VERONICA, CALLER FROM HAWAII: Hey, I knew Jodi personally in Rancho Mirage, California. We worked together. She would be in the packing lot refusing to go to work because she couldn`t get him on the phone.
I said, Jodi, leave the boy alone. She goes, I can`t, Veronica. He`s the only man I want to marry. He`s the only man I want to have children with.
PINSKY: Veronica, when was this?
VERONICA: This was back in 2008. She worked at the restaurant for four or five months.
PINSKY: Did you notice anything peculiar about her? Is there anything you can tell us --
VERONICA: Every night. She had a flat affect. She was horrible at the job, but she got it because she was pretty.
And she -- and owners of the restaurant would say, I never want her at my table again. I would say, Jodi, what happened? And she`d say, nothing.
REYNOLDS: What restaurant was this because she lied and said she worked at a place called Margaritaville. There was no such place.
VERONICA: Bull. She worked at Bing Crosby`s in Rancho Mirage.
PINSKY: In Rancho Mirage, in the desert.
VERONICA: And she was living in a house, at Palm Desert Country Club. And she was trying to get me to buy this house for $300,000.
PINSKY: OK. Was she -- does she create chaos? Were she -- did you see any aggression? Was there anything about her that was --
VERONICA: No, Jodi does not show outwardly anything. Jodi stays at a flat affect. Jodi -- she would be telling me, I`ve got to drive to Arizona, Veronica. I`m going tonight after work. And I`d say --
PINSKY: Veronica, when you heard, were you shocked she was capable of something like this?
VERONICA: No, because she abused an animal, I know.
REYNOLDS: Oh, gosh. Well, a lot of Jeffrey Dahmers start with animals.
PINSKY: Tell me about. Again, we cannot confirm or deny what Veronica is telling us, but go ahead. Please tell us what you know.
VERONICA: OK. We had an employee there. He was getting there. His wife was allergic to the cat. He asked her to take the cat. But two weeks while they went on honeymoon, she told me where it`s at. She said, Veronica, I`m going to do it. So, she took the cat in.
After two weeks when the guy got back from his honeymoon, she came up to me and said, Veronica, when I went back to get the cat after two weeks - - I said, two weeks, what do you mean? She said, I left it in a dark room with enough food and water. A lot at her and I was about to strangle her right there. And I had a whole (INAUDIBLE).
And she said the cat was shaking horribly, Veronica. I guess I kind of felt bad. Oh!
REYNOLDS: Showing she`s obviously heartless. Are you watching the trial at all, Veronica?
VERONICA: Yes, ma`am.
REYNOLDS: And so, your thoughts are?
VERONICA: That`s Jodi. She won`t show you what`s going on in her. She won`t show you.
PINSKY: Did she ever sort of flip into different characters where you were sort of surprised by the sort of range where she almost seemed like somebody else?
VERONICA: No, because Jodi has flat affect.
PINSKY: She was flat.
VERONICA: She doesn`t show happiness or sadness or nervousness. She -- oh. My grandmother had a saying. Butter wouldn`t melt in her mouth.
PINSKY: I`m going to say, Dr. Golland, you know, one of the things about sociopaths is they don`t experience much anxiety. So --
GOLLAND: Exactly. That`s exactly what I was thinking.
PINSKY: If Veronica is telling us something accurate, that would sort of fit with the sociopath/psychopath spectrum.
All right. Veronica, I hope you`ll hold for me because I have no doubt I`ll have more questions for you.
Next up, I promise to show you a tape of Jodi`s friend who alleges a different side to Jodi. I`m going to have Veronica maybe ring in on what this other friend is saying.
Then, I`ve got a guest who knows more about the Steubenville rape than anyone else apparently. He`s an insider and he says he`s going to tell us a different story. That`s next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PINSKY: We are back talking about the Jodi Arias trial with my co- host, Jillian Barberie Reynolds and our guests. Now, as I said, she`s got some supporters. I want to show you part of an in-session interview with her friend, Donavan Bering, talking about the Jodi she claims to know.
And I have Veronica -- as by the way, I`ve said before, I can`t confirm nor deny the veracity of what Veronica is telling us, but I want her to respond to this tape. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONAVAN BERING, JODI ARIAS FAMILY FRIEND: I know Jodi well enough to know that if the situation could be taken back, it would be taken back. Jodi -- Jodi -- would not be in the situation she`s in if she could have helped it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: So, Veronica, there`s someone that claims she knows -- I`m going to have the whole team listen to the Veronica respond to this knows Jodi. What do you say to that little tape?
VOICE OF VERONICA, SAYS SHE KNEW JODI ARIAS: Well --
(LAUGHTER)
VERONICA: Well, anyone who feels bad about something, Dr. Drew, is going to fess up. OK? This little girl --
(LAUGHTER)
VERONICA: Boy, she`s going to try the best she can to get out of it. I don`t understand the mentality of it, doctor, but boy, I sure worked with her and I knew her. And what I see in her trial and that flat affect and her just holding it all in and just acting like nothing is wrong.
PINSKY: And Veronica, was anyone ever concerned about her? Did anybody get the willies? Did anybody --
VERONICA: Oh, yes. I had co-workers at the restaurant who said, Veronica, stay away from her. What are you talking about? She`s a pretty little girl -- oh no, Veronica, stay away from her. There`s nothing wrong with her. She doesn`t show emotion. She doesn`t get upset. She doesn`t cry. We are wait staff. We are emotional, we are passionate, and she had nothing.
JILLIAN BARBERIE REYNOLDS, TV HOST: I have a question here, Dr. Drew. You know, we`ve all had that friend that goes a little too far, calling the acts and you`re like easy. This looks a little obsessive --
PINSKY: Stalking behaviors.
REYNOLDS: Yes. And it`s just desperate behavior.
PINSKY: Yes.
REYNOLDS: Are you born with that? Is that something that, you know - -
PINSKY: No, you`re not. That`s sort of more has to do with your ruptured relationships in childhood and think psychopathy can be something you are born with --
MICHELLE GOLLAND, PSY.D., CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: Which also a big --
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: Go ahead, Dr. Golland.
GOLLAND: Which also brings up the idea of what was her childhood like? Clearly, and not that there`s any justification for this, but we know, you don`t just come into the world and do this, OK? So, it`s important to understand how these personality disorders develop and how someone could become so flat and so lacking empathy and consciousness that they would do what it seems she did.
PINSKY: Although my understanding is if it`s a psychopath as a opposed to a severe borderline or other kinds of trauma personalities, that does tend to be a brain issue that is more genetic. And otherwise, Mark, you were trying to say something. Let me ask you before -- you`ve made your comment, but I also ask would you put -- where is the mom?
Why isn`t she on the stand? Why aren`t some of these supporters up there, you know, defending her, given her sort of a character profile that makes her look a little better?
MARK EIGLARSH, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: OK. Well, first of all, the court of public opinion doesn`t render a verdict, so that`s something that I try not to address as much as the courtroom. Now, in the courtroom, the defense is in a classic catch-22. They can`t prove this self-defense probably ever, but without evidence of self-defense, and as Jillian said, her view kind of reflects every opinion I`ve received on Twitter and Facebook.
That is, the evidence is inconsistent with self-defense. So, the only way you have a chance is if somebody testifies to it. That means you have to put her up on the stand, and I never like putting defendants on the stand because I can`t control how they`re going to do. I got to say one more thing, by the way.
July 15th, 2008 was the day that Caylee went missing. July 15th, 2008 is when Arias was arrested. Ironically, both Casey Anthony and Jodi Arias spent July 15th, that same day, lying to law enforcement.
PINSKY: That is the one thing we know about both these women. They lie, lie, lie. Yes. It`s bizarre to think -- Lisa Wexler, I`m going to go to you. I mean, these investigators, these women look them straight in the eye and just cold-blooded lying in a way that`s hard even to understand, and then --
REYNOLDS: Think about what they`ve just done. Think about what they`ve just done. They just butchered somebody, of course they can lie.
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: Yes, go ahead, Lisa.
REYNOLDS: That`s so secondary compared to what they`ve just done. That`s nothing compared to butchering a human being.
PINSKY: You`re right. Lisa?
LISA WEXLER, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: I agree --
(CROSSTALK)
DR. BILL LLOYD, HAS PERFORMED OVER 500 AUTOPSIES: Let`s get past the lying. We`re not talking about the lying as much as the compartmentalization.
PINSKY: Yes.
LLOYD: That`s what amazes me, Drew. She`s able to take a story, put it in a package, put the package over here, and then go kill somebody.
PINSKY: That`s right.
(CROSSTALK)
PINSKY: Let me just say, though, that severe compartmentalization is really disassociation where people literally are not aware of what they`re doing and those -- they gray out or black out --
Continued here
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