Russia Attacks Ukraine - 23 Feb 2022

[otto]

I know this sounds terribly naive probably, but why is that? If the world had taken these months to send a force of troops all along the border, would it have made Putin think twice? Or do you think he doesn't care if his soldiers die? Or there's an acceptable amount of loss as long as he's sure he will end up victorious? Like part of me can't imagine one country being willing to go up against a bunch of other countries. I know he has nuclear weapons, but is he really going to use them? And is this why he never gets more than a slap on the wrist no matter what he does? This just seems so hopeless the way it is right now. My heart is aching and afraid.

If no one sends troops to help Ukraine, this is just the beginning. More countries will be annexed, one by one. If NATO sends troops, there's a threat and a possibility that Russia retaliates to all NATO countries - triggering a world war. Putin is banking on NATO doing nothing beyond sanctions, and he's not worried about sanctions.

I think that Putin, like any world leader, knows that there will be casualties in conflict - the cost of securing critical supply routes. People survived Hiroshima and Chernobyl, so I expect that nuclear weapons are on the table.

I should add - everything I post on this discussion is opinion.

 

[sunshineray]

I know this sounds terribly naive probably, but why is that? If the world had taken these months to send a force of troops all along the border, would it have made Putin think twice? Or do you think he doesn't care if his soldiers die? Or there's an acceptable amount of loss as long as he's sure he will end up victorious? Like part of me can't imagine one country being willing to go up against a bunch of other countries. I know he has nuclear weapons, but is he really going to use them? And is this why he never gets more than a slap on the wrist no matter what he does? This just seems so hopeless the way it is right now. My heart is aching and afraid.

It is heartbreaking to watch and hear Ukraine's President say no one is coming to help. If Ukraine had been welcomed into NATO, voted in, already then NATO forces would have engaged. NATO over the past years since Putin took the Crimea have helped train and supply Ukraine's defenses but have not allowed them in. Now Ukraine is left to suffer the phsyicality of war on it's own.

"Zelenskiy [Ukrainian President]says 137 Ukrainians have been killed so far in the Russian operation. After talking to Western leaders he says, "We're alone for defense of our country. Who will fight along with us now? To be honest, I see no one"

https://mobile.twitter.com/ASLuhn/status/1496981841567358982

 

[zencompass]

Michael Kofman is a Senior Research Scientist at CNA and a Fellow at the Wilson Center researching and writing on the Russian military.

The following PBS News video is an interview with Mr. Kofman:


What Russia is hoping to achieve in Ukraine


https://twitter.com/KofmanMichael

 

[otto]

I'm listening to BBC World TV News - good coverage.

 

[sunshineray]

I find this to be chilling:

"My grandparents were sent away to Siberia," said Jaunius Kazlauskas, a 50-year-old teacher in Vilnius, Lithuania's capital.

"My father was persecuted by the KGB. Now, I live in a free democratic country, but it seems that nothing can be taken for granted."

Who is going to stop Putin from sending Ukranians branded as dissidents to Siberia. The people who exercised their right to free speech as citizens of the country of Ukraine. Is Putin targeting Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy for a trip to Siberia??

I read earlier today that Russia has a hit list of people in the Ukraine. That might be why some small villages have been targeted today as was reported. I saw interviews with numerous Ukraines on the street who said they were trying/planning to get out of the city to the countryside to avoid bombing.

I'm sure the genius Russian hackers have provided lists of all the second vacation homes of Ukrainian government's notables. and exiled Russian dissidents living in Ukraine. AJMO

 

[sunshineray]

I'm listening to BBC World News - good coverage.

The Guardian has had excellent coverage also.

 

[shotgun09]

To be quite honest, I have been paying a bit of attention to this Ukraine issue for a few days/ weeks. I heard POTUS say something along the lines of "a slight incursion" that may happen from the Russian front last week. I also heard the President of Ukraine claim 'all is well' in so many words.... and all the while Putin is grinning like a Cheshire cat. They thought he was bluffing! He played well. He may be a monster, but he outsmarted them all. One month? For 'sanctions' to maybe have an affect? Give me a break...

War games suck...when it's for real.
The leaders and warmongers will continue to rule, raking in the big bucks, all while living a protected life..but...

Young men and young women will be killed in the line of duty, encouraged and pushed to this brink.
Civilian life in and near the Ukraine is questionable at best.
Innocent civilians from across the globe will be affected by this....emotionally, financially etc.

When will we ever learn?

 

[Lexiintoronto]

It looks like Ukraine will be annexed by force by Russia within days. Any country or organization, such as NATO, that sends troops will very likely be attacked as well. It's too risky to help Ukraine with military support without triggering a world war.

I’m a bit more optimistic. He has underestimated the Ukrainian army and has overestimated his popularity. Russians in his city of birth are demonstrating and that is life-threatening for them. Think Nazis and WWII tactics. But that’s not stopping them.

He’s too close to NATO countries. Expect all of them to fight him in the Ukraine.

My opinion only, being part Estonian.

 

[sunshineray]

To be quite honest, I have been paying a bit of attention to this Ukraine issue for a few days/ weeks. I heard POTUS say something along the lines of "a slight incursion" that may happen from the Russian front last week. I also heard the President of Ukraine claim 'all is well' in so many words.... and all the while Putin is grinning like a Cheshire cat. They thought he was bluffing! He played well. He may be a monster, but he outsmarted them all. One month? For 'sanctions' to maybe have an affect? Give me a break...

War games suck...when it's for real.
The leaders and warmongers will continue to rule, raking in the big bucks, all while living a protected life..but...

Young men and young women will be killed in the line of duty, encouraged and pushed to this brink.
Civilian life in and near the Ukraine is questionable at best.
Innocent civilians from across the globe will be affected by this....emotionally, financially etc.

When will we ever learn?

I think a lot of the financial sanctions will be felt immediately, frozen assets and Russians banks being basically closed. Hopefully Putin has gone too far for the richest Russians and can be ousted. But who knows what the world will get then...be careful what you wish for, right?

 

[CSIDreamer]

https://twitter.com/ZelenskyyUa/status/1496785547594924032?t=mcQUuiLNBtoHx0hhCojCqg&s=19

We will give weapons to anyone who wants to defend the country. Be ready to support Ukraine in the squares of our cities.

 

[sunshineray]

I’m a bit more optimistic. He has underestimated the Ukrainian army and has overestimated his popularity. Russians in his city of birth are demonstrating and that is life-threatening for them. Think Nazis and WWII tactics. But that’s not stopping them.

He’s too close to NATO countries. Expect all of them to fight him in the Ukraine.

My opinion only, being part Estonian.

He's going to be very careful about not overstepping the borders of those countries. It could happen though, there are ways.

 

[Lexiintoronto]

Welcome him to my country!

and Welcome to the Canadians!

Our navy has just sent a ship from Halifax.
I’m half-Estonian, born in Canada.

We won’t let the Ukraine or the Baltic states down

 

[CrimeAway]

Ukrainians have no choice but to send Russian soldiers home in body bags.

Truth be told, Putin smelled weakness, and pounced.

Principles of war are timeless. Tyrants and aggressors defeated by force.

Civilian populations suffer once again at the hands of yet another despot.

Fight, Ukraine FIGHT!

Maybe not even body bags. Apparently, Russia has mobile crematoria:

 

[CSIDreamer]

Maybe not even body bags. Apparently, Russia has mobile crematoria:

Well, that's awful.

 

[Herat]

Maybe not even body bags. Apparently, Russia has mobile crematoria:

I can't be the only one that instantly thought of the Nazi concentration camp crematoriums.....

 

[Sundog]

China rejects calling Russia move 'invasion' | Toronto Sun

 

[otto]

China rejects calling Russia move 'invasion' | Toronto Sun

That's dangerous. Putin is friends with China and North Korea. The world is distracted with woke-ness, pandemic, truck convoys, and border blockades. Canada's border weakness was severely exposed and compromised in the last month.

Putin can occupy and annex Ukraine. He can continue to occupy and annex adjacent countries to acquire natural resources and supply routes. If NATO retaliates, Putin could strike the USA West Coast. Biden cannot retaliate for fear of releasing radiation to Western Europe.

Radiation moves with the wind as it dissipates. I was in Northern Netherlands when the winds blew in from Chernobyl. Milk had to be destroyed for 3 weeks (half-life), livestock ate silage. Dropping a bomb on Russia risks harming people in Western Europe.

I don't think NATO can do anything to stop this.

 

[otto]

Russia is the largest country in the world, Canada comes next, then China, finally USA. Russia aligned with China to annex another country means a very powerful presence. While Canada and the USA are bickering about vaccine passports, the EU is falling. A few weeks ago, North Korea tested roughly 9 missiles within a few weeks.

Largest Countries in the World by Area - Worldometer

 

[Tiff23fr]

China rejects calling Russia move 'invasion' | Toronto Sun

IMO China is watching and responding while keeping an eye on Taiwan. I feel there is a massive chess game underway. A scary one at that.
Taiwan warns Chinese aircraft in its air defence zone

 

[zencompass]

IMO China is watching and responding while keeping an eye on Taiwan. I feel there is a massive chess game underway. A scary one at that.
Taiwan warns Chinese aircraft in its air defence zone

Dear @Tiff23fr,

Thank you for your insightful post as well as the link!

A "massive chess game" indeed.


Chinese embassy in Ukraine tells citizens to display Chinese flags on vehicles | National Post

Excerpt:

BEIJING — China’s embassy in Kyiv told its citizens in Ukraine to stay home or at least take the precaution of displaying a Chinese flag on their vehicles if they needed to drive anywhere, following Russia’s attack on the country.