Questions you'd like answers to...

[UKGuy]

When Patsy said they were xerox copies, do you think she's talking about b/w copies on standard weight copy paper, yes or no?

GSM Weight Description
74 20lb bond/50lb text Most often found in your everyday copy machine.

https://paperworks.com/about-paper-weights

icedtea4me,
Who knows, I never saw any xerox productions, I've not seen the cutesy photographs either. It sounds like Patsy is offering an explanation but everyone knows it does not really explain much.

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[UKGuy]

I would say they are part of the crime scene.


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Cottonstar,
But which crime-scene, a staged one that Patsy cannot explain away? Or was someone photographing JonBenet and this is the basis for an assault scenario?

That BPD sought a search warrant for Michigan speaks volumes to me, and that the results were redacted, even more. My take away is that the cutesy photographs link one of the Ramsey's to JonBenet's death, but I dont know which one!

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[singularity]

Are the photographs staging or part of the basement crime-scene?

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How about both?

Like you say there is no dancing with Patsy, its like you found photographs, were they cute or what?

Like not its a homicide case and were they nasty, did somone abuse my baby etc?


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She didn't need to ask for detailed descriptions of the photographs because she knew what they were.



During one of the exchanges about photographs that morning they are beating around the bush and she interrupts them and asks if they are wondering why she's not in the photographs.

. My take away is that the cutesy photographs link one of the Ramsey's to JonBenet's death, but I dont know which one!

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I'll give you four guesses....the first one doesn't count.

 

[UKGuy]

How about both?

She didn't need to ask for detailed descriptions of the photographs because she knew what they were.



During one of the exchanges about photographs that morning they are beating around the bush and she interrupts them and asks if they are wondering why she's not in the photographs.

I'll give you four guesses....the first one doesn't count.

singularity,

How about both?

Yes it could be that.

She didn't need to ask for detailed descriptions of the photographs because she knew what they were.

Maybe that why she was asked

"HANEY: Did you take some photographs of JonBenét in the basement laundry room?

PATSY: No.

I reckon Haney thinks Patsy did indeed take those photos, thats if they actually exist and its not a trick question? That could be why Patsy wants to explain why she is not in them?

The interesting bit is DeMuth locks Patsy into visiting the Laundry Room regularly, now if the photographs were inconsequential Patsy could just say, I took one or two photographs, yet Patsy says she never took them.

So who does that leave ?


I reckon Patsy is lying and that she did take the photographs, but does not want linked to JonBenet along with the basement?

Patently the intruder never took the photographs, and if Patsy is denying taking them that must mean Patsy knows that the investigators will want to take a hard look at BR and JR.

I'm thinking this is why they got the search warrant for Michigan, if they find similar photographs there then they can narrow the options.

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[archieil]

Can you give some source for matters around photos?

I feel somewhat lost.

I am not sure what you are talking about.

On acandy, a lot of crime pictures has dead links and I feel it will be hard to find it myself.

 

[singularity]

I reckon Haney thinks Patsy did indeed take those photos, thats if they actually exist and its not a trick question? That could be why Patsy wants to explain why she is not in them?
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I don't think Haney believes she took those basement photos. He was fishing. He just didn't bait his hook.

As far as Patsy mentioning why she's not in them, that was in reference to the Christmas morning photographs, not the basement photos.

The interesting bit is DeMuth locks Patsy into visiting the Laundry Room regularly, now if the photographs were inconsequential Patsy could just say, I took one or two photographs, yet Patsy says she never took them.
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Under no circumstances was Patsy going to take credit for those photographs. Notice when she moves on from the 'xerox copies', she claims to know nothing.

That's not by accident.

So who does that leave ?
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John
John Andrew

I reckon Patsy is lying and that she did take the photographs, but does not want linked to JonBenet along with the basement?

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I don't believe she took them.....and of course they're going to distance themselves from those photographs. That's why they're in the basement in the first place.

 

[singularity]

Can you give some source for matters around photos?

I feel somewhat lost.

I am not sure what you are talking about.

On acandy, a lot of crime pictures has dead links and I feel it will be hard to find it myself.

The photographs we're discussing never leaked out in the open. You wont find them on candyrose.

There were photographs found in both houses that the family tried distancing themselves from. Actually they didn't try....they did it.

Weren't you IDI? That's probably why you haven't heard anything about them. IDI always pretended that the photos never existed.

If you want to read about them, dive into the lengthy transcripts.

 

[DeDee]

Daylight was 7:20am on Christmas morning. This picture probably was taken around 6am. Possibly before. Most of all the presents are still unopened.


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I am thrilled to find this discussion on photos. The photo being discussed of JBR has always intrigued me.

The lights are off in the room. An eyewitness claimed that room always had the lights turned on except for Christmas Night.

It is dark outdoors. Yet, JB is performing a cutesy pose for her audience. Is Little Miss Christmas wearing her death apparel? The bottoms certainly resemble the longjohns. The white top seems a bit more loose around the waist than I recall the Gap Star shirt having.

The Christmas Tree lights are not lit. Actually, that was the first thing I noticed when seeing the image. Many families leave their Christmas Tree lights on Christmas Eve and Christmas Night. [Unless Christmas is not celebrated at your home.]

As far as the time being studied on the image:
The 8 is not a part of the time. It is a part of a package or gift wrapped present. Then, again, If she was awake at 2:25AM, wouldn't she be dead very soon after the photograph was snapped, in order, to stay within the Timeline?

The time is 2:25AM. How do I know that? Common sense, maybe.Or maybe I'm wrong. Someone snapped this photo during the wee hours of the morning. Which morning is the question.

 

[archieil]

https://www.timeanddate.com/sun/usa/boulder?month=12&year=1996

I was curious.

 

[Tortoise]

I've done some digging. What I've been able to come up with is that this camera had been used by the family previously, so it wasn't a gift opened that morning, and it wasn't the same camera used to snap the other two pictures of JonBenet that morning.

I'll post the image of the photo taken that morning again, for comparison against some of the family's older photos. I now think the 2:25 is the time and not a date setting, because I believe the 25 is set too close to the 2 before it.

The photo was taken Christmas morning (I would say closer to 2am than 6am given the complete darkness outside) before they opened the presents and JonBenet is wearing her pink pyjamas, not the longjohns.

 

[Tortoise]

 

[Tortoise]

 

[Tortoise]

 

[Tortoise]

Last one, showing the camera also had a date function but the digits are set further apart.

 

[Cottonstar]

Last one, showing the camera also had a date function but the digits are set further apart.

Hey, great pull Tortoise. What I gather from the set of photos you posted is that the camera was multi-functional, and you could toggle the settings for how the date/time was to be displayed. One photo has just the month/day/year. Other ones seem to have the time/year setting on. Nevertheless, as you can see from the ‘87 year being on more than one photo, which obviously, isn’t the correct year, is that no one hardly set the correct day/time function on the camera. Back in the 90’s you saw this all of the time.

Also, 6am on Xmas morning it was pitch dark outside. She is wearing the same pajamas in the other two Xmas pictures we have of her.


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[UKGuy]

I don't think Haney believes she took those basement photos. He was fishing. He just didn't bait his hook.

As far as Patsy mentioning why she's not in them, that was in reference to the Christmas morning photographs, not the basement photos.


Under no circumstances was Patsy going to take credit for those photographs. Notice when she moves on from the 'xerox copies', she claims to know nothing.

That's not by accident.






John
John Andrew



I don't believe she took them.....and of course they're going to distance themselves from those photographs. That's why they're in the basement in the first place.

singularity,
Yet John Andrew has an alibi, I could also see PR flinging him under the bus to explain away the photos.

I agree Patsy does not want linked with the photographs, I'm thinking this:

HANEY: If she was doing something really cutesy or something, would you maybe run and get the camera, take one of her?

does not mean anything illegal, if he does not think Patsy took them, then Patsy has ruled herself out.

"HANEY: Did you take some photographs of JonBenét in the basement laundry room?

That is pretty specific, as if its the basement laundry room that is important, and not some cutesy photograph?

Was it Patsy who said JonBenet never liked the basement, yet Haney has one or more photographs of her snapped in the Laundry Room?

JonBenet did a lot of photographic sessions, commercial and private, BPD would be able to rule out the commercial stuff, including the pageant shots. I'll bet this will be why they searched Michigan, since finding a collection there would demonstrate a pattern of behaviour.

Looks like the photos have been dumped to sever any link with the Ramsey who was taking snaps of JonBenet? Could be one or both parents applying the precautionary principle?

 

[Tortoise]

Records show the stages of twilight on Christmas morning 1996

Astronomical twilight 5:43 am
Nautical twilight 6:16 am
Civil twilight 6:50 am
Sunrise 7:21 am

After Astronomical twilight the sky is no longer pitch dark, so in my view the photo was taken before 5:43 am.

 

[Tortoise]

What to make of it?

I'm leaning towards Burke and JonBenet getting up in the wee hours, before John and Patsy. That explains two different cameras in use. I'm also thinking now about the partially unwrapped gifts that I've read Burke (reluctantly?) took responsibility for - were they caught red-handed?

It's possible they may have been in a bit of trouble and those gifts were taken away. But why wouldn't they admit it? They always needed to project this perfect image but that's not what family life is like.

 

[UKGuy]

What to make of it?

I'm leaning towards Burke and JonBenet getting up in the wee hours, before John and Patsy. That explains two different cameras in use. I'm also thinking now about the partially unwrapped gifts that I've read Burke (reluctantly?) took responsibility for - were they caught red-handed?

It's possible they may have been in a bit of trouble and those gifts were taken away. But why wouldn't they admit it? They always needed to project this perfect image but that's not what family life is like.

Tortoise.
Yes, kinda looks that way, can you see a tired parent rising early? From memory JR allegedly told BR what might be a suitable time to awaken him up.

There is no proof but it looks like BR took some photos, he said he and JonBenet took photos of each other opening gifts.

Also when Kolar interviewed BR , BR said he was in the wine-cellar Christmas Afternoon, and admitted opening some of the gifts despite Patsy sayng she did that?

You have to wonder if Kolar asked BR if he ever took snaps of JonBenet in the Laundry Room?

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[Cottonstar]

Records show the stages of twilight on Christmas morning 1996

Astronomical twilight 5:43 am
Nautical twilight 6:16 am
Civil twilight 6:50 am
Sunrise 7:21 am

After Astronomical twilight the sky is no longer pitch dark, so in my view the photo was taken before 5:43 am.

Right. But, in real time you wouldn’t be able to see any hint of daylight until about 6:50ish. With kids that young, they were probably up around 5:30ish anyways, regardless of what John and Patsy claimed.

Also, both JR and PR said that JR brought Patsy’s bike in from the garage right before they opened presents that morning. We know Patsy’s bike is behind JB in the pic.


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