POI: Michael Pak

[Redbird]

Is there more than one way out of Oak Beach?

Maybe a local could answer that question for us. I could swear we have discussed this before and we were told there is another exit.

 

[mcme]

The only way to leave the OIBA with a car is through the gate.

 

[Peter Brendt]

I have never heard that SG was running around OB 25 minutes after her call. The last I heard was her mother's account saying the 911 call recorded her screaming "Mike" while being pulled into a truck. This was a comment her mother made on her FB page. We only have MP's word that he did not know OB. I don't believe anything this convicted sex trafficker says. You are ASSUMING his accounts are true. We do not know exactly when GC was at the gate, so how can you say for sure he could not have missed MP leaving. Also I believe there is another way out.

So MG and JR, who read the same transcript on the same day at the same time in the same room, obviously disagree about that point. It wasn'T in 487 Hours ...
Aside of that, we know, what MG said, can't be true. Because first GC saw SG and even later BB saw her. And the question of the footprints in the sand, well, it could indicate, where she was in between. I haven't the exact times at hand, maybe Foreigner with her timelines has the exact times. But the time, SG had to be around in OB would be

Time(BB)-Time(911CallEnded)

the time she was under way, after she left GC would be

Time(BB)-Time(GC)

and her head start on MP would be the time, MP and GC talked. Which could have been only a few minutes. Maybe two, maybe three? Lets call that Time(Talk).

We know,

Time(Abduction)>Time(BB)

and we also know, MP wasn't seen leaving (we had this discussion some months ago and yes, there is another way to leave on foot, but not with a car)

This means

Time(MPLeaving)<Time(CollettiAtTheGate)

So MP's actual time window to find and abduct her would be

Time(BB)-Time(MPLeaving)

So how long would Coletti need to reach the gate? Old man and all? Because if Time(BB)>=Time(CollettiAtTheGate), MP had effectively no time window. We can calculate that. There is, with mathematical precision and certainty, no way, MP could have snatched her in OB.

The other point is, if Time(MPLEaving)<Time(ColettiAtTheGate). In this case Coletti would have missed MP leaving. But since Time(BB)>Time(ColettiAtTheGate), this would be also mathematical precise prove, MP left without SG.

And to make everyone happy: This is based on the assumption, that the space-time continuum is stable for speed under 10% light speed and the assumption, that the physical law that one body can't be in two different locations at the same time is true. Since both of those physical laws IMO are a given, I think, I can rely on them. String theory anyone?

 

[To Kill a Mockingbird]

But then, she was 23 minutes on the phone, 23 minutes in which nobody tried to kill her.

you don't know that...you've never heard the call


And after that, she was running around in Oak Beach for at least another 25 minutes (till the BB sighting).

you don't know that....please support your statement with evidence of BB's phone call so we know exactly what time the call was made.


And MP would have needed much more than headlights (which wouldn't be that "additional" helpful anyway, the sun was already up).

that's very conflicting...dormer said in interviews shannan was running towards a streetlamp because it was dark out.....

you don't know WHAT MP would have needed to find shannan. you don't know unless you were there.

MP didn't know the area in the first place,

How do you know what MP knew and didn't know....you don't know this at all, unless you know MP and have questioned him. you DON'T know this.

so he didn't know whereto Anchor Way leads (for example).

how do you know what pak knows? have you met him? how do you know what he knows????? you don't - you're putting words in his mouth and that's that.


SG's way was not a straight line given the time between the moment, she met GC and the moment, she was seen by BB.
How do you know what route she really took? were you there?
you DON'T KNOW what route she really took - if you do
please make it minute by minute and step by step with evidence.


So that leaves theoretically only the time after BB saw her.

It doesn't theoretically mean ANYTHING.


But at that time, Coletti was already at the gate

correction - Coletti SAYS he was at the gate - but you don't know where he really was

and he didn't see MP leave.

he has SAID he didn't see MP leave.... but you don't know what he really saw.


Means, you have to construct temporary blindness to explain why someone would have missed a freaking big black SUV driving out of OB while staying at exact that very gate to let the police in.

he SAID he was at the gate for 45 minutes and its been printed repeatedly. It doesn't mean he WAS at the GATE. There is NO EVIDENCE he was at the gate.
You can NOT state for fact what YOU want in this case.
That is what is going to be revealed in court.
You can ONLY STATE THE FACTS.
And you DON"T HAVE THE FACTS RIGHT NOW.
YOU REALLY DON'T.

this case WILL NOT BE DISMISSED -
it will go forward and a lot of secrets and untruths are going to be revealed.

 

[Mountain_Kat]

What is the latest on the drifter staying at JB's house.I am new on here so hopefully this is the proper way to post a question.

:welcome:

The drifter...maybe he exists, maybe he doesn't. Maybe he wrote a book...maybe some whacko wrote a book pretending to be him.

Your guess is as good as mine.

 

[Peter Brendt]

he SAID he was at the gate for 45 minutes and its been printed repeatedly. It doesn't mean he WAS at the GATE. There is NO EVIDENCE he was at the gate.
You can NOT state for fact what YOU want in this case.
That is what is going to be revealed in court.
You can ONLY STATE THE FACTS.
And you DON"T HAVE THE FACTS RIGHT NOW.
YOU REALLY DON'T.

this case WILL NOT BE DISMISSED -
it will go forward and a lot of secrets and untruths are going to be revealed.

Well, of course. Then John Ray lied when he told about the trascript of the phone call in 48 Hours. Do you suggest, JR lied there? And GC lied too, of course. And the officer, who arrived and was actually let in by GC ... he lied too. And the 911 dispatchers lie, who took the call and claimed it was 23 minutes. But if only one of those people doesn't lie, if only one isn't part of the big bad conspiracy, then GC was at that gate.

You know what, I just realized, most people must think, Australia doesn't exist. Because they were never there and all people who claim to have been in Australia are probably lying ... I mean, how do you know, Australia exists?

Well, and when it comes to this case, I wish, it wouldn't be dismissed, that would allow for some questioning of a lot of people.. But as far as it is, no witnesses, no evidence, just another publicity stunt.

 

[To Kill a Mockingbird]

Well, of course. Then John Ray lied when he told about the trascript of the phone call in 48 Hours. Do you suggest, JR lied there? And GC lied too, of course. And the officer, who arrived and was actually let in by GC ... he lied too. And the 911 dispatchers lie, who took the call and claimed it was 23 minutes. But if only one of those people doesn't lie, if only one isn't part of the big bad conspiracy, then GC was at that gate.

You know what, I just realized, most people must think, Australia doesn't exist. Because they were never there and all people who claim to have been in Australia are probably lying ... I mean, how do you know, Australia exists?

Well, and when it comes to this case, I wish, it wouldn't be dismissed, that would allow for some questioning of a lot of people.. But as far as it is, no witnesses, no evidence, just another publicity stunt.

please support evidence for what you've said.

you were speaking in FIRST PERSON affirmative for what Pak knows
and exactly where Shannan ran; if you can NOT support your statements with evidence backing up (even limited to the pathetic msm) then you can't STATE it as FACT.

 

[To Kill a Mockingbird]

There is direct evidence and there is circumstantial evidence.

Get your "facts" straight PB, you keep purporting information and stating it with
authority as if your say is the FINAL say.

The FINAL say in this case will be Judge Dan Martin's decision; NOT PETER BRENDT's.

 

[Peter Brendt]

There is direct evidence and there is circumstantial evidence.

Get your "facts" straight PB, you keep purporting information and stating it with
authority as if your say is the FINAL say.

The FINAL say in this case will be Judge Dan Martin's decision; NOT PETER BRENDT's.

Okay, I used "we know". I respectfully replace that with "I know" under the assumption the laws of physics are still intact. Obviously, you deny to know. So the term "we" was wrongfully used.
Of course, you can claim, GC lied when he said, he went to the gate. You are also free to assume, that by a twist of the very fabric of time and space, he needed more than 30 minutes to the gate ... but in the realm of normality, that isn't likely. We ... apologies, I know also, SUVs are big. They can'T just sneak out under a closed gate. So everybody who wants out with an SUV has to open the gate which, additionally to the size of that vehicle (a vehicle Coletti had seen only a short time before in front of his home, so a vehicle he was aware of the driver's involvement), would have been noticed by him. So the only possible explanation (aside of light-rerouting power fields, 5th dimension wormholes and the always popular "beam me up") is, that MP left before GC was at the gate.
So, IMO and assuming, that MP has no worm hole generator installed in his SUV (and you're right, I don't know that), I actually know, MP left before GC was at the gate. Because there is simply no other possibility. So, mathematics may words it to much as a final certainty, but a mathematical 1 is a 1 is a 1, not a 2, not a 0.99 or something. 1, in this case the numbers of options, is a 1. Nothing else. And you can try to ask me now, whether I can supply a link proving 1 is 1 and probably, I won't find one on MSM. So what? Feel free to spread the theory, MP had any physical means to pass that gate unseen after GC arrived there.

 

[Tugela]

I have never heard that SG was running around OB 25 minutes after her call. The last I heard was her mother's account saying the 911 call recorded her screaming "Mike" while being pulled into a truck. This was a comment her mother made on her FB page. We only have MP's word that he did not know OB. I don't believe anything this convicted sex trafficker says. You are ASSUMING his accounts are true. We do not know exactly when GC was at the gate, so how can you say for sure he could not have missed MP leaving. Also I believe there is another way out.

If that were true, MP would be a POI, and he isn't.

She was inside JBs house during the call, so, unless he has a truck in his living room, probably not.

 

[LINative13]

Tugela,
Why dont you tell us what happened? With the whole thing. Soup to nuts. What happened?
Nat

 

[deedee21]

If that were true, MP would be a POI, and he isn't.

She was inside JBs house during the call, so, unless he has a truck in his living room, probably not.

I THINK JR said SG was still on the phone when she left JB house. If she was then she hung up before she reached GC house. So if her mother heard her daughter say Mike it was before she was banging on his door. Not after. There was no calls after that.

 

[Redbird]

We don't really know when she actually hung up the phone. Our witnesses are JB, MP, and GC. Anything JB or MP reported is extremely self-serving and not to be trusted. GC has told several different versions of his story, including (on Nancy Grace) that he never let her in. I think he never let her in and that's why she didn't stay there. LE may know the exact length of her call in relation to her location but they are not revealing all they know. If you have any links that disprove my comment, I would love to see them. I am not meaning to be snarky.

 

[ps149]

Not with a car

100% you are correct that there is no way out with a car but MP drove a truck and everyone knows that there is another way in and out of the Oak Beach Association community at the end of Hawser Drive using a truck that has 4 wheel drive.

I attached two maps for all to see.

Hawser Drive becomes a dirt road that leads to the exit ramp for the Robert Moses Bridge.

 

[deedee21]

On 48 hours aired last june, EM said SG fleeing and still on the phone. Then JR said she could be heard breathing heavy for the next 5 to 6 minutes. Then he made reference to her arriving at GC house. If she was still on the phone at that point, anything said would be on the 911 tape. All that remains to be seen.

 

[mcme]

100% you are correct that there is no way out with a car but MP drove a truck and everyone knows that there is another way in and out of the Oak Beach Association community at the end of Hawser Drive using a truck that has 4 wheel drive.

I attached two maps for all to see.

Hawser Drive becomes a dirt road that leads to the exit ramp for the Robert Moses Bridge.

I'm going to say that what you are suggesting is impossible. The poles in the ground at the end of Hawser would keep any full size vehicle from passing. If somehow you could, you'd need a highly modified 4x4 to navigate the brush between there and the area under the bridge. Thanks for spilling the beans about one of the best lovers lanes left on the island though.

 

[Peter Brendt]

I THINK JR said SG was still on the phone when she left JB house. If she was then she hung up before she reached GC house. So if her mother heard her daughter say Mike it was before she was banging on his door. Not after. There was no calls after that.

JR said in 48 Hours something like then you can hear her breath when she ran out. So ... not even all the way to GC and nothing (according to GC) that indicates an attack. And honestly, if anything actually sounding like an attack would be on that tape, the dispatcher probably would have changed his mind about SG being incoherent and mentioned a possible attack to the officer en route.

 

[Peter Brendt]

100% you are correct that there is no way out with a car but MP drove a truck and everyone knows that there is another way in and out of the Oak Beach Association community at the end of Hawser Drive using a truck that has 4 wheel drive.

I attached two maps for all to see.

Hawser Drive becomes a dirt road that leads to the exit ramp for the Robert Moses Bridge.

What car exactly did MP drive that night. All I hear is black SUV. Well, with a Jeep, a Hummer or a Landcruiser no problem, one only has to be very familiar with the area to find that way. But most of what is called nowadays SUV would stuck at the sink near Hawser out in the marsh area before the even could turn right. And if, if, if, they make it that far, they have the soft beach to dig themselves in before they reach the way up to the ramp. So, it can be done. By someone who knows his car, knows how to drive it off-road, knows the area very well to guess there is that way in the first place. Does that describe MP? I think, not. That guy had SG asking JB for the way. And yeah, now someone will say, he lied. But if he lied there, it would mean, he planned on killing her already at that time or he would have had no reason. But then, all what happens later contradicts that intention.

 

[WINDSOR]

Okay now this is getting interesting.

ps149 aludes to a second exit out of Oak Beach that MP could have taken.

Peter Brendt does not believe that MP had enough time to leave Oak Beach through the gated entrance without GC seeing him.

Peter has done some mathematical type equations to show that it was, from Peter's point of view impossible for GC to not have seen MP leave Oak Beach. I have shown calculations proving that it was possible for MP to leave the gate exit prior to GC being their, and /or how GC could have been unaware of MP's leaving.

The key points in my calculations are the time of BB's 911 call, and the actual time GC arrived at the gate.

Let me recommend a documentary on National Geographic Channel. This is a link to it, on You Tube. http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xq...isode-1-pay-attention_shortfilms#.USgVIR1f0bE

It will change you mind about what you and others believe they saw.

The point I am trying to make, is something most detectives already know, eyewitnesses provide the worst evidence.

GC is absolutely certain he did not see MP's vehicle leave Oak Beach. This is probably a true statement because.......

MP left before GC arrived at the gate,

GC was distracted, occupied with or focused on some other issue (the tapes, his cell phone, his baldder) when MP left.

MP left by another exit.

Watch the You Tube show first, before you say it was impossible for anybody to not see MP's vehicle leaving.

MOO

 

[Vivalor]

It's hard to post and quote with an iPad ugh still need my computer. There is this article here that states MP went to GA. Interesting enough it mentions the drifter too! There ya go if true you have the link of why SG was brought to that party. I can see now why SG was afraid of MP, perhaps she figured something out during the party? This needs more figuring out of course. IMO
http://bayridgejournal.blogspot.com/2011/01/body-dump-at-gilgo-beach.html

Also I have read it before he was in GA

Grr iPads I even hit the wrong link at times trying to get to a thread it will bring me to a persons page.

I have always felt that she figured something out well at the party. Something that maybe JB didn't even know about and scared the crap out of her. That is why she didn't want to leave his house. I've been trying to find more out about it and what maybe it could have been. I think it is no surprise that she was scared for her life and then the other bodys were found. How ever it might have been something very unrelated but something that she was not to find out and feared for her life.