POLL ADDED Connect The Dots-Working theories thread #2

[cluciano63]

I have to say, before I bow out of here for a bit, I'm amazed at the willingness to believe in all sorts of bizarre scenarios in this case, child-selling, groups of people "stashing" a child, underworld connections, tunnels, etc. Most kids are killed by a parent. Usually a complex reason does not exist. I don't know if Terri killed Kyron, or if the (statistically possible but unlikely) stranger did, but I do think this case will turn out to be far less complicated than it has been made out to be. Terri may have severe mental issues that led her to dream up a way to kill Kyron and blame the school, who knows. But the idea of a number of people being invovled in a felonious caper makes zero sense to me. I have a feeling that many of the "clues" will turn out to mean very little.
That is, if we ever know what happened. I'm not at all sure we will.

 

[Morag]

In an effort to stay objective, I decided to look at this from the perspective that Terri is guilty, and using information we know, or we can infer from published news reports, attempt to analyze it.

My approach was based on three key pieces of information --

1. Terri being near the second FM around 10:00 a.m., which is supported by Andrea, and the leaked news report that begins her unverifiable time at 10:10 a.m.

2. The leaked reports of her cell phone pinging near Suavie Island. As a data point, I picked an area (a nature trail) close to the water on the Portland side of Suavie Island, although there are many choices.

3. Terri arriving at the gym at or around the time inferred in her e-mail and leaked in a news report, which was roughly 11:39 a.m.

As I was analyzing this information, I added in addresses on NW Germantown Rd (where Dede was working that morning) and the driving time alone, from where we know Terri was, to my fixed data point on Suavie Island, back to NW Germantown Road, and then to Terri's gym, was longer than the time Terri's time is unverifiable.

On the Google map, A = the second FM, where Andrea saw and spoke to Terri, B = a randomly selected address on the Portland side of Suavie Island, and C = Terri's gym.

Driving time alone between these three points is 1 hour and 8 minutes. This doesn't take into account the time it would take to kill Kyron, dump his body, get in and out of a vehicle, park, etc.

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&sou...22.810755&sspn=0.035393,0.090895&ie=UTF8&z=14

Thanks for doing this. Can this be added to the Map thread?

 

[Jo in Calif]

Interesting digger.... I believe he's still alive...The LE are now up to three people involved in this... It doesn't take 3 people to murder a child... I think the elephant in the room needs to be unveiled...and soon....MOO....

Where are you getting that LE are up to 3 people being involved in this?

 

[cypress]

Where are you getting that LE are up to 3 people being involved in this?

Terri
Dede
unknown person in/around truck

Also, if you subscribe to the Dede is involved/Kyron is stashed theory, it requires the involvement of three people -- Terri as orchestrator, Dede as helper, unknown person as the one who is holding Kyron against his will.

 

[Jo in Calif]

Terri
Dede
unknown person in/around truck

Also, if you subscribe to the Dede is involved/Kyron is stashed theory, it requires the involvement of three people -- Terri as orchestrator, Dede as helper, unknown person as the one who is holding Kyron against his will.

I never heard LE say there is another person holding Kyron. This was my original question. When did LE ever say there were 3 people involved?

 

[grandmaj]

I'm seeing baiting here..... baiting = hinting to something but not coming out and saying it. :nono:

This post lands at random but I'm seeing several posts.

 

[cypress]

I never heard LE say there is another person holding Kyron. This was my original question. When did LE ever say there were 3 people involved?

The going theory, per Kaine and Desiree, is that Terri stashed Kyron and had help. I don't personally agree with them, but a lot of people do, so that's why I said "if you subscribe to the theory..." in an earlier post; however, even if you don't subscribe to a particular theory, in terms of suspects you're left with:

Terri, obviously
Dede is on the second questionnaire, why?
unknown person in/around the truck, that LE has indicated wasn't Dede

That's how I'm coming to the conclusion LE is looking for a third person, with Terri and Dede being the first two.

 

[Chili Fries]

In an effort to stay objective, I decided to look at this from the perspective that Terri is guilty, and using information we know, or we can infer from published news reports, attempt to analyze it.

My approach was based on three key pieces of information --

1. Terri being near the second FM around 10:00 a.m., which is supported by Andrea, and the leaked news report that begins her unverifiable time at 10:10 a.m.

2. The leaked reports of her cell phone pinging near Suavie Island. As a data point, I picked an area (a nature trail) close to the water on the Portland side of Suavie Island, although there are many choices.

3. Terri arriving at the gym at or around the time inferred in her e-mail and leaked in a news report, which was roughly 11:39 a.m.

As I was analyzing this information, I added in addresses on NW Germantown Rd (where Dede was working that morning) and the driving time alone, from where we know Terri was, to my fixed data point on Suavie Island, back to NW Germantown Road, and then to Terri's gym, was longer than the time Terri's time is unverifiable.

On the Google map, A = the second FM, where Andrea saw and spoke to Terri, B = a randomly selected address on the Portland side of Suavie Island, and C = Terri's gym.

Driving time alone between these three points is 1 hour and 8 minutes. This doesn't take into account the time it would take to kill Kyron, dump his body, get in and out of a vehicle, park, etc.

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&sou...22.810755&sspn=0.035393,0.090895&ie=UTF8&z=14

Andrea said she saw Terri sometime between 9:30 and 10:00. It sounds to me like it was before 10:00 because Andrea said she was on her way to Borders before 10:00.

http://s296.photobucket.com/albums/mm166/crankycrankerson/Kyron%20Horman%20%20-OR-/?action=view&current=92B1F461_Mediacenter-KOINLocal6.mp4

If Terri was out of Fred Meyer at 9:40 that gives her 2 hours to get to Sauvie Island and back, and she might not have had to go all the way on the island because she could have accessed the water from the Hwy 30 side of the mainland (remember in her e-mail she says LE accused her of being out on Hwy 30). If she did do it and it was a plan executed with one or two other people then she probably wouldn't have needed much extra time during her unaccounted for period.

I wonder if Terri forgot something she needed for her plan, something that DeDe had at her work. Maybe plastic wrap or twine or something she was afraid to buy at the supermarket because it would look suspicious.

I missed it the first time but I did notice in that interview Andrea said she knew baby K was sick the day before. Makes me think Terri took her to the gym the day before, that sickness wouldn't deter Terri from taking her there. Terri was probably that fanatical about working out.

 

[Billylee]

The largest number of missing children are, from most frequent to least frequent:

1. Runaways
2. Family abductions
3. Lost, injured or otherwise missing children
4. Nonfamily abductions (in these cases, the child is at greatest risk of injury or death).

http://www.missingkids.com/missingkids/servlet/PageServlet?LanguageCountry=en_US&PageId=2816#6

My newest theory based on the above statistics and the fact that KH & DY seem to think TH may have Kyron hidden somewhere, and the fact that they both seem to believe TH would not harm him is that this is a botched parental abduction. (And really, because I want to find a scenario that makes sense and keeps Kyron alive!)

Parental abduction.

Could it be that Terri planned this from the beginning because she wanted to get a divorce (for whatever reason, doesn't really matter) from Kaine and that Kaine would of course, as bio Dad, be awarded custody of Kyron and she would no longer have Kyron whom she raised since he was two? I brought a similar theory up before, but want to add a bit.

Terri sends J to live with relatives, where's he safe but away from KH. Tells her friends KH kicked him out to garner sympathy for her planned abduction. Probably tells them a lot of other carp too. Terri has help (a male) get Kyron out of the school. Terri hides Kyron with friends/relatives/whomever, someone she trusts. Everyone still looking for Kyron, everyone worried about Kyron, except Terri's getting her hair done, why, because she knows where Kyron is. One day Kaine goes to work out at the gym, leaves baby K with day care. Terri picks up baby K. She goes and gets J, goes and gets Kyron and it's adios..... off to Mexico or wherever, along with her male accomplice.


That was TH's plan, but it didn't work, because when she thought everyone would be looking FOR Kyron, they were actually looking AT her. She never, ever expected this and now she's in a heap of trouble.


I don't know but it answers the "stashed" attitude and it would mean Kyron was alive and I kinda like that part!


It would explain a lot of things. It would also explain why DY & KH think that Kyron may be stashed.

 

[MarieFaith]

BillyLee, for Kyron's sake, I hope you're right.

But why after all this time and turmoil, would the people holding Kyron not come forward, saying, "enough already, sorry, didn't know it would turn out this way."

 

[cluciano63]

LE sure isn't behaving as though they believe he is alive, in my opinion. No public address to whoever is "holding" him, no offer of a deal to come forward, release Kyron and testify against the co-defendant, no sense of urgency at all. Seems more like a slow, methodical case being put together, rather than a search for an endangered child.

 

[nonfictionrocks]

Who is this guy and does he not have the same last name as the guy who saw the "mysterious truck" twice on his road on the day Kyron went missing?

http://www.kptv.com/news/24777153/detail.html

 

[gardeness]

BBM

I've thought this for a while now. She was "ready" and wanted to get this ball rolling. She couldn't believe it when the time for the bus rolled around and she still had not been contacted! Sheesh! She could have taken her time instead of rushing around like a mad woman. *lol*

IIRC, didn't she send two seperate emails to the school that day? Or am I thinking of something else?

Tia!

I've been thinking about this for a while. Really, we only have Terri saying what time she walked him down the hall. I *think* that LE retracted the 9:00 a.m. sighting a week or two later. Also, as you pointed out, in order to get the receipt from the FM shortly after 9, she HAD to leave sooner than 8:45. Also, I think the email to the teacher in the afternoon was a fishing expedition to see if there were any red flags at the school by that time.

bbm

If this were the case, and she sent the email when she returned home from the gym (around 1:00), then she knew that everyone was at the talent show at that time and she would not receive an immediate response.

 

[kappy50]

Who is this guy and does he not have the same last name as the guy who saw the "mysterious truck" twice on his road on the day Kyron went missing?

http://www.kptv.com/news/24777153/detail.html

I think their last names are spelled different...first gentleman spelled his "Kelly"...this dude spells his "Kelley"...but good catch for sure non!

 

[nonfictionrocks]

I think their last names are spelled different...first gentleman spelled his "Kelly"...this dude spells his "Kelley"...but good catch for sure non!

Sorry but their last names are spelled the same way. Our WS thread title has it spelled wrong.

"Kelley, who lives about a mile and a half down hill, at the end of a winding, secluded country lane off Cornelius Pass, said police, federal agents, K-9 teams and helicopters scoured the area Saturday.

"We had two odd sightings of a vehicle on our road Friday," Kelley said. Around 3 p.m., he and a neighbor reported seeing a white pick-up truck with a female driver pull to the end of the long road, idle and then turn around. Then again at 2 a.m. Saturday morning, a similar white pickup truck appeared, idled and when a neighbor loosed her dogs, eased away."

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/06/day_three_search_continues_hun.html

 

[PDXMom]

Who is this guy and does he not have the same last name as the guy who saw the "mysterious truck" twice on his road on the day Kyron went missing?

http://www.kptv.com/news/24777153/detail.html

So much for the myth that SOs never mix genders...

 

[chairdancer]

http://www2.co.multnomah.or.us/Public/EntryPoint?&ch=1d09d146a590c010VgnVCM1000003bc614acRCRD
This is pretty scary stuff. I quit counting at 30 for the ones that either have no adress or are wanted within the county.

 

[nonfictionrocks]

http://www2.co.multnomah.or.us/Public/EntryPoint?&ch=1d09d146a590c010VgnVCM1000003bc614acRCRD
This is pretty scary stuff. I quit counting at 30 for the ones that either have no adress or are wanted within the county.

Yikes, these are just the registered SO's. What about those that have not yet be caught or have beat a conviction? I wish we had this same information available to us up here in Canada.

 

[Beatrice]

Terri needed the pickup truck to take Kyron's exhibit home.
The exhibit was over at 10am. She had been gone for over an hour...
Driving around somewhere. Seems she really wasn't sure of her destination.

She could have gone back at any time to get the exhibit...She didn't.
Most especially at the end of the school day. She has Kaine go with her to the busstop.

There is no mention of the talent show & Kyron's involvement. She knew she would be gone with Kyron right before it started...no need to rehearse anything.

Never does she mention baby K being at the exhibits, school or the truck. Who was taking care of baby K? An adult had to have met Terri in the parking lot & got in the truck. The 4 drive aimlessly thru Sauvie Island. Looking for Dede's farm?

There is no mention of J coming to visit for the weekend. No mention of the 4 hour round trip ride to Eugene to drop off Kyron with Tony.

IMO Kyron could be hidden in the area of the 24 Hour Gym. A garage, a storage facility, etc. A secret place known only to Terri where she can drink, get high, sleep, stash her most recent purchases. And maybe a place to do her sexting privately.

Any news on MC?

 

[debs]

Terri needed the pickup truck to take Kyron's exhibit home.
The exhibit was over at 10am. She had been gone for over an hour...
Driving around somewhere. Seems she really wasn't sure of her destination.

Where is this listed as fact? Kaine and Desiree are the only ones who have said this.

She could have gone back at any time to get the exhibit...She didn't.
Most especially at the end of the school day. She has Kaine go with her to the busstop.

Kaine says that he took baby K and headed for the bus stop, and Terri followed a minute or so later.

There is no mention of the talent show & Kyron's involvement. She knew she would be gone with Kyron right before it started...no need to rehearse anything.

There seems to be a great deal of confusion regarding the talent show, even if it is on the sign. Given that neither parent was made aware of this activity, it could also stand to reason that Kyron wasn't really in the show, even if someone said she thought her son was going to do something with Kyron in it. Until the school explains whether that was also open to the family of the kids, I'll leave that as something that Terri also didn't know about (outside of it being on the sign). Plus, you bring up a good point......IF Kyron had been in a talent show of some kind, wouldn't he have mentioned needing to practice? My goodness, I can't tell you how often we had to hear about Princess PeePee's one line before the graduation from kindergarten. If Kyron was going to perform something, I can't imagine he'd not tell his whole family.

Never does she mention baby K being at the exhibits, school or the truck. Who was taking care of baby K? An adult had to have met Terri in the parking lot & got in the truck. The 4 drive aimlessly thru Sauvie Island. Looking for Dede's farm?

1. All we know is that she didn't say anything about K being with her at the school to her friend, in an email. We don't know what she told LE.
2. She had K with her by the time she ran into Andrea, so when is it she was supposed to have gotten rid of K only to get her back by the time she saw Andrea? This one is constantly puzzling to me.
3. I'm not following how there is an assertion that another adult HAD to have met Terri in the parking lot and got into her truck. Which 4 drive aimlessly? When did they do this driving, since Terri is at FM by 9:12. Wouldn't DeDe have just given directions if anyone were in fact looking for the farm? Besides, the farm seems like a well-known place; can't be that off the beaten trail.

There is no mention of J coming to visit for the weekend. No mention of the 4 hour round trip ride to Eugene to drop off Kyron with Tony.

Why would this be mentioned, and to whom?

IMO Kyron could be hidden in the area of the 24 Hour Gym. A garage, a storage facility, etc. A secret place known only to Terri where she can drink, get high, sleep, stash her most recent purchases. And maybe a place to do her sexting privately.

Any news on MC?

1. Kyron could be anywhere.
2. We have no information that Terri is in fact a drinker, drug user, chronic sleeper, or compulsive shopper. Without attempting to defend her, all I'm saying is that we can't just throw stuff out there because she's the villian du jour.
3. Apparently she didn't need privacy to sext, since LE has it.
4. What sort of news should there be, other than he was a friend of Kaine's from high school who seems to have managed to carve out a niche in the oddity of what this case has become. He didn't really add much to the search for Kyron, after all.