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[Just K]

It just SEEMS like way too many assumptions are being made... perhaps it depended on where there was still available space, light, cover, etc.... Perhaps it was just convenient to where he/she stopped the vehicle.

 

[Peter Brendt]

It just feels like way too many assumptions are being made... perhaps it depended on where there was still available space, light, cover, etc.... Perhaps it was just convenient to where he/she stopped the vehicle.

Since space, light and cover are almost equal over all the dump area, I doubt that. But of course, one can always "feel" things.

 

[marie-chantal]

It just feels like way too many assumptions are being made... perhaps it depended on where there was still available space, light, cover, etc.... Perhaps it was just convenient to where he/she stopped the vehicle.

That's what I think too. There's always the risk, even in the dead of night, that someone might happen upon you. I doubt he spent hours laying the bodies out. He probably had an idea of where he wanted them and then worked quickly to leave the bodies there. In addition to running the risk of someone happening upon him, he may have also been dealing with weather conditions that would impede upon his being able to spend a great deal of time placing the bodies in a very specific way.

 

[Peter Brendt]

That's what I think too. There's always the risk, even in the dead of night, that someone might happen upon you. I doubt he spent hours laying the bodies out. He probably had an idea of where he wanted them and then worked quickly to leave the bodies there. In addition to running the risk of someone happening upon him, he may have also been dealing with weather conditions that would impede upon his being able to spend a great deal of time placing the bodies in a very specific way.

One thing is always amazing to me. In each and every serial killer case, people tell what they "feel" and why each and every detail has to be just coincidence. Which is especially funny considering that we talk here about unsubs, who do things because they have a meaning to them ... just to get the point in here: Dahmer didn't build a skull altar by coincidence, Gacy didn't hunt by coincidence at the bus terminal, Bundy didn't hunt by coincidence on university campuses and so on. Still, in each and every case, there were a lot of people out there who "felt" things and told, it was all coincidence. So, can we go back to the details please?

 

[marie-chantal]

One thing is always amazing to me. In each and every serial killer case, people tell what they "feel" and why each and every detail has to be just coincidence. Which is especially funny considering that we talk here about unsubs, who do things because they have a meaning to them ... just to get the point in here: Dahmer didn't build a skull altar by coincidence, Gacy didn't hunt by coincidence at the bus terminal, Bundy didn't hunt by coincidence on university campuses and so on. Still, in each and every case, there were a lot of people out there who "felt" things and told, it was all coincidence. So, can we go back to the details please?

There's no need to be rude or dismissive. This thread is titled "Post your Theory". This is my theory. Maybe he felt that he had all the time in the world to stage the bodies; however, IMO, there is always the possibility that someone could happen upon the killer as he disposed of the bodies. The only way that there is zero possibility of this occurring is if he had someone looking out at the road for anyone passing by or if he did this on his own private land.

You have your theory, I have mine. You are free to disagree with it all you want, but please be respectful.

 

[CriminalMinds]

I believe the order from left(west) to right(east) was 4, 2, 1, 3.

yes--that's how i figured left-handed

 

[Just K]

Originally Posted by Peter Brendt View Post
"One thing is always amazing to me. In each and every serial killer case, people tell what they "feel" and why each and every detail has to be just coincidence. ... Still, in each and every case, there were a lot of people out there who "felt" things and told, it was all coincidence. So, can we go back to the details please?"

No one wants to argue semantics with posters. In the US, English speakers interchange the word "feel" with "perceive." The point was simply that ASSUMPTIONS cannot be made as to the left or right-handedness of the killer. When in fact, we don't have enough details and we don't even know if the dumper is the same person as the killer. So, yes, let's stick to the facts because with the facts that the public has been given there are very few conclusions that can be determined.

gfyah...

 

[deedee21]

There arent that many facts. Without assumptions and opinions there wouldnt be a forum. Our opinions are probably based more on what we dont know rather than what we do know. In my case anyway.

 

[nugzter]

I agree those two statements completely

I do see a hole in the theory of the killer "dating" the girls before he kills them. Like SG, most escorts keep notes of their Johns. Numbers, general apperance, favors requested, type of car, ect...I am sure LE has investigated this angle.

 

[Peter Brendt]

Originally Posted by Peter Brendt View Post
"One thing is always amazing to me. In each and every serial killer case, people tell what they "feel" and why each and every detail has to be just coincidence. ... Still, in each and every case, there were a lot of people out there who "felt" things and told, it was all coincidence. So, can we go back to the details please?"

No one wants to argue semantics with posters. In the US, English speakers interchange the word "feel" with "perceive." The point was simply that ASSUMPTIONS cannot be made as to the left or right-handedness of the killer. When in fact, we don't have enough details and we don't even know if the dumper is the same person as the killer. So, yes, let's stick to the facts because with the facts that the public has been given there are very few conclusions that can be determined.

gfyah...

Which leaves me at the same point. The dumping pattern is there. The order in which the victims have been dumped at Gilgo Beach is a fact. The way left- and right-haders react in direction based decision-situations is a well known fact. Adding two facts is called "deduction". It has not much to do with "assumption". An assumption would be guess work without any underlying facts.
To ignore the facts, whether you call it "feel" or "perceive", doesn't make them go away. So, thanks for the language hint (and I appreciate those, really), but well, the dumping pattern is still there ...

 

[Peter Brendt]

I do see a hole in the theory of the killer "dating" the girls before he kills them. Like SG, most escorts keep notes of their Johns. Numbers, general apperance, favors requested, type of car, ect...I am sure LE has investigated this angle.

To add to this:

1.) As soon, as LE could find TWO last Johns, the idea of a homicidal John should be off the table unless someone would claim those two last Johns were in it together. Now we know, they found that State Trooper. And we know, they stopped at a certain point looking for last Johns, which makes me think, they found them, but they didn't identify them to the public.

2.) If the killer would meet them several times, this would happen in the time, he is there or it would happen all year around. Now, we know, the murders happened all in May-September. In 2010, there were two victims, which would limit the time per victim to average 8 1/2 week per victim if his activity is limited to the months he also kills. This would be some money to spend in 8 1/2 weeks if every meeting would cost him at least $450. However, if his activity in the area would be stretched out over the whole year, why isn't he killing spread out over all the year?

3.) Why would it be necessary to meet the victims several times before killing them. It would only make the necessary objectization harder.

Just some added thoughts to the technical problem of prostitutes taking often notes.

 

[websurfer]

:twocents:

At first I was thinking mostly about the source of the burlap bags.
I am thinking they may be associated with:
Gardening?
Lots of people use them to plant and to transport plants.Also, plants in a burlap bag would be harder to detect[ if any dirt etc. was inside them.
Also:
I thought perhaps a nursery is nearby the dumping grounds. The recent SANDY storm probably unearthed more stuff so if I were LE I would go there and do some METAL DETECTING ASAP...
seems like some copycats may have dumped a few things there too?
I am thinking more burlap bags and jewelry?
After trying to find a possible match for the adult female and the child with jewelry, I have had no luck at all finding any matches.:waitasec:
I was thinking sisters?
Aunt and niece?
Mother and daughter?
Yet? No match for them yet? after all this time?
My theory is to find who they are then who was in touch with them or picked them up and where may help open some new leads?
WS:twocents:

 

[hawkshaw]

There arent that many facts. Without assumptions and opinions there wouldnt be a forum. Our opinions are probably based more on what we dont know rather than what we do know. In my case anyway.

I couldnt have said it better.

 

[LINative13]

Hello Ladies and Gentlemen,
With the recent developments here on the board and recent developments in my own off the radar investigating....I will now be participating in the discussion again.
Nat

 

[LINative13]

I have switched gears a little bit in regards to me own theory.

I took a walk through those "brambles", and let me tell you.....it is some nasty crap. Even with the vegetation dying off due to the cold, it is NASTY. I ripped my jeans and almost lost a shoe. The terrain seems to shift. One day you can probably have dry sand, but on other days and the day I was there.....it was not dry. It was gross. In the pitch black, accidental death is a very real possibility.

Does this make me think that SG actually did die accidentally? To be 100% honest; it does make is a possibility. She did not have to drown, she could have slipped and gotten knocked out and died of hypothermia. She could have also been murdered in there. I am just pointing out the fact that accidental death is a very real possibility in there. But the fact still remains her pants were found far from the body. I still do not think pants travel like that, so I still lean towards fould play.

 

[Peter Brendt]

Hello Ladies and Gentlemen,
With the recent developments here on the board and recent developments in my own off the radar investigating....I will now be participating in the discussion again.
Nat

Nice to have you back here

 

[Peter Brendt]

I have switched gears a little bit in regards to me own theory.

I took a walk through those "brambles", and let me tell you.....it is some nasty crap. Even with the vegetation dying off due to the cold, it is NASTY. I ripped my jeans and almost lost a shoe. The terrain seems to shift. One day you can probably have dry sand, but on other days and the day I was there.....it was not dry. It was gross. In the pitch black, accidental death is a very real possibility.

Does this make me think that SG actually did die accidentally? To be 100% honest; it does make is a possibility. She did not have to drown, she could have slipped and gotten knocked out and died of hypothermia. She could have also been murdered in there. I am just pointing out the fact that accidental death is a very real possibility in there. But the fact still remains her pants were found far from the body. I still do not think pants travel like that, so I still lean towards fould play.

Oookay, when you almost left your shoe ... and you didn't because you noticed it, but if you would have hasted on, haunted by your own drug induced demons ... how far would have this shoe been away from your body?

 

[LINative13]

It got stuck in the mud. I noticed it immediately. Am I answering your question?

As I was walking I stepped in deep mud. When I went to pull my leg out of it, by shoe got stuck and I felt it coming off. So I reached down, grabbed the heel of it and simu.tanesoly pulled my leg out and held onto my shoe. If I did not do that it would have been lost in the muck. It would not have floated hundreds of feet away though like her pants.

 

[Peter Brendt]

It got stuck in the mud. I noticed it immediately. Am I answering your question?

As I was walking I stepped in deep mud. When I went to pull my leg out of it, by shoe got stuck and I felt it coming off. So I reached down, grabbed the heel of it and simu.tanesoly pulled my leg out and held onto my shoe. If I did not do that it would have been lost in the muck. It would not have floated hundreds of feet away though like her pants.

No it wouldn't. But if you would be there at night in a bout of drug induced delusional paranoia, you would have not take the time to get the shoe. You would have hurried on. And if you would have died later, this shoe would be quite a way distant from your body then.

 

[marie-chantal]

It got stuck in the mud. I noticed it immediately. Am I answering your question?

As I was walking I stepped in deep mud. When I went to pull my leg out of it, by shoe got stuck and I felt it coming off. So I reached down, grabbed the heel of it and simu.tanesoly pulled my leg out and held onto my shoe. If I did not do that it would have been lost in the muck. It would not have floated hundreds of feet away though like her pants.

Regarding her pants, I think that the theory posited by LE that they fell off of her is ridiculous. It was reported that she was wearing skinny jeans. I don't know if anyone here ever wears skinny jeans, but if you do, then you'll know that this theory is absolutely ridiculous. Unless she was wearing skinny jeans that were 10 sizes too big for her (and I highly doubt that), they are not going to fall off while running. If you don't believe me, go get a pair of skinny jeans and try to run in them. They will not fall off. Trust me.

Even if she tried to remove them herself while running, it would have been very difficult. One of the features of skinny jeans is that they're really tight around the ankle area. It's not an easy thing to quickly take them off, especially while standing.

I don't know how she became separated from her pants, but I'm fairly certain that the pants didn't just fall off of her. Even if they got snagged on a branch, they're not going to totally rip away from the body that easily.