OK OK - Lauria Bible, 16, & Ashley Freeman, 16, Welch, 30 December 1999 *ARREST*

[amber1]

I finally got to watch the Disappeared episode, and these are my thoughts (my apologies, most of it is rehash, but I want to keep the thread going):
Despite the sightings of the girls at the meth house, Florida and New Mexico, I don't believe they were involved in the Freeman murders, and I don't believe they ran away. I know there were questions of abuse with Danny and Ashley, but it's too far fetch'd of a scenario to me.
I know the sheriff's dept. was another angle because they had killed Ashley's brother Shane in self defense. I could see this angle to an extent, because they were a week away from filing a wrongful death lawsuit-is it a coincidence the whole family died a week before their deadline to file? The lie detector test the sheriff took also bugged me because they stated they did not release the results of the test, but were no longer investigating this angle...well, if you were innocent, wouldn't you want those results released to clear your name?
I feel, despite the time lapse of his arrest, Jeremy Jones is the most likely suspect and scenario out of the 3 presented. He knew things about the crime the public did not. He had a history of crimes similar to the Freeman's tragedy (when he raped and shot a woman and burned down her trailer). He stated he put the girls in one of the hundreds of mineshafts in Galena, KS. You could search many times there, and still not come up with remains, even if they are there. Not only are their hundreds of mineshafts, but all those underground tunnels, the water, things moving over time...it would be close to impossible to finding them. I know he recanted his statement, they didn't find the girls, and there was a time lapse...but what if he was not alone??? I could see someone else being involved with him, if this whole thing was about drugs espcially.
Another option is that the person who did it has stayed off the radar, and is someone who has not even been identified yet....but people talk, and eventually the truth will come out. Lauria's family is one family that will never give up, I do believe their perserverance will give them answers. And sad to say, it seems like they have accepted the fact they most likely aren't alive anymore.

 

[Penny Lane]

What is Jeremy Jones alleged motive for killing the Freemans and the girls? I wasn't able to watch the episode that aired unfortunately. The girls may have been by chance, as they were in the wrong place at the wrong time.

How long was JJ in the area of Welch? How did he meet/know the Freemans? Does he have friends/relatives around here? Sorry if this has all been mentioned before, I'm trying to catch up!

 

[neverletgo]

Bumping this up for anyone who hasn't had a chance to watch it yet:

Disappeared: Season 6 Episode 9
Out Of The Ashes

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GH9AeFNw4eE
​

 

[amber1]

What is Jeremy Jones alleged motive for killing the Freemans and the girls? I wasn't able to watch the episode that aired unfortunately. The girls may have been by chance, as they were in the wrong place at the wrong time.

How long was JJ in the area of Welch? How did he meet/know the Freemans? Does he have friends/relatives around here? Sorry if this has all been mentioned before, I'm trying to catch up!

I believe in the episode he mentioned it all circled around drugs for his motive...he mentioned he shot both Ashley's parents and set the trailor ablaze, then he saw both the girls running out of the trailor. It was then he had them get into his truck, and he drove them to the mineshafts in KS where he killed them. Did it even happen...well, that's a good question!

 

[M86]

One thing I think it's pretty safe to assume is that the girls' bodies wound up in a mine shaft, there are so many of them around here. Jeremy Jones grew up in this area and I've wondered why he would need to cross a state line - though it's not far away - to find a site to bury them. The answer, of course, is that he didn't, and he's lying - about that anyway, and probably about it all as the timeline stretches a bit too taut for him to be the sole culprit. Just doesn't work really. Was he involved? Could be. But not alone. One can guess successfully at what accelerant might have been used, or one could rely on hearsay.

I remember this case from the day it happened, and, while one's thoughts evolve about what did occur, that doesn't necessarily mean one gets closer to the truth. For example, now I think the girls probably were held for a time before they were killed. But I have nothing to base that on other than the rumors the ID Discovery show covered. Sometimes here in town I'll see some mean-looking sorts who were around back then and wonder, do they know? Somebody does. Several somebodies. But, barring a spectacular revelation or a death bed confession, this one will, sadly, probably stay unsolved. Hope I'm wrong.

The Bibles are very good people. One would hope goodness might be rewarded with answers to their prayers.

Can you describe what a mine shaft is? I'm trying to picture it. I'm in NW Arkansas, btw... and I've been through Vinita and NE Oklahoma.

I'm still convinced that LE was somehow involved... and maybe Jeremy?

Is NE Oklahoma a big drug-dealing area? I know the answer.

 

[AnonymousD]

Can you describe what a mine shaft is? I'm trying to picture it. I'm in NW Arkansas, btw... and I've been through Vinita and NE Oklahoma.

I'm still convinced that LE was somehow involved... and maybe Jeremy?

Is NE Oklahoma a big drug-dealing area? I know the answer.

The mine shaft photos they showed on the Disappeared episode weren't like what I typically picture as a mine shaft. IIRC, they showed actual news footage of the search, or they showed where they searched on the Disappeared episode.

It was hilly/mountainous land with lots & lots of holes like these....everywhere. They seemed to be just feet apart at times.

 

[wfgodot]

Can you describe what a mine shaft is? I'm trying to picture it. I'm in NW Arkansas, btw... and I've been through Vinita and NE Oklahoma.

I'm still convinced that LE was somehow involved... and maybe Jeremy?

Is NE Oklahoma a big drug-dealing area? I know the answer.

A mine shaft is basically a long vertical tunnel which provides access to the underground working surfaces of a mine. They can be very long, very deep. Shafts are supposed to be capped for safety reasons, but some either haven't been or the cap has been removed.

Most of the drug trafficking in the region happens because of easy interstate access (I-44) and because meth is easy to cook. The tri-county area that makes up the northeastern-most corner of NE OK is historically a poverty-ridden region subject to an underground economy (both literally, when the region was still mined, and now figuratively, with drug-selling and -purchase).

 

[M86]

A mine shaft is basically a long vertical tunnel which provides access to the underground working surfaces of a mine. They can be very long, very deep. Shafts are supposed to be capped for safety reasons, but some either haven't been or the cap has been removed.

Most of the drug trafficking in the region happens because of easy interstate access (I-44) and because meth is easy to cook. The tri-county area that makes up the northeastern-most corner of NE OK is historically a poverty-ridden region subject to an underground economy (both literally, when the region was still mined, and now figuratively, with drug-selling and -purchase).

Thank you for the explanation.

Am I the only one who thinks that LE had a part in this, somehow?

 

[wfgodot]

Thank you for the explanation.

Am I the only one who thinks that LE had a part in this, somehow?

Lots of people in this area have no problem believing it. If anyone believes the initial investigation was thorough, one would have to explain their not having located Mr. Freeman's body. Incredible.

 

[amber1]

Lots of people in this area have no problem believing it. If anyone believes the initial investigation was thorough, one would have to explain their not having located Mr. Freeman's body. Incredible.

great point wfgodot! I mean...'cmon....how do you miss a body being trained LE, and then someone else takes a walk through the rubble and finds it? What else was missed? What if Mr. Freeman was never found...maybe, if they were involved...that would work in their favor, because then it all could have been pinned on him?
I have mentioned this before...but I think it is soo weird the officer's poly results weren't released, but it was still said they would not further investigate that angle...wouldn't you want that released to clear your name?! Wouldn't the whole dept. want that released to clear the dept?

 

[M86]

great point wfgodot! I mean...'cmon....how do you miss a body being trained LE, and then someone else takes a walk through the rubble and finds it? What else was missed? What if Mr. Freeman was never found...maybe, if they were involved...that would work in their favor, because then it all could have been pinned on him?
I have mentioned this before...but I think it is soo weird the officer's poly results weren't released, but it was still said they would not further investigate that angle...wouldn't you want that released to clear your name?! Wouldn't the whole dept. want that released to clear the dept?

amber1, The OSBI (Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation) is notorious for being... well... awful.

 

[joe]

Forgive me if this has been talked about, but what about Freeman's boyfriend, the last one to see her alive? I found it odd the program didn't say anything more about him.

 

[wfgodot]

Forgive me if this has been talked about, but what about Freeman's boyfriend, the last one to see her alive? I found it odd the program didn't say anything more about him.

I don't think he was ever seriously considered as having had anything to do with the tragedy.

 

[HippieShrink]

Hello Everyone,

I know I am a little late to the discussion but have only recently stumbled upon this case and WS. This is my first posting! I have been lurking about on this discussion thread since I first watched the Investigation Discovery Disappeared episode "Out of the Ashes".

In my research on this case I came across some topics I wanted to inquire about especially since so many of the posts have been from locals and those connected to the case.

The official explanation of the crime scene does not fit the evidence that has been released. For example: Mr. Freeman-is missing both forearms and a leg below the knee. This is not realistically the result of the fire. Something would remain. Even after cremation parts of bones are not reduced to powder. What is your opinion on that? If that were the case than the limbs are missing. Could this be a killer who takes souvenirs?
It stands to reason that since the Freeman family had a wood burning stove as their primary source of heat that an ax would be readily available. Perhaps even by the door? If the bones were to have been "missing" due to animals in the area then the ME/coroner would be able to see the teeth marks of said animals. Any thoughts?
I would be interested in hearing some of your thoughts on how Mrs. Kathy Freeman was found face down on the bed naked shot in the face with her intestines beside her? This is not a scene that one would consider for one who was shot in her sleep. I put forth the possibility that Mrs. Kathy Freeman was sexually assaulted and (possibly) tortured prior to her death, shot, and moved/manipulated or staged. It does not make sense she was naked. She had house guests, on a cold night, in a home that was not heated well-who would have slept naked under those circumstances? (On a really cold night) And how does one get shot in the face and lay to rest face down unless moved?
I will also add that Mr. Freeman's remaining foot had a tennis shoe on. So it is completely false to assert that he was also shot in his sleep (which is also the official story). (Who sleeps with their shoes on?) Also, Mr. Freeman also had his belly cut open and his intestines were placed outside his body. This indicates significant time was taken to torture these poor people. Torture takes time and a certain comfort with the places/space. This indicates to me that the perp. knew them, knew their home, and also knew what kind of weapons could be found their within. Also, since the perp. did not bring these weapons in then this was not a pre-meditated crime.
In other resources I found speculation that there was a strong possiblity that the weapon (shotgun) used to shoot Mr. and Mrs. Freeman were actually one of Mr. Freeman's own weapons. I have not seen that discussion here, however. If the ax (if there was one in fact used) and the shotgun were actually on the scene prior to these crimes than if would be fair to consider that whomever committed these acts was/were person(s) that know the Freeman family knew. The crime scene appears from the descriptions I have read to be extremely disorganized and present as a rage type of episode. It was also extremely personalized. Shot in the face.
I have not seen any discussion about the break in of Mr. and Mrs. Bible's home by Shane Freeman. It seems extremely curious and suspicious that one of Mr. Bible's shotguns was stolen as were some of Lauria Bible's personal items. I have not found any details of what those personal items may have been.
What are your thoughts regarding the reports that there was a video of the gils in a "crack house" not far away. This video was made of them being assaulted. I have very little resources on this topic and would welcome any perspectives on this issue.

Also I am getting used to the rules and etiquette of how WS forums work so please excuse if I mess up- I am a newbie.

 

[wfgodot]

Hello and welcome to WS, HippieShrink.

 

[wfgodot]

Ohio Women Rescued Gives Hope to Oklahoma Family (ktul.com)

 

[wfgodot]

Mom Of Welch Girl Missing Since 1999 Still Hopes For Her Return (newson6.com)

---
"When you find out, after ten years, three girls have been found, then you want that to be your daughter," Lorene Bible said.
---
"They could still be out there somewhere," she said.

As a mom who longs to see her daughter, or at the very least find out something about what happened to the girls, Bible can't help but hold on to hope that the outcome in Cleveland could happen to her, all these years later.

"'God, can you make this happen for me now? Is it my turn?'" Bible said.

 

[BlithePlum]

Bumping for these two girls and their families.

Age progressions:
Ashley - http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/f/freeman_ashley.html
Lauria - http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/b/bible_lauria.html

 

[hoshizora]

:bump:

This case really haunts me. It's just such a strange set of circumstances. House is set on fire, parents are dead, daughter and her friend are gone.

On Unsolved Mysteries, apparently Mr. Freeman said to his brother (I think, or it might've been a friend) that if anything were to happen to him, blame the local LE. I've always found that quote extremely interesting. It's almost as if he knew something bad was going to happen.

The police really did botch this case, which is very sad for the two girls involved.

 

[amber1]

Hoshizora,
I agree. I do not think the girls were the targets, they were in the wrong place at the wrong time, especially Lauria. Praying for answers.