Russia Attacks Ukraine - 23 Feb 2022 #11

[JennieM]

25m ago16.52 GMT
Patrick Wintour

As Keir Starmer surveys the wreckage of the US-Ukrainian relationship caused by the Oval Office bar-room fight, the UK prime minister is clearly intent on trying to repair the diplomatic damage, but it may be that the mood of mutual antagonism not just in the US, but in Europe, is too great.

It is not as if Starmer, to use Trump’s blunt phraseology, has many cards left to play. He had already played them, and his hand was not strong enough to prevent the US-Ukraine breakdown.

Courtesy of King Charles, he offered an unprecedented second state visit to President Trump. He had rushed through a cut in the overseas aid budget so as to be in a position to present Trump with an increase in UK defence spending, and during his meeting on Thursday he had fawned over Trump’s ability to “change the conversation over Ukraine”.

Yet despite the decent atmospherics, Starmer, in common with Emmanuel Macron earlier in the week, could not extract the one concession he wanted: a clear US commitment to provide security guarantees – principally air cover and intelligence – for a European force being prepared to oversee a ceasefire inside Ukraine. Trump continued to insist he trusted Vladimir Putin to abide by the ceasefire and focused on the concessions Ukraine was going to have to make.

‘You have full backing across the UK’: Zelenskyy leaves Downing Street after meeting with Starmer – as it happened

Ukrainian president has held talks with PM Keir Starmer ahead of defence summit with European leaders tomorrow. This blog is now closed.

www.theguardian.com

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Well the deals off and it looks like the US it's going to let Zelensky move forward with his war. He doesn't want peace. He wants all his land returned, back to 1996. He wants all frozen access turned over to Ukraine. He wants US military troops on the ground to protect him or fight to take his land back. All funded by the US taxpayer.

The US has chosen not to enter war with Russia. The policy has not changed. Zelenskyy wasn't able to pressure the previous administrations to enter his war but we did help fund it.

It would take Congressional approval for the US to enter war. The President does not have the authority. He can ask Congress, like Bush did after 911. None of the administrations have ask permission to enter this war.

What has changed .... The unlimited flow of funds to Ukraine. It doesn't bother me what other countries think of our president or our business practices. The hurtful things that are being said, by those we thought were our partners, will affect our relationships long into the future.

Moo...

Zelenskyy is a fool. How does he expect to get Russia out of Ukraine? He can't do it on the battlefield. Three years of stalemate fighting is proof of that. If he thinks having US troops do it for him that would lead to World War III which is insane.

President Trump was right in shutting him down at the PC. Zellenskyy can now head home with his tail between his legs and hopefully figure out that a negotiated peace is in his countries best interest and not this never ending war of attrition.

I think that all of the hate being sent our way is letting us know who are true friends are in the world. Perhaps we should rethink how our money is being spent on other countries defense. JMO.

 

[JennieM]

2m ago12.15 EST
French president Emmanuel Macron said he is ready to start discussions on nuclear deterrence for Europe, hinting France could help to protect other EU countries, given the security threats posed by Russia.

European leaders will meet in London on Sunday to discuss a peace plan for Ukraine and they will attend a European Union summit on Thursday.

Macron told Portuguese TV RTP in an interview he posted on X on Saturday that if Europe wanted to move towards “greater autonomy” in matters of defence and nuclear deterrence, then its leaders should start a discussion about it.

“I am available to open this discussion...if it allows to build a European force,” he said. “There has always been a European dimension to France’s vital interests within its nuclear doctrine.”

‘You have full backing across the UK’: Zelenskyy leaves Downing Street after meeting with Starmer – as it happened

Ukrainian president has held talks with PM Keir Starmer ahead of defence summit with European leaders tomorrow. This blog is now closed.

www.theguardian.com

 

[Donswife48]

MSN

On the social media site X, Sen. Eric Schmitt, R-M posted, "Zelenskyy could have signed the deal five days earlier but wanted to come to the White House. He’d been difficult for two weeks. Yet he wanted the White House meeting. Trump was upbeat about it even just the day before publicly and privately the day of. Although he could have reset the whole thing, Zelenskyy was antagonistic and over the top."

 

[Simply Southern]

Seems the Ukraine delegation wanted to continue with the agreement, "practically in tears wanting to move ahead.

‘You have full backing across the UK’: Zelenskyy leaves Downing Street after meeting with Starmer – as it happened

Ukrainian president has held talks with PM Keir Starmer ahead of defence summit with European leaders tomorrow. This blog is now closed.

www.theguardian.com

Top White House official gives account of events after the Oval Office argument
The US national security adviser, Mike Waltz, has given Fox News a first-person account of the moment he told a “still argumentative” Volodymyr Zelenskyy it was time to leave the White House.

Trump and Zelenskyy retreated to separate rooms after the fracas in the Oval Office ended, Waltz said on Saturday, and he, the secretary of state, Marco Rubio, and other top officials then “advised the president – pretty much unanimously advised the president – that after that insult in the Oval Office, we just do not see how that can move forward, that any further engagement would only go backwards from this moment on”.

Asked by Fox News whether Zelenskyy seemed to recognise what had happened, Waltz said: “No, he didn’t. Frankly, his team did. His ambassador and his adviser were practically – I mean, they were practically in tears wanting this to move forward. But Zelenskyy was still argumentative.”

Waltz said he told Zelenskyy: “Time is not on your side here. Time is not on your side on the battlefield. Time is not on your side in terms of the world situation, and, most importantly, US aid and the taxpayers’ tolerance is not unlimited.”

Zelenskyy, he added, “has not gotten the memo that this is a new sheriff in town. This is a new president, and we are determined to take a new approach towards peace.”

 

[PommyMommy]

President Zelensky is flying to London ahead of European summit. Zelensky earlier confirmed that he will travel to London for a summit with European leaders to discuss joint defense and security plans to be held on March 2.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1895778970194542961

Russian forces suffer record vehicle losses in February.During the month of February, Ukrainian forces destroyed the largest number of Russian vehicles since the start of the full-scale invasion, according to Ukraine's Defense Ministry.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1895873380475424840

Craig Unger, a journalist and writer who has written two books on Trump’s connections to Russia, says he is "absolutely certain" that the U.S. president is a Russian asset.The Kyiv Independent sat down with Unger to hear what makes him so certain.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1895889625325203782

 

[JennieM]

Zelensky embraced by Starmer as he arrives for talks in wake of Trump showdown​

​

Zelensky arrives at Number 10​

IMAGE SOURCE, REUTERS
Volodymyr Zelensky has arrived outside Number 10 for his meeting with Prime Minister Keir Starmer.

Starmer greets the Ukrainian leader with a handshake and embraces him while posing for some pictures.

As a reminder, Zelensky's visit comes a day after he met with Donald Trump at the White House - and days after Starmer himself met the US president.

Zelensky tells BBC Ukraine 'ready to sign' minerals deal with US

The Ukrainian president's comments to Laura Kuenssberg came after he failed to sign the deal at the White House on Friday.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[keek]

Post in thread 'Russia Attacks Ukraine - 23 Feb 2022 #11'
Russia Attacks Ukraine - 23 Feb 2022 #11

View attachment 567174T

It's MIND BOGGELING to me that THIS should even be said..P has always been trying to overtake anyyyyy of his neighboring countries. It's no secret! People going on here about why should we fund Ukraine?? I mean, P has already won over and inserted himself 100 percent to this 'presidency'. <modsnip>

 

[snarast]

Craig Unger, a journalist and writer who has written two books on Trump’s connections to Russia, says he is "absolutely certain" that the U.S. president is a Russian asset.The Kyiv Independent sat down with Unger to hear what makes him so certain.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1895889625325203782

Well, that would shake things up a bit, wouldn’t it?

 

[JennieM]

What real allies look like. Proud of the UK and Keir Starmer.​

Zelenskyy arrives at Downing Street for talks with Starmer​

The Ukrainian president, Volodymyr Zelenskyy, has arrived in Downing Street for bilateral talks with Keir Starmer.

View image in fullscreen
British PM Keir Starmer meets Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskiy in London. Photograph: Toby Melville/Reuters

‘You have full backing across the UK’: Zelenskyy leaves Downing Street after meeting with Starmer – as it happened

Ukrainian president has held talks with PM Keir Starmer ahead of defence summit with European leaders tomorrow. This blog is now closed.

www.theguardian.com

 

[Simply Southern]

I think the reason this 'negotiation' was to be filmed live was because Trump was so certain that the Zelensky would capitulate to the pressure that he wanted the fame, the glory and wanted Putin to know he solidified the deal he and Putin had hammered out. So that's why the Tass news people got 'overlooked'. When Zelinsky refused to sign any kind of deal with assurances that ending the war would end Putin's attempt to try again, that's when Trump and Vance attacked him, like schoolyard bullies. "Give us your lunch money" level of spite and immaturity. So what was supposed to be a victory enjoyed by Putin and Trump in real time has become an sound bite that will live on long after permanently cementing America's devolution into a pandering appeaser for Putin.

They were following the same format as the other two prime minister visits.
They come in and set in the yellow chairs. Trump welcomes the person, the guest usually thanks for the visit. There's lite chit chat. They usually State the reason for the visit, but no details or indepth discussion. Then they take a few questions.

Attend the White House luncheon, including the prime minister and his full cabinet. Then they meet and discuss. A follow up press conference is usually held around 4:00 or 5:00, both parties speaking of the outcome. The press conferences have been very cordial, they have both have expressed disagreement, respectfully, sometimes they joke about their disagreement.

Moo...
Moo... And I've been watching all the press conferences. They are available under White House press on YouTube.

 

[keek]

Well, that would shake things up a bit, wouldn’t it?

Clearly he is, NK too.

 

[JennieM]

Starmer: You are very welcome here in Downing Street, you have our full support and backing for as long as it takes. A lasting peace for Ukraine. So important for Europe and Ukraine.

 

[JennieM]

Z very emotional and grateful.

 

[Betty P]

Trump threatened to pull out of NATO because the members were not paying the required dues. The US has become a honey pot for foreign aid. After his threat folks decided to pay a little more, but still aren't meeting the obligation. I'm thankful Trump stood up for Americans, many countries benefit from NATO without paying full membership. Trump's going to take care of American interest and the American dollar. Hallelujah!!! NATO members need to step up and pay their fair share or the organization will fail, it's common sense. If everyone paid their 2% at least, NATO wouldn't I have a financial problem. The US is paying almost 4%, Poland's paying almost five.

I'm not sure that most Americans care whether Ukraine /Europe trust us. What we do care about is how much money we pour into the war that's going nowhere. We do care about the threat of nuclear war, which Ukraine is determined to lead us all into. I certainly don't trust Zelensky. <modsnip - HB is off topic>. Zelenskyy even flew to the US in October, to campaign for the Democratic candidate.

As far as, Alaska and Russia, I'm not worried. The American government unjustifiably accused Russia of political interference, which turned out to be a lie. I think Putin, will have some loyalty to Americans, who proved the truth.

Everybody's all mad and upset cuz the US won't continue to fund Ukraine. These countries offer "support", but few dollars are attached to that commitment. They say they've given more than the US. Well I guess so, when you combine all the donations from 27 countries. I'll give them credit they know how to spin a story. These 27 countries, should be able to provide security for Ukraine, but they prefer to try to shame the US into taking on the burden. Why would we even want to help, after the horrific things that have been said in the media by our supposed partner countries?

All my opinion only, respectfully

The EU isn't asking the US to keep funding their portion of the costs of Ukraine's war.

They're asking the US to provide air cover and intelligence for EU forces if Russia violates the peace agreement.

‘You have full backing across the UK’: Zelenskyy leaves Downing Street after meeting with Starmer – as it happened

Ukrainian president has held talks with PM Keir Starmer ahead of defence summit with European leaders tomorrow. This blog is now closed.

www.theguardian.com

Starmer, in common with Emmanuel Macron earlier in the week, could not extract the one concession he wanted: a clear US commitment to provide security guarantees – principally air cover and intelligence – for a European force being prepared to oversee a ceasefire inside Ukraine. Trump continued to insist he trusted Vladimir Putin to abide by the ceasefire and focused on the concessions Ukraine was going to have to make.

Contrary to Trump's remarks, the US hasn't been paying the full cost of the Ukraine war, it has been sharing those costs with EU countries. Are these errors of his due to a lack of knowledge about Russia's invasion of Ukraine? Has Trump forgotten those important facts or is he being dishonest? The EU hasn't asked the US to pay the full cost of defending Ukraine. They're only asking they contribute to the effort to provide security in the event of another Russian attack. Air cover and intelligence seems like a reasonable request.

Russia has broken cease fire agreements many times in the past. There's no reason to trust their word.

 

[JennieM]

1m ago17.39 GMT
Keir Starmer told Ukrainian president Volodymyr Zelensky he has “full backing across the United Kingdom and we stand with Ukraine for as long as it may take” as the pair met inside Downing Street on Saturday evening.


4m ago17.37 GMT

Keir Starmer meets Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskiy in London, a day after the Ukraine president’s turbulent visit to the White House to meet with Donald Trump. Photograph: Toby Melville/Reuters

Zelensky tells BBC Ukraine 'ready to sign' minerals deal with US

The Ukrainian president's comments to Laura Kuenssberg came after he failed to sign the deal at the White House on Friday.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[snarast]

Clearly he is, NK too.

NK doesn’t have that much to do with the new world order. A new world order that is apparently not an immutable object but rather oscillating wildly.

 

[Simply Southern]

President Zelensky is flying to London ahead of European summit. Zelensky earlier confirmed that he will travel to London for a summit with European leaders to discuss joint defense and security plans to be held on March 2.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1895778970194542961

Russian forces suffer record vehicle losses in February.During the month of February, Ukrainian forces destroyed the largest number of Russian vehicles since the start of the full-scale invasion, according to Ukraine's Defense Ministry.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1895873380475424840

Craig Unger, a journalist and writer who has written two books on Trump’s connections to Russia, says he is "absolutely certain" that the U.S. president is a Russian asset.The Kyiv Independent sat down with Unger to hear what makes him so certain.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1895889625325203782

After that propaganda about Trump. I'm done with Ukraine. Moo

 

[Marysmith]

After that propaganda about Trump. I'm done with Ukraine. Moo

We know you are. You made that clear many, many times.

 

[JennieM]

'We stand with Ukraine', says Starmer​

IMAGE SOURCE, PA MEDIA

We're now hearing from Ukraine's Volodymyr Zelensky and UK Prime Minister Keir Starmer ahead of their meeting.

Starmer reiterates the UK's support for Ukraine, saying "we stand with Ukraine for as long as it may take".

He speaks of "unwavering determination" to achieve a lasting peace for Ukraine.

Zelensky thanks Starmer for his support, and thanks King Charles III for accepting a meeting with him tomorrow.

"We are happy to have such partners and such friends," he says.

Zelensky tells BBC Ukraine 'ready to sign' minerals deal with US

The Ukrainian president's comments to Laura Kuenssberg came after he failed to sign the deal at the White House on Friday.

www.bbc.co.uk