Patsy maxing out John's credit cards and then hiding them?

[BOESP]

In their television interviews, there always seems to be a leaden hostility between them...although they do the requisite hand-holding thing. I think that PR would have used spending sprees as a form of passive aggression against JR - he was emotionally withholding, and spending money was a sure way to get a rise out of him. She probably also felt that she deserved to buy whatever that she wanted, in recompense for the aridity of her emotional life. She could barely contain her rage in interviews, and one shudders to think what she (and he, of course) were like at home. MOO.

They came across as phony in my opinion. She in particular seemed phony and he seemed to be on the verge of yelling at her in their earliest television appearances. Then years later she got quiet and he started getting preachy.

I think in PMPT there was a chapter devoted to the building of their computer business while still in Atlanta. Seems like, iirc, Patsy's marketing and organizational skills were what got their Access Graphics business off and running, and financial backing from Don Paugh (Patsy's dad). John seems to have taken a lot of credit that, in my view, Patsy deserved.

 

[BOESP]

Yes, the whole note reads like a diatribe against JR...formatted to distill every drop of venom gathered over the years. The tone is humiliating and belittling throughout, and strangely personal in its tone (considering it was supposed to have been written by "a small foreign faction" of outside agents). So creepy. MOO.
[snip]

Bonette, what you said is another good reason, along with QDEs not excluding her as having written the note, why I believe Patsy wrote the note.

Wish we knew what, according to Linda Arndt, the secrets were that "imprisoned" Patsy.

 

[OpenMind4U]

Bonette, what you said is another good reason, along with QDEs not excluding her as having written the note, why I believe Patsy wrote the note.

Wish we knew what, according to Linda Arndt, the secrets were that "imprisoned" Patsy.

John's affair with other woman? He did it before this marrige, I'm sure he would do the same w/Patsy. Habbits of the man are hardly ever changed...hey, hey guys - please don't trough rocks at me! JMO and I'm merrit to the same man for 44 years...:woohoo:

 

[Bonnette]

I think in PMPT there was a chapter devoted to the building of their computer business while still in Atlanta. Seems like, iirc, Patsy's marketing and organizational skills were what got their Access Graphics business off and running, and financial backing from Don Paugh (Patsy's dad). John seems to have taken a lot of credit that, in my view, Patsy deserved.

I remember that...yes, he accepted her creativity and promotional skills as his due (divine right might be more like it). JR could never have succeeded in the business world without Patsy's PR skills and Don Paugh's money...and now that he is the only player on the field (save BR, who will probably never speak on the record), JR has morphed into a preachy blowhard. Agree with your observations entirely, BOESP.

 

[Bonnette]

Wish we knew what, according to Linda Arndt, the secrets were that "imprisoned" Patsy.

OpenMind4u might well have nailed one of them (above)...JR had plenty of opportunity over the years, and with PR's illness I can imagine all sorts of ramifications.

 

[OpenMind4U]

I remember that...yes, he accepted her creativity and promotional skills as his due (divine right might be more like it). JR could never have succeeded in the business world without Patsy's PR skills and Don Paugh's money...and now that he is the only player on the field (save BR, who will probably never speak on the record), JR has morphed into a preachy blowhard. Agree with your observations entirely, BOESP.

As the businessman, John was the cold and calculated person. He knows how to use people and when he's done with them - they are history! He wasn't respected boss by his employee. He could be on friendly note with co-worker today and fired him tomorrow without much thoughts and explanations. He wasn't trustfull among his peers.

As the husband, John was the selfish and disgusting human being. When Patsy was fighting with the cancer (surgeries, flying to out of town for chemos)- John wasn't with her...he was busy 'making money' or traveling or dinning/golfing with the 'right' people.

I don't know how John was with his kids. I only know that his behavior after JBR death was absolutely different than how he reacts to Beth's death. Even his co-workers noticed that....

jmo

 

[BOESP]

OpenMind4U said: I don't know how John was with his kids.

I believe when Burke did the "family" drawing interview (where he drew a picture of his family and didn't include JonBenet) that he said his dad was always gone. Iirc, Burke drew his dad in an airplane.

 

[crimedoesnotpay]

As the businessman, John was the cold and calculated person. He knows how to use people and when he's done with them - they are history! He wasn't respected boss by his employee. He could be on friendly note with co-worker today and fired him tomorrow without much thoughts and explanations. He wasn't trustfull among his peers.

As the husband, John was the selfish and disgusting human being. When Patsy was fighting with the cancer (surgeries, flying to out of town for chemos)- John wasn't with her...he was busy 'making money' or traveling or dinning/golfing with the 'right' people.

I don't know how John was with his kids. I only know that his behavior after JBR death was absolutely different than how he reacts to Beth's death. Even his co-workers noticed that....

jmo

Business is often cold and calculating which is the feel i get from the ransom note - but not from John;;; if JB died accidentally (of being garrotted ??? ) then why write a ransom note... fake a kidnap scene in your own house.. write a phoney psychopathic letter... then call the police with all the evidence in your house.. when if you do not wish to admit to the accident - and you have means at your disposal ad also time available... to deposit the body elsewhere - ???? No.

 

[Bonnette]

OpenMind4U said: I don't know how John was with his kids.

I believe when Burke did the "family" drawing interview (where he drew a picture of his family and didn't include JonBenet) that he said his dad was always gone. Iirc, Burke drew his dad in an airplane.

JR was reportedly inconsolable when Beth died, weeping openly. Not so JBR. Burke's interview drawing depicted him as distant, seated in the cockpit of a plane.

 

[crimedoesnotpay]

JR was reportedly inconsolable when Beth died, weeping openly. Not so JBR. Burke's interview drawing depicted him as distant, seated in the cockpit of a plane.

Yes it can be assumed that the picture was demonstrating John as being distant in the eyes of his son - one could also assume that Burke was expressing pride in his father.

When some people have experienced intolerable grief - they sometimes find it difficult to maintain attachments or they don't make new ones - they protect themselves emotionally and sometimes their minds start to work on other new levels - focussing on reasoning or logic components as opposed to emotional ones - because they just can't take any more suffering or pain; of John was distant to his loved ones at times I expect I expect it was part of the grieving process for his daughter - he has now lost 2 daughters and a wife - his life has been very cruel to him - especially if he has been betrayed in every possible way also by close so-called friends.

On the credit card thing - since time immemorial women have commented on loving a spend up and men have moaned about it - its the way of the world - nowt new to see there and certainly not relevant to the events of that night - unless John was blackmailing himself or Patsy wanted the money so bad as to suddenly inherit psychopathic ruthless tendencies for a bit of dough. No.

 

[DeeDee249]

I can't imagine how you "accidentally" garrote someone. That being said, compression of the nerve can stop the heart unintentionally.
BUT..the forensic specialists who reviewed the autopsy all agreed that she was bashed on the head FIRST. The garrote was likely staging, though it played an obvious part in her death.

 

[DeeDee249]

As far as Patsy being aware of the $118,000. bonus- she claimed NOT to have known about it, but I am sure she did. Every wife knows the details of her husband's Christmas bonus, and someone like Patsy already had it spent in her mind. Like her mother Nedra said "We LOVE to spend JR's money".

 

[ILikeToBendPages]

As far as Patsy being aware of the $118,000. bonus- she claimed NOT to have known about it, but I am sure she did. Every wife knows the details of her husband's Christmas bonus, and someone like Patsy already had it spent in her mind. Like her mother Nedra said "We LOVE to spend JR's money".

Pasty was said to of had a checking account of her own to pay household expenses from. I know several couples with that arrangement, no big deal unless they went over their allowance. I'm sure she knew how much they had in the bank also. Pasty said she was to leave a check for LHP for two thousand dollars on the kitchen counter. I'm sure that was to of come out of her allowance and not John Ramsey.

The ransom note is quite personal all the way through. How would a small foreign faction know of inside jokes about John Ramsey? Or the amount of his bonus. No Pasty wrote that note, She's all over that thing.

 

[dodie20]

As far as Patsy being aware of the $118,000. bonus- she claimed NOT to have known about it, but I am sure she did. Every wife knows the details of her husband's Christmas bonus, and someone like Patsy already had it spent in her mind. Like her mother Nedra said "We LOVE to spend JR's money".

Thanks for this information. I researched some, but couldn't find anything. I also read differing accounts of when JR received the money, everything from almost a year earlier, to right before that Christmas. PR saying she didn't know about the bonus is interesting, IMO, and it does make me wonder. Once I got the idea of JR not telling her about the money, in my head, the more it seemed to fit. Not as a motive for murder, but more as a reason for all of the anger that I, personally, picked up on in the ransom note. If he hadn't told her, then the amount being put in the ransom note, might 'clear' her, in his eyes, and she would have every reason for not admitting that she had found out somehow. When PR said she didn't know about the bonus, did JR give a reason for not telling her? I've been reading up on the different reasons that mothers kill their children, and 1 reason that keeps popping up, is the mother wants to punish the father. IDK if there was any of that in this case, but the tone of that note, was so angry and ticked off, it was almost palpable. I did run across a very interesting article, written by a primatologist. He compared the physical, mental, and chemical reactions in certain animals who kill their young, to mothers who kill their children. His points on stress, the harmone cortisol, and the 'pecking order', were enlightening. If JR didn't tell PR about the bonus, she wouldn't have been poor or powerless, but she may have felt powerless, and pushed out. She helped build that company and this could have been like a slap in her face, and made her wonder what was going on in her marriage. All MOO.

 

[crimedoesnotpay]

Thanks for this information. I researched some, but couldn't find anything. I also read differing accounts of when JR received the money, everything from almost a year earlier, to right before that Christmas. PR saying she didn't know about the bonus is interesting, IMO, and it does make me wonder. Once I got the idea of JR not telling her about the money, in my head, the more it seemed to fit. Not as a motive for murder, but more as a reason for all of the anger that I, personally, picked up on in the ransom note. If he hadn't told her, then the amount being put in the ransom note, might 'clear' her, in his eyes, and she would have every reason for not admitting that she had found out somehow. When PR said she didn't know about the bonus, did JR give a reason for not telling her? I've been reading up on the different reasons that mothers kill their children, and 1 reason that keeps popping up, is the mother wants to punish the father. IDK if there was any of that in this case, but the tone of that note, was so angry and ticked off, it was almost palpable. I did run across a very interesting article, written by a primatologist. He compared the physical, mental, and chemical reactions in certain animals who kill their young, to mothers who kill their children. His points on stress, the harmone cortisol, and the 'pecking order', were enlightening. If JR didn't tell PR about the bonus, she wouldn't have been poor or powerless, but she may have felt powerless, and pushed out. She helped build that company and this could have been like a slap in her face, and made her wonder what was going on in her marriage. All MOO.

There was a recent story here of a woman who stabbed her 4 year old to death - but she then drank a bottle of antifreeze to kill herself but failed - citing the fact she had lost her job and didn't want her child to live without money or on the breadline so to speak. Other stories I can think of also include those whereby the parent self harms at the same time as killing their offspring - kill the kids and themselves - they want to die but feel they can't leave the child behind alone. I can't think of one premeditated for money where they remain cold and aloof and ruthless.. it is usually those who kill the children of others that display the pathological behaviour.

There was one case however of torture - I am not sure if it was in Holland whereby the mother was torturing her child in a basement along with other family members and friends - to the point of cutting the ends of the child's fingers off and feeding them to the child and the child was found cos they were using some sort of radio communication between themselves and what was going on in the basement was overheard by an outsider to the goings on and rang for help.. the mother claimed she was sorry but had been drawn in my fanatical christians of some sort who had educated her in this sort of punishment.. every time you think you have heard the worst thing you will ever hear life comes along and proves you wrong.

If I had to narrow things down to those in the house alone then accidental death through child's play between Burke and Jonbenet is the only answer I could accommodate right now.

I know there is evil in the world but we cannot let this blind us to humanness.

 

[ILikeToBendPages]

Thanks for this information. I researched some, but couldn't find anything. I also read differing accounts of when JR received the money, everything from almost a year earlier, to right before that Christmas. PR saying she didn't know about the bonus is interesting, IMO, and it does make me wonder. Once I got the idea of JR not telling her about the money, in my head, the more it seemed to fit. Not as a motive for murder, but more as a reason for all of the anger that I, personally, picked up on in the ransom note. If he hadn't told her, then the amount being put in the ransom note, might 'clear' her, in his eyes, and she would have every reason for not admitting that she had found out somehow. When PR said she didn't know about the bonus, did JR give a reason for not telling her? I've been reading up on the different reasons that mothers kill their children, and 1 reason that keeps popping up, is the mother wants to punish the father. IDK if there was any of that in this case, but the tone of that note, was so angry and ticked off, it was almost palpable. I did run across a very interesting article, written by a primatologist. He compared the physical, mental, and chemical reactions in certain animals who kill their young, to mothers who kill their children. His points on stress, the harmone cortisol, and the 'pecking order', were enlightening. If JR didn't tell PR about the bonus, she wouldn't have been poor or powerless, but she may have felt powerless, and pushed out. She helped build that company and this could have been like a slap in her face, and made her wonder what was going on in her marriage. All MOO.

Pasty knew the amount and that was all that she was willing to lose.

No matter that her little girl, should of been worth one hundred times that amount, but that was the price Pasty put on JonBenet.

 

[Bonnette]

Pasty knew the amount and that was all that she was willing to lose.

No matter that her little girl, should of been worth one hundred times that amount, but that was the price Pasty put on JonBenet.

Yeah...and not only that, but how about the measly $100,000 reward the Rs put up to find JB's "real killer"? Considering they were worth millions, that amount speaks volumes. Especially since they knew they'd never have to pay out.

 

[dodie20]

Yeah...and not only that, but how about the measly $100,000 reward the Rs put up to find JB's "real killer"? Considering they were worth millions, that amount speaks volumes. Especially since they knew they'd never have to pay out.

well, they had a lot of financial priorities, like all the lawyers they hired, the public relation company, and no telling what else. Did JR pay for his ex wife's and kids lawyers, or did they? He claimed the legal fees broke him, to the point of him having to live on a boat, so a lot of money went out. moo

 

[ILikeToBendPages]

well, they had a lot of financial priorities, like all the lawyers they hired, the public relation company, and no telling what else. Did JR pay for his ex wife's and kids lawyers, or did they? He claimed the legal fees broke him, to the point of him having to live on a boat, so a lot of money went out. moo

That Ramsey money sure kept a lot of mouths shut didn't it? Someone posted the other day about Lin Wood earning his money with his shake down tactics.

 

[Bonnette]

He claimed the legal fees broke him, to the point of him having to live on a boat, so a lot of money went out. moo

Aw, poor baby. He could have saved himself a lot of coin if he'd just talked to LE from the get-go. Reminds me of Bugliosi's statement - the R's are like the kid who killed his parents and then threw himself on the mercy of the court because he was an orphan. MOO.