Possible Victim: Shannan Gilbert, 24, missing May 2010, found Oak Beach Dec 2011 #3

[Ruminations]

Regarding RH's potential involvement with Shannan's death. It has speculated that RH was most active when his wife AE was away from their home in Long Island.

Where was AE when Shannan disappeared from Oak Beach? Was she home on Long Island?

A VERY interesting question!

I'm a doubter that Asa was always away for every crime, and in fact believe a witnesses sworn statement comes very close to admitting that she "knew" but-didn't allow herself to fully process and accept- that Karen was being imprisoned.

It stands to reason that Asa "knew" at least on the same sub-level the same thing.

The didn't live with Rex in the intervening years, and wasn't financially intertwined. So when the arrest was made, it would be much easier for her to see what she saw without self-protecting filters.

I find it really strange that Asa stated explicitly that she'd blame herself if she were to believe Rex hired sex workers, when it appears that indeed she did know this. I mean, what if it happens that Rex is not sexually satisfied unless he is hurting someone. Does she think a dutiful wife has to keep such a husband satisfied? I think it shows the control Rex did have over her; he managed to strap himself to her such that she couldn't throw him under the bus without joining him. Seeing the evidence right in front of her face honestly means having to be a bad wife. No wonder she sees it with such distortion.

John Ray's staff who learned that neither Asa nor Rex was checked into hotels in Atlantic City on exactly the dates asserted by the prosecution. This seemed to annoy Tierney, but I agree that the prosecutor interpreted the date too literally from the information on the credit card statement. Yet, obviously there was some activity that does show some person being present at, for example, an AC liquor store and clothing stores. And we don't know other clues the prosecutors might know, such as where Rex's phone traveled around those dates. From the statements, we only know that an adult holding the Heuermann CC, likely Rex or Asa, was at a few retail places on a few dates. This was back in the time that the charges didn't go through in real time, but the transaction date, often before the posting date, was noted. Time stamps existed on register printouts if the register had its clock set, but rarely as a kept CC transaction record. It seems to me that we are not privy to a clear time line surrounding Maureen's disappearance. I do believe Asa and the kids were in AC sometime near that. Asa asserted in the Peacock piece that she could not be made to believe Rex picked up MBB, brought her to MP, killed her, then joined the family in AC. Now, as far as I know, the prosecutor did not claim Rex joined the family. In addition the prosecutor did not locate the scene of the murders; they only said it was possible at least one murder was committed in the house. Asa's statement included a lot of assumptions of the prosecution theory.

Why did she make so many assumptions? Why did she not address the unclear dates? Who took what mode of transport when, and where did each spend each night? IMO, she denied a scenario so specific it almost sounded to my ears that she was confirming something different happened with the logistics, not different in that there was no murder.

My theory is something as unsettling what happened with Karen Vergata happened that weekend, and she is not processing it or sharing it due to the power Rex had over her, which has been replaced with the power Macedonia and the promise of a million dollars had over her.

Remember, Karen Vergata happened first, while Asa was pregnant according to Macedonia, and abusers get away with escalating outrageous actions, they don't reel themselves in. The Atlantic City trip, with unclear dates and movement of people, occurred when Asa was about as dependent on Rex as possible.

Just as VH at first doubted the prosecution theory but believed it was possible, and later came to believe it is likely true, I predict Asa will evolve from where she is now to where VH started: agreeing it is possible.

All that to say, I'm not sure Asa had to be all that far out of town for Rex to be involved, and for her to not know it.

MOO

 

[Sherlock&Watson]

anyone notice how on the phone call with 911, she starts with "YEAH, someone's following me". If you were in danger, would you start your phone call so calmly with yeah? That combined with the fact that she keeps saying she "doesn't know," yet it takes a severe, dangerous problem for a prostitute to call 911. Too many things don't add up about the phone call in my personal opinion. as well as Gus using 911 aswell, possibly as a tool.

I noticed this too. I went back and listened again and the dispatcher asks her if she needs help, then she says "Yeah" etc.

 

[Ruminations]

Regarding RH's potential involvement with Shannan's death. It has speculated that RH was most active when his wife AE was away from their home in Long Island.

Where was AE when Shannan disappeared from Oak Beach? Was she home on Long Island?

A VERY interesting question!

I'm a doubter that Asa was always away for every crime. In fact, a witnesses sworn statement comes very close to admitting that the swinger witness "knew" but-didn't allow herself to fully process and accept- that Karen was being imprisoned. Why wouldn't Asa have felt the same way that night? And others.

It stands to reason that Asa "knew" at least on the same level the witness "knew" about Karen.

I believe coercive control can do a lot to a person. It's not to make an excuse, but I do get how Asa could have been largely under Rex's control even then, pregnant and "rescued" by Rex. This evening may have been one of many steps before and after it that could have groomed Asa to accept more and more crazy, sadistic and, of course, criminal behavior from Rex. I think Asa could have known without knowing.

I agree with John Ray that the Atlantic City credit card statements used as evidence do not confirm dates of hotel stays, nor do they indicate who was staying. (The defense could theoretically claim it was Rex in AC at those unconfirmed dates, and he was therefore not murdering! If the dates were reliable.)

I don't think it is a sure thing at all that Asa was away for every murder, especially given testimony from witnesses that say she knew sex workers were in the home, plus the consensual swinger. There are also reports of sexual services being provided to Rex with Asa's knowledge while children were home, but in a non-violent, businesslike way. That also "works" in a coercive control marriage. The occasional chaotic visit, with mostly businesslike visits to normalize and calm down the wife. And, what a gift to Rex it must have been when she accused a worker of stealing something! That was time for Rex to play the victim of his "emotional" wife and make it seem like she was the one who caused the problems during these perfectly normal days at home.

I feel like this post might manage to rankle two groups, but it is he way I feel. I think Asa could have so damaged by Rex, she could not see what was going on around her. She knew. But she didn't.

MOO

 

[snooptroop88]

A VERY interesting question!

I'm a doubter that Asa was always away for every crime. In fact, a witnesses sworn statement comes very close to admitting that the swinger witness "knew" but-didn't allow herself to fully process and accept- that Karen was being imprisoned. Why wouldn't Asa have felt the same way that night? And others.

It stands to reason that Asa "knew" at least on the same level the witness "knew" about Karen.

I believe coercive control can do a lot to a person. It's not to make an excuse, but I do get how Asa could have been largely under Rex's control even then, pregnant and "rescued" by Rex. This evening may have been one of many steps before and after it that could have groomed Asa to accept more and more crazy, sadistic and, of course, criminal behavior from Rex. I think Asa could have known without knowing.

I agree with John Ray that the Atlantic City credit card statements used as evidence do not confirm dates of hotel stays, nor do they indicate who was staying. (The defense could theoretically claim it was Rex in AC at those unconfirmed dates, and he was therefore not murdering! If the dates were reliable.)

I don't think it is a sure thing at all that Asa was away for every murder, especially given testimony from witnesses that say she knew sex workers were in the home, plus the consensual swinger. There are also reports of sexual services being provided to Rex with Asa's knowledge while children were home, but in a non-violent, businesslike way. That also "works" in a coercive control marriage. The occasional chaotic visit, with mostly businesslike visits to normalize and calm down the wife. And, what a gift to Rex it must have been when she accused a worker of stealing something! That was time for Rex to play the victim of his "emotional" wife and make it seem like she was the one who caused the problems during these perfectly normal days at home.

I feel like this post might manage to rankle two groups, but it is he way I feel. I think Asa could have so damaged by Rex, she could not see what was going on around her. She knew. But she didn't.

MOO

I believe these JR witnesses as well, and agree with JR about the credit card. I mean, is that seriously all LE did to "confirm," look at the statement?? Let's hope not?

Regarding RH's potential involvement with Shannan's death. It has speculated that RH was most active when his wife AE was away from their home in Long Island.

Where was AE when Shannan disappeared from Oak Beach? Was she home on Long Island?

And agreed COMPLETELY that this is an absolutely fascinating question.

If the answer is yes, AE was away when SG was murdered-- why's that not relevant? And seriously, I think that even were the answer "yes, AE away that month," many of the same people banging the drum when it comes to the importance of this "AE vacation factor" for supporting AE would suddenly not care so much about it, jmo. And that's a worry.

 

[Ruminations]

I believe these JR witnesses as well, and agree with JR about the credit card. I mean, is that seriously all LE did to "confirm," look at the statement?? Let's hope not?

And agreed COMPLETELY that this is an absolutely fascinating question.

If the answer is yes, AE was away when SG was murdered-- why's that not relevant? And seriously, I think that even were the answer "yes, AE away that month," many of the same people banging the drum when it comes to the importance of this "AE vacation factor" for supporting AE would suddenly not care so much about it, jmo. And that's a worry.

The prosecution has handled the family in the weirdest way.

I have never seen arresting authorities to comment beyond the boilerplate statement they usually give when the press/public asks about any witness. "[Insert the name of the person the reporter asked about here] is considered a witness. [Name] is cooperating fully with this investigation." Instead, in multiple ways, the prosecutor asserted the family's ignorance and innocence.

The fact that the PROSECUTOR explicitly exonerated the family while there is an ongoing investigation is bizarre! Who has seen that before on any other case? And there is good reason to assert that the investigators are following the facts. What if Rex's defense is that his wife did it? He now has a plausible argument that the investigation was biased. That is, I imagine, the reasoning behind the typical, bland comments about witnesses.

MOO