his parents?

I looked and couldn't find any, his family and his pregnant girlfriend were in court so maybe court photos would show them.

And I agree with your assessment, especially if they were wannabe Crips.

 

[Karmady]

I also urge all the folks who are trying to make this into a racial issue, or some sort of "why are kids these days so bad?" issue to look up thrill killers - young people who kill out of "boredom" or to "see what it's like". From Leopoldo and Loeb, to Mary Bell, Parker and Hulme, the NJ high schoolers who attacked a mentally disabled girl, etc etc... It's unfortunately not new. And it's certainly not a matter of race (unless you want to maybe argue that it's a white thing, since the overwhelming number of thrill killers seems to be white). :twocents:

I think there's a difference between true "thrill" kills and this type of case. There are people who literally enjoy the act of killing. Then there are those who think so little of the victim or act itself that they will do it to "pass the time" so to speak. A meaningless act to them and something that'll get them some street cred. I think this is the latter type of case. jmo

 

[Salem]

This is not the political pavilion. Drop the race and gun control talk, now, please.

This is about 3 bored teens. A thrill kill - it happens. Discuss it from that angle because we are NOT going to get into racial issues, here.

Thanks,

Salem

 

[Gardenlady]

I think there's a difference between true "thrill" kills and this type of case. There are people who literally enjoy the act of killing. Then there are those who think so little of the victim or act itself that they will do it to "pass the time" so to speak. A meaningless act to them and something that'll get them some street cred. I think this is the latter type of case. jmo

To tease this out a little bit - do you think that, say, Mary Bell (who, by all accounts, had a horrific upbringing, and has, since released, seemingly been rehabilitated and gone on to live a productive life) placed more of a value in her young victims than these young men did?

I don't see it.

I know a lot of folks like to think "youth these days" are somehow more evil, more irresponsible, etc, but really, there is nothing new under the sun, unfortunately.

 

[Cappuccino]

To tease this out a little bit - do you think that, say, Mary Bell (who, by all accounts, had a horrific upbringing, and has, since released, seemingly been rehabilitated and gone on to live a productive life) placed more of a value in her young victims than these young men did?

I don't see it.

I know a lot of folks like to think "youth these days" are somehow more evil, more irresponsible, etc, but really, there is nothing new under the sun, unfortunately.

I agree with the point you're making here, but IMO Mary Bell is a bad example. A disturbed ten year old is very different to a teenage thrill kill. On paper they're both juvenile murderers, but there's a heck of a difference between a ten year old who has been battered and sexually abused and a fifteen/sixteen year old who kills for fun.

Leopold and Loeb would be a better example, or the I Don't Like Mondays girl.

 

[Karmady]

To tease this out a little bit - do you think that, say, Mary Bell (who, by all accounts, had a horrific upbringing, and has, since released, seemingly been rehabilitated and gone on to live a productive life) placed more of a value in her young victims than these young men did?

I don't see it.

I know a lot of folks like to think "youth these days" are somehow more evil, more irresponsible, etc, but really, there is nothing new under the sun, unfortunately.

I don't think she placed more value on her victims. But I think the difference lies in her motivations and what was derived from the act. She, apparently, felt compelled internally to do it and got an actual "thrill" or release of some sort from it. Here, on the other hand, it appears that the act involved the same amount of mental/emotional involvement as taking out the trash. And the likely motivation being at least partly if not mostly external (acceptance in gang culture) v. internal. jmo

 

[LambChop]

Tip of the Day: Please post responsibly. :whip:

 

[Sonya610]

To tease this out a little bit - do you think that, say, Mary Bell (who, by all accounts, had a horrific upbringing, and has, since released, seemingly been rehabilitated and gone on to live a productive life) placed more of a value in her young victims than these young men did?

But Mary Bell was also being poisoned/overdosed by her crazy mother (her mother wanted to get rid of her badly).

Some theories suggest the poisoning/overdosing caused her to go temporarily insane as a result.

 

[Kimster]

Other cases of "thrill killing" are listed at this link

Thrill killing - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Cappuccino]

Other cases of "thrill killing" are listed at this link

Thrill killing - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Thanks. Like everything else on Wikipedia it should not be taken as gospel, (eg, they have Thompson and Venables on their list which is rubbish, those two are in the same category as Mary Bell).

 

[HMSHood]

I agree with the point you're making here, but IMO Mary Bell is a bad example. A disturbed ten year old is very different to a teenage thrill kill. On paper they're both juvenile murderers, but there's a heck of a difference between a ten year old who has been battered and sexually abused and a fifteen/sixteen year old who kills for fun.

Leopold and Loeb would be a better example, or the I Don't Like Mondays girl.

Brenda Spencer

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleveland_Elementary_School_shooting_(San_Diego)
http://www.schoolshooters.info/PL/Articles_files/Expanding the Sample- Five School Shooters 1.3.pdf

 

[Gardenlady]

I agree with the point you're making here, but IMO Mary Bell is a bad example. A disturbed ten year old is very different to a teenage thrill kill. On paper they're both juvenile murderers, but there's a heck of a difference between a ten year old who has been battered and sexually abused and a fifteen/sixteen year old who kills for fun.

Leopold and Loeb would be a better example, or the I Don't Like Mondays girl.

You're right (and Sonya too), and really I have a good amount of sympathy for Mary Bell, because her upbringing was so hellish. But I don't think she had any more empathy for her victims (at the time she committed the acts) than these guys do.

But yes, a better comparison definitely would be the duo of L&L, who killed not due to any mental problems stemming from abuse (or seemingly any mental problems at all) but because of sheer boredom and looking for excitement. Cool as cucumbers, those two.

 

[Jersey*Girl]

Man who dobbed in suspects accused of murdering Melbourne baseball player Chris Lane says his son was next

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/ma...his-son-was-next/story-fni0fiyv-1226700172461

James Johnson, 52, called the police to tell them that the accused killers were hiding in the car park of the Immauel Baptist Church car park at about 5pm, two hours after they allegedly shot Lane.

"They threatened to kill my son because they are in a gang, the Crips, and were trying to get my son in it and I wouldn't let him do it.

"I told him he couldn't run with those boys. He's a little terrified."

Mr Johnson said the Crips, a predominantly African American street gang that began in Los Angeles in 1969 and had been in Duncan for the past few years.

Like I said... Just sayin'... :banghead:

 

[gxm]

The pic I saw on fb last night was no bi-racial person, he was as white as me and I'm Irish. Either that pic is wrong or the media have got it wrong again, normally I'd doubt the facebook post but with this case, who knows?

IMO, the mug shots that are being published make all three perps look darker complected than other pictures I've seen (on their social media). I'm guessing it's just a technical, color-balance issue. Sometimes people think the media does this on purpose but usually it's just a bad, poorly lighted photo. I agree that the mugshot makes MJ look darker complected than he probably is.

And ITA, I really wish LE would hold a PC to dispel the misinformation that is circulating about this case.

 

[gxm]

One thing is bothering me and it hasn't really been reported on. They shot Chris in an upscale neighborhood. So, was that their intention...to go shoot a random person in an upscale neighborhood away from where they live? What is the demographic in that neighborhood? If its not diverse, then it could lend credence to why some people are making this a racial hate crime bc maybe they believe it is.

Again, wish race could stay out of it. If it did play a factor then I'll be all over it digging stuff up. Hoping its not. I want racism to end.

I'm wondering if one of them lived in the neighborhood. The reporting has been horrendous, but IIRC it was said that Christopher jogged by a house they were staying at. So I'm speculating that either they were visiting a friend or one of them lived there.

Did anyone else read that MJ has a pregnant GF who left the courtroom in tears? Poor girl!

 

[LambChop]

Could we try to stay focused on what they did and not their appearance, please? They are out of control teens and hopefully sending a message out to the community that they will be tried in an adult court and spend years in jail will send a message out to those who think because they are under the age of 18 they can get away with murder. Spending most of your life in jail is not a solution to boredom. jmo

 

[Jersey*Girl]

This is not the political pavilion. Drop the race and gun control talk, now, please.

This is about 3 bored teens. A thrill kill - it happens. Discuss it from that angle because we are NOT going to get into racial issues, here.

Thanks,

Salem

Salem, I can't believe I'm saying this bc I can't stand anything racially charged - it gives me agida - but I'm afraid I might have to concede considering what Mr Johnson said. Crips don't like the upper echelon white establishment. That's a fact, it sucks but its true.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/ma...his-son-was-next/story-fni0fiyv-1226700172461

Man who dobbed in suspects accused of murdering Melbourne baseball player Chris Lane says his son was next
CARMEL MELOUNEY, AAP HERALD SUN AUGUST 21, 2013 5:08PM

Snipped:
James Johnson, 52, called the police to tell them that the accused killers were hiding in the car park of the Immauel Baptist Church car park at about 5pm, two hours after they allegedly shot Lane.

Mr Johnson claimed that Edwards Jr had threatened the life of his own 17-year-old son C*********r on Facebook. His son was at home with his mother and sisters near the church when he received the death threat.

"They threatened to kill my son because they are in a gang, the Crips, and were trying to get my son in it and I wouldn't let him do it.

"I told him he couldn't run with those boys. He's a little terrified."

Mr Johnson said the Crips, a predominantly African American street gang that began in Los Angeles in 1969 and had been in Duncan for the past few years.

He said the group consisted of teenagers who he called "wannabes."

"I've been living here all my life and we never had this, but in the past few years gangs from Lawton have been coming here," Johnson said of the Crips.

Johnson's son also attends Duncan High School, where suspect Luna and Edwards Jr. were students. He said he knew both boys, and described them as "troublemakers" and "bullies" who had "no parental supervision."