Penn State Sandusky scandal: AD arrested, Paterno, Spanier fired; coverup charged #5

[Pensfan]

. and the victims parents, and witnesses etc...

We've seen this all before............. Nothing wrong with being "attracted" to young boys & sharing a shower. Sounds all too much like " Nothing wrong with sharing a bed" we all heard & saw a famous, now deceased celebrity say on national tv. EVERYONE learned of all the grooming that went on. The SAME sick twisted smile erupting from his lips & glazed over eyes when talking about his attraction to children.

We saw the defense smear the mother of one victim, learned of multiple pay off others and we saw the machine that knew and never said a word cause they were making money. The people that saw & told were also smeared and defamed.

I get the same sick feeling in the pit of my stomach & like crying with this case. So many people failed all the victims.

Hopefully, this sicko won't get away with it. I will not be surprised if he does.

IMO

Hopefully the independent investigation into The Second Mile will be completely truthful. Even if it isn't and the jurors don't believe all the kids' statements, Sandusky could be hung by bank records. In Pennsylvania an adult has sign on a child's account. It is beyond suspicious that he was setting up bank accounts for the same kids that state he molested/raped them.

 

[Linda7NJ]

Hopefully the independent investigation into The Second Mile will be completely truthful. Even if it isn't and the jurors don't believe all the kids' statements, Sandusky could be hung by bank records. In Pennsylvania an adult has sign on a child's account. It is beyond suspicious that he was setting up bank accounts for the same kids that state he molested/raped them.

Don't count on it.

The other famous one, that will remain nameless, paid millions to atleast two accusers...made no difference. A good defense lawyer can lie and lie and spin the crap out of it.

we're already hearing shades of how Jerry is just a big kid..:banghead:

 

[Dr.Fessel]

The interviews Sandusky is doing now are starting to make a little sense to me now that I have learned the State of Pennsylvania does not allow experts to "to address questions about victim behavior in sex assault cases, including why a person abused in childhood might wait for decades to report the assaults."

The more they can get out now about the victims not coming out sooner, the weirdness of the victims going to dinners and stuff is a plus since the state will not be able to explain that behavior during trial.

Quote came from:
Pittsburgh Tribune-Review http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pit...reports/pennstate/s_770237.html#ixzz1fWH0l5D4

 

[Pensfan]

If this one starts talking about how he didn't have a childhood & thinks he's Peter Pan my head is going to explode!

The only hope I have is that now a whole nother genre of people "sports people" will learn how grooming works, whose vulnerable and how adapt these freaks are at selecting their victims. All the while appearing to most to be fine upstanding (charitable sometimes)...but usually respected citizens. Face it.... if behaved like total jerks and wore a dirty trench coat and tried to lure kids on the corner...children wouldn't fall prey at the rate they do.

I hope everyone that is involved in any type of organization that involves children is learning about how pedophiles try to enter organizations to gain legitimate access to children. Sadly, Sandusky established The Second Mile in the 1970s when pedophilia was not a topic that was discussed or even researched.

The Stranger Danger program is very important, but fixated pedophiles are not strangers. There should be a national campaign to educate parents that it is not just strangers that prey on children. Mr. Overly Helpful could also be dangerous.

 

[Pensfan]

The interviews Sandusky is doing now are starting to make a little sense to me now that I have learned the State of Pennsylvania does not allow experts to "to address questions about victim behavior in sex assault cases, including why a person abused in childhood might wait for decades to report the assaults."

The more they can get out now about the victims not coming out sooner, the weirdness of the victims going to dinners and stuff is a plus since the state will not be able to explain that behavior during trial.

Quote came from:
Pittsburgh Tribune-Review http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pit...reports/pennstate/s_770237.html#ixzz1fWH0l5D4

I agree. Hopefully House Bill 1264 will be passed before the trial starts.

Did anyone read anything about what gifts Sandusky and Sarge gave the boys at that dinner? I wonder what Sandusky used to try to bribe the victims to come to their house for dinner. I hope it was something tangible since that one victim did not wear a wire. Was it stated anywhere if the other victim that went to dinner agreed to wear a wire?

List of PA representatives to contact about supporting House Bill 1264:
http://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs...ator/index.cfm?CFID=92294808&CFTOKEN=19815659
http://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs/legis/home/member_information/representatives_alpha.cfm

 

[ThoughtFox]

Through the centuries people have instinctively known that "nice" adults in authority are often just waiting to pounce on innocent children.

Read Jane Eyre or David Copperfield for examples.

Older stories include the "Big Bad Wolf" from Little Red Riding Hood, and the Pied Piper of Hamelin who led the children away from the village with his bright clothing and merry whistle but then closed them up in a mountain away from their parents.

Modern day cautionary tales include the Child Catcher from Chitty-Chitty Bang Bang and Dolores Umbridge (with her little-girl voice and love of cats) & Gilderoy Lockhart (handsome teacher heart-throb who leaves children to die in the Chamber of Secrets) in the Harry Potter Books.

And yet it's always a shock when these happen, and people always talk about what a nice, kind, honorable person this was. Like Norman Bates in Psycho, he wouldn't hurt a fly. :furious:

 

[MaryNo]

:noooo: :noooo: I did not know this!

How have cases like this been prosecuted successfully in the past???? There have to be some really amazing prosecutors in PA.

It really opens my eyes as to why the specific investigations have taken so long. It's the rare victim who doesn't behave sideways in "keeping the secret" when they haven't received coping skills in therapy. I'm sure it raises the unlearned juror's eyebrows a bit when this behavior is thrown out there in relationship to the victim's credibility.

Here's to praying they rush this legislation through, so the victims will get a fair shot in court

Bill would permit experts to testify about sex abuse victim behavior






Pennsylvania is the only state that does not allow expert witness testimony about victim behavior to be offered during sexual assault criminal trials, such as the upcoming proceedings against former Penn State football defensive coordinator Jerry Sandusky.

A bill in the state Senate Judiciary Committee would change that, and the Pennsylvania Coalition Against Rape wants to see the measure expedited into law.

House Bill 1264, sponsored by state Rep. Cherelle Parker, D-Philadelphia, and co-sponsored by Rep. Kate Harper, R-Montgomery County, would allow experts to address questions about victim behavior in sex assault cases, including why a person abused in childhood might wait for decades to report the assaults.

"If victims finally get the courage to come forward and report the abuse, they should not be further victimized by having the very normal behaviors and reactions of a sex assault victim looked upon as abnormal by a court or a jury who simply isn't educated in these things," Parker said on Friday

Read more: Bill would permit experts to testify about sex abuse victim behavior - Pittsburgh Tribune-Review http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/news/regional/s_770237.html#ixzz1fWB9mDzl

 

[Dr.Fessel]

I agree. Hopefully House Bill 1264 will be passed before the trial starts.

Did anyone read anything about what gifts Sandusky and Sarge gave the boys at that dinner? I wonder what Sandusky used to try to bribe the victims to come to their house for dinner. I hope it was something tangible since that one victim did not wear a wire. Was it stated anywhere if the other victim that went to dinner agreed to wear a wire?

List of PA representatives to contact about supporting House Bill 1264:
http://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs...ator/index.cfm?CFID=92294808&CFTOKEN=19815659
http://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs/legis/home/member_information/representatives_alpha.cfm

I am not sure they will be able to use that law retroactive if it is passed before the trial. Wish they would have addressed that in the article.

 

[Pensfan]

Through the centuries people have instinctively known that "nice" adults in authority are often just waiting to pounce on innocent children.

Read Jane Eyre or David Copperfield for examples.

Older stories include the "Big Bad Wolf" from Little Red Riding Hood, and the Pied Piper of Hamelin who led the children away from the village with his bright clothing and merry whistle but then closed them up in a mountain away from their parents.

Modern day cautionary tales include the Child Catcher from Chitty-Chitty Bang Bang and Dolores Umbridge (with her little-girl voice and love of cats) & Gilderoy Lockhart (handsome teacher heart-throb who leaves children to die in the Chamber of Secrets) in the Harry Potter Books.

And yet it's always a shock when these happen, and people always talk about what a nice, kind, honorable person this was. Like Norman Bates in Psycho, he wouldn't hurt a fly. :furious:

Yeah, but IMO most adults assumed that the above characters were psychopaths who would use children to meet their sadist desires rather than pedophiles who want to use them for sex.

 

[Pensfan]

I am not sure they will be able to use that law retroactive if it is passed before the trial. Wish they would have addressed that in the article.

When the New Law Disadvantages the Defendant

To determine whether the new law may disadvantage the defendant, one must first determine whether the legislature intended the law to further punitive goals or to deter future offenses. If the legislative intent is not punitive, the defendant must show that the law is punitive in nature.

If the law creates a new crime or broadens the definition of an existing one, the law is punitive. Furthermore, if a new law creates an enhanced penalty for an existing offense, the new law may not be retroactively applied to the defendant. If a new law creates a mandatory minimum sentence, that law may not be applied to the defendant.
http://www.brunnabend.com/Publications/CriminalLawNewsletter.aspx?NewsItemid=3

The legislation (House Bill 1264) does not enhance a penalty or create a mandatory minimum sentence. IMO, it is stretching to consider it punitive towards Sandusky, but I don't know. What do you think?

 

[Salem]

Yeah, but IMO most adults assumed that the above characters were psychopaths who would use children to meet their sadist desires rather than pedophiles who want to use them for sex.

Is there a difference?

Salem

 

[ynotdivein]

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2011/12/03/sports/ncaafootball/20111202-sandusky-audio.html?ref=ncaafootball

Fifth link, subtitle "Sandusky's Extended Family"

(at 3:10 on that link)

Interviewer: And how did you meet them?

JS: OK I'd have to tell you my role at at the camp. Pretty much I had budgeted late afternoon to evening that I would spend time.... So I'd go, lotta times I went swimming with them, horsed around threw 'em, they loved getting thrown... and I would throw them... um...

 

[Concerned Papa]

Interesting points, Benny. And by the way, :welcome: to WS!

I've been scratching my head over Amendola's approach to this ever since he allowed the Costas interview. The man has a plan, no doubt about that. IMO, it seems to involve:

1 - Get Jerry out there in the media to tell "his story"/counteract the claims in the GJ presentment & do image rehabilitation--look, he's just this big loveable misunderstood lug of a guy (though this may seem insane to those of us who follow these things closely, think about all the potential jurors and just regular citizens who don't, and who are only reading whatever story pops up on the top of MSM websites?); and

2 - Attempt to discredit the victims, by any means necessary.

Jer says they reached out to HIM for all his "hugging":

Wrestling, hugging — “I think a lot of the kids really reached out for that,” he said.

 

[Concerned Papa]

I hope to see these two tangle in their respective narrative of events:

Mr. Sandusky, in the interview, said word of an episode with a young boy in the shower reached Mr. Raykovitz. He said he talked with Mr. Raykovitz, and identified the boy he thought Penn State was concerned about. Mr. Sandusky, though, said Mr. Raykovitz did not see fit to limit his interaction with youths, in part because he was aware of the nature of Mr. Sandusky’s mentoring relationship with the boy, and in part because he knew Mr. Sandusky had undergone repeated background checks clearing him to work with children.

Mr. Raykovitz’s lawyer, Kevin L. Hand, called Mr. Sandusky’s account inaccurate, but refused to say more.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/03/s...ky-tells-his-own-story.html?pagewanted=2&_r=2

No telling what kind of truths would shake out of that tree.

 

[Pensfan]

Is there a difference?

Salem

Answering your rhetorical question.....
Yes, psychopaths and pedos can have overlapping personal characteristics. Both can be conscienceless/amoral sexual offenders.

Psychopaths are versatile, aggressive criminals and rape is only one of the many violent crimes that they may commit. Pedophiles are specialized sexual offenders. Because they must "fly under the radar", they typically avoid participating in other crimes where their "great guy/gal" facade could be removed.

Violent non-psychopaths are motivated by feelings of jealousy, anger, or sexual arousal. Violent psychopaths are motivated by retribution against specific people or retribution against society. They are also motivated by money or power.

Big Bad Wold, Pied Piper, Dolores Umbridge, Gilderoy Lockhart, and The Child Catcher do not have pedo characteristics except that some worked around children and chose children as their victims. Therefore, they fall under the category of conscienceless psychopath.
http://crime.about.com/od/sex/p/pedophile.htm

 

[Pensfan]

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2011/12/03/sports/ncaafootball/20111202-sandusky-audio.html?ref=ncaafootball

Fifth link, subtitle "Sandusky's Extended Family"

(at 3:10 on that link)

Interviewer: And how did you meet them?

JS: OK I'd have to tell you my role at at the camp. Pretty much I had budgeted late afternoon to evening that I would spend time.... So I'd go, lotta times I went swimming with them, horsed around threw 'em, they loved getting thrown... and I would throw them... um...

To throw them, he likely put one hand around their chest and one between their legs/under their bum. I'd bet they didn't like being thrown and little girls weren't thrown as often as boys.

 

[ynotdivein]

To throw them, he likely put one hand around their chest and one between their legs/under their bum. I'd bet they didn't like being thrown and little girls weren't thrown as often as boys.

Pens, I think you're right about how these boys were "thrown" in the pool.

And lets also remember JS talking about Dottie being concerned about having the 'Second Mile boys' in the house after a football game--JS said he went downstairs and 'there's a boy flying over the couch, and then there's the dog flying over the couch'... this from http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/03/sports/ncaafootball/at-center-of-penn-state-scandal-sandusky-tells-his-own-story.html?pagewanted=all

No good way to phrase this--but I don't think Sandusky preyed on little girls at all.

 

[ynotdivein]

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2011/12/03/sports/ncaafootball/20111202-sandusky-audio.html?ref=ncaafootball

Sorry to relentlessly post links to this interview, but I do believe it provides a very important insight not only into the mind of JS, but also into his relationship with his lawyer JA...

Please click on link #12 titled "Bob Costas Interview" starting at 17 seconds:

JS: ... <snipped> If say no, I'm not attracted to boys, that's not the truth, because I'm attracted to young people, boys, girls [Amendola shouts from somewhere else in the room, "Even not sexually... you're attracted because you enjoy spending time with them..."] JS then amends to say, "I enjoy, that's what I was tryin' to say, I [Amendola: "Answer that"] enjoy spending time with young people, I enjoy spending time with people. My two favorite groups are the elderly and the young. The young because they don't think about what they say, and the old because they don't care.... I love being around both groups, both those groups of people, and neither one of the are going anywhere, they're not caught up like all of us in trying to make a living and trying to impress people... they are who they are, and that's why I love... those groups."

 

[ynotdivein]

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...20111202-sandusky-audio.html?ref=ncaafootball

At beginning of "Bob Costas interview" segment:

JS: Wow, I would have said things differently

[Amendola: Well you have the chance now... to say things differently... this is your open mike!]

You know I don't know how different I would have said things you know when they said... when they said, um i don't know how exactly they said it, are you attracted to boys, i was sitting there saying what in the world is this question, what is it what, um if I say no, I'm not attracted to boys that's not the truth...

 

[Pensfan]

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2011/12/03/sports/ncaafootball/20111202-sandusky-audio.html?ref=ncaafootball

Sorry to relentlessly post links to this interview, but I do believe it provides a very important insight not only into the mind of JS, but also into his relationship with his lawyer JA...

Please click on link #12 titled "Bob Costas Interview" starting at 17 seconds:

JS: ... <snipped> If say no, I'm not attracted to boys, that's not the truth, because I'm attracted to young people, boys, girls [Amendola shouts from somewhere else in the room, "Even not sexually... you're attracted because you enjoy spending time with them..."] JS then amends to say, "I enjoy, that's what I was tryin' to say, I [Amendola: "Answer that"] enjoy spending time with young people, I enjoy spending time with people. My two favorite groups are the elderly and the young. The young because they don't think about what they say, and the old because they don't care.... I love being around both groups, both those groups of people, and neither one of the are going anywhere, they're not caught up like all of us in trying to make a living and trying to impress people... they are who they are, and that's why I love... those groups."

bbm

The pedophile needs the feeling of power and elderly people are vulnerable and easy to control just like little children.