Possible NEW Suspects In JonBenet Ramsey Case?

[AKWILKS]

vlpate - I am happy to answer any non-sarcastic questions from you or anyone else. Since your question does not pertain to the Ramsey case, I answer it here in a thread on Zodiac and Kaczynski:

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=6902911#post6902911"]Unsolved 18 From The First Zodiac Code And Possible Kaczynski/Zodiac Connection - Page 3 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

 

[vlpate]

vlpate - I am happy to answer any non-sarcastic questions from you or anyone else. Since your question does not pertain to the Ramsey case, I answer it here in a thread on Zodiac and Kaczynski:

Unsolved 18 From The First Zodiac Code And Possible Kaczynski/Zodiac Connection - Page 3 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

I'll go there in a bit...I guess my point is that you shrug off anyone telling you that the palm print could be MR's because they cite a newpaper article, yet you do the very same thing to prove you had something to do with the FBI looking asking for TK's DNA. Just because you said FBI agents called you doesn't make it a fact...do you have phone records of those calls? Do you have any evidence, whatsoever, that you corresponded with the FBI about the TK/Tylenol case? So far all I've seen are interviews with you and a gazillion blogs and forum posts by YOU in connection to the case.

Can't have it both ways.

 

[Agatha_C]

Agatha - Sometimes I just assume everyone reads my mind and it articulates what my fingers neglect to explain correctly.

When I said "let her go", what I was thinking, and what I thought when the Mark Karr debacle started up, was how much all this must hurt her - how her parents abandoned her and have let this humiliation go on for so many years just to save their own a$$es. I can't believe, I don't want to believe that her resting in peace is dependent upon the truth of what happened that night. I've always prayed she has gone on.

I would love to see closure to this case. I would love someone be accountable - but MY opinion is that until either John or Burke confess, or tell what really happened, there will never be closure.

I feel SO strongly...and my opinion stems from many years of looking at every single player involved and not involved - all the evidence and depositions...that there will never be an arrest unless it is John or Burke Ramsey.

Do you know that Lin Wood sued the hell out of anyone who even hinted that Burke Ramsey was involved, and virtually all those lawsuits were settled out of court -- however, in 1997, if you googled JonBenet Ramsey, your search would render THOUSANDS of sites with references to JonBenet and NOT ONE lawsuit was ever brought upon any of those sites - they were, by all appearances, completely ignored. It was never about JonBenet, not ever, it was always about John, Patsy, and Burke Ramsey. The tip line in their book was to a number that didn't even work, and they never publicly corrected it.

They've never spoken out for abused, missing, or murdered children - there has never been a (legitimate), foundation started by them in her name. Even the name of their book, "The Death Of Innocense" meant THEIR innocense, not JonBenet's.

Make no mistake, I have prayed for justice for JonBenet since this story broke December 1996, but at some point I resolved myself to the belief that there will never be justice as long as the two people left continue their self-serving silence.

I know what you mean. I am read wrong all the time. Im beginning to think my name should be Miss Understood (LOL!

Thank you for your eloquent post...

 

[AKWILKS]

I'll go there in a bit...I guess my point is that you shrug off anyone telling you that the palm print could be MR's because they cite a newpaper article, yet you do the very same thing to prove you had something to do with the FBI looking asking for TK's DNA. Just because you said FBI agents called you doesn't make it a fact...do you have phone records of those calls? Do you have any evidence, whatsoever, that you corresponded with the FBI about the TK/Tylenol case? So far all I've seen are interviews with you and a gazillion blogs and forum posts by YOU in connection to the case.

Can't have it both ways.

The reason Jamie Sotonoff of the Chicago Daily Herald printed it as a "fact" that I contacted the FBI in 2009 is because that is when I started communicating with her and told her this at the time AND I have sent her copies of emails I sent to the FBI and emails I got back from them, which also reference our phone conversations and emails exchanges over a two year period from 2009 to 2011.

If you don't want to believe I contacted the FBI thats OK with me.

My whole point in mentioning it was to just to give a little background info on Doug Oswell and myself.

I don't "shrug off" newspaper reports, but in the Ramsey case in particular, there have been many stories by major newspapers that proved to be false. I would like to see a statement from law enforcement saying the palm print was definitively sourced to Melinda Ramsey. But in the absence of that, the newspaper article and the seeming acceptance or lack of challenge to it by the Ramsey's attorney makes me consider it likely to be correct, but it is not yet absolutely confirmed.

 

[vlpate]

The reason Jamie Sotonoff of the Chicago Daily Herald printed it as a "fact" that I contacted the FBI in 2009 is because that is when I started communicating with her and told her this at the time AND I have sent her copies of emails I sent to the FBI and emails I got back from them, which also reference our phone conversations and emails exchanges over a two year period from 2009 to 2011.

If you don't want to believe I contacted the FBI thats OK with me.

My whole point in mentioning it was to just to give a little background info on Doug Oswell and myself.

I don't "shrug off" newspaper reports, but in the Ramsey case in particular, there have been many stories by major newspapers that proved to be false. I would like to see a statement from law enforcement saying the palm print was definitively sourced to Melinda Ramsey. But in the absence of that, the newspaper article and the seeming acceptance or lack of challenge to it by the Ramsey's attorney makes me consider it likely to be correct, but it is not yet absolutely confirmed.

What do you make of the letters SBTC that closes the JBR ransom note? What do you suggest Mitchell meant, if indeed he or Barzee wrote the ransom note.

I always found it odd that Patsy told 911 that morning she hadn't read the ransom note all the way through - but mentions the acronym SBTC, which closed the note, almost in the same breath.

 

[vlpate]

I know what you mean. I am read wrong all the time. Im beginning to think my name should be Miss Understood (LOL!

Thank you for your eloquent post...

Right!

You're welcome Agatha, and thank you

 

[AKWILKS]

What do you make of the letters SBTC that closes the JBR ransom note? What do you suggest Mitchell meant, if indeed he or Barzee wrote the ransom note.

I always found it odd that Patsy told 911 that morning she hadn't read the ransom note all the way through - but mentions the acronym SBTC, which closed the note, almost in the same breath.

My thought is that given their extreme views, their belief that they were commanded to take the "daughters of God" out of "Babylon" so they could be "redeemed by Jesus Christ", SBTC could stand for "Saved By The Cross", as many others have already speculated.

Or it could have some other meaning, or no meaning at all.

If you listen to the 911 tape, the operator asks Patsy something like "Does it say who took her?", to which Patsy responds "SBTC. Victory."

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NFMrNtTPaSY"]‪JonBenet 911 call FULL (high quality with subtitles)‬‏ - YouTube[/ame]

 

[wonderllama]

I haven't got anything to add at this stage, just wanted you to know I wasn't dead.

That is all.
Carry on

 

[Agatha_C]

I haven't got anything to add at this stage, just wanted you to know I wasn't dead.

That is all.
Carry on

You Freaking cracked me up!!!!!!!! :floorlaugh:

I was having the worst night, with an evil spin lord in a galaxy far far away, and you wonder of all wonders made it all go away.. Bless you! LOL!

 

[Agatha_C]

P.S. Glad that your still alive! I forgot to add that...

 

[Tadpole12]

Barzee's natural script is not as stylized as the sample from her journal.

Barzee's apology letter to ES:
http://www.heraldextra.com/pdf_9b34e174-d3df-11de-bccd-001cc4c03286.html
http://bloximages.chicago2.vip.town.../9b34e174-d3df-11de-bccd-001cc4c03286.pdf.pdf


Barzee testimony:
http://breaking.sltrib.com/mitchell/nov18barzeetranscript.php

Barzee: I kept a journal.
Steele: What did you call that journal?
Barzee: I can’t remember.
[Steele calls for exhibit. Shows it to Barzee.]
Barzee: I think this is the journal I wrote when we went through the nation.
Steele: If you would look at ... first of all ... is it typed, handwritten?
Barzee: It’s in my handwriting.
Steele: And your handwriting is special is it not?
Barzee: It was then. I was always right-handed but when we traveled through the nation we were up in the Santa Cruz mountains of Palo Alto, California. We stayed there for five months while we pulled a handcart and I felt impressed to practice writing with my left hand. So this was written with my left hand.
Steele: How long did it take to teach yourself to write left-handed?
Barzee: It took me a while. While Brian said he was ministering, I would be at libraries and I would practice writing recipes and things down.
Steele: If I were to call that calligraphy instead of mere handwriting would that be fair?
(answer not heard)

 

[wonderllama]

P.S. Glad that your still alive! I forgot to add that...

It was assumed :great:

 

[Roy23]

My thought is that given their extreme views, their belief that they were commanded to take the "daughters of God" out of "Babylon" so they could be "redeemed by Jesus Christ", SBTC could stand for "Saved By The Cross", as many others have already speculated.

Or it could have some other meaning, or no meaning at all.

If you listen to the 911 tape, the operator asks Patsy something like "Does it say who took her?", to which Patsy responds "SBTC. Victory."

‪JonBenet 911 call FULL (high quality with subtitles)‬‏ - YouTube

I am really gonna be pissed if you are right about them still not testing this DNA against Mitchell and Barzee. I have just always assumed this was done with all the similarities.

 

[BBB167893]

If the parents included the "$118,000" as a way to cast suspicion on an "insider", a current or former Access Graphics employee who knew of John's bonus, why then did they make the ransom note tell John to use his "southern" common sense, when he is from Michigan?

Any number of reasons.

Why is there an unknown palm print, not from the Ramsey's or any of their friends on the wine cellar door? Two unknown boot prints? An unknown pubic hair on the blanket? An unknown partial fingerprint on the ransom note? Scuff marks under the basement window?

Agatha already answered that.

What did the Ramsey's do with the duct tape? The police took 800 items of evidence, but found no duct tape matching what was used on JonBenet. Where is it?

There are any number of things they could have done with it.

How do you explain three spots of male DNA, NOT from a Ramsey, or any friends, or any of JonBenet's friends or playmates, on two items of clothing? One of them is a 9 marker DNA spot, indicating a rough pull on the longjohns.

You of all people should know what a tricky science DNA is. Henry Lee estimated that HALF the DNA found at crime scenes is unrelated, and he said that BEFORE TDNA was developed. It's a fact that the more sensitive DNA testing methods become, the more likely they'll be to pick up artifact material.

Why did the DA state that such new DNA results clear the Ramsey's? Oh, I forgot, the DA office is also part of the conspiracy and cover up, the Ramsey's being rich and all.

While I don't appreciate your sarcasm, you're more right than you know.

The fact is there are hundreds of questions you can ask for any Ramseys did it scenario, with no good answers

Try me, pilgrim.

 

[BBB167893]

Agatha - You state all these are proven. Proven and not in dispute?

Well, some of them (not all) are certainly disputed by the Ramseys!

Uhmmmm, the palm print on the wine cellar door was sourced to MRL, JRs daughter.

AK - Can you give me a source or cite for this being proven?

I can. That one was revealed back in 2002 in an article by Charlie Brennan. In that article, and as confirmed on Catherine Crier's show, that was not disputed by the Ramseys at all. (Didn't stop them from claiming it later, though!)

The boots (HiTech) both BR and FWJ admitted to the grand jury that they each owned a pair.

AK - Source or cite?

Same Charlie Brennan article, plus I believe Fleet White mentioned it in PMPT, as well.

The hair on the blanket was sourced to Patsy's arm, thats right it was an arm hair and not pubic.

AK - Source or cite please?

Same Charlie Brennan article. In fact, they even went so far as to say HOW they found out: the hair was tested for mitochondrial DNA.

 

[BBB167893]

Do you know that Lin Wood sued the hell out of anyone who even hinted that Burke Ramsey was involved, and virtually all those lawsuits were settled out of court -- however, in 1997, if you googled JonBenet Ramsey, your search would render THOUSANDS of sites with references to JonBenet and NOT ONE lawsuit was ever brought upon any of those sites - they were, by all appearances, completely ignored.

Wood was actually asked about that, vlpate. He said that it wasn't worth his time.

Lin Wood is a self-serving con-artist, and those are his good points.

It was never about JonBenet, not ever, it was always about John, Patsy, and Burke Ramsey. The tip line in their book was to a number that didn't even work, and they never publicly corrected it.

They've never spoken out for abused, missing, or murdered children - there has never been a (legitimate), foundation started by them in her name. Even the name of their book, "The Death Of Innocense" meant THEIR innocense, not JonBenet's.

Yup!

 

[BBB167893]

I am really gonna be pissed if you are right about them still not testing this DNA against Mitchell and Barzee. I have just always assumed this was done with all the similarities.

Don't go away, pilgrim. I got something special just for you!

 

[AKWILKS]

I do NOT know if the DNA of Brian David Mitchell and Wanda Barzee has been compared to the possible suspect DNA (or "unknown DNA") in the Ramsey case.

I asked Boulder PD if BDM and WB have been cleared in the Ramsey case. I was told it was an open investigation and they cannot tell me anything. I then explained who Doug Oswell and I were, and that I had information on BDM and WB as possible suspects in the case. I asked if I should send it to them. They said yes and gave me an email so I sent it to them.

From that I draw a reasonable inference that BDM/WB have probably not been cleared as of yet. But I don't know for sure. My hope is that what I sent them convinces them to do the comparisons and include or exclude them as suspects.

SuperDave, can you tell me or give me a link to who you think killed JonBenet, how and most important why?

 

[DeeDee249]

I haven't got anything to add at this stage, just wanted you to know I wasn't dead.

That is all.
Carry on

Of course, if you WERE dead, I could still talk to you.

 

[Agatha_C]

Of course, if you WERE dead, I could still talk to you.

OMG! You people make me laugh so hard.. :floorlaugh: