Omaha Double Murder #2

[omaha]

Does anyone have any inside info why AMW has not been re-approached, or why there has been little pressure coming from the DA or local politicians?

 

[Snick1946]

Does anyone have any inside info why AMW has not been re-approached, or why there has been little pressure coming from the DA or local politicians?

Many of us have no idea why AMW's help was declined the first time. There was a press release that seemed to me and others to be double-talk. At the time most of us were left with the feeling that an arrest was due and that they felt AMW would complicate the outcome. Well, that was 18 months ago and ever since, nothing. I got the feeling that AMW was sort of stunned.

I personaly contacted some local elected officials last year- got the 'we share your pain' sort of responses but then the usual ' we have to let the police handle this in their own way' thing.

Any readers of this board who want to contact county attorney Don Kleine's Criminal Division can do so via this site:

http://www.douglascounty-ne.gov/countyattorney/contact-us/criminal-division

Omaha Mayor Jim Suttle's hotline is 402-444-5000

IMO, OPD messed up the investigation early on. Now they are playing CYA. That's why they don't want national media in here asking questions. I have also wondered if someone like Nancy Grace should be contacted. I have previously contacted both local sources above and just received generic replies. They have me pegged as a crank-Maybe if they start getting more complaints someone may figure out that they need some help with this thing. So far OPD doesnt seem to be getting the message.

 

[omaha]

Snick,

I sorta thought the same thing, maybe they were close. Is there any reason, hypothetically, that they were and ARE close, and are just trying to find hard evidence? Maybe they have someone in mind, but have no way to tie it up? Looking for witnesses, snitches or something?

What about that LA case they made the arrest on yesterday… that type of DNA profiling that isn't direct. I forget what it's called. They narrow it down when they have evidence but nothing to match it against by finding a close relative DNA match and getting your family genes. Wonder if that could help here…

 

[waltzingmatilda]

Snick,

I sorta thought the same thing, maybe they were close. Is there any reason, hypothetically, that they were and ARE close, and are just trying to find hard evidence? Maybe they have someone in mind, but have no way to tie it up? Looking for witnesses, snitches or something?

What about that LA case they made the arrest on yesterday… that type of DNA profiling that isn't direct. I forget what it's called. They narrow it down when they have evidence but nothing to match it against by finding a close relative DNA match and getting your family genes. Wonder if that could help here…

I'm not Snick but can add to this....hope I have it correct here...

'Familial DNA' helped solve the 'Grim Sleeper' case in LA. DNA from the suspect's son, who was arrested and subsequently had DNA collected from his person, was compared to the database and the son's DNA was a close match to the alledged perp's DNA collected from the victims. This was the first time that 'familiar DNA' evidence led to apprehending a suspect in the history of the state of CA, per MSM reports.

I think it could help here in the Omaha case if there was DNA from the perp collected at the scene of the crime. Just maybe this perp has a relative with a criminal record who's DNA shows the same characteristics.

I also wish to give kudos to LAPD for not giving up and providing a new set of eyes (investigators) to aid in solving this cold case of a serial rapist/ murderer.

All moo and per my recollection of main stream media reports.

wm

 

[omaha]

I'm not Snick but can add to this....hope I have it correct here...

'Familial DNA' helped solve the 'Grim Sleeper' case in LA. DNA from the suspect's son, who was arrested and subsequently had DNA collected from his person, was compared to the database and the son's DNA was a close match to the alledged perp's DNA collected from the victims. This was the first time that 'familiar DNA' evidence led to apprehending a suspect in the history of the state of CA, per MSM reports.

I think it could help here in the Omaha case if there was DNA from the perp collected at the scene of the crime. Just maybe this perp has a relative with a criminal record who's DNA shows the same characteristics.

I also wish to give kudos to LAPD for not giving up and providing a new set of eyes (investigators) to aid in solving this cold case of a serial rapist/ murderer.

All moo and per my recollection of main stream media reports.

wm

Is Familial DNA testing legal in Nebraska?

 

[waltzingmatilda]

Is Familial DNA testing legal in Nebraska?

Omaha, I am not sure of the answer to your question. But we could check it out with a lil research! I'll see if I can find any information on it.

wm

 

[waltzingmatilda]

OK I googled Familial DNA testing. It is apparently controversial. Here's a transcript from NPR.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=7641971

I'm still googling it to see what I find regarding familial DNA in Nebraska.

 

[waltzingmatilda]

DNA testing in the US
There are state laws on DNA profiling in all 50 states of the United States.[19] Detailed information on database laws in each state can be found at the National Conference of State Legislatures website.[20]

[ame]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DNA_profiling[/ame]

Maybe this will help in answering your question, Omaha. I must log off for now but will check in later and see if I can find anything more specific.

wm

 

[waltzingmatilda]

I put in a request with Salem, our super mod, to refer one of our WS members who are verified attys to this thread to help us with our questions reagrding familial DNA and DNA in general.

It might be helpful if we begin to list our questions in advance. I have one.

Is DNA conducted only on those persons who have been convicted of a crime and are actively serving time in a state or federal correctional facility?

Hopefully this will help.

wm

 

[Salem]

There are several lawyers listed in this post: [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4544853&postcount=1"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Professional Posters[/ame]

I'll let you guys choose one, maybe one of them posts on this thread? You can send them a pm and ask them to weigh in on the DNA issues or let me know and I will be happy to contact them for you.

Salem

 

[Salem]

What I think I know about DNA issues is that each state treats the collection of DNA differently.

In California, special permission was needed from the Attorney General to do a search looking for familiar (family) DNA to catch a serial killer in the Los Angeles area. You can read about some of it here: [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5381307&postcount=75"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - The Grim Sleeper. Update: Arrest in the Grim Sleeper Case![/ame]

Salem

 

[YellowDog]

Wouldn't the person have to give it willingly unless there was an arrest?

 

[waltzingmatilda]

Wouldn't the person have to give it willingly unless there was an arrest?

Hi there YD! This link decribes the way LE officials in LA obtained the 'Grim
Sleepers' DNA.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/38162451/ns/us_news-crime_and_courts/

An undercover officer pretending to be a waiter collected tableware, napkins, glasses and pizza crust at a restaurant where the suspect ate in recent days, allowing detectives to obtain a DNA match.

Salem, Thank you for the link. I'll send pm's today re: if this new DNA technique is used in NE.

I noticed the above article stated that the Cal. AG approved familial DNA in
'08. So we might have to contact the NE AG to find out.

My apologies for not doing this yesterday. I was distracted by watching a baseball game yesterday pm.

wm

 

[Snick1946]

I have not heard about any DNA recovery of the perp from the crime scene. I assume that if that happened OPD is keeping it close to their chest.
I wonder- could they have had some idea all this time as to who the killer was and are just making sure their case is airtight before moving on it? This case gets stranger and stranger..

 

[waltzingmatilda]

I have not heard about any DNA recovery of the perp from the crime scene. I assume that if that happened OPD is keeping it close to their chest.
I wonder- could they have had some idea all this time as to who the killer was and are just making sure their case is airtight before moving on it? This case gets stranger and stranger..

Snick, I agree the if DNA was collected at the scene of the crime, LE is keeping it close to the vest. And rightfully so.

However, I don't know how the perp could have escaped the scene without leaving some DNA behind.

Let's think for a sec. There are 2 victims. So the perp couldn't have stabbed both victims to death simultaneously, since Tom was found in the DR and Shirlee was found in the downstairs hall beside the staircase. Tom and Shirlee were both in the home so wouldn't it make sense that whoever was killed first, the other was alerted to some noise and came to check what in the world was going on?
The second victim, having a little more time to react upon seeing what was happening, (especially if the perp was surprised by the presence of another person) would have had more time to fight back, kick, bite, scratch, the killer.

This is all JMO but I betcha some DNA evidence was found at the scene of the crime! This is why I feel like the perp may have been a younger person with no priors/convictions.

I sent a request to three of WS professional posters who are attys, to join us and weigh in on our DNA questions here but haven't heard back.

Maybe we should consider contacting the NE Attorney General's office directly to ask if 'familial DNA' is used in NE?

as always, all MOO

wm

 

[colette]

An interesting site about familiar DNA

http://www.denverda.org/dna/Familial_DNA_Database_Searches.htm

 

[waltzingmatilda]

Hi all, I received this pm back from one of our professional posters, per my request, who weighed in on the use of familial DNA. I know more now than I did know and am grateful for the response. Thanks, NB


Hi Waltzingmatilda,
Sorry, I don't know much about this emerging avenue of dna collection. I do know that Colorado and California are the only two states which have laws which expressly afford for the use of familial dna. Maryland has a law prohibiting the use of familial dna.
The problem I could see re: Nebraska is that Nebraska does not require (or until very recently did not require) the collection of dna samples upon arrest or conviction. Nebraska has been one of the few states that doesn't require these samples. So, Nebraska's dna database would be very limited, making familial dna testing quite difficult IMO. I read somewhere that NE has started some sort of new offender dna database, but as I recall this is relatively new and contentious. So, the major limitation I foresee is that LE would have trouble getting familial matches because their database is too small. But, as far as I know, there's no rule or law prohibiting LE labs from seeking familial dna matches in Nebraska.

I have a feeling that since the 'Grim Sleeper' familial DNA match and resulting arrest that we may witness more and more states jumping on the offender DNA bandwagon.
North Carolina just passed a law last week allowing for DNA to be collected upon the arrest of a suspect in a violent crime...

http://www.wect.com/Global/story.asp?S=12785442

DNA certainly is a fascinating tool used in crime solving. I wish I knew more about it.

wm

 

[waltzingmatilda]

Bumping up for Tom and Shirlee!

Since we have been discussing dna evidence, (and in an effort to keep the thread current)
I am posting a couple of links about a case that was solved using Mitochondrial dna. This type of DNA was also used to identify Caylee Anthony's remains, IIRC.

I find the use of dna in solving crimes a fascinating subject that I enjoy learning about personally, so I hope it doesn't bore you all. It is something for us to chew on while we wait for new developments in the murders of Tom & Shirlee! We can only hope and pray. All MOO.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/38158659/

http://www.lexisone.com/lx1/caselaw...=hZLZ.SXdb.cSIQ.Lada&searchFlag=y&l1loc=FCLOW

Hope everyone has a nice weekend.

wm

 

[waltzingmatilda]

An interesting site about familiar DNA

http://www.denverda.org/dna/Familial_DNA_Database_Searches.htm

Wow, collette, alot of cases have been solved using familial DNA. I had no idea. Mitochondrial DNA also had a section. Thanks so much for the link!

wm

 

[waltzingmatilda]

It has been awhile since any updates on this case. I wonder if OPD is making any progress in solving this case. I know they don't owe us, the public, any information but geesh, they could throw us a crumb once in awhile.

Anyway, I was reading about this society on another thread and decided to link it. Perhaps OPD should consider asking them for help. It never hurts to have some new eyes looking at the evidence.

http://www.vidocq.org/index.html

Bumping up for Tom and Shirlee!

wm