Russia Attacks Ukraine - 23 Feb 2022 #11

[Deleted member 352484]

those two are not diplomatic. they want rare earth minerals and they want 'im bad. But if they were playing good cop/bad cop, they messed up and both played bad cop.

Zelensky was the one who offered the rare earth minerals in his "victory plan" back in October.

Ukraine PM says minerals deal agreed with US

Denis Shmyhal said the Ukrainian government would not sign a deal without security guarantees.

www.bbc.com

Ukraine has also claimed on several occasions that a deal was done with the US then backed out for various reasons.

Ukraine PM says minerals deal agreed with US

Denis Shmyhal said the Ukrainian government would not sign a deal without security guarantees.

www.bbc.com

 

[acutename]

Zelenskyy speaking in an interview with Fox News issues his thanks to the American people. “You helped us to survive”.But he stands by his words with Trump/Vance.“We have to be honest. And nobody wants to finish this war more than us”.

When asked by the Fox News host, Zelenskyy declines to apologise to Trump.“I think we have to be open and honest… I’m not sure we did something bad.”But he does suggest the conversation should have happened off camera


“It’s not good for both sides”, admits Zelenskyy about the “spat” with Trump.“But I can’t change Ukrainian attitudes to Russia. They are killers to us”.“It doesn’t mean we don’t want peace, it means we just want to recognise the reality”.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1895611936433455309

https://twitter.com/x/status/1895613781847503322

https://twitter.com/x/status/1895612981138149830

I am afraid of that too! And not "tomorrow," but maybe 2 hrs after signing an agreement.
Remember glasnost? it did not last...

"A polarizing figure who was lionized abroad as a global hero of liberalism, Mr. Gorbachev was also castigated by many at home for bringing about the end of the Soviet empire."

Putin Reacts to Mikhail Gorbachev's Death as World Pays Tribute (Published 2022)

People reflected on the death of Mikhail Gorbachev, the last Soviet leader, who was lionized abroad as a hero of liberalism, but castigated by many in Russia for bringing about the end of the Soviet empire.

www.nytimes.com

 

[I am not Sherlock H.]

Working on my very best Yoko Ono singing impression here, but

" All we are saaaayyinng, is give Peace a chance "

Thank you. Thank you very much.

Peace

Cannot say that I disagree @shotgun09 ….. although I also believe a full withdrawal and retreat by the Russian and aggressor forces from all Ukrainian lands are needed. As one of many conditions that likely still need to be determined.

And if US officials and US diplomats cannot do better than was displayed in the press conference today with the President of Ukraine, not so sure that they should be involved. MOO

 

[Fairy1]

Zelensky was the one who offered the rare earth minerals in his "victory plan" back in October.

Ukraine PM says minerals deal agreed with US

Denis Shmyhal said the Ukrainian government would not sign a deal without security guarantees.

www.bbc.com

Ukraine has also claimed on several occasions that a deal was done with the US then backed out for various reasons.

Ukraine PM says minerals deal agreed with US

Denis Shmyhal said the Ukrainian government would not sign a deal without security guarantees.

www.bbc.com

Perhaps because they're getting nothing of value in return? What kind of leader would Zelenskyy be if he just gave up? He is the President of Ukraine and is obligated to act in the best interests of the Ukranian people and their future. They have a country to rebuild. Why would he surrender their assets? The rare earth minerals in Ukraine are a bargaining tool for them. That's their card. If they give that up, they truly have nothing left with which to negotiate.

 

[keek]

Cannot say that I disagree @shotgun09 ….. although I also believe a full withdrawal and retreat by the Russian and aggressor forces from all Ukrainian lands are needed. As one of many conditions that likely still need to be determined.

And if US officials and US diplomats cannot do better than was displayed in the press conference today with the President of Ukraine, not so sure that they should be involved. MOO

Russia's most significant opposition leader for the past decade, Alexei Navalny, has died in an Arctic Circle jail, the prison service has said.
President Vladimir Putin's most vociferous critic, he was serving 19 years on extremism charges that were widely seen as politically motivated. NEVER FORGET THE BRAVERY AND INTEGRITY OF THIS MAN AS WELL, HE DIED FOR IT, KILLED FOR IT, AGAINST P.

 

[acutename]

What to know about an unprecedented Oval Office exchange​

IMAGE SOURCE, REUTERS
US President Donald Trump and Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky were locked in a testy exchange in the Oval Office earlier today - which led to Zelensky being told to leave the White House.

It's a lot to take in, so we've rounded up the key points you may have missed.

• Trump accused Zelensky of "gambling with World War Three". US Vice-President JD Vance also weighed in, and called Zelensky "disrespectful"
• Zelensky said there should be "no compromises" with Vladimir Putin - but Trump says Kyiv will have to make concessions to reach a peace deal with Russia
• Shortly after the talk ended, Zelensky left the White House - without signing a much-touted deal that would offer Washington access to Ukraine's rare earth minerals
• According to our US partner CBS, the Ukrainian delegation left the Oval Office to a "separated room" where they were told to leave
• A scheduled press conference with Zelensky and Trump was cancelled
• Trump posted on his Truth Social platform and called for Zelensky to return "when he is ready for peace"
• Zelensky thanked the US and Trump four times in a post on X
• European officials and leaders have expressed support for Ukraine, with Polish Prime Minister Donald Tusk telling Zelensky: "You're not alone"

Zelensky told to leave White House after angry spat with Trump and Vance

The Ukrainian leader was told to leave the White House after an angry exchange with the US president.

www.bbc.co.uk

Ah...."Trump posted on his Truth Social platform and called for Zelensky to return "when he is ready for peace."

For anyone who read "The Art of the Deal," is this in one of the chapters? When I had a rescue dog that was "bad," I used to put him on the porch for awhile and then let him back in. : ( Glad to know that such simple methods can be used in world diplomacy.

 

[Jade]

Why was Vance sitting next to the two Presidents when he doesn’t even care about Ukraine?

Vance has lots to say about Ukraine and Putin and more in this pre election article.

It was never going to be a good visit with that sour puss Vance around, imo:

'I don't care' – JD Vance on Ukraine, in his own words

The selection of Ohio Senator J. D. Vance as Donald Trump's running mate this week has sent ripples of concern around the globe, felt not least in Ukraine. One of the most vocal opponents of U.S. aid to Ukraine, Vance has an extensive back catalog of statements that might raise eyebrows in Kyiv...

www.yahoo.com

All imo

 

[Leilei]

But back then, he was alone. Now he has his sidekick, Vance.

Vance showed his true colors today.
He is the one who set the match to this fire.
IMO.

 

[branmuffin]

As long as the Trump administration doesn't do a deal with Russia...

That's what worries me. I know Trump has been referred to as a Russian agent for over 40 years since his first forays into Russia. The Russians are expert at exploiting an individual's weaknesses and Trump's weakness is his vanity. Trump has repeatedly shown his disdain for the west's policies going so far as saying publicly that he believed Russia over the USAs intelligence that Russia had not interfered in the 2016 election. At a meeting in Finland with Putin, they had a private conversation for 2 hours with no transcripts, no other people but two translators for each man. That is unprecedented. He constantly curries favor with Putin calling him a strong man, wishing he had the same control over his country that Putin has over his.

So earlier in this conversation I brought up all the military installations that the US has - 128 military bases in 49 countries. In Europe there are over 60K troops. If the US is no longer interested in protecting their allies in NATO are they going to clean up shop and leave? Does the US consider Europe an ally any more under Trump. If not, then I think it is imperative that all those military bases be considered enemy combatants. Because I can't get over this niggling feeling that one of the classic forms of war is to attack from within. It's obvious to me that Trump is more interested in appeasing Putin than showing a united front with NATO against Russia's aggression. Having US military bases all over Europe with a Republican president who views Putin's desire to return Russia to its pre-revolutionary boundaries as a desire he can understand is extremely dangerous, imo.

‘The perfect target’: Russia cultivated Trump as asset for 40 years – ex-KGB spy

The KGB ‘played the game as if they were immensely impressed by his personality’, Yuri Shvets, a key source for a new book, tells the Guardian

www.theguardian.com

Where Are U.S. Forces Deployed in Europe?

The start of U.S.-Russia talks on a possible agreement to end the war in Ukraine has spurred discussion about whether U.S. military forces in Europe will be reduced—a decision that would signal a sig…

www.cfr.org

 

[Fairy1]

Vance showed his true colors today.
He is the one who set the match to this fire.
IMO.

Honestly, it seemed quite contrived to me. I feel like Vance was just a useful tool playing the part he was instructed to play. The question is, who was the audience to whom they were playing?

 

[Simply Southern]

Zelensky was the one who offered the rare earth minerals in his "victory plan" back in October.

Ukraine PM says minerals deal agreed with US

Denis Shmyhal said the Ukrainian government would not sign a deal without security guarantees.

www.bbc.com

Ukraine has also claimed on several occasions that a deal was done with the US then backed out for various reasons.

Ukraine PM says minerals deal agreed with US

Denis Shmyhal said the Ukrainian government would not sign a deal without security guarantees.

www.bbc.com

Zelenskyy's playing games, he thinks his buddy Macron is gonna save him. He wants to divide NATO, divide European and US relationship. BIG MISTAKE!!!
Made me sick to see Zelensky sitting their rolling his eyes, smirking, and shaking his head. He doesn't want to end the war, he said so. His true self came out shouting .... Putin needs to pay for reconstruction, they need to give Ukraine frozen Russian assets, Putin needs to give back our land. Demanding Europe and US stop Putin. Even when Trump said this could lead to WWII, he still wouldn't shut up. I knew then he' had no intentions of a peace deal.
Hoping President Trump stands firm .... Trashing America does not get what you what you want. Happy there's an ocean between us and this guy.
Moo...

 

[PommyMommy]

Trump: "So it's going to be a lot of money will be made from the sale and from the use of raw Earth. And as you know, our country doesn't have much raw Earth. We have a lot of oil and gas, but we don't have a lot of the raw earth. And what we do have is protected by the environmentalists.

So we're going to be using that, taking it, using it for all of the things we do, including AI and including weapons and the military."

https://twitter.com/x/status/1895523058200334688

Zelenskyy: "Putin must pay for Ukraine's recovery"

He said Ukraine would never accept only a ceasefire because Russia would violate it. "Putin has violated the ceasefire with Ukraine 25 times," Zelenskyy pressed Trump.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1895523962177667354

Zelenskyy: Putin broke the ceasefire. He killed our people. He did not exchange prisoners. We signed the exchange of prisoners, but he didn't do it. What kind of diplomacy you are speaking about?JD Vance: I think it's disrespectful for you to come into the Oval Office and try to litigate this in front of them American media.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1895535031617274134

 

[PommyMommy]

Polish Prime Minister Donald Tusk supported Zelenskyy: "Dear Zelenskyy, dear Ukrainian friends, you are not alone".

https://twitter.com/x/status/1895549103846932907

Macron reacts to Trump-Zelenskyy shouting match"Russia is the aggressor, and Ukraine is the aggressed people. I think we were all right to help Ukraine and sanction Russia 3 years ago, and to continue to do so."

https://twitter.com/x/status/1895551222846759011

"Canada needs to be closer to Europe and the United Kingdom," - Canada's Ministry of Foreign Affairs Mélanie Joly."We are in a security crisis," added Joly.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1895553553458249968

 

[HmmMysterious]

Putin needs to pay for reconstruction, they need to give Ukraine frozen Russian assets, Putin needs to give back our land. Demanding Europe and US stop Putin.

Yes.

Zelensky's right.

 

[branmuffin]

Give Peace A Chance
The War needs to stop
The people need to go back to their homes
The kids need to go back to school
The mail needs to be delivered.

Oh, how trite. Trump isn't asking for peace he's asking for appeasement. Two totally different things.

 

[Fairy1]

After today, I really wonder how many more times the POTUS has to demonstrate his allegiance to Putin before people see it for what it actually is.

 

[Simply Southern]

How does Zelinsky get to the US? Do we fly him in and out? Where does he stay? And why did he agree to meet with Trump and Vance "by himself?" Could he bring a Ukrainian posse? Just do not see how he would not be like a trapped animal between those two and do not see how it would not all be too high volume to be productive. IMO.

He did bring his staff I watched his team walk in and out. I also, watched his team s reaction to his behavior. There are many media clips of his staff lowering their head, pinching the bridge of their nose, with their eyes closed.
Moo...

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Zelenskyy's playing games, he thinks his buddy Macron is gonna save him. He wants to divide NATO, divide European and US relationship. BIG MISTAKE!!!
Made me sick to see Zelensky sitting their rolling his eyes, smirking, and shaking his head. He doesn't want to end the war, he said so. His true self came out shouting .... Putin needs to pay for reconstruction, they need to give Ukraine frozen Russian assets, Putin needs to give back our land. Demanding Europe and US stop Putin. Even when Trump said this could lead to WWII, he still wouldn't shut up. I knew then he' had no intentions of a peace deal.
Hoping President Trump stands firm .... Trashing America does not get what you what you want. Happy there's an ocean between us and this guy.
Moo...

I agree.

I found it amazing that Zelenskyy said that Ukraine has been "all alone" in the war against Putin's Russia. Totally insulting all Americans and the people of all of the other countries that have provided massive amounts of aid the last three years. JMO.

 

[Simply Southern]

Yes.

Zelensky's right.

Well I wish him good luck on trying to collect that debt. He seems to forgotten Putin has nuclear weapons. Zelenskyy's gonna keep talking til HE pushes Putin to shut him up. He don't stand a chance. Get ready for a nuclear war.
Moo...

 

[keek]

Zelenskyy's playing games, he thinks his buddy Macron is gonna save him. He wants to divide NATO, divide European and US relationship. BIG MISTAKE!!!
Made me sick to see Zelensky sitting their rolling his eyes, smirking, and shaking his head. He doesn't want to end the war, he said so. His true self came out shouting .... Putin needs to pay for reconstruction, they need to give Ukraine frozen Russian assets, Putin needs to give back our land. Demanding Europe and US stop Putin. Even when Trump said this could lead to WWII, he still wouldn't shut up. I knew then he' had no intentions of a peace deal.
Hoping President Trump stands firm .... Trashing America does not get what you what you want. Happy there's an ocean between us and this guy.
Moo...

Russia's most significant opposition leader for the past decade, Alexei Navalny, has died in an Arctic Circle jail, the prison service has said.
President Vladimir Putin's most vociferous critic, he was serving 19 years on extremism charges that were widely seen as politically motivated.