Rescued beagles experience grass & sunlight for the 1st time

[Hopeful One]

HC - I don't think you have to worry about boring people. Quite the opposite, actually. I, for one, love coming here to read and catch up on Romi's progress. It's one of the nice threads to come to after reading all the bad stuff in this world.

So, don't stop the updates!

 

[Mom who cares]

Herding Cats: Boring us? Are you kidding? I crave these updates, they brighten my days and I often come back and re-read this thread. Blessings to you and the herd!

 

[Opie]

Boring? No way, HC. I'm another fan of these updates and sure hope you keep them coming. It's so wonderful to "see" Romi developing into a real dog.

 

[MicciStella]

HC - I don't think you have to worry about boring people. Quite the opposite, actually. I, for one, love coming here to read and catch up on Romi's progress. It's one of the nice threads to come to after reading all the bad stuff in this world.

So, don't stop the updates!

Boring? No way, HC. I'm another fan of these updates and sure hope you keep them coming. It's so wonderful to "see" Romi developing into a real dog.

Herding Cats: Boring us? Are you kidding? I crave these updates, they brighten my days and I often come back and re-read this thread. Blessings to you and the herd!

And all other here..... You guys rock...... smile...

No HC and Romi-bomi and co never ever will bore us...... Right?......

So why don't we build up the

Romi-bomi Romeo and Herd Fanclub...... smile.....

Thanks for brighten up my day....

love blessing and woof arrrooooooooooooow for you all

Micci with loving beasties Bobby and Gingy

 

[justbeachy]

How on earth did I miss this thread??? I saw the original video, but missed everything about Romi!!! No worries...I've now read all 17 pages and caught up everything (tears, smiles, laughter, more tears, lots of smiles!).

HC - you are an angel. A lot of people *say* they want to help, but you DID IT. You changed little Romi's life forever!! His entire view of the world has changed because of YOU! I'm honored to say I know you even if it's just in the virtual sense. Such an inspiring and heart-warming story...and your journey together is just beginning.

Romi is one lucky beagle! I bet he never could have imagined his life would turn out so beautifully!

 

[MicciStella]

Welcome in Romis life Justbeachy.....

Yes he is a trooper... I am really proud of him... But even prouder of HC with her golden heart... Smile....

You are great to read thru all ... Smile.. But I think it is like reading a wonderful book... ...


by the way I don't know if you saw this one..... you might like it...... lol....

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=159575"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

we do love it a lot.....


Blessings

Micci

 

[Herding Cats]

I'm sad today. I had to smack Romi last night. The offense was definitely terrible, and it was a justified smacking, but still. It bothers me.

He has been progressively more and more growly over bones. Nothing else, just bones. He has begun to take bones into his bed, and will protect them come hell or high water. Last night, he and Gracie were growling over bones; all she does is bark at him, and she does growl back, but will back off.

But last night, he was in the bedroom, and I was coming in for something or other. And he growled at me...

I laid over the bed, and gave him the "mad dog" look. It's enough to get Gracie to back off, but not Romi. He growled right in my face. I growled back. He looked a bit surprised, but still...kept growling. So, because *I* am pack leader, I reached down to remove the bone (because darn it, that is what the pack leader would do...take the bone if they wanted it). He snarled. Not just growled, but actual lips back snarled at me.

So I popped him (very gently, mind you, very gently), told him "no", and took the bone away. He was so surprised, but still maintained his nasty posture. And growled (at least it wasn't snarling) again. And then got another bone and put it in front of himself, and growled at me again. So I reached down to get it, and he curled his lip at me. So I popped him again (very gently, please know that!!). This time, he moved all the way off his bed, broke eye contact, and gave "submissive posture".

He didn't growl at me or Gracie again last night, but he did keep one bone in his bed with him.

I'm at a bit of a loss. I don't want to stop giving bones, as I believe they are very important for both dental health as well as emotional health. But I won't tolerate a growly, snarly dog either. Grace did that over her food once, so I took it away (the only meal she's ever missed), and she never did it again.

So I'm thinking about curtailing the bones. I am thinking of restricting the collection of bones (meaning, removing all bones that are not the "current" one). And I'm thinking of limiting the place he can take the bone, meaning only in the living room.

I still feel terribly about popping him...it didn't hurt (I'd never hurt any animal unless they were hurting me...), but it was needed to let him know "I am the giver of the bone, and I am the taker of the bone" and I just can't tolerate a snarling dog. He needs to know that I'm the boss, even over the bones.

This is the ONLY time I've ever popped him. And he is only like this around bones. So I'm at a bit of a loss as to how to correct this, still allow him to have his own personality and satisfy his needs, but that does not include dominance over me.

Any one have any other ideas? I'm kinda lost. And I feel terrible, too. He's not holding it against me - came for cuddles last night, gave me lovies this morning - but I feel so sad.

Best-
Herding Cats

 

[amandab]

Awwwwww, HC - that had to be so tough. (hugs)

Definitely sounds like you did the right thing, though - that kind of behavior can't be allowed to take root.

Personally, I wouldn't worry about it too much if I were you - just keep an eye on him and see if his bone behavior shows improvement after the correction.

Tough love sucks. :/

 

[Steely Dan]

I'm sad today. I had to smack Romi last night. The offense was definitely terrible, and it was a justified smacking, but still. It bothers me.

He has been progressively more and more growly over bones. Nothing else, just bones. He has begun to take bones into his bed, and will protect them come hell or high water. Last night, he and Gracie were growling over bones; all she does is bark at him, and she does growl back, but will back off.

But last night, he was in the bedroom, and I was coming in for something or other. And he growled at me...

I laid over the bed, and gave him the "mad dog" look. It's enough to get Gracie to back off, but not Romi. He growled right in my face. I growled back. He looked a bit surprised, but still...kept growling. So, because *I* am pack leader, I reached down to remove the bone (because darn it, that is what the pack leader would do...take the bone if they wanted it). He snarled. Not just growled, but actual lips back snarled at me.

So I popped him (very gently, mind you, very gently), told him "no", and took the bone away. He was so surprised, but still maintained his nasty posture. And growled (at least it wasn't snarling) again. And then got another bone and put it in front of himself, and growled at me again. So I reached down to get it, and he curled his lip at me. So I popped him again (very gently, please know that!!). This time, he moved all the way off his bed, broke eye contact, and gave "submissive posture".

He didn't growl at me or Gracie again last night, but he did keep one bone in his bed with him.

I'm at a bit of a loss. I don't want to stop giving bones, as I believe they are very important for both dental health as well as emotional health. But I won't tolerate a growly, snarly dog either. Grace did that over her food once, so I took it away (the only meal she's ever missed), and she never did it again.

So I'm thinking about curtailing the bones. I am thinking of restricting the collection of bones (meaning, removing all bones that are not the "current" one). And I'm thinking of limiting the place he can take the bone, meaning only in the living room.

I still feel terribly about popping him...it didn't hurt (I'd never hurt any animal unless they were hurting me...), but it was needed to let him know "I am the giver of the bone, and I am the taker of the bone" and I just can't tolerate a snarling dog. He needs to know that I'm the boss, even over the bones.

This is the ONLY time I've ever popped him. And he is only like this around bones. So I'm at a bit of a loss as to how to correct this, still allow him to have his own personality and satisfy his needs, but that does not include dominance over me.

Any one have any other ideas? I'm kinda lost. And I feel terrible, too. He's not holding it against me - came for cuddles last night, gave me lovies this morning - but I feel so sad.

Best-
Herding Cats

A friend of mine had a westie and she would stare him in the eye. It made him very uncomfortable and he'd assume the passive pose. She said it was her way of reminding him "I'm alpha."

 

[Herding Cats]

Steely, yes, and when I stare him down, he will back off. Except over bones. Then, he returns the stare. That's the "mad dog" look - it's supposed to remind the submissive dog they are actually submissive. Pack leaders use it all the time, and it's very, very effective. And it works well with Romi, except when it comes to the bones.

He takes "no" and "ehhhhhhh" very well, in every area...he's very responsive when he knows what you want, and will do what he can to figure out what it is you're asking for, and give it to you.

Except for the bones. When it comes to those, his gloves come off, and he assumes the aggressive posturing.

In the wild, the pack leader would snap and snarl to back off the offending pack member. I don't have a good snarl, but I do have a good growl, and my snap is a gentle pop.

I just don't want him to start equating bones=his dominance. I also don't want him to get a complex because I'm asserting my dominance in the bone arena.

I just don't know. I am going to stop allowing it into the bed room, though...I think he sees that as "his cave", and it should be. But he also shares it with me and Gracie and whichever cat happens to be there, so I *can't* have that behavior in the bedroom. I just don't like restricting him...he's so new to freedom, you know?

But maybe with freedom comes learning new rules, and learning new behaviors, and respect.

Just not sure about everything. Unknown territory...although I've dealt with food aggression in cats, Gracie, and my horses. Seems to be the same principle...I am the giver of food/bones, I am the taker-away of food/bones, and it's when and how I say it is."

Just a bit tough, because it's Romi. I've popped Grace, the horses, the cats...but Romi seems so fragile, you know? Maybe he's not as fragile as I seem to think...

Dunno.

Amanda, I will see how the behavior shapes up over the next few days. And yes, tough love is, indeed, tough.

sigh.

Best-
Herding Cats

 

[MicciStella]

Oh my dear HC .....

Don't you worry... I know how hard it is to punish the babies like this... But it is like with human kids.... They try and have to find their boundaries.. And if not listen, well than a little spanking... It hurts mommy or daddy more than the babies...

What I say, but I am sure I don't have to tell you, that no one should use the hand instead rolled up news paper or something like this... And what helped too is after getting the little spanky keep it close ... If he does it again it even might be that you only have to wave the roll and he backs off...

I know it breaks your heart to punish but sometimes it is necessary ... And tell yourself for your own sake: IT IS ONLY A PHASE..... IT IS ONLY A PHASE... He is still trying to find his place....

But KNOW ... You do a wonderful job....

You are loved and we understand how you feel...

Blessings and woof arrroooooooows

Micci and beagles

 

[Steely Dan]

Oh my dear HC .....

Don't you worry... I know how hard it is to punish the babies like this... But it is like with human kids.... They try and have to find their boundaries.. And if not listen, well than a little spanking... It hurts mommy or daddy more than the babies...

What I say, but I am sure I don't have to tell you, that no one should use the hand instead rolled up news paper or something like this... And what helped too is after getting the little spanky keep it close ... If he does it again it even might be that you only have to wave the roll and he backs off...

I know it breaks your heart to punish but sometimes it is necessary ... And tell yourself for your own sake: IT IS ONLY A PHASE..... IT IS ONLY A PHASE... He is still trying to find his place....

But KNOW ... You do a wonderful job....

You are loved and we understand how you feel...

Blessings and woof arrroooooooows

Micci and beagles

BBM

 

[MicciStella]

BBM

Good Grief...lol ......Steely ... Didn't I just write on other part you have far to much time to dig out all that.... Do I really have to let the super duper Emu know.... Smile....

Nice find though ...

Blessings

Micci

 

[Steely Dan]

Good Grief...lol ......Steely ... Didn't I just write on other part you have far to much time to dig out all that.... Do I really have to let the super duper Emu know.... Smile....

Nice find though ...

Blessings

Micci

It literally took me about 1 minute to find that. I remembered the cartoon and searched for it on Google under different titles until I found it.

 

[Herding Cats]

LOLing at you, Steely. When I was a wee kid, we had a baby sitter. She relied on the wooden spoon on a regular basis. My brother and I didn't like her at all - much less when the spoon came out. One night, my brother and I secreted some spoons of our own in the bedroom; and when she came, and she went for her spoon, she was met by two kids, in bunk beds, waving their own spoons right back at her.

She never sat for us again.

We were not disappointed.

Micci, the only issue I have with using a rolled newspaper is timing. Correction has to happen immediately, so unless I have the paper in my hand, the timing is blown (I learned that with horses; cats don't care. LOL). So I have, and probably will, continue to (gently, gently, lightly, lightly) pop with my hand (and it's very light, I promise; I'm not beating any animal, please know that) because of timing.

Still, having to do that made me sad. He's not holding it against me - he's just as sweet and dear as he's been before. The real test will be tonight when the bones come out...I am going to restrict to the living room, and we will see how that goes.

I agree - he's still trying to figure out his place in the home, and with Grace. He is learning, and learning is hard...but it can be done, and he's doing his best. I just hope I'm doing MY best, you know?

Best-
Herding Cats

 

[Penelope]

One of my Karelian Bear Dogs has behaviour similar to Romi. He is not food aggressive, but tends to guard his dog cookies and chews. He will growl and snarl when the other dogs go near him, but he knows that if mom growls back at him or says something to him, he backs off and will even let the dogs have his treat. It took a little while, but he knows I am the Alpha. My youngest Karelian, Yogi, is only a year old and I have had to correct him quite a few times. I hated to do it, but it is necessary.

It must be heartbreaking to correct Romi as I can imagine all those years when he never had a bone or treat of his own. He must LOVE his bones so much. I had a stepson who had lived in an abusive situation with his aunt. She deprived him of food when he was younger, and as an adult he used to hide food in his room yet deny it was there. Romi's behaviour is probably the result of deprivation and he is so afraid that he is never going to get another bone that he does not want ANYONE near the one he has. Who knows what was done to him in the lab? Maybe they gave him bones or treats only to take them away.

 

[Herding Cats]

One of my Karelian Bear Dogs has behaviour similar to Romi. He is not food aggressive, but tends to guard his dog cookies and chews. He will growl and snarl when the other dogs go near him, but he knows that if mom growls back at him or says something to him, he backs off and will even let the dogs have his treat. It took a little while, but he knows I am the Alpha. My youngest Karelian, Yogi, is only a year old and I have had to correct him quite a few times. I hated to do it, but it is necessary.

It must be heartbreaking to correct Romi as I can imagine all those years when he never had a bone or treat of his own. He must LOVE his bones so much. I had a stepson who had lived in an abusive situation with his aunt. She deprived him of food when he was younger, and as an adult he used to hide food in his room yet deny it was there. Romi's behaviour is probably the result of deprivation and he is so afraid that he is never going to get another bone that he does not want ANYONE near the one he has. Who knows what was done to him in the lab? Maybe they gave him bones or treats only to take them away.

That's exactly it, Penelope, and why it's so hard to discipline him. Believe me, I have no issues disciplining Grace - she lives in Doggy Disneyland, you know? And so does Romi, but he has 5 years to overcome of living in a cage, people poking him, experimenting on him, and so on. And Romi didn't even know what a bone was, let alone what to do with it, when he first got here.

I don't want to take his joy away; I don't want to pop his happy bubble. He loves his bones, and he is so happy when he's chewing on it.

Sigh. It's hard, I guess, and it's just something that comes with the territory. I just don't like it much.

Right now, they're both here in the living room with me; Romi tucked up on his hearth, Gracie sprawled with her stuffie. I love them both so much, you know? They are so dear to me.

I want to do right by Romi-bomi, and the rest of the herd...

micci, you're right (I know I said it earlier), but he's still learning the rules, and learning what a world outside of a cage is like. I'm sure I'm taking this far harder than he did....

Best-
Herding Cats

ETA: I love Karelian Bear Dogs...

 

[Herding Cats]

So what I did last night was give the bones once each pup was in their own bed. No growling, no trading, no fussing...just each with their bones, chewing happily.

I think that perhaps this is the way to go, at least until Grace is allowed out of her pen at night (which is coming soon...). Romi gets to have his bone in bed, Gracie doesn't have to worry if Romi is going to steal her bone or plot to retake the bone from him, and I'm right there to handle anything untoward should it happen.

I'll give it another go tonight...maybe this is the solution, at least for now.

Best-
Herding cats

 

[MicciStella]

So what I did last night was give the bones once each pup was in their own bed. No growling, no trading, no fussing...just each with their bones, chewing happily.

I think that perhaps this is the way to go, at least until Grace is allowed out of her pen at night (which is coming soon...). Romi gets to have his bone in bed, Gracie doesn't have to worry if Romi is going to steal her bone or plot to retake the bone from him, and I'm right there to handle anything untoward should it happen.

I'll give it another go tonight...maybe this is the solution, at least for now.

Best-
Herding cats

Perfect HC... Good and wise choice... Smile...

Romi going to be happy with his bones... And Miss Gracie too....

And HC I know that you NEVER would hurt him or any other li'll friend...

Blessing and fun to you and Romi-bomi and co...

Woof arrrooooooooowws

Micci

 

[Herding Cats]

Please say a prayer for my love Romi.

He is just now in surgery, and if all goes well, he'll be out by 7-8 pm PST.

We are not sure what's happened; he seems to have eaten something, and not been able to bring it up or pass it through. The xrays show a good sized lump of some sort of something in his upper stomach, so whatever it is, it hasn't been there long (or it would have moved to his lower stomach).

He ate fine this morning, ran around and goofed off with Gracie, and about 1:30 or so I brought them in. I noticed pretty quickly that something was wrong with Romi, as he tore right by the water bowl and on into the bedroom, and wouldn't come when I called. I left him be for a while, but Gracie started whining and pacing, and "got me" to come look at Romi.

He was in the bedroom, licking. Not just licking...but obsessively licking. The furniture. The bed. The blankets. The toys.

And while licking, he was panting. Heavy, hyperventilation type panting, not just the normal "wow, it's hot" kinda pant. And his eyes looked different. And he wouldn't come onto the bed, and he didn't wag his tail at all. (Note: He loves the bed now, and will always wag his tail when I invite him up...even if he's sitting, his tail is going...maybe just the tip, but it's going. There was no tail action at all).

I checked him over, but couldn't see anything wrong. Watched him for a bit longer, and he started the reverse sneezes that beagles are famous for. And then yurked. But nothing came out. Then he yurked again, and again, nothing came out. Back to the licking...everything.

And then he destroyed a dog toy. He's never done that before. I palpated his belly and abs again, but still nothing...

And then he yurked again, and this time, threw up a whole bunch of crud - mostly hair, because he'd been licking the blankets covering Grace's bed, but some other stuff too.

And now, the farting started. huge, big, vile smelling farts (not the "regular" dog farts; these were like hell and sewers combined).

That was it. Grabbed his leash, and off we went.

My regular vet was there, so she checked him out. Got him right in for xrays. And sure enough, something is in his stomach.

Not sure, and won't be sure, what it is until after surgery, but something is there.

So I sent him back to the surgeon, and he's now being operated on. The lab results on his emergency blood indicate that he's also dehydrated, but that's not a problem (they've started IV fluids on him) that I'm worrying about; that's easily handled.

I could've waited over night, to see if he passed whatever it was, but I decided that a stomach surgery is less invasive, and can have far fewer complications than an intestinal surgery, or an obstructed colon which may rupture or worse. So I decided to go now with the surgery; because it didn't look to me like there was much sense in waiting, and because I know that the earlier caught on things like this, the easier in the long run.

Poor wee Romi. I am so worried; not just because he's quite sick, but because how badly will this set him back...how hard this is going to be for him to recover from?

Poor boy. My poor little lovie Romi. Oh, bless his heart, he was feeling so bad....

I'm a little freaked at the moment, so sorry if this is disjointed and rambling.

Can you all just say a prayer for him? That he makes it through, no problems, and that he can come home tomorrow and that he doesn't suffer a huge setback from this?

Please and thank you...

Best-
Herding Cats