GUILTY PA - Kent, 2, & Brandon Schaible, 7 mos, die as parents rely on faith healing, 2009

[Filly]

Oh good Lord.

Here's what especially got me. They "Schaible's" called our local funeral parlor after Brandon died. Poor little. Poor, poor little couldn't sleep, breathe or eat. Honestly how does that work? Someone dies in your home you don't go calling the funeral parlor.

RIP little one.

 

[fhc]

Jmo, this WASN'T God's will,
This wasn't the Devil's work,

This WAS the SCHAIBLES' will.

 

[fhc]

Oh good Lord.

Here's what especially got me. They "Schaible's" called our local funeral parlor after Brandon died. Poor little. Poor, poor little couldn't sleep, breathe or eat. Honestly how does that work? Someone dies in your home you don't go calling the funeral parlor.

RIP little one.

Sooooooo, was embalming acceptable???????? But no fluids for hydration or an oxygen tent!

 

[Jan]

It is so sad that this couple did not get medical care for their child. I think there is a good chance that with good medical care the child wouldn't have died. At least the child would have had a chance. The couple are lucky that most of their children have stayed fairly healthy. I wonder if they even got them immunizations? Probably not. So sad!

 

[Donjeta]

Two year old Kent Schaible had bacterial pneumonia. He died and his dad Herbert Schaible aged 42 told a DHS worker two days later they never had a child die after praying over them. His mother Catherine Schaible also was convicted of manslaughter.

Well, children dying is so rare anyway... but they can't use this as an excuse this time as they've had two...

Didn't God create fluids that you can give to a sick baby? Antibiotics? What if He put all those interesting enzymes and receptors and surface proteins in the bacteria on purpose so that we can use them to help people who are ill? Didn't He create brains so that we could learn from our mistakes?

 

[seattlechiquita]

Jmo, this WASN'T God's will,
This wasn't the Devil's work,

This WAS the SCHAIBLES' will.

wise words my friend. wise words.

 

[Synaptic Cliff]

Though the defense attorney is quoted in the above-linked article as saying that the bacteria "is drug-resistant and that medical intervention would not have saved the child." This is not necessarily true.

While Haemophilus influenzae b (Hib) has some resistance to penicillins, it can still be treated by other antibiotics, such as cephalosporins and macrolides, as well as penicillin combos with beta lactamase inhibitors like Unasyn (ampicillin/sulbactam), and with quinalones in adults (though we don't use them in kids usually, because of their side effects. I actually think death is a worse side effect than tendon rupture). Now, I haven't seen the sensitivities from his culture, so maybe.. MAYBE.. It was totally antibiotic resistant. Maybe...

BUT--Hib is at least 95% preventable with a vaccine routinely given to all children in the US. So, if he had been routinely vaccinated, he would almost certainly be alive today.

I saw one other article here:

http://articles.philly.com/2010-12-10/news/25292698_1_kent-pneumonia-jury

that suggested that he had might have had staph aureus pneumonia as well, per defense witness. This is also usually treatable with antibiotics. Even MRSA can be treated with vancomycin, linezolid or daptomycin. Not necessarily 100% effective, but way better odds than sitting home and praying. (Sorry, tried not to be snarky, but it just slipped out! :blushing

Seriously, even if we go with the defense's suggestion that the child had two XDR bacteria in his lungs--how would an otherwise healthy two year old child get pneumonia with two different highly drug-resistant bugs at the same time? I call BS.

My guess is that this is a kid who picked up Hib because he'd never been immunized, and then got real sick because it wasn't treated. Maybe the staph was a contaminant (I didn't see it mentioned at all in the original medical examiner's testimony) or maybe it was a super-infection, on top of the Hib. Either way, we practitioners of "evil" Western medicine would have given this child a great chance at being alive right now. From vaccine to antibiotics. We could have given him a chance to have the full and happy life he deserves.

I won't comment on the legalities. That is not my strength. Ethically, however, I cannot help but think, if this had been my child, I would never, ever forgive myself.

MOO

 

[Donjeta]

Though the defense attorney is quoted in the above-linked article as saying that the bacteria "is drug-resistant and that medical intervention would not have saved the child." This is not necessarily true.

Lots of people are alive after being infected with drug resistant bacteria.

Drug resistant germs do not indicate a certain death sentence and it doesn't mean that the medical science is powerless to help you. There are several things that can be done to help keep you alive while your body fights the disease. Extra oxygen, IV fluids and nutrition, intensive care and respiratory support if necessary might help, for one thing, but of course if your parents won't take you to a doctor even a relatively banal infection might turn out to be fatal.

 

[Kimster]

This sums up my thoughts on this case:

It had been raining for days and days, and a terrible flood had come over the land. The waters rose so high that one man was forced to climb onto the roof of his house to avoid the floodwaters, faithfully praying to God to save him.

As the waters rose higher and higher, a man in a rowboat appeared, and told him to get in. “No,” replied the man on the roof. “I have faith in the Lord, the Lord will save me.” So the man in the rowboat went away. The man on the roof prayed for God to save him.

The waters rose higher and higher, and suddenly a speedboat appeared. “Climb in!” shouted a man in the boat. “No,” replied the man on the roof. “I have faith in the Lord; the Lord will save me.” So the man in the speedboat went away. The man on the roof prayed even harder, knowing that God would save him.

The waters continued to rise. A helicopter appeared and over the loudspeaker, the pilot announced he would lower a rope to the man on the roof. “No,” replied the man on the roof. “I have faith in the Lord, the Lord will save me.” So the helicopter went away. The man on the roof prayed again for God to save him, steadfast in his faith.

The waters rose higher and higher, and eventually they rose so high that the man on the roof was washed away, and alas, the poor man drowned.

Upon arriving in heaven, the man marched straight over to God. “Heavenly Father,” he said, “I had faith in you, I prayed to you to save me, and yet you did nothing. Why?” God gave him a puzzled look, and replied “I sent you two boats and a helicopter, what more did you expect than that?”

 

[Filly]

ME rules baby's death as murder.




http://www.philly.com/philly/news/20130522_M_E___Death_of_faith-healing_couple_s_baby_is_murder.html

 

[fhc]

Oh, this makes me sick!!!

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/05/22/us-usa-crime-baby-idUSBRE94L1AS20130522

A Philadelphia couple was charged on Wednesday in the death of their infant son

In addition to third-degree murder, the parents were charged with involuntary manslaughter, conspiracy and endangering the welfare of a child.

Their 7-month-old son Brandon died on April 18 after becoming ill with bacterial pneumonia, dehydration and strep, District Attorney R. Seth Williams said at a news conference.

So this poor baby had strep,(we all know how painful that can be, nothing eases the pain) AND bacterial pneumonia (difficulty breathing, they had seen this before in their 2 yr old that died) AND dehydration (wasn't nursing or taking in fluids). INEXCUSABLE, jmo.

HOW COULD THEY...

 

[seattlechiquita]

ME rules baby's death as murder.




http://www.philly.com/philly/news/20130522_M_E___Death_of_faith-healing_couple_s_baby_is_murder.html

YES and more YES. I'm all for freedom of religion, but when a child cries in pain, ANY god wants that child to be tended to.

 

[Ausgirl]

Freedom of religion should not apply to or justify neglect or abuse of ANYONE.

Plenty of fundamental religious groups follow the word of the bible closely, but imagine if they thought stoning women to death for being raped was okay, or any of the other savage practises recommended in those ancient texts... which were written as a social control mechanism for another time, long in the past.

This falls squarely in the bounds of that example, IMO. Charge 'em with murder, they knew the child needed help and refused to seek it. How those little ones must have suffered (strep IS agonising!), so that their parents could cling to their ego-driven need to feel righteous (or just RIGHT). Or their delusons, whatever. The result is the same.

I can't believe the defense is "well, the child would have died anyway". Sickening is not even close to what that is.

Poor babies.

 

[seattlechiquita]

Wise words my friend, wise words.

 

[tlcya]

This sums up my thoughts on this case:

It had been raining for days and days, and a terrible flood had come over the land. The waters rose so high that one man was forced to climb onto the roof of his house to avoid the floodwaters, faithfully praying to God to save him.

As the waters rose higher and higher, a man in a rowboat appeared, and told him to get in. “No,” replied the man on the roof. “I have faith in the Lord, the Lord will save me.” So the man in the rowboat went away. The man on the roof prayed for God to save him.

The waters rose higher and higher, and suddenly a speedboat appeared. “Climb in!” shouted a man in the boat. “No,” replied the man on the roof. “I have faith in the Lord; the Lord will save me.” So the man in the speedboat went away. The man on the roof prayed even harder, knowing that God would save him.

The waters continued to rise. A helicopter appeared and over the loudspeaker, the pilot announced he would lower a rope to the man on the roof. “No,” replied the man on the roof. “I have faith in the Lord, the Lord will save me.” So the helicopter went away. The man on the roof prayed again for God to save him, steadfast in his faith.

The waters rose higher and higher, and eventually they rose so high that the man on the roof was washed away, and alas, the poor man drowned.

Upon arriving in heaven, the man marched straight over to God. “Heavenly Father,” he said, “I had faith in you, I prayed to you to save me, and yet you did nothing. Why?” God gave him a puzzled look, and replied “I sent you two boats and a helicopter, what more did you expect than that?”

Exactly! I cannot understand why people would pray and then refuse to see or accept the answer to that prayer when it is right in front of them.

Advances in Medicine = answered prayers of many ill people. Why can some not see that?

 

[Filly]

No bail for the parents.

Here's a link that shows how many stories were done over the years on this Church and the one they are an offshoot from.



http://articles.philly.com/keyword/faith-healing


This is actually seriously really close in proximity to me. Most people now are like "Where the he** is this place?" You could have fooled me. I had no idea that was a Church and they have a significant amount of members. I do recall a few years ago a child stepped on something in bare feet and got infection and died. I am fairly sure it's this Church.

Apparently upward to two dozen children have died. I'll find that link.

The head Reverend's name keeps coming up Nelson Ambrose Clark. The Schaibels did call on the Pastor and got the assistant.

 

[Filly]

Article on two dozen children who have died since 1971.




http://doubtfulnews.com/2013/05/sch...ongregation-has-had-at-least-22-child-deaths/

This Church also does not believe on continuing education. You are not permitted to own any property or a vehicle. They also do not believe in seatbelts for children or child safety seats. They do not believe in dental care or toothpaste either.

Last night a guy called in to talk radio and said his wife grew up in that Church, but left. Her brother died at the age of 14. She said he just lay sick on the couch dying. Her own mother died very young as well. There's also a case of a woman dying in childbirth.

 

[Donjeta]

“The church believe that people get sick because they’re not doing the right thing,” the man named John said. He refused to give his last name during the interview.

“God promised us that if we do his will, that there’s no infection; all these diseases that you name, would not come to you,” the man explained. John says he believes the congregation is being persecuted for their beliefs.

Where does God say that good people never get the flu?

At least 22 children from the congregations have died from illnesses.

In 1991, Faith Tabernacle lost five children to the measles after an outbreak.

If God really told them that there would be no infection if they do his will, all these kids getting the measles should have been a clue that God is mad about withholding treatment.

At some point people should look around and figure out that they are not sick any less than the regular people who are not doing God's will by withholding treatment from their sick children and they have more children. And some of them die of trivial infections that other children overcome easily with the help of medical aid or never got in the first place because they were vaccinated. At some point someone should add up two and two and figure out it's not working. If faith protects from illness you should lose fewer children to infections than the infidels, not more. Either God never promised that doing his will will keep you healthy or you're mistaken about what His will is.

JMO.

http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news...nked-to-Two-Dozen-Child-Deaths-208745201.html

 

[ceecee30]

I'm not oppose to religious beliefs but when people refuse to seek treatment for their children as they think praying will cure the illness... It makes my blood boil..

I wish DHS had taken the other kids away, poor little bubba may he rest in peace

 

[Ausgirl]

This Church also does not believe on continuing education. You are not permitted to own any property or a vehicle. They also do not believe in seatbelts for children or child safety seats. They do not believe in dental care or toothpaste either.

Last night a guy called in to talk radio and said his wife grew up in that Church, but left. Her brother died at the age of 14. She said he just lay sick on the couch dying. Her own mother died very young as well. There's also a case of a woman dying in childbirth.

Less a Church than a dangerous cult? When I see things like "can't own property or vehicles" and "don't allow conventional education" I see CULT -- not a religion (which exists FOR its people) but a cult (which exists FOR its leaders at the expense of its people).


Don't get me started on how cults like that devastate families. They're a social sickness, all too often lurking under the blanket of conventional churches.

Freedom of religion, my . When they start murdering, neglecting and ripping off their followers, they need to be shut down and prosecuted, every last one of them.