Retrial for Sentencing of Jodi Arias #3

[oceanblueeyes]

I agree that Arias displays behaviour that indicates she is a psychopath. As for her intelligence, the assessment carried out showed a higher level of word skills/use. Her other scores weren't outstanding. She is conniving rather than impressively cunning and exaggerates her own abilities to a mockable degree. Look how she misjudged Detective Flores when presenting her, "I was never in Arizona" claim? She isn't bright enough to carry out the 'perfect murder' She repeatedly fails to grasp the intelligence of others. A perfect example of this is how Arias thought through the motive part of the murder. She thought that claiming to have no motive (when it was screamingly obvious to the world that there were several strong ones) was a clever move. She is almost self-congratulatory when smugly stating she was never in Mesa. She simply doesn't have the intelligence to control her narcissism.

As for emotion, Arias shows plenty - when crying for herself. Psychopaths have traditionally been classed as incapable of emotion but recent studies and thought on this reflects a shift in approach. The processing of the emotions is interesting. Psychopaths are goal orientated and deal with emotions in a way that helps achieve their aims. I found it fascinating to hear how many times Arias mentioned her goals in court. Arias has feelings of intense rage bubbling below the 'motiveless' surface. Remember how her voice cracked when Juan Martinez asked her about taking Mimi to Cancun? Just saying the word Cancun caused her voice to change, followed by a cough. This is indeed a great opportunity for psychologists and psychiatrists to study a psychopath over a long period on the stand in court. It's also predictable that her Defense Team are now using mental illness diagnosis presented by prosecution experts. Focus on mental illness will be a key part of future strategies, I'd bet.

You are correct. Psychopaths can have and exhibit emotions but only if it is directly about themselves. They always see themselves as the victim and never the victimizer they truly are.

I found it rather humorous that she told the jury to spare her life because of her family when Arias doesn't care one whit about her family or anyone else for that matter. She was merely using them as pawns to achieve her goal of hoodwinking the jury.

She is a classic example of a psychopath.

It is still chilling to me that Travis had her pegged when he called her a psychopath.

Even the diagnosis the state expert diagnosed her with is still not considered mental illness by judicial standards and Juan needs to drive that point home to this jury. She is not mentally insane. She definitely knew what she did to Travis was criminally wrong and that is why she tried to cover it up but being the psychopath that she is she just didn't care and felt she was entitled to murder Travis in the manner she did because he dared to reject her.

No one gets away with rejecting a psychopath. Many don't resort to murder but they sure can make it a living hell for anyone who dares to displease and reject them.

IMO

 

[janx]

Why can't it be introduced somehow in this penalty phase that the killer had, in her possession, a handgun & a knife when she was arrested? Can't the prosecution use that as one of the factors to help determine the convict's state of mind & that just through her having these weapons her state of mind was such that she would/could perhaps kill again & should be given death because if she was ever given the possibility of getting parole she should be considered a danger to society? Or was she still in the "fog" when she was arrested. Who drives around with a 9mm taped to an engine?
Darn, if the defense can bring up tweets allegedly sent by someone with ties to the investigator, can't the prosecution bring out the FACT that CMJA had those weapons?
I love my country & would give my life for the USA if necessary but for goodness sake, our system seems to give a defendant more rights than the victim.

It was not illegal for her to have those weapons. I agree that it was awfully suspicious, especially in the way she chose to transport them, but the 9mm was legal and so, obviously, was the knife (or knives).

 

[oceanblueeyes]

BBM

St. Jodi of Arias maintains that she was saving the world's children by placating a dangerous pedophile.

:stormingmad:​

I still can't believe JSKS allowed that hokum in her courtroom.

:banghead:

To this day that ruling shocks me.

JS should have never allowed that in. Not one piece of evidence supported her allegations. NONE.

Thank goodness the jury didn't fall for those filthy lies.

Her false allegations against Travis made me have even more disdain for this vile and wicked creature.

 

[krkrjx]

I agree that Arias displays behaviour that indicates she is a psychopath. As for her intelligence, the assessment carried out showed a higher level of word skills/use. Her other scores weren't outstanding. She is conniving rather than impressively cunning and exaggerates her own abilities to a mockable degree. Look how she misjudged Detective Flores when presenting her, "I was never in Arizona" claim? She isn't bright enough to carry out the 'perfect murder' She repeatedly fails to grasp the intelligence of others. A perfect example of this is how Arias thought through the motive part of the murder. She thought that claiming to have no motive (when it was screamingly obvious to the world that there were several strong ones) was a clever move. She is almost self-congratulatory when smugly stating she was never in Mesa. She simply doesn't have the intelligence to control her narcissism.

As for emotion, Arias shows plenty - when crying for herself. Psychopaths have traditionally been classed as incapable of emotion but recent studies and thought on this reflects a shift in approach. The processing of the emotions is interesting. Psychopaths are goal orientated and deal with emotions in a way that helps achieve their aims. I found it fascinating to hear how many times Arias mentioned her goals in court. Arias has feelings of intense rage bubbling below the 'motiveless' surface. Remember how her voice cracked when Juan Martinez asked her about taking Mimi to Cancun? Just saying the word Cancun caused her voice to change, followed by a cough. This is indeed a great opportunity for psychologists and psychiatrists to study a psychopath over a long period on the stand in court. It's also predictable that her Defense Team are now using mental illness diagnosis presented by prosecution experts. Focus on mental illness will be a key part of future strategies, I'd bet.

I think you nailed this. In particular, the DT focus for the upcoming retrial.

Defense Team will try to make the jury believe the killer is mentally ill--not because it can exonerate her--it's too late for that now--but because "we do not execute the mentally ill." They may even use the brutality of her crime to drive their point home because what do they have to lose at this point by admitting the crime was brutal? And my bet is they won't stop at BPD or PTSD; they will try to convince even one juror that anyone who could commit such a crime would have to be insane.

I really believe that is where the current rift between Arias and Nurmi has been. She wants to still claim abuse and self defense and all...he wants the jury to feel guilty voting for DP for a sick person.

Juan will be ready for them either way. If they hammer at the abuse thing, Juan will bring up that there was no evidence whatsoever of TA abusing Arias and remind jurors that she was the one who drove 1,000 miles. If they go the mental illness route, Juan will let the jurors know what "insanity" means and show them that her level of premeditation alone shows she was in full control of her thoughts and actions before, during and after the murder. IMO.

 

[T-4-2]

snips:

I agree that Arias displays behaviour that indicates she is a psychopath. As for her intelligence, the assessment carried out showed a higher level of word skills/use. Her other scores weren't outstanding. She is conniving rather than impressively cunning and exaggerates her own abilities to a mockable degree. Look how she misjudged Detective Flores when presenting her, "I was never in Arizona" claim? She isn't bright enough to carry out the 'perfect murder' She repeatedly fails to grasp the intelligence of others. A perfect example of this is how Arias thought through the motive part of the murder. She thought that claiming to have no motive (when it was screamingly obvious to the world that there were several strong ones) was a clever move. She is almost self-congratulatory when smugly stating she was never in Mesa. She simply doesn't have the intelligence to control her narcissism.

Narcissism + immaturity. Not a good combination.

At the tail-end of Det. Flores' interrogation, Jodi is yet again denying she had any motive. For me, this was another of the "prick up your ears" moments:

JA: I know it's obvious that I was there.
DF: No, it's obvious that you committed a crime, that you hurt Travis.
JA: There's no reason for me to hurt Travis.
DF: No! It's not like that. It's... I know that you did this and you refuse to tell me why. You refuse to tell me why.
JA: There's no reason.
DF: There's no reason somebody else would come in and do this to him. There's no motive whatsoever. We haven't found any.
JA: What is my motive?
DF: Jealousy? Anger? Fear? Fear of being alone? Angry at him for not keeping you in his life? I don't know, that's why I'm trying to figure it out. There are so many motives with you. Too many. (... lists some of the evidence...)
JA: I wasn't jealous of anything. I was a little bit envious he was going to Cancun, but that wasn't the reason. Like, I could go to Cancun. It's not cheap to go to Mex... I mean it's not expensive to go to Mexico.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sn6mWpXa5zs&index=3&list=PLrAJFqIjBGeBWQ8jumn4nJ92njqRQwm0k
(This conversation starts about a minute in.)

That wasn't the reason? Holy cow.That wasn't the reason for what? For why she killed Travis? Is Jodi admitting to the murder, but just quibbling over her motive?

Like, I could go to Cancun. Good Lord. Was she planning to go to Cancun on her own? Was this maybe her snappy retort to Travis when he told her he was taking Mimi, not her? Did she say something like, "Go ahead, take Mimi, I don't care, I could go to Cancun by myself. Who needs you!" That sounds exactly like what a child, or a childish adult, would say if they were majorly pissed off about not being invited to Cancun! It also sounds like the sort of thing someone would say if they were projecting (is that the right word?) their own obsession onto the person they are obsessed with. In Jodi's mind, Travis' sole motive in inviting Mimi was to hurt Jodi. Everything Travis did revolved somehow around Jodi. Except that it didn't. At all. Everything Jodi did revolved around Travis. By saying, "I can go to Cancun by myself" she could deny Travis the satisfaction she assumed he derived from snubbing her. Because, again, it's obvious that the only reason he could possibly have invited Mimi was to hurt Jodi. It had nothing to do with Mimi. It was all about Jodi. Because absolutely everything is always about Jodi.

I mean it's not expensive to go to Mexico. Just last night I read a post either here or on the sidebar in which someone mentioned the possibility that Jodi was heading to Mexico and planning to tie up some loose ends on the way (i.e. kill some people). This is why she was packing up the car and bringing knives and a gun with her. "It's not expensive to go to Mexico" is something a person might say if they had recently been contemplating a trip to Mexico and trying to determine whether or not they could afford it.

Remember how her voice cracked when Juan Martinez asked her about taking Mimi to Cancun? Just saying the word Cancun caused her voice to change, followed by a cough.

Yep. She wants people to think she was not jealous of Mimi and that she was completely ambivalent about Cancun. No biggie. CLEARLY she was obsessed to the point that she couldn't mask her obsession.

Rejection hurts. Exclusion hurts. Envy and jealousy can both seriously cloud a person's judgement. But they are all unavoidable, and as we mature we become better able to handle them in ways which are neither self-destructive nor life-threatening (our own life or anyone else's). We've all been there, no doubt some of us are there now, but we muddle through. We torment ourselves by trying to figure out what went wrong and how to fix it, we realize we can't control other people or every situation, we cry on friends' shoulders, we eat a lot of ice cream, we find new things/people to fill the void, we contemplate our navels, we write out our feelings in letters we don't plan to send, sometimes we do send them and immediately regret it, then we eat more ice cream. Eventually things get better. Our lives may be different, but that can actually turn out to be kind of OK. Learning these lessons is a part of life and we all get plenty of opportunities to get better at it.

Then there's Jodi. Unfortunately for everybody, her stunted emotional development made her incapable of dealing with painful experiences. Well, no -- she dealt, but she dealt really, really badly. And she set herself up to deal badly. She had absolutely every last one of her eggs in one basket (Travis, cliquish PPL, LDS church, Mesa), and this put her in an extremely precarious position -- given that she's a psychopath who CANNOT tolerate rejection. She had no life of her own, very little (if any) potential for making a life of her own, so she glommed onto Travis and his. When all that fell apart, she was left with nothing but her fury and her psychopathic need for revenge.

So now Travis is dead, his family and friends are devastated, and as for Jodi? Well, let's just say she's never going to Cancun.

 

[rose222]

I think you nailed this. In particular, the DT focus for the upcoming retrial.

Defense Team will try to make the jury believe the killer is mentally ill--not because it can exonerate her--it's too late for that now--but because "we do not execute the mentally ill." They may even use the brutality of her crime to drive their point home because what do they have to lose at this point by admitting the crime was brutal? And my bet is they won't stop at BPD or PTSD; they will try to convince even one juror that anyone who could commit such a crime would have to be insane.

I really believe that is where the current rift between Arias and Nurmi has been. She wants to still claim abuse and self defense and all...he wants the jury to feel guilty voting for DP for a sick person.

Juan will be ready for them either way. If they hammer at the abuse thing, Juan will bring up that there was no evidence whatsoever of TA abusing Arias and remind jurors that she was the one who drove 1,000 miles. If they go the mental illness route, Juan will let the jurors know what "insanity" means and show them that her level of premeditation alone shows she was in full control of her thoughts and actions before, during and after the murder. IMO.

That's it. Borderline Personality Disorder as diagnosed by Demarte herself. That is all they have to do to get at least one juror to vote against death. All they have to do is emphasize the point that Arias has BPD-a mental illness and she might just escape the lethal injection. Of course, Arias won't go quietly into the night. She will trash Travis and hurt his family as much as possible before being carted off to prison.

 

[T-4-2]

That's it. Borderline Personality Disorder as diagnosed by Demarte herself. That is all they have to do to get at least one juror to vote against death. All they have to do is emphasize the point that Arias has BPD-a mental illness and she might just escape the lethal injection. Of course, Arias won't go quietly into the night. She will trash Travis and hurt his family as much as possible before being carted off to prison.

Does BPD render a person incapable of knowing right from wrong? I thought it just meant that they didn't care, and were willing to do anything (good, bad, legal, illegal) to get what they want. (Just a thought, not based on any relevant knowledge.)

 

[Deleted member 122533]

I really believe that is where the current rift between Arias and Nurmi has been. She wants to still claim abuse and self defense and all...he wants the jury to feel guilty voting for DP for a sick person.
.

So many thought-provoking points - thanks. You raise one that hasn't been widely covered. Wasn't it amusing to watch Nurmi 'craft' a defense around abuse, coach Arias into acting it out - then see him wince as she contradicted claim after claim? It was staggering to observe Arias dismantle her own defense. The Defense tactics were lame but how much of that was down to Arias? Did she forge the abuse letters before signing up with Nurmi? Did this gave him little choice but to run with this crazy tactic as switching stories again would have been fatal?

 

[Becky Sharp]

snips:


Narcissism + immaturity. Not a good combination.

At the tail-end of Det. Flores' interrogation, Jodi is yet again denying she had any motive. For me, this was another of the "prick up your ears" moments:

JA: I know it's obvious that I was there.
DF: No, it's obvious that you committed a crime, that you hurt Travis.
JA: There's no reason for me to hurt Travis.
DF: No! It's not like that. It's... I know that you did this and you refuse to tell me why. You refuse to tell me why.
JA: There's no reason.
DF: There's no reason somebody else would come in and do this to him. There's no motive whatsoever. We haven't found any.
JA: What is my motive?
DF: Jealousy? Anger? Fear? Fear of being alone? Angry at him for not keeping you in his life? I don't know, that's why I'm trying to figure it out. There are so many motives with you. Too many. (... lists some of the evidence...)
JA: I wasn't jealous of anything. I was a little bit envious he was going to Cancun, but that wasn't the reason. Like, I could go to Cancun. It's not cheap to go to Mex... I mean it's not expensive to go to Mexico.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sn6mWpXa5zs&index=3&list=PLrAJFqIjBGeBWQ8jumn4nJ92njqRQwm0k
(This conversation starts about a minute in.)

That wasn't the reason? Holy cow.That wasn't the reason for what? For why she killed Travis? Is Jodi admitting to the murder, but just quibbling over her motive?

Like, I could go to Cancun. Good Lord. Was she planning to go to Cancun on her own? Was this maybe her snappy retort to Travis when he told her he was taking Mimi, not her? Did she say something like, "Go ahead, take Mimi, I don't care, I could go to Cancun by myself. Who needs you!" That sounds exactly like what a child, or a childish adult, would say if they were majorly pissed off about not being invited to Cancun! It also sounds like the sort of thing someone would say if they were projecting (is that the right word?) their own obsession onto the person they are obsessed with. In Jodi's mind, Travis' sole motive in inviting Mimi was to hurt Jodi. Everything Travis did revolved somehow around Jodi. Except that it didn't. At all. Everything Jodi did revolved around Travis. By saying, "I can go to Cancun by myself" she could deny Travis the satisfaction she assumed he derived from snubbing her. Because, again, it's obvious that the only reason he could possibly have invited Mimi was to hurt Jodi. It had nothing to do with Mimi. It was all about Jodi. Because absolutely everything is always about Jodi.

I mean it's not expensive to go to Mexico. Just last night I read a post either here or on the sidebar in which someone mentioned the possibility that Jodi was heading to Mexico and planning to tie up some loose ends on the way (i.e. kill some people). This is why she was packing up the car and bringing knives and a gun with her. "It's not expensive to go to Mexico" is something a person might say if they had recently been contemplating a trip to Mexico and trying to determine whether or not they could afford it.


Yep. She wants people to think she was not jealous of Mimi and that she was completely ambivalent about Cancun. No biggie. CLEARLY she was obsessed to the point that she couldn't mask her obsession.

Rejection hurts. Exclusion hurts. Envy and jealousy can both seriously cloud a person's judgement. But they are all unavoidable, and as we mature we become better able to handle them in ways which are neither self-destructive nor life-threatening (our own life or anyone else's). We've all been there, no doubt some of us are there now, but we muddle through. We torment ourselves by trying to figure out what went wrong and how to fix it, we realize we can't control other people or every situation, we cry on friends' shoulders, we eat a lot of ice cream, we find new things/people to fill the void, we contemplate our navels, we write out our feelings in letters we don't plan to send, sometimes we do send them and immediately regret it, then we eat more ice cream. Eventually things get better. Our lives may be different, but that can actually turn out to be kind of OK. Learning these lessons is a part of life and we all get plenty of opportunities to get better at it.

Then there's Jodi. Unfortunately for everybody, her stunted emotional development made her incapable of dealing with painful experiences. Well, no -- she dealt, but she dealt really, really badly. And she set herself up to deal badly. She had absolutely every last one of her eggs in one basket (Travis, cliquish PPL, LDS church, Mesa), and this put her in an extremely precarious position -- given that she's a psychopath who CANNOT tolerate rejection. She had no life of her own, very little (if any) potential for making a life of her own, so she glommed onto Travis and his. When all that fell apart, she was left with nothing but her fury and her psychopathic need for revenge.

So now Travis is dead, his family and friends are devastated, and as for Jodi? Well, let's just say she's never going to Cancun.

Wow, T-4-2! Thanks for such an amazing post! I just popped in to catch up on the craziness that is this trial and really think you nailed it in your post about She-who-must-be-obeyed.

I was once married to a full-blown narcissist who was also a sociopath, but thank my lucky stars that he wasn't physically violent.

I look forward to reading more of your posts!

 

[T-4-2]

I'm afraid that someone owes canned ham an apology.

Still giggling...

 

[T-4-2]

Wow, T-4-2! Thanks for such an amazing post!

Wow right back! Thanks so much for the compliment! :tyou:

 

[thefragile7393]

No one gets away with rejecting a psychopath. Many don't resort to murder but they sure can make it a living hell for anyone who dares to displease and reject them.

IMO

Respectfully snipped from a great post that IMO speaks the truth about what Arias is. I don't have a link on me unfortunately but in my study of socio/psychopaths (thanks to this trial and my job and a patient I encountered last year) I read that the majority of socio/psychopaths are not criminals, but the majority of criminals are are socio/psychopaths.

 

[krkrjx]

Does BPD render a person incapable of knowing right from wrong? I thought it just meant that they didn't care, and were willing to do anything (good, bad, legal, illegal) to get what they want. (Just a thought, not based on any relevant knowledge.)

It does not. Many Borderline-diagnosed individuals know full well the difference between right and wrong. But it is an illness of, in part, stunted emotional growth. Anger, threats, acting out in juvenile ways is the norm for these individuals. They are highly manipulative as well as obsessive. It is not mental retardation--they can have average, above average, or even well-above average IQ. It is more of an emotional retardation.

Arias could very well have BPD but in my book that just makes her all the more dangerous. There is no cure and behavior modification for such individuals is at best difficult to achieve. Arias has an added psychopathy that is just plain frightening to contemplate in terms of her ever being free in society.

Borderline Personality Disorder would not cause her to flip out and kill someone on the spur of the moment as Nurmi hinted at in his closing. He knew she would be found guilty but wanted the jury to feel bad about making it Murder One. Likewise, in this retrial to decide penalty, he will want the jury as a whole or individually to be wracked with guilt at the thought of sending a mentally ill person to death row. What is most interesting about that whole deal is Arias has fought that idea for a long time. Maybe she even still fights it even though it could possibly be her best hope of the jury not voting for death. IMO.

 

[T-4-2]

I think Juan is ready for any antics she may do. He even knows her better now than ever before. She hates that he does know her so well. She hates that he exposes the true Arias. He knows how to push her buttons and even she falls for it because of her narcissism.

I actually kind of enjoy Jodi's bursts of bratty backtalk. Martinez isn't trying to make her lose her cool -- I believe he is setting her up to show the jury, simply by her behavior on the stand, how infuriating she can be, how manipulative she can be, how petty she can be, how cruel she can be, how smug and self-satisfied she can be when she thinks she's scored a point (and that's precisely what she's trying to do), and of course that she's a liar who cannot and should not be trusted.

Just a small dose of Jodi makes it abundantly clear why Travis sent angry texts! Even if we don't necessarily know the specific things/events he refers to, we can understand why he...

Sigh. I was just about to type "was sick to death of her." He didn't realize that being sick of Jodi could be fatal.

It shows that Juan is far more intelligent than she is and knows Arias like the back of his hand.

Maybe after the trial, we should all pitch in to buy him some nice hand soap. Or some of those wash-and-scrub packets surgeons use to wash and scrub the bejesus out of their hands.

 

[T-4-2]

snip:

Borderline Personality Disorder would not cause her to flip out and kill someone on the spur of the moment as Nurmi hinted at in his closing. He knew she would be found guilty but wanted the jury to feel bad about making it Murder One. Likewise, in this retrial to decide penalty, he will want the jury as a whole or individually to be wracked with guilt at the thought of sending a mentally ill person to death row. What is most interesting about that whole deal is Arias has fought that idea for a long time. Maybe she even still fights it even though it could possibly be her best hope of the jury not voting for death. IMO.

Maybe he'll present Jodi's steadfast refusal to accept a diagnosis of mental illness as a symptom of mental illness.

 

[Deleted member 122533]

snips:


Narcissism + immaturity. Not a good combination.

At the tail-end of Det. Flores' interrogation, Jodi is yet again denying she had any motive. For me, this was another of the "prick up your ears" moments:

JA: I know it's obvious that I was there.
DF: No, it's obvious that you committed a crime, that you hurt Travis.
JA: There's no reason for me to hurt Travis.
DF: No! It's not like that. It's... I know that you did this and you refuse to tell me why. You refuse to tell me why.
JA: There's no reason.
DF: There's no reason somebody else would come in and do this to him. There's no motive whatsoever. We haven't found any.
JA: What is my motive?
DF: Jealousy? Anger? Fear? Fear of being alone? Angry at him for not keeping you in his life? I don't know, that's why I'm trying to figure it out. There are so many motives with you. Too many. (... lists some of the evidence...)
JA: I wasn't jealous of anything. I was a little bit envious he was going to Cancun, but that wasn't the reason. Like, I could go to Cancun. It's not cheap to go to Mex... I mean it's not expensive to go to Mexico.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sn6mWpXa5zs&index=3&list=PLrAJFqIjBGeBWQ8jumn4nJ92njqRQwm0k
(This conversation starts about a minute in.)

That wasn't the reason? Holy cow.That wasn't the reason for what? For why she killed Travis? Is Jodi admitting to the murder, but just quibbling over her motive?[/B]
............

Yep. She wants people to think she was not jealous of Mimi and that she was completely ambivalent about Cancun. No biggie. CLEARLY she was obsessed to the point that she couldn't mask her obsession.

Rejection hurts. Exclusion hurts. Envy and jealousy can both seriously cloud a person's judgement. But they are all unavoidable, and as we mature we become better able to handle them in ways which are neither self-destructive nor life-threatening (our own life or anyone else's). We've all been there, no doubt some of us are there now, but we muddle through. We torment ourselves by trying to figure out what went wrong and how to fix it, we realize we can't control other people or every situation, we cry on friends' shoulders, we eat a lot of ice cream, we find new things/people to fill the void, we contemplate our navels, we write out our feelings in letters we don't plan to send, sometimes we do send them and immediately regret it, then we eat more ice cream. Eventually things get better. Our lives may be different, but that can actually turn out to be kind of OK. Learning these lessons is a part of life and we all get plenty of opportunities to get better at it.

Then there's Jodi. Unfortunately for everybody, her stunted emotional development made her incapable of dealing with painful experiences. Well, no -- she dealt, but she dealt really, really badly. And she set herself up to deal badly. She had absolutely every last one of her eggs in one basket (Travis, cliquish PPL, LDS church, Mesa), and this put her in an extremely precarious position -- given that she's a psychopath who CANNOT tolerate rejection. She had no life of her own, very little (if any) potential for making a life of her own, so she glommed onto Travis and his. When all that fell apart, she was left with nothing but her fury and her psychopathic need for revenge.

Incredible detail in this thoughtful post. Thanks. You have illustrated so well the pain of rejection which normal people can suffer. This emotion is understandable, human, real. People get that. What isn't easy to grasp is making someone pay for not wanting you by savage slaughter. You pointed to the toxic combination of Arias' immaturity and narcissism. Her psychopathy was the final touch that sealed Travis' fate.

I was intrigued by your post on the video interview. On reading, I thought - wow, incredible catch. I listened again (having watched it before). She does indeed say this at around 2.40

http://youtu.be/sn6mWpXa5zs

Problem is that the sentences are ambiguous and contradictory. Given the context, it's arguable that she is referring to not being envious that he is going to Cancun (not envious of the vacation, the destination but rather that he was taking someone else instead of her?) This is typical Arias mode - a little bit jealous one minute, not at all jealous the next.

"I wasn't jealous of anything.
I was a little bit envious that he was going to Cancun but that wasn't the reason. I could go to Cancun... It's not expensive to go to Mexico

Detective Flores doesn't pick this up ( "But that wasn't the reason') which makes me think that the jumble isn't an admission. And yet... and yet... There just might be something there.

 

[krkrjx]

snip:


Maybe he'll present Jodi's steadfast refusal to accept a diagnosis of mental illness as a symptom of mental illness.

He may do so.

The best way for it to be countered, IMO, is for the jury to get a stronger feel for how she lured men using sex, preplanned a killing right down to demanding an inconspicuous color rental car, and last but not least, tried to blackmail the state's attorney into doing things her way--Murder 2 or else!

Oh she knew what she did was wrong, covered it up, then tried to manipulate the legal system. Whether they can seat a jury comprised of those who will not buy what she tries to sell them remains to be seen. Zervakos walked away believing TA had abused her...and he claims he is not stupid. So...it will be interesting to see if anyone on the jury caves like WZ did.

 

[T-4-2]

snip:

No one gets away with rejecting a psychopath. Many don't resort to murder but they sure can make it a living hell for anyone who dares to displease and reject them.

IIRC, one of Dr. DeMarte's reasons for diagnosing Jodi as having BPD was her tendency to either love someone or hate them, and her feelings can turn on a dime. Scary stuff for anyone who crosses her path. Also scary is the idea that she could very well fixate on someone who has no idea that they've become in any way significant to her. They can do something that displeases her (without knowing what it is or that she was even paying attention), and then -- boom. Welcome to your nightmare.

 

[T-4-2]

II was intrigued by your post on the video interview. On reading, I thought - wow, incredible catch. I listened again (having watched it before). She does indeed say this at around 2.40

http://youtu.be/sn6mWpXa5zs

Problem is that the sentences are ambiguous and contradictory. Given the context, it's arguable that she is referring to not being envious that he is going to Cancun (not envious of the vacation, the destination but rather that he was taking someone else instead of her?) This is typical Arias mode - a little bit jealous one minute, not at all jealous the next.

"I wasn't jealous of anything.
I was a little bit envious that he was going to Cancun but that wasn't the reason. I could go to Cancun... It's not expensive to go to Mexico

Detective Flores doesn't pick this up ( "But that wasn't the reason') which makes me think that the jumble isn't an admission. And yet... and yet... There just might be something there.

Great point. She knows Det. Flores thinks she was jealous about Travis taking Mimi and not her. She may be trying to clarify that she'd simply like to take a trip to Cancun -- just for the sake of taking a trip to Cancun.

 

[janx]

I think you nailed this. In particular, the DT focus for the upcoming retrial.

Defense Team will try to make the jury believe the killer is mentally ill--not because it can exonerate her--it's too late for that now--but because "we do not execute the mentally ill." They may even use the brutality of her crime to drive their point home because what do they have to lose at this point by admitting the crime was brutal? And my bet is they won't stop at BPD or PTSD; they will try to convince even one juror that anyone who could commit such a crime would have to be insane.

I really believe that is where the current rift between Arias and Nurmi has been. She wants to still claim abuse and self defense and all...he wants the jury to feel guilty voting for DP for a sick person.

Juan will be ready for them either way. If they hammer at the abuse thing, Juan will bring up that there was no evidence whatsoever of TA abusing Arias and remind jurors that she was the one who drove 1,000 miles. If they go the mental illness route, Juan will let the jurors know what "insanity" means and show them that her level of premeditation alone shows she was in full control of her thoughts and actions before, during and after the murder. IMO.

The mental illness defense: Yes, I have thought about this since it was brought up in the defense's closing at the first trial. They mentioned the BPD then, which was surprising since it was a state witness who provided the diagnosis. I suspect, as you do, that the rift between JA and Nurmi has to do with her not wanting any kind of mental illness defense. What I can't figure out is if Nurmi actually thought the "battered woman syndrome" or "abuse" defense was a good idea in the first place.