GUILTY PLEA DEAL ACCEPTED - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #111

[TristanP]

If he tries to get make a case for being imprisoned in PA so he can see his family, the families will raise you know what. "Why should he be given special placement so he can get to see his family when they will never get to see their families again." That will be the argument against him going there. However, He could be sent to that Super Max prison in Colorado that all of the infamous killers are sent to. Being sent there would be additional punishment on top of life in prison.

However, as the judge made very clear yesterday, nothing the families or the public has to say will influence decision making by the court, which carries over to the correctional system as well.

With the availability of video visits, in-person visits are not as big of deal these days anyway.

 

[Jw192]

Steve wanted the ultimate punishment for his daughter’s murderer, anything less is failure to him. His state has that option. There are individuals on death row for crimes against one person, much less four. He did not want this to be a decision made by a prosecutor and a defense attorney. He wanted that trial with all of the facts exposed, he needs people to hear exactly what his daughter suffered at the hands of Bryan Kohberger. He doesn’t understand how he is expected to quietly accept a plea because it is a sure thing and it is better for others involved. Kaylee was his kid, and he will fight for her right to justice because he feels that is his duty. Do I agree with his methods? No, but who am I to judge? Would we be okay with him if it was just his daughter that was the victim, or are we cringing because she was only one of four and the other families are accepting? I will say that the Judge, who is great, seemed more annoyed by Steve’s request that people tie up the phone lines of the court, than the murderer standing before him. I honestly feel like that start to the proceeding was a Kohberger win. The couple of years spent on this trial that never was is far more disruptive than a day of tied up phone lines. And let’s not forget four dead people.

Oh trust me I'm not disputing or demeaning any of that. I cannot imagine the pain and anger he's feeling and all of his feelings about the plea deal are valid and justified. I can understand that his blind rage fueled lashing out is his choice right now, but that doesn't mean I cannot speak up as to how damaging it may be for him personally y'know? Nobody wants to see him get into any trouble but I fear that if he carries on as he is right now, that may happen. I don't believe anything would help ease his suffering. Say trial went ahead with BK maintaining his not guilty plea, the prosecutions evidence would be laid out there (we don't know if they have any more evidence than what's in the PCA) would he be satisfied with that? Say a jury determined he is guilty, would that satisfy him fully? Say the jury sentenced him to death and the lonnnnng drawn out speel began of appeal after appeal, is that satisfactory? Regardless of a trial or this plea, that creep is not going to give the answers that SG has stated he wants. Even if pigs got up and grew wings and he did, would that satisfy SG? I truly feel like there's nothing at all possible that would be "enough" for SG and there isn't nothing that will ease his pain but time. Time where he is still in the horrific ocean of grief, he's just developed the ability to stay afloat better That's not to say that I don't admire his passion for justice for his daughter, I just don't believe that his version of justice exists unless he was put in a room with BK alone with zero legal repercussions.

 

[Dotta]

The premeditation was for the girls on the upper floor. Kaylee and Maddie. He wasn't expecting Xana and Ethan.

Was he expecting Kaylee though?

AFAI remember
she was only visiting.

What a terrible twist of Fate for her
Only visiting for a day or two.

JMO

 

[NottaYutz]

My original assumption was that he went there to....kill MM, and then he found both MM and KG in the same bed, which ruined his plan. So, he stabbed MM which she woke up screaming and KG started fighting him and he killed her. Then, he was going to leave and XK saw him come down the stairs so he had to kill her, too. But if EC was asleep, he didn't have to kill him because he had not seen or heard anything.

This has been my belief all along. MOO: He went there with the intent to slip in, kill MM, and slip out. But Kaylee was sleeping with MM that night, so he was forced to kill both. Then he's seen while trying to slip out, and the rest is history. As for him killing Ethan, that's a mystery if Ethan was passed out, yet Ethan might have made a sound or moved while sleeping, and Kohberger thought Ethan saw him. Or by that time, he was so hopped up he was basically rabid, and the murder and alleged "carving" of Ethan's legs was done out of anger that his initial plan went so totally wrong.

 

[Missyrocks5]

I just watched a video from a true crime vlogger. She has attended numerous trials and is passionate that innocence projects are focused on money, not justice. She was outraged at the outcome in the Diddy trial and, as one of her points, argued how the plea agreement here was The best outcome because of how juries have been wild cards with their verdicts.

She said what I think most people think. The anger felt by the parents who disagree with the plea deal is absolutely understandable; however, considering how off the rails unjust how many verdicts have come down it seems all the more frequently, she said that SG should consider himself lucky that this killer is behind bars. I have listened to her long enough to know where she falls ideologically, and she absolutely falls in with SG ideologically. I think that part of his anger starts with his distrust of the ideology of the prosecutor, and it just gets worse from there. With all the known defense attorney tactics, to start from an assumption that the jury would have come back with a guilty verdict is a mirage.

She has seen way too many juries come back with unjust verdicts and falling for defense arguments all over the place. They've happened in recent cases that have just been all over the news. It's almost like jury nullification. They all believe defense arguments & social media posts of don't trust this corrupted process, you can't trust LE, you can't trust the DNA, you can't trust your own eyeballs, on and on.

She said that BK behind bars without a chance for an appeal is a great thing. We can all understand that the families have gone through horror and will for the rest of their lives. But assuming that the only outcome in this case would've been a guilty verdict and a DP vote is not based on the reality of what we see with juries in these days of social media, documentaries about supposed innocence projects, etc. It seeps into juries.

 

[Tillyjames]

I guess, in a way, this is really BK's ultimate power move. He "stole" the victims families their opportunity to have the highest punishment inflicted on him. No wonder Steve Goncalves is angry and frustrated. He wanted BK to have the "Death Penalty". And BK outmaneuvered him.

Not sure about Xana’s family but we know at least 2 of the 4 families are happy with this outcome. I get both sides.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

This has been my belief all along. MOO: He went there with the intent to slip in, kill MM, and slip out. But Kaylee was sleeping with MM that night, so he was forced to kill both. Then he's seen while trying to slip out, and the rest is history. As for him killing Ethan, that's a mystery if Ethan was passed out, yet Ethan might have made a sound or moved while sleeping, and Kohberger thought Ethan saw him. Or by that time, he was so hopped up he was basically rabid, and the murder and alleged "carving" of Ethan's legs was done out of anger that his initial plan went so totally wrong.

I think it's even possible he wasn't even going to kill anyone at all. So much as 'hot stalk' and maybe hold hostage MM or abduct her at knife point. Well imagine leaving home with a deviant stalking or rape / sexual violation plan and it turns into wholesale slaughter of multiple people. DD driver and DM very lucky to remain alive.

I suppose if he could tell the truth he might want to say actually I never was going to kill everyone.
Wouldn't it be marvellous if criminals could tell the truth about their thoughts, feelings, motivations, actions, for the sake of accountability and to help society as a whole? Instead we have to guess and speculate what the heck happened.

JMO MOO

 

[snooptroop88]

This guy, SG, and his wife, worked their a--es off for a very long time so they could have upward mobility and raise their children. They loved their children. They still love their children. They paid a hefty penny to send one of those children through college at University of Idaho, and she loved it.

But one of their children isn't with them any longer. Because BK decided at some point, you know, her time was up. For whatever reason, BK felt the need to "get rid of" Kaylee. and her friends.

What this man SG, her father, and his wife are going through... is unimaginable. It is a living nightmare. And one I hope nobody else has to deal with, but let me tell you, looking at Websleuths daily, with the number of missing people swallowed into a hole-- aside from the murdered-- I know better.

Have you read Watership Down by Richard Adams? It is about a civilization of rabbits, and at one point, the rabbits are dealing with a warren that has snares set. Nobody knows who set them, and nobody cares. They're being fed well. They just know certain victims (unidentified, luck of the draw), won't be with them any longer because-- there are these snares. And they accept that. It's just part of the daily routine. This "warren of the snares" is recognized to be western culture.

That's not "freedom." That makes us all slaves to a bunch of perverts, freaks, and murderers.

I'm sorry, I can see where SG is coming from on this. Because there is not perfect justice in this system of supposed justice, and perhaps in any nation's sytem. But the system should strive towards actual justice.

 

[bestill]

OF course, SG feels railroaded. The judge was far more concerned with his office receiving phone calls than he was with four victims who were killed in their home. Imagine how the judge woud feel If his loved one was killed while she slept. The judge was rather irate over receiving phone calls, which are completely harmless. The whole process is a sham, and sadly, SG is recognizing this in realtime. Only criminals have rights. I am sorry for the loss of his daughter as well as the other three victims.

Now that I think about it, the Judge set a tone yesterday when he opened the hearing. Had he used that opportunity to reach out to the G's and their supporters vs chastise the callers it could have eased the plea deal a bit. Maybe he should have started out saying he appreciated the passion and concern from the public and families of the victims who may or may not agree with the plea deal and not complained about the many calls. They happened for a couple of days and I highly doubt they will be getting many more calls about this other than from the media.

JMO

 

[Boodles]

I think it's even possible he wasn't even going to kill anyone at all. So much as 'hot stalk' and maybe hold hostage MM or abduct her at knife point. Well imagine leaving home with a deviant stalking or rape / sexual violation plan and it turns into wholesale slaughter of multiple people. DD driver and DM very lucky to remain alive.

I suppose if he could tell the truth he might want to say actually I never was going to kill everyone.
Wouldn't it be marvellous if criminals could tell the truth about their thoughts, feelings, motivations, actions, for the sake of accountability and to help society as a whole? Instead we have to guess and speculate what the heck happened.

JMO MOO

Hopefully, some time after sentencing, he’ll sit down with some true crime writer and divulge. Of course, it would be his self-serving version of events so would have to be taken with a pound of salt.

 

[Boodles]

Now I’m quite curious about this “container” that DM saw him carrying. Was he wearing a hazmat suit and stripped out of it after killing Ethan and wrapped it up with the knife into a wad of some sort? Is that why he didn’t kill DM, because he was no longer wearing “protective gear”?

Has this already been discussed here?

 

[NanZDrew]

The Door Dash delivery has always perplexed me. I remember a picture on the counter with Xana's name on it, so it would seem she got it before the attacks. Was BK in the house already and ending with Maddie and Kaylie, and heading down the stairs when the DD delivery occurred and the driver saw him then? He was wearing black so black wouldn't be too obvious. This part has always been hard to understand. Just a tight timeline.

 

[CLGM]

A couple of things:

I wonder if SG felt like only when BK was dead (via death penalty) would he feel relief from the pain of losing his daughter, that her death had been avenged. And knowing there would be a future date certain helped him to get through the present. And so when the DP was taken off the table, he lost the only way ( in his mind) that he could ever feel some release from the grief .

BK bought the knife early in 2022 before he moved - do you think he was already considering murder in some form at that point? I wonder if his family knew about the knife? Did he say it was for safety or that he was going to be doing lots of outdoors stuff, hunting/ fishing, etc?

If things had gone as he planned, what would it have looked like? Would he have only killed MM? Was that going to be his serial killer persona in his mind? Sneaking into inhabited houses in densely populated neighborhoods in college towns and murdering a single person? Was the sheath going to be his calling card, if he left it on purpose? (Are there other serial killers who would leave something behind?

 

[Magic8Ball]

OF course, SG feels railroaded. The judge was far more concerned with his office receiving phone calls than he was with four victims who were killed in their home. Imagine how the judge woud feel If his loved one was killed while she slept. The judge was rather irate over receiving phone calls, which are completely harmless. The whole process is a sham, and sadly, SG is recognizing this in realtime. Only criminals have rights. I am sorry for the loss of his daughter as well as the other three victims.

The phone calls were not completely harmless.

There's a word for that kind of behavior: Harassment.
SG has expressed his (misdirected) hostility toward the prosecution and LE repeatedly.

Judge Hippler was entirely correct to draw a line and say he would allow no such behavior.
The calls were an attempt to influence the justice system through mob-like intimidation.
We've seen that type of behavior being displayed in other cases recently as well.

SG is the one feeding the animals in the media zoo, who are feasting on his rage with carnivorous glee. And the $uper Chat$, like$ and view$ keep pouring into their gaping mouths.

I admire Judge Hippler so much for keeping Lady Justice safe from the mob.
Thank you, Judge Hippler!

JMO.

 

[Miss Poovy]

Have been trying and trying to locate the post where someone mentioned the prison BK would maybe go to, and I'm having a terrible time finding it. Okay, here we go @SteveP :

I would think so as well, that this seems like where he'd end up. This is where men's Idaho Death Row is, right? (But not every inmate is on Death Row there) BK really ought to be on Death Row, so this facility seems like it would probably be the place. Does anyone else think BK's a high escape risk? I do. (But not at this facility.)

One hour of exercise a day, per some sources. Looking at a video of the place now, like a tour of cell in solitary. Like something out of Silence of the Lambs. Not quite, but reasonably close.

Most states have an evaluation that determines your classification for prison assignment. Sometimes when a prisoner enters the prison system, the prisoners may detained in a specific prison until their evaluation is completed. Maybe BK’s evaluation will be completed before his sentencing hearing. Here’s some info from ABA.

https://www.americanbar.org/groups/criminal_justice/resources/standards/treatment-of-prisoners/

Check out the Snake River Correctional Facility on the Oregon/Idaho border.

 

[DizzyB]

Oh trust me I'm not disputing or demeaning any of that. I cannot imagine the pain and anger he's feeling and all of his feelings about the plea deal are valid and justified. I can understand that his blind rage fueled lashing out is his choice right now, but that doesn't mean I cannot speak up as to how damaging it may be for him personally y'know? Nobody wants to see him get into any trouble but I fear that if he carries on as he is right now, that may happen. I don't believe anything would help ease his suffering. Say trial went ahead with BK maintaining his not guilty plea, the prosecutions evidence would be laid out there (we don't know if they have any more evidence than what's in the PCA) would he be satisfied with that? Say a jury determined he is guilty, would that satisfy him fully? Say the jury sentenced him to death and the lonnnnng drawn out speel began of appeal after appeal, is that satisfactory? Regardless of a trial or this plea, that creep is not going to give the answers that SG has stated he wants. Even if pigs got up and grew wings and he did, would that satisfy SG? I truly feel like there's nothing at all possible that would be "enough" for SG and there isn't nothing that will ease his pain but time. Time where he is still in the horrific ocean of grief, he's just developed the ability to stay afloat better That's not to say that I don't admire his passion for justice for his daughter, I just don't believe that his version of justice exists unless he was put in a room with BK alone with zero legal repercussions.

Steve will never be right again. I hope he finds some peace. I watched yesterday, parents on their best behavior in the courtroom, sitting there listening to the monster who took their children away, like their lives meant nothing. I am afraid I would be more like Steve, shouting nonsense from the rafters. Not because it made sense, but because of how broken I was.

 

[Boxer]

I guess, in a way, this is really BK's ultimate power move. He "stole" the victims families their opportunity to have the highest punishment inflicted on him. No wonder Steve Goncalves is angry and frustrated. He wanted BK to have the "Death Penalty". And BK outmaneuvered him.

Im one way maybe, but this plea deal also prevents continuous BK news/influencer cottage industry theories and actual appeals or parole hearings tangling up the victims and witnesses lives for BKs remaining decades.
LWOP is a slow death sentence as you will die in custody.

To find something like a knife or gun, they would use sonar and drop large magnets off the sides of boats and drag it along the bottom of the area where those two rivers intersect. Of course, there's no telling how far it traveled if the current was swift.

2 years of spring runoff. Something with a bit of a flat fin like shape might be miles down the river.

 

[Chimera]

Sorry for SC, but no matter how I keep looking at it, this was the absolute best outcome for the murderers' punishment.
Too risky to hope that the jury would all do the right thing.

I will withhold judgement on Mr. Goncalves as I have never lost anyone in that manner, and cannot fathom going through such horror.
It beggars belief how much pain he and the rest of the kid's families must be in -- like being thrown into an ocean of pain and just having to 'swim' --and being expected to act civilly.
The only way he might be helped with an intervention is through his family or another parent who has endured similar trauma, as I doubt anyone else could begin to understand, no matter how much they want to help him.
I wish him and all of the families healing.

 

[turaj]

Im one way maybe, but this plea deal also prevents continuous BK news/influencer cottage industry theories and actual appeals or parole hearings tangling up the victims and witnesses lives for BKs remaining decades.
LWOP is a slow death sentence as you will die in custody.

2 years of spring runoff. Something with a bit of a flat fin like shape might be miles down the river.

at first I thought they should confirm the location of the murder weapon as a condition of plea deal but as I think about it what good would that really do? I don't think any more resources should be spent. He confessed and evidence supports the confession 100%.

 

[turaj]

Sorry for SC, but no matter how I keep looking at it, this was the absolute best outcome for the murderers' punishment.
Too risky to hope that the jury would all do the right thing.

I will withhold judgement on Mr. Goncalves as I have never lost anyone in that manner, and cannot fathom going through such horror.
It beggars belief how much pain he and the rest of the kid's families must be in -- like being thrown into an ocean of pain and just having to 'swim' --and being expected to act civilly.
The only way he might be helped with an intervention is through his family or another parent who has endured similar trauma, as I doubt anyone else could begin to understand, no matter how much they want to help him.
I wish him and all of the families healing.

I think some of the other family members of the murdered students probably have tried to talk to him. Clearly MM's family attorney yesterday was doing that in some of his comments.