Possible Victim: Shannan Gilbert, 24, missing May 2010, found Oak Beach Dec 2011 #3

[Ruminations]

I don't think RH had anything to do with Shannan at all.

We don't know if RH was involved. It sure would be nice to know where he was that night, and it would be great to see the comings and goings on Oak Beach that night. Pity about the security camera footage. Pak and Brewers narratives are not very credible, and it does seem like there was a lot more going on that evening than Shannan and brewer playing cards while Pak played on his phone in the driveway.

I don't know if RH was pat of that more going on or not.

But what it indisputable is something happened to Shannan, whether Rex Heuermann is directly involved or not.

MOO

 

[Betty P]

In my opinion RH was nowhere near there. Brewer was hanging out with her for 3 hours before her 911 call. How does waiting 3 hours to make a move on her make sense. You really think RH would be working with someone else? You think he would call a girl with an armed driver? RH made sure to use Burner phones. He picked all his victims up. It took him 12 years to get caught. RH wrapped his victims in camo and put them more or less on the side of the road so he could go back and visit them. Shannon was found in veggitation that would slice you up. Why would a potential murderer go through all that when they could have dumped her body somewhere easier to get to. The cops used a treaded vehicle to reach her.

Her body wasn't that far from the roadside. It seems much more likely it was placed there from the roadside than that she ran/struggled/climbed a much greater distance from a spot inside Oak Beach neighborhood.

While I'm about 70/30 believing that Shannan met with foul play, I'm not fully sure it was RH who killed her. Possible, but also possible another person or persons were the killer. There was something about her death that made local LE avoid investigating it while stonewalling state and federal agencies. Everything about the response to the 911 call and investigation of Shannan's disappearance has been abnormal and suspicious. The general rule of thumb is that if any part of a death investigation has been falsified, hidden or otherwise misdirected, all of the results are thrown into question.

Oh, to have been a fly on the wall at Suffolk County PD when that canine officer went out to Oak and Gilgo Beach and discovered the first serial killer victim.

JMO

 

[minazoe]

literally 5 hours of unaccounted for time. no resolution to any of the suspicions or events of the night. no explanations. in the Gilgo B Doc..they say she died transversing the marsh. but, there is zero evidence that that is what happened. you hear her saying " Stop it, NO!, what are you going to do to me?" then screams...but she died of hypothermia in the marsh.

let's go back, shall we? this case needs a fresh start. mOO

 

[minazoe]

I mean PH called her mother and told her he treated her...that is WHACK!!! mOO

 

[lohrtabitha]

Her body wasn't that far from the roadside. It seems much more likely it was placed there from the roadside than that she ran/struggled/climbed a much greater distance from a spot inside Oak Beach neighborhood.

While I'm about 70/30 believing that Shannan met with foul play, I'm not fully sure it was RH who killed her. Possible, but also possible another person or persons were the killer. There was something about her death that made local LE avoid investigating it while stonewalling state and federal agencies. Everything about the response to the 911 call and investigation of Shannan's disappearance has been abnormal and suspicious. The general rule of thumb is that if any part of a death investigation has been falsified, hidden or otherwise misdirected, all of the results are thrown into question.

Oh, to have been a fly on the wall at Suffolk County PD when that canine officer went out to Oak and Gilgo Beach and discovered the first serial killer victim.

JMO

We don't know how many years he has been killing? Although his DNA has been taken, until other cold cases run their dna evidence, he could be responsible for many killing across many states. I do think he could have killed Shannan and many others as suggested in this article.imo

Rex Heuermann's alleged murder spree could spread coast-to-coast

Police nationwide are looking deeper into cold cases that may now have a connection to Rex Heuermann.

www.newsweek.com

 

[minazoe]

the law is no CODIS until conviction.

 

[lohrtabitha]

the law is no CODIS until conviction.

I know. So we wait.

 

[Betty P]

We don't know how many years he has been killing? Although his DNA has been taken, until other cold cases run their dna evidence, he could be responsible for many killing across many states. I do think he could have killed Shannan and many others as suggested in this article.imo

Rex Heuermann's alleged murder spree could spread coast-to-coast

Police nationwide are looking deeper into cold cases that may now have a connection to Rex Heuermann.

www.newsweek.com

I agree. He could have killed Shannan. I'm just not 100% sure he did. It would be interesting to find out where he was that night and what he was doing. As someone else mentioned earlier, it would be interesting to see his GPS or cell phone data from that night, as well as the records of PH and other relevant people.

 

[Betty P]

the law is no CODIS until conviction.

Is that just New York law?

 

[minazoe]

Is that just New York law?

I think it might be..I think it's because you can't randomly find a person who is not convicted and attach a crime to them based on DNA taken without permission or a specific warrant...something like that...once you are convicted you lose your right to the privacy of your DNA..

I think??? something like that...mOO

 

[Betty P]

I think it might be..I think it's because you can't randomly find a person who is not convicted and attach a crime to them based on DNA taken without permission or a specific warrant...something like that...once you are convicted you lose your right to the privacy of your DNA..

I think??? something like that...mOO

IIRC, it took New York a long time to develop and deploy rules for using DNA evidence in criminal cases. Same thing happened with our metro county prosecutor's office. They still rarely use DNA evidence in murder cases. It's just old school ways of doing things. IYKWIM

 

[LongIsland731]

Let's breakdown her interaction with coletti. If she was really being chased as opposed to being in a physcosis/hallucinating wouldn't she have been as clear as possible after he opened the door for her? Instead she basically stared at him and just said I need help then ran off again.

Coletti : "what's the matter?"
-No response for 7 seconds
Coletti : "what's the matter?"
-No response yet again
Coletti : "is somebody after you, huh?"
-Another 10 second pause the maybe shanna says something its not clear.
Coletti : "are you alright?"
Shanna : "i need help"
Coletti : "don't get yourself hurt, where are you going?"
-Again no answer from Shanna just breathing
Coletti : "wait a minute, where are you going? What are you doing"
-evidence in my opinion shannan was acting erratic, even coletti is confused (like pak and Brewer were)

Then shannan took off running again.

What coherent, sober, in true danger, person knocks on a door for help gets someone to open, then provides ZERO details as to what's going on, why they knocked on the door and what they need help with?

It would have gone a lot closer to something like this:

Coletti : "what's the matter?"
-BEFORE HE COULD EVEN FINISH ASKING
Shannan : "let me in let me in someone is trying to kill me , let me in and close the door call the police (or im on the phone with the police tell then where we are tell them your address)". "Help someone is after me he's chasing me" ...

ANYTHING !!! Instead she didnt respond to multiple questions from coletti , then said I need help and ran off again. If her words and action at Brewers didn't already confirm she was not in the right state of mind, her interaction with coletti, whom she sought help from was the cherry on top!!!

And I have no love for suffolk pd, I've have my fair share of problems with them but their experts have listened to the call and investigated every detail up and down and came to the same conclusion.

 

[Ruminations]

Let's breakdown her interaction with coletti. If she was really being chased as opposed to being in a physcosis/hallucinating wouldn't she have been as clear as possible after he opened the door for her? Instead she basically stared at him and just said I need help then ran off again.

Coletti : "what's the matter?"
-No response for 7 seconds
Coletti : "what's the matter?"
-No response yet again
Coletti : "is somebody after you, huh?"
-Another 10 second pause the maybe shanna says something its not clear.
Coletti : "are you alright?"
Shanna : "i need help"
Coletti : "don't get yourself hurt, where are you going?"
-Again no answer from Shanna just breathing
Coletti : "wait a minute, where are you going? What are you doing"
-evidence in my opinion shannan was acting erratic, even coletti is confused (like pak and Brewer were)

Then shannan took off running again.

What coherent, sober, in true danger, person knocks on a door for help gets someone to open, then provides ZERO details as to what's going on, why they knocked on the door and what they need help with?

It would have gone a lot closer to something like this:

Coletti : "what's the matter?"
-BEFORE HE COULD EVEN FINISH ASKING
Shannan : "let me in let me in someone is trying to kill me , let me in and close the door call the police (or im on the phone with the police tell then where we are tell them your address)". "Help someone is after me he's chasing me" ...

ANYTHING !!! Instead she didnt respond to multiple questions from coletti , then said I need help and ran off again. If her words and action at Brewers didn't already confirm she was not in the right state of mind, her interaction with coletti, whom she sought help from was the cherry on top!!!

And I have no love for suffolk pd, I've have my fair share of problems with them but their experts have listened to the call and investigated every detail up and down and came to the same conclusion.

This is a duplicate post by you, so see the 911 call thread.

But to answer this question:

"What coherent, sober, in true danger, person knocks on a door for help gets someone to open, then provides ZERO details as to what's going on, why they knocked on the door and what they need help with?"

Shannan Gilbert. She was coherent, sober, in true danger, and needed her call traced. Coletti called the police, call traced, mission accomplished. She did not need to hang around and risk Pak or whoever was following her to talk him into her getting subdued.

MOO

 

[LongIsland731]

This is a duplicate post by you, so see the 911 call thread.

But to answer this question:

"What coherent, sober, in true danger, person knocks on a door for help gets someone to open, then provides ZERO details as to what's going on, why they knocked on the door and what they need help with?"

Shannan Gilbert. She was coherent, sober, in true danger, and needed her call traced. Coletti called the police, call traced, mission accomplished. She did not need to hang around and risk Pak or whoever was following her to talk him into her getting subdued.

MOO

She said nothing for 30 seconds , then barely got the words "I need help" out then ran off again. Idk what definitions of coherent and sober you looked up but thats very far from it. Next time your in dire need of help and someone asks you do you need help make sure to stare at them for 30 seconds silently. It's the quickest way to get help. Especially when you bannged on their door in the middle of the night running for a potential murderer. That's the most logical thing a sober coherent person would do. Don't explain a tbing , dont ask for an address, dont mention someone is chasing you, none of the logical, sober things that make sense. Just bang on door, get the response you wanted, which is for someone to open, then answer none of their questions and run off back into the danger zone.

 

[minazoe]

maybe she saw a sick little old man and decided to try somewhere else. maybe she was afraid he couldn't defend her...maybe she didn't want to upset someone with frailties..maybe she was so scared she didn't know what she was doing...maybe she was paranoid and freaked out. mOO

 

[LongIsland731]

maybe she saw a sick little old man and decided to try somewhere else. maybe she was afraid he couldn't defend her...maybe she didn't want to upset someone with frailties..maybe she was so scared she didn't know what she was doing...maybe she was paranoid and freaked out. mOO

Still doesn't explain not answering him for 30 seconds after he asked her if she needs help nor asking for anything from him that she could relay to the dispatcher. Wild screams for help at the top of her lungs is what logic would expect here. Not a deafening slicnece followed by a faint and contextless "i need help" followed by a spring back into danger.

 

[lohrtabitha]

She said nothing for 30 seconds , then barely got the words "I need help" out then ran off again. Idk what definitions of coherent and sober you looked up but thats very far from it. Next time your in dire need of help and someone asks you do you need help make sure to stare at them for 30 seconds silently. It's the quickest way to get help. Especially when you bannged on their door in the middle of the night running for a potential murderer. That's the most logical thing a sober coherent person would do. Don't explain a tbing , dont ask for an address, dont mention someone is chasing you, none of the logical, sober things that make sense. Just bang on door, get the response you wanted, which is for someone to open, then answer none of their questions and run off back into the danger zone.

So who is the man going to call? The police? The police that was headed by a Cheif Burke who frequented swinger parties with these escorts? Burke who beat the snot out of a young man which landed him in prison in addition to other things? Burke who would perhaps be brought down along with his officers when Shannan was going to testify in court? Burke who is back in prison for soliciting sex from male prostitutes? I'm sure all this was going through ner mind and can explain her silence and awkwardness. There was absolutely no one who she could trust to save her. So she ran. Imo

 

[Ruminations]

She said nothing for 30 seconds , then barely got the words "I need help" out then ran off again. Idk what definitions of coherent and sober you looked up but thats very far from it. Next time your in dire need of help and someone asks you do you need help make sure to stare at them for 30 seconds silently. It's the quickest way to get help. Especially when you bannged on their door in the middle of the night running for a potential murderer. That's the most logical thing a sober coherent person would do. Don't explain a tbing , dont ask for an address, dont mention someone is chasing you, none of the logical, sober things that make sense. Just bang on door, get the response you wanted, which is for someone to open, then answer none of their questions and run off back into the danger zone.

Well, she was out of breath! And it really wasn't the middle of the night anymore. It was very early morning. Coletti and his wife were up and getting dressed.

If I stayed up all night, had a scare, sprinted several hundred feet and then found an elderly man already calling 911, I would prefer to breathe over talking, too. I'm not sure I was a fit as she had to be to do that at 24.

Shannan did not know exactly what the danger was. Remember, she tried to find out from Pak if the plot was to kill her. He did not respond, "No! don't worry. Thats why I'm here. I have a gun." Nothing he did or said was reassuring. It's a small surprise that Shannan did not know who to trust by then. Pak may have sweet talked Coletti out of providing safety. No reason to feel safer there.

Also remember, Pak booked Brewer. We don't know what else or who else he was working with that night. We don't know who came and left from the community. We don't know if there had been bigger party at Brewers or elsewhere in the community. We don't know when Hackett inserted himself or how he got Mari's contact information. We don't know why people who, like Hackett, should be neutral, such as the Cannings, and if their reasons for inserting themselves were related to her murder or not.

MOO

 

[lohrtabitha]

Still doesn't explain not answering him for 30 seconds after he asked her if she needs help nor asking for anything from him that she could relay to the dispatcher. Wild screams for help at the top of her lungs is what logic would expect here. Not a deafening slicnece followed by a faint and contextless "i need help" followed by a spring back into danger.

Everyone responds to trauma differently and that is common knowledge. Imo