Ramsey reaction to JonBenet's death

[Solace]

We can't defeat death but we can have our small victories. When you are asked to reminisce about somebody who has died it is your chance at a small victory.

Wow, I really like that.

I see how some would say the handful comment in and of itself does not imply guilt, but see what Albert said above. Given everything that has occurred, given the fact that he has been publicly accused of this crime, wouldn't you think he'd take this moment to express love for JB. The handful comment is one of many things that is "off" with him. So agree about the other "off" thing...the compassion he felt for John Mark Karr...WTF????

If I were him, I would have taken the opportunity to speak from the heart. I agree this is not an incriminating statement, but it is a strange thing to say if you just leave it at that.

I agree. It is most definitely an opportunity to say how much he loved her.

 

[Toltec]

No doubt John loved his little girl....JonBenet was daddy's little girl.

I guess calling her a sparkplug or a handful is his way of trying to tell people she was a little bratty, a little stubborn, and a very smart and delightful child.

 

[Solace]

No doubt John loved his little girl....JonBenet was daddy's little girl.

I guess calling her a sparkplug or a handful is his way of trying to tell people she was a little bratty, a little stubborn, and a very smart and delightful child.

You have to check out the other thread where Rocket posts part of the interview Detective Haney has with Patsy. Rocket is so good.

 

[Ames]

I totally agree. And geez....what a way to describe your dead daughter. He had also described her as a "spark plug". A spark plug and a handful. You are right, there should have been a BUT after, "she was a handful"....something like, oh maybe...I don't know...."She was a handful, but we loved her with all of our hearts, she was our little girl, and you have no idea how greatly she will be missed. There is a void in our lives now that can never be filled. The person that killed her is still out there, and we will not STOP until he is caught!!! He took away our baby, and we will never, ever forgive him. She was our heart and our soul....our precious baby girl". BUT NO....John says..."she was a handful"...and leaves it at that. Maybe they should have inscribed "JonBenet Patricia Ramsey....she was our handful, and our sparkplug", on her tombstone. The more I think about those descriptions...the madder I get. (IMO)

As I have stated in an earlier post above...this is what I would have expected John to say about his daughter.

 

[rashomon]

Yeah, he felt sorry for Karr, because he KNEW that Karr wasn't guilty...and had admitted to something that he didn't do, and was being torn apart by the public. IMO...he KNEW that Karr wasn't guilty from the start....and how did John know this? Because IMO he knew and still knows who the killer is. IMO IMO

John's reaction to the Karr arrest speaks volumes indeed.
He knew Karr had never been in that house and that this would be found out soon. Hence his trying to downplay things by telling the media not to jump to conclusions and that he felt sorry for Karr.

 

[Ames]

John's reaction to the Karr arrest speaks volumes indeed.
He knew Karr had never been in that house and that this would be found out soon. Hence his trying to downplay things by telling the media not to jump to conclusions and that he felt sorry for Karr.

Exactamundo!! When I heard him say that he "felt sorry for Karr'...my mouth dropped to the floor, and I said to the tv...."WHAT?" I thought that it spoke volumes....HUGE volumes....a bright, red FLAG.

 

[Toltec]

You have to check out the other thread where Rocket posts part of the interview Detective Haney has with Patsy. Rocket is so good.

The "basement" episode was discussed in a previous thread....you might want to search for it.

 

[JMO8778]

Exactamundo!! When I heard him say that he "felt sorry for Karr'...my mouth dropped to the floor, and I said to the tv...."WHAT?" I thought that it spoke volumes....HUGE volumes....a bright, red FLAG.

It seems he's more concerned about overall not looking like an angry person,than he is an understandably angry parent of a murdered child whose killer hasn't been found.

 

[Ames]

It seems he's more concerned about overall not looking like an angry person,than he is an understandably angry parent of a murdered child whose killer hasn't been found.

Yes, and I find that quite odd. His daughter was murdered, he has the right to be angry about that, and at the murderer. But, yet...he wants to come off as Mr. Nice Guy. And I think that its just an act...so that people will continue to say..."There is NO WAY he had a part in his daughter's murder...he is such a NICE GUY". Bull.......manure.

 

[BBB167893]

JR was not talking about his dear daughter murdered by an intruder, rather he was subconciously letting it slip that there was a good reason for Patsy's rage attack on JonBenet. She was a handful alright.

Oops!

 

[Albert18]

I think people may have misunderstood the intent of my first post in this thread, so let me try again. Purge any staging from your mind while reading this!!!!!

Let's say you are in the front yard of your house. You are trying to get your little girl to put on a jacket and she isn't cooperating. In fact, she is being downright naughty and disrespectful to you. In the ensuing melee, she runs into the street, is hit by a car and is killed.

FORGET ALL THE STAGING!

Look at it as two events; a private event that involved the head injury, which the Ramsey's have never talked about and in fact deny it even occurred and a public event, which is the staging and which is blamed on the poor intruder.

What I'm trying to understand is how this family, and I mean the entire bunch of relatives, have stuck together like glue throughout this ordeal. Is it because they look at that night differently then we do?

Now I realize there are questions. Why stage an accident to look like a murder? (You mean besides the fact intruders don't come into a person's house and cause accidents?)

 

[UKGuy]

I think people may have misunderstood the intent of my first post in this thread, so let me try again. Purge any staging from your mind while reading this!!!!!

Let's say you are in the front yard of your house. You are trying to get your little girl to put on a jacket and she isn't cooperating. In fact, she is being downright naughty and disrespectful to you. In the ensuing melee, she runs into the street, is hit by a car and is killed.

FORGET ALL THE STAGING!

Look at it as two events; a private event that involved the head injury, which the Ramsey's have never talked about and in fact deny it even occurred and a public event, which is the staging and which is blamed on the poor intruder.

What I'm trying to understand is how this family, and I mean the entire bunch of relatives, have stuck together like glue throughout this ordeal. Is it because they look at that night differently then we do?

Now I realize there are questions. Why stage an accident to look like a murder? (You mean besides the fact intruders don't come into a person's house and cause accidents?)

Albert18,

Most cases of domestic child abuse and neglect are staged as accidents, precisely because of the wish to disguise the actual cause of any injury. Also an accident, generally, does not carry the criminal consequences that an assault would.

JonBenet's injuries are enough to dispel any notion that her death was accidental, she was asphyxiated twice, sexually assaulted, and whacked across the head, causing a severe cranial fracture, not discounting her facial injuries, she had abrasions and contusions on the rest of her body.

Her death was intentional, she was killed to silence her, and her final resting place was staged to look like a murder, because thats what it was!


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[rashomon]

Albert18,

Most cases of domestic child abuse and neglect are staged as accidents, precisely because of the wish to disguise the actual cause of any injury. Also an accident, generally, does not carry the criminal consequences that an assault would.

JonBenet's injuries are enough to dispel any notion that her death was accidental, she was asphyxiated twice, sexually assaulted, and whacked across the head, causing a severe cranial fracture, not discounting her facial injuries, she had abrasions and contusions on the rest of her body.

Her death was intentional, she was killed to silence her, and her final resting place was staged to look like a murder, because thats what it was!

I think the term 'accident' is misleading here. 'Rage attack' would describe it far better imo.
In the infamous Jeffrey MacDonald case for example, we have a rage attack which was then staged by the father as "murder by intruders". This case and the JBR case have a lot in common.

 

[rashomon]

Albert18,

Most cases of domestic child abuse and neglect are staged as accidents, precisely because of the wish to disguise the actual cause of any injury. Also an accident, generally, does not carry the criminal consequences that an assault would.

JonBenet's injuries are enough to dispel any notion that her death was accidental, she was asphyxiated twice, sexually assaulted, and whacked across the head, causing a severe cranial fracture, not discounting her facial injuries, she had abrasions and contusions on the rest of her body.

Her death was intentional, she was killed to silence her, and her final resting place was staged to look like a murder, because thats what it was!

UkGuy,

The autopsy report mentions nothing about her being asphyxiated twice. The second abrasion on her neck (and it was only an abrasion) probably came from the stager's fumbling with the cord.
For it takes quite a bit of fingerwork to do this knot. The knot is not complicated (it is a so-called double loop slip knot), but trying to loop the cord around itself and adjusting it could have casued the (other) abrasion, especially if it was a layperson not familiar with effective and quick knot-tying.

And where did JB have 'contusions' on the rest of her body? Weren't they all only abrasions?

 

[Albert18]

Yes when I say accident, I am thinking rage attack. Somebody lost it, somehow. Whatever happened, JonBenet ended up hurt.

 

[Toltec]

Striking your child causing an eight inch fracture is murder...even though it was a split-hair decision by Patsy. She could not take it back so self-preservation kicked in and the staging ensued.

 

[Ames]

Striking your child causing an eight inch fracture is murder...even though it was a split-hair decision by Patsy. She could not take it back so self-preservation kicked in and the staging ensued.

Yep, and the reason that she didn't throw her in the car, and go blasting down the street to the ER, is because she isn't stupid...she knew that the ER Docs, would figure out that it was NO accident (by accident, I mean falling down or something)...and that the police would be called, and that her fanny would be thrown in jail. Therefore...the self-preservation kicked in. Why go to the ER and for sure be thrown in jail....when you can stage an "intruder did it" crime scene...and maybe...JUST MAYBE...get away with it?

 

[UKGuy]

UkGuy,

The autopsy report mentions nothing about her being asphyxiated twice. The second abrasion on her neck (and it was only an abrasion) probably came from the stager's fumbling with the cord.
For it takes quite a bit of fingerwork to do this knot. The knot is not complicated (it is a so-called double loop slip knot), but trying to loop the cord around itself and adjusting it could have casued the (other) abrasion, especially if it was a layperson not familiar with effective and quick knot-tying.

And where did JB have 'contusions' on the rest of her body? Weren't they all only abrasions?

rashomon,

Ok abrasions, on her legs , back , neck and face, imo not the result of any accident.

The autopsy report mentions nothing about her being asphyxiated twice.

Of course it does'nt, just as it does not state that JonBenet was probably sexually assaulted more than once, or whacked about the head more than once.

imo Coroner Meyer was economic with the truth when he authored that autopsy report, and we know the police were telling him to redact specific details, I reckon although generally correct, that there are some items of information yet to to be revealed?

That lower mark is a compressed material abrasion its generally seen on victims who have been stalked or surprise attacked where the offender uses the victims shirt, blouse, scarf to subdue and asphyxiate the victim, search google and you will be offered text book examples of this.

It does not require knot-tying acumen or proficiency to asphyxiate someone either manually or using a garrote such as cord, wire etc.

The lower abrasion can plainly be seen to differ from the upper abrasion which is neatly circumferential the lower one is not, it only appears precisely where you might expect someones hands/thumbs to be, is broken , and does not appear on the back of her neck.

The evidence is before your eyes, yet you offer the excuse that JonBenet's killer fumbled, or did JonBenet involuntarly wet her herself post-mortem?

JonBenet's death is not the result of some parent losing it or a rage attack, she was killed probably because she refused her killer's sexual demands, her killer knew she was going to talk, so JonBenet was killed specifically to silence her.

As far as I know there is no death penalty for an accidental death, but there may be for a murder, so for a parent not to arrange medical assistance for an injured daughter, particularly when on a prior occassion where Burke accidently whacked JonBenet on the face with a golf-club, she was rushed straight to hospital, must allow you to ask why so?


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[Ames]

rashomon,

Ok abrasions, on her legs , back , neck and face, imo not the result of any accident.


Of course it does'nt, just as it does not state that JonBenet was probably sexually assaulted more than once, or whacked about the head more than once.

imo Coroner Meyer was economic with the truth when he authored that autopsy report, and we know the police were telling him to redact specific details, I reckon although generally correct, that there are some items of information yet to to be revealed?

That lower mark is a compressed material abrasion its generally seen on victims who have been stalked or surprise attacked where the offender uses the victims shirt, blouse, scarf to subdue and asphyxiate the victim, search google and you will be offered text book examples of this.

It does not require knot-tying acumen or proficiency to asphyxiate someone either manually or using a garrote such as cord, wire etc.

The lower abrasion can plainly be seen to differ from the upper abrasion which is neatly circumferential the lower one is not, it only appears precisely where you might expect someones hands/thumbs to be, is broken , and does not appear on the back of her neck.

The evidence is before your eyes, yet you offer the excuse that JonBenet's killer fumbled, or did JonBenet involuntarly wet her herself post-mortem?

JonBenet's death is not the result of some parent losing it or a rage attack, she was killed probably because she refused her killer's sexual demands, her killer knew she was going to talk, so JonBenet was killed specifically to silence her.

As far as I know there is no death penalty for an accidental death, but there may be for a murder, so for a parent not to arrange medical assistance for an injured daughter, particularly when on a prior occassion where Burke accidently whacked JonBenet on the face with a golf-club, she was rushed straight to hospital, must allow you to ask why so?


.

I would think that there would be a difference in taking your unconscious daughter to the ER with a smashed in skull...and taking her to the ER after being accidently hit in the face with a golf club, by her brother.

 

[UKGuy]

I would think that there would be a difference in taking your unconscious daughter to the ER with a smashed in skull...and taking her to the ER after being accidently hit in the face with a golf club, by her brother.

Ames,

Please explain the difference to me?



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