PA PA - Ray Gricar, 59, Bellefonte, 15 April 2005 - #11

[J. J. in Phila]

I have and continue to feel the finances are a dead end but it was certainly worth the effort. Thanks again Tracker.

It could end up being a dead end, but right now, it is very open.

Trackergd did an excellent job, but it only eliminates the possibility that RFG had a large amount of money just sitting there and LG let it just sit there.

 

[SuperSmith]

All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost;
The old that is strong does not wither,
Deep roots are not reached by the frost.

From the ashes a fire shall be woken,
A light from the shadows shall spring;
Renewed shall be blade that was broken,
The crownless again shall be king.

J.R.R. Tolkien

 

[SuperSmith]

SPM doesn't impress me. She is a glamor DA that spends entirely too much time on FB & Twitter to be considered a true professional. She doesn't come close to RG.

I hope the gallery forgives me for not getting excited about a quote from her that is 3 years old.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I've never been a Tolkien fan.

Now, I am old enough to remember both Watergate and All the President's Men. As Deep Throat said, in the film at least, "Follow the money."

 

[J. J. in Phila]

SPM doesn't impress me. She is a glamor DA that spends entirely too much time on FB & Twitter to be considered a true professional. She doesn't come close to RG.

I hope the gallery forgives me for not getting excited about a quote from her that is 3 years old.

The electorate of Centre County seems to disagree with you. Going back to 1981, no other District Attorney in Centre County has ever gotten both party nominations, including RFG, who had an uncontested race in 1997. In terms of electoral strength, she has exceeded RFG.

I would also point out that, unlike RFG, she left a lucrative practice as a defense attorney to take the job.

I should point out that it was followed up by a quote from TG, about 3 months later.

 

[SeekingJana]

http://www.centredaily.com/2006/05/13/3802/missed-leads.html

It has been quite a while since I have referenced or re-read Pete Bosak's excellent blog post, written in 2006.

I would like to borrow a few direct quotes from the link above:

<<Snipped>> "
Relying on Lara
Zaccagni also revealed that police are not monitoring Gricar's checking and savings accounts, which Zaccagni said totaled more than $100,000 -- but not much more -- when Gricar disappeared.
The accounts were held jointly by Gricar and his daughter, Lara, and had been for years. Since his disappearance, Lara Gricar has been named trustee of her father's estate.
"It's a substantial sum, but nothing extravagant," Zaccagni said.
"I don't personally check it at all. Lara knows to contact us if anything unusual happens. We rely on Lara to contact us if there are any unusual withdrawals."

Zaccagni said he last talked with Lara Gricar more than a month ago.

Snipped>>"Sloane, when told the state of Gricar's financial accounts, was stunned. Gricar was known as a frugal man who did not throw money around, he said.
"Wow," Sloane said.
"He should have had more money than that, I would think. He wasn't into investing. He wasn't very into 401(k)s or IRAs."

Lara Gricar would not comment on her father's finances. "That's nobody's business," she said.


Lastly, I would like to quote an outside investigator. From the original link at the top of the page:
When told that no officials were monitoring Mr. Gricar's checking or savings accounts for activity, this was his professional reply:"Gricar's finances should be the Bellefonte Police Department's business, said John Lajoie, a nationally known, Massachusetts-based private investigator who serves as Northeast regional director for the National Association of Legal Investigators.

"If they are not personally watching his checking, savings and credit cards, they're not conducting an effective investigation," Lajoie said.

My notes- Were DZ's statements regarding the lack of monitoring correct?
Apparently, Lara had access from the beginning of Mr. Gricar's disappearance. Was there any accountability, though?

There are many salient points in Mr. Bosak's blog post but I chose the ones dealing with finances in 2006, when the post was written.
Maybe others might like to discuss other aspects or updates which have come from other official sources? Thanks.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

The accounts, according to "Missed Leads" were all in both RFG's and LG's name. That is not too unusual, and since college, I had that arrangement with my father, well before he became ill.

There were several good reasons to do this.

1. If RFG should have been in an accident, or had a health problem, e.g. a heart attack or a stroke, and couldn't write checks or handle the accounts, LG could see that the bills are paid.

2. If RFG would die, for estate purposes, the account would be split down the middle, even if LG didn't put a cent into it. Assume that the account had a balance of $100 K. If it was solely in RFG's name, and LG got it all, she would be taxed on it at 7.5%, or $7,500. If LG's name was on it, half of it would be considered hers for estate purposes, $50 K. She would be taxed at 7.5% on $50 k, or $3,750. It is perfectly legal and good estate planning practice.

I would not read too much into this, unless RFG put LG on the accounts recently. She was next of kin after his 2001 divorce.

The estate tax is a PA tax.

"Missed Leads" is one of those articles that marks a turning point in the Gricar case.

 

[SuperSmith]

I first want to acknowledge that I believe it's a great thing that all of you continue to keep the Ray Gricar missing persons case alive. At the end of the day that is what matters.

We all have our own thoughts, our own analytical ways, and our own conclusions as to what the most likely of resolutions to this case could be.

Much like some of your thoughts regarding Saunterer and I exploring the HA story and theories I feel the same regarding the finances as a productive avenue to explore.

Perhaps I am giving Mr. Gricar too much credit but in my opinion I believe he would not leave a gaping hole (if there is one) that would raise a red flag to even us amateur sleuths regarding his money. Finances are one of the first aspects to look at in a case like this and it was to a degree. Aside from a full forensic audit of all of RG's finances I believe this is a dead end. We cannot go any further with it.

I believe a sound bite from the current DA that is three years old is receiving too much weight. Besides it is the BPD that is investigating and I have heard nothing of the sorts from Weaver or Rickard that his finances are still be explored.

JMO

:headache:

 

[J. J. in Phila]

On the HA story, I think it was taken seriously, though skeptically, when the story broke. Even BB's comments were taken seriously to the point of checking them out. The problem was that what came out didn't support the theory.

As for a "gaping hole," think about this. The first thing that LE is going to look at is not finances; they will first be looking for a car. Then they will look for his destination and then a body. Then they will look to see if his credit card was used. Then they look to see if he removed cash recently. Then, maybe, they will look to see if he has any debt.

Like his computer searches, looking at his assets will not be the first priority. Here, we are talking about looking at his finances long term. By the time they find anything, RFG will be long gone.

LE didn't know about the computer searches until late 2006. It wasn't hidden, but it wasn't priority.

 

[SuperSmith]

On the HA story, I think it was taken seriously, though skeptically, when the story broke. Even BB's comments were taken seriously to the point of checking them out. The problem was that what came out didn't support the theory.

As for a "gaping hole," think about this. The first thing that LE is going to look at is not finances; they will first be looking for a car. Then they will look for his destination and then a body. Then they will look to see if his credit card was used. Then they look to see if he removed cash recently. Then, maybe, they will look to see if he has any debt.

Like his computer searches, looking at his assets will not be the first priority. Here, we are talking about looking at his finances long term. By the time they find anything, RFG will be long gone.

LE didn't know about the computer searches until late 2006. It wasn't hidden, but it wasn't priority.

Respectfully, I said "one of the first things" and of course after the car.

My point was clear that we really can no longer discuss this avenue being that we cannot get more information. I suppose you can either wait for SPM or continue to run on assumption. That of course is your choice.

LOL, if RG really did walk away, and after 8 years, I think he is already long gone.

 

[SuperSmith]

The HA story is far from over.

There is suggestion that a third informant came forward.

http://www.fox8tv.com/News/NewsDetails.asp?NewsID=12298

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Respectfully, I said "one of the first things" and of course after the car.

My point was clear that we really can no longer discuss this avenue being that we cannot get more information. I suppose you can either wait for SPM or continue to run on assumption. That of course is your choice.

LOL, if RG really did walk away, and after 8 years, I think he is already long gone.

Well, there might be other avenues.

This would not be one of the first things LE was looking at, past financial movements. As noted, even in regard to the computer searches, LE had not checked until the second half of 2006.

We can look at his salary, as you attempted and look from there.

If RFG was planning for retirement, why isn't that money in the estate?

 

[J. J. in Phila]

The HA story is far from over.

There is suggestion that a third informant came forward.

http://www.fox8tv.com/News/NewsDetails.asp?NewsID=12298

This isn't a "third source," necessarily. It might be the same source as Bock's source, expanding or retelling the same old story. Another possibility is that A.K. told multiple versions of the same story, none of which are true.

 

[SuperSmith]

Do Bonds or CD's show up in an accounting of the estate?

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Do Bonds or CD's show up in an accounting of the estate?

CD's would; they are like money in a bank account. Savings bond interest should be: http://www.owmlaw.com/publications/US-savings-bonds.pdf Stocks would; so would precious medals. Life insurance and possibly some annuities (not generally used for retirement) would not be subject to state estate tax. Interest from those could be.

Oh, I double checked the PA inheritance tax rate. It is 4.5% for a child not 7.5%.

 

[Saunterer]

I have the utmost confidence in SPM, as the current DA of Centre County and the one presently charged with solving (her personal quest) the Gricar mystery. I have also been fortunate to have had many productive exchanges with the likes of personal representatives of Gricar's family, law enforcement and media types. It is a complicated mess, to be sure. But it is vitally important to the justice system. Too few understand that. Very sad!

 

[Saunterer]

This isn't a "third source," necessarily. It might be the same source as Bock's source, expanding or retelling the same old story. Another possibility is that A.K. told multiple versions of the same story, none of which are true.

Sinderson's informant is absolutely a third source alleging knowledge of Gricar's demise. I suggest that this particular aspect is far from over.

 

[Saunterer]

Trackergd's information proves, once and for all and without doubt, that Gricar's assets are accounted for...just as was asserted by LE in 2005. JMOO

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Sinderson's informant is absolutely a third source alleging knowledge of Gricar's demise. I suggest that this particular aspect is far from over.

All of these sources are secondary sources. Bock's source talked to A. K. BB source talked to A. K. Sinderson's source may or may not be one of those two, but we are getting different versions.

Bock's source, supposedly in the HA and thought that the shaft would incriminate him. Reason, revenge for a harsh sentence that turned out not to be.

BB's source, the location is in the nonexistent "Quarryville, Bucks County."

Sinderson's source, RFG ran a "corrupt office" and was in debt to the Hells Angels. Do you really think RFG borrowed money from the Hells Angels? They are not exactly the First National Bank of Bellefonte.

 

[Saunterer]

There is no indication that Buehner's 2010 pen pal was ever connected with either Bock's or Sinderson's more recent informants.