Russia Attacks Ukraine - 23 Feb 2022 #11

[Simply Southern]

11.47 GMT

Here is President Zelenskyy's full statement expressing gratitude to the United States...​

“We are very grateful to the United States for all the support. I’m thankful to President Trump, Congress for their bipartisan support, and American people. Ukrainians have always appreciated this support, especially during these three years of full-scale invasion.

America’s help has been vital in helping us survive, and I want to acknowledge that. Despite the tough dialogue, we remain strategic partners. But we need to be honest and direct with each other to truly understand our shared goals.

It’s crucial for us to have President Trump’s support. He wants to end the war, but no one wants peace more than we do. We are the ones living this war in Ukraine. It’s a fight for our freedom, for our very survival.

As President Reagan once said: ‘Peace is not just the absence of war.’ We’re talking about just and lasting peace – freedom, justice, and human rights for everyone. A ceasefire won’t work with Putin. He has broken ceasefires 25 times over the last 10 years. A real peace is the only solution.

We are ready to sign the minerals agreement, and it will be the first step toward security guarantees. But it’s not enough, and we need more than just that. A ceasefire without security guarantees is dangerous for Ukraine. We’ve been fighting for three years, and Ukrainian people need to know that America is on our side.

I cannot change Ukraine’s position on Russia. The Russians are killing us. Russia is the enemy, and that’s the reality we face. Ukraine wants peace, but it must be a just and lasting peace. For that, we need to be strong at the negotiation table. Peace can only come when we know we have security guarantees, when our army is strong, and our partners are with us.

We want peace. That’s why I came to the United States, and visited President Trump. The deal on minerals is just a first step toward security guarantees and getting closer to peace. Our situation is tough, but we can’t just stop fighting and not having guarantees that Putin will not return tomorrow.

It will be difficult without the US support. But we can’t lose our will, our freedom, or our people. We’ve seen how Russians came to our homes and killed many people. Nobody wants another wave of occupation. If we cannot be accepted to Nato, we need some clear structure of security guarantees from our allies in the US.

Europe is ready for contingencies and to help fund our large army. We also need the US role in defining security guarantees – what kind, what volume, and when. Once these guarantees are in place, we can talk with Russia, Europe, and the US about diplomacy. War alone is too long, and we don’t have enough weapons to push them out entirely.

When someone talks about losses, every single life matters. Russia invaded our homes, killed our people, and tried to erase us. This isn’t just about territories or numbers – it’s about real lives. That’s what we need everyone to understand.

I want the US to stand more firmly on our side. This is not just a war between our two countries; Russia brought this war on to our territory and into our homes. They are wrong because they disrespected our territorial integrity.

All Ukrainians want to hear a strong US position on our side. It’s understandable the US might look for dialogue with Putin. But the US has always spoken about ‘peace through strength’. And together we can take strong steps against Putin.

Our relationship with the American president is more than just two leaders; it’s a historic and solid bond between our peoples. That’s why I always begin with words of gratitude from our nation to the American nation.

American people helped save our people. Humans and human rights come first. We’re truly thankful. We want only strong relations with America, and I really hope we will have them.”

‘You have full backing across the UK’: Zelenskyy leaves Downing Street after meeting with Starmer – as it happened

Ukrainian president has held talks with PM Keir Starmer ahead of defence summit with European leaders tomorrow. This blog is now closed.

www.theguardian.com

Same old song and dance. I'm sorry, but he's still demanding the US fund the Ukraine war, and provide military support and enter a war with Russia. Did he not read the room on Friday? His own staff lowered their heads and pinch the bridge of their noses. They wanted to meet on the deal, even after Zelenskyy's hissy fit. The Ukraine Parliament had voted and approved the deal on Friday. Zelenskyy made sure the deal didn't go through.

What I don't understand....
He makes demands the US enter the war and fund his country, but he's not making those same demands on his partners, neighbors, and the European Union.

Waiting to say what Zelenskyy's next move/plan is?

Moo...

 

[chimpface]

Same old song and dance. I'm sorry, but he's still demanding the US fund the Ukraine war, and provide military support and enter a war with Russia. Did he not read the room on Friday? His own staff lowered their heads and pinch the bridge of their noses. They wanted to meet on the deal, even after Zelenskyy's hissy fit. The Ukraine Parliament had voted and approved the deal on Friday. Zelenskyy made sure the deal didn't go through.

What I don't understand....
He makes demands the US enter the war and fund his country, but he's not making those same demands on his partners, neighbors, and the European Union.

Waiting to say what Zelenskyy's next move/plan is?

Moo...

We must have watched a different PC, JD Vance was throwing the hissy fit for the benefit of his boss, nothing more nothing less.

Totally morally bankrupt.

 

[Lonicera]

It’s time to make peace. And on that point, Trump is right. <modsnip - off topic>

 

[nhmemorymaker]

The only winner here in Putin.

<modsnip - quoted post was removed>

The Propaganda machine will get people to believe its about money. Money saved. Evening out the pots of money. Getting our money back.
America has always the be main benevolent leader, always putting more into the pot.
THAT is what America was built upon.

As it slowly rolls out, even normal t supporters will see this......
The biggest criminals on the planet are now Russia and America.
The world knows this.

 

[chimpface]

Looking at a map of the Black Sea area it is obvious that Crimea is a major Shipping Port. And it is needed by millions of people in that part of the world for the basics like food and shelter.
Starting 10 years ago Russia has developed this Shipping Route with Billions invested.
It was Three years ago Zelenskyy was on National TV across America saying he doesn't like Russia and never has. Well this war has turned into a nightmare. Two countries who are geographically next to each other are always going to be better off, In a trading partnership with each other.

*after illegally annexing it

 

[JennieM]

What the papers sayDonald Trump

‘A spectacle to horrify the world’: what the papers say about Trump and Vance’s meeting with Zelenskyy​

The shocking and unprecedented scenes in the Oval Office dominate UK front pages today, with the papers united in horror

‘A spectacle to horrify the world’: what the papers say about Trump and Vance’s meeting with Zelenskyy

The shocking and unprecedented scenes in the Oval Office dominate UK front pages today, with the papers united in horror

www.theguardian.com

 

[chimpface]

What the papers sayDonald Trump

‘A spectacle to horrify the world’: what the papers say about Trump and Vance’s meeting with Zelenskyy​

The shocking and unprecedented scenes in the Oval Office dominate UK front pages today, with the papers united in horror

‘A spectacle to horrify the world’: what the papers say about Trump and Vance’s meeting with Zelenskyy

The shocking and unprecedented scenes in the Oval Office dominate UK front pages today, with the papers united in horror

www.theguardian.com

As I pointed out last night virtually every European leader has come out in support of Zelensky, he was completely railroaded into that but kept his decorum.

Hungary has obviously sided with Russia/USA as Orban is another dictator. Slovakia unsurprisingly quiet.

 

[Mo Thuairim]

(SNIP) I think it's very disrespectful what European countries are saying about America.
Moo

Well, I think most rational countries lost all respect for the US last night after that barbaric display by Trump and Vance in the Oval Office. The 'disrespect' is entirely earned.

 

[Sarahlou]

Well, I think most rational countries lost all respect for the US last night after that barbaric display by Trump and Vance in the Oval Office. The disrespect is entirely earned.

No rational or decent countries/people would find that spectacle okay or the right way to go about things.
I love seeing how much support Zelensky has received from around the world.

 

[Simply Southern]

Zelenskyy is dealing with reality, a reality which includes the mass murder of civilians in occupied territories. He knows what will happen if he agrees to a deal which results in Ukraine's capitulation.

Trump and Vance were spouting Russian propaganda not based on reality. Zelenskyy has never trashed the USA and has often shown his gratitude. But he has to challenge post truth BS, you can't negotiate a deal with someone who knowingly lies about what the deal is about. It was a shake down, peace on Russia's terms means mass murder, rape and ethnic cleansing.

Whatever eventually happens Zelenskyy will be seen as one of history's greatest leaders. I doubt Trump, the bone spur faking, draft dodging coward will be held in such regard.

Well the deals off and it looks like the US it's going to let Zelensky move forward with his war. He doesn't want peace. He wants all his land returned, back to 1996. He wants all frozen access turned over to Ukraine. He wants US military troops on the ground to protect him or fight to take his land back. All funded by the US taxpayer.

The US has chosen not to enter war with Russia. The policy has not changed. Zelenskyy wasn't able to pressure the previous administrations to enter his war but we did help fund it.

It would take Congressional approval for the US to enter war. The President does not have the authority. He can ask Congress, like Bush did after 911. None of the administrations have ask permission to enter this war.

What has changed .... The unlimited flow of funds to Ukraine. It doesn't bother me what other countries think of our president or our business practices. The hurtful things that are being said, by those we thought were our partners, will affect our relationships long into the future.

Moo...

 

[nhmemorymaker]

This may be the perception, created by the media spin, but rest assured, a majority (by vote) support President Trump. I don't think you'd find many Americans willing to go to war with Russia. We certainly don't want a nuclear war. I remember growing up with the threat of nuclear war. Air raid drills, hiding in the school basements, community bomb shelters, and JFK reminding Americans of the threat.

The Europeans are not gonna be able to "shame" America, when they don't ask their citizens to pay more. I think it's very disrespectful what European countries are saying about America.
Moo

And you and I do not live in such close proximity to war zones over time. You and I have never been bombed. Shaming Europeans is totally ludicrous. Their sacrifices are exponentially greater over all of History than yours and mine.
It is not ALL ABOUT MONEY.

Just a minor point on that perception issue. I lived in an 80% Red county. and 80% of those people neither cared nor understood the International stage. Their issues were guns, economy, wokeness and guns and guns.

I, therefore, do want to thank you for your serious and valuable information and consideration of this International Stage. Regardless, of which side of the American fence you are on... please please do help your acquaintances get more knowledgeable.

One more minor point.
I know that word---'disrespectful'---- is the new buzzword.
No leader on the face of the earth has been more disrespectful, saying horrible, horrible horrible things of every other world leader who does not please him.
I could find 100 links if need be, but I think this is well enough known by the world, as well.

 

[nhmemorymaker]

I suppose most people are aware that Zelensky was a comedian and actor prior to becoming president. In a TV series he played a teacher who was elected President. After the show’s finale he ran for and was elected President. Life imitating art! I’ve found a few of the shows on YouTube and they are hilarious. I suspect his humor enabled him to respond so well to the reporter who asked him why he didn’t wear a suit and show respect. (You have to watch the whole video to see it)
A couple of articles about his switch from actor to president…

https://www.cnn.com/2022/02/25/europe/volodymyr-zelensky-profile-cmd-intl/index.html

Ukraine's Volodymyr Zelensky: The comedian who became a wartime leader

Zelensky had no experience of politics when he was elected but is now a symbol of Ukrainian defiance.

www.bbc.com

And my kids "have made me" go back and watch episodes of The Apprentice too.
True story. It was just for he-haws... but they wouldn't let me leave the room!!!!
We all did have a really good laugh.

In a way, some of the funny stuff helps us float above the reality for a few minutes....

 

[keek]

And you and I do not live in such close proximity to war zones over time. You and I have never been bombed. Shaming Europeans is totally ludicrous. Their sacrifices are exponentially greater over all of History than yours and mine.
It is not ALL ABOUT MONEY.

Just a minor point on that perception issue. I lived in an 80% Red county. and 80% of those people neither cared nor understood the International stage. Their issues were guns, economy, wokeness and guns and guns.

I, therefore, do want to thank you for your serious and valuable information and consideration of this International Stage. Regardless, of which side of the American fence you are on... please please do help your acquaintances get more knowledgeable.

One more minor point.
I know that word---'disrespectful'---- is the new buzzword.
No leader on the face of the earth has been more disrespectful, saying horrible, horrible horrible things of every other world leader who does not please him.
I could find 100 links if need be, but I think this is well enough known by the world, as well.

Just a minor point on that perception issue. I lived in an 80% Red county. and 80% of those people neither cared nor understood the International stage. Their issues were guns, economy, wokeness and guns and guns.

THIS. Totally ignorant of ANYTHING of the larger world, past and present. Just repeat what makes them feel comfortable. All of a sudden, they had a cause, yeahhh, yeaaaahhh, my guns, my gunsssssss. 'They're' taking all the jobssssss, why I am where I am.. and on and on, their 'reasonssssssss'. They are around and clueless to learning on their own, so stay right where you are because you always will.

 

[Niner]

This may be the perception, created by the media spin, but rest assured, a majority (by vote) support President Trump. I don't think you'd find many Americans willing to go to war with Russia. We certainly don't want a nuclear war. I remember growing up with the threat of nuclear war. Air raid drills, hiding in the school basements, community bomb shelters, and JFK reminding Americans of the threat.

The Europeans are not gonna be able to "shame" America, when they don't ask their citizens to pay more. I think it's very disrespectful what European countries are saying about America.
Moo

I do not believe Z wants America to fight against Russia - they want peace - permanent peace - like the Baltic States have after 50 years of Soviet rule. I now live in one of those Baltic States. My parents homeland that they had to flee back in 1944 when the Russians did come in here & occupy it!
And now my "adopted" country America - is definitely going off the wrong track with this latest press conference.
Disrespectful?? You probably have not lived under a regime - that most of the European countries have over! They KNOW what Putin is like. I feel sorry for the Americans that are falling for Trump's diplomacy, his rudeness, his arrogance.....
I think I have said enough....

 

[JennieM]

'Trump looks like a partner for Russia' - Ukrainians react to White House showdown

Zelensky tells BBC Ukraine 'ready to sign' minerals deal with US

The Ukrainian president's comments to Laura Kuenssberg came after he failed to sign the deal at the White House on Friday.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Jade]

Putin’s Russia has eclipsed that now with his present day unrestrained war; in addition the cruelty to his own, the people of Russia, suffering with loss of a generation sacrificed to war.

Russian oligarchs - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

All imo

 

[crussell821]

The only disrespect I saw came from Trump and Vance. Trump, a draft-dodger, yelling at a war-weary man who literally took up arms in the streets to protect his country and people, is laughable. They looked like fools. MOO

 

[Simply Southern]

Well, I think most rational countries lost all respect for the US last night after that barbaric display by Trump and Vance in the Oval Office. The 'disrespect' is entirely earned.

The only countries we're hearing complain are European. Haven't heard a word out of the Middle East. Israel voted with the United States on the UN resolution, they've got our back, and vice versa. Haven't heard a word out of Mexico, our closest neighbor. Haven't heard a word out Asia, or Japan and many more. I consider all these rational countries.

Yeah, the US still has a lot of friends and partners. We have not limited ourselves to a small group of region partners. We've tried to establish strong world wide partnerships.

I think the US media will lose interest, move on to new problem and if they don't Trump's a big guy he can take the heat. The European media will start to focus on Zelenskyy's new plans. European citizens will want answers to, the extent of their involvement, putting troops in Ukraine, additional taxpayer cost and the threat of nuclear war.

Moo...

 

[JennieM]

Trump-Zelensky row signals looming crisis between Europe and US​

Jeremy Bowen
International editor, BBC News

There will be many more doubts and questions about the US commitment to European security outside Ukraine. The biggest is whether President Trump would keep the promise his predecessor Harry Truman made in 1949 to treat an attack on a Nato ally as an attack on America.

Those concerns are based on what appears to be Trump's determination to restore a strong relationship with Russian President Vladimir Putin.

He has put heavy pressure on Ukraine while offering Putin big concessions - that would have to be made by the Ukrainians.

The security of Ukraine is coming a poor second - and Europeans are worrying theirs is too.

Bowen: Trump-Zelensky row signals looming crisis between Europe and US

Doubts are growing about the US commitment to European security outside Ukraine.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[JennieM]

Starmer and Zelensky to meet at Downing Street​

IMAGE SOURCE, JONATHAN BRADY / PA
Emma Rossiter
BBC News

Published 2 hours ago

Prime Minister Sir Keir Starmer and Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky will meet in Downing Street on Saturday afternoon, No 10 has said.

Starmer and Zelensky to meet at Downing Street

Zelensky has arrived in the UK a day before Sir Keir is set to host a summit of European leaders to discuss an end to the war between Ukraine and Russia

www.bbc.co.uk