Satellite could plummet to Earth

[dingo]

I've got my little slingshot aimed at you! :blowkiss:

Dingo, I'm still cracking up at your bike helmet. BTW, I think I was lending you that but forgot to mention the $100/day fee. Mail it when you get a chance, k?




Sheesh, I'm giddy from verdict-watching Bobby Cutts all day. ...zzz....zzzz

I knew I should of bought my own helmet

 

[Elphaba]

Update: Spaceweather is saying that the Pentagon may try to bring it down in a few days.

That said: if they can bust it up into small pieces, it will burn up in the atmosphere and look like an impromptu meteor shower... it is large pieces that are worrisome.

 

[Truly]

http://www.cnn.com/2008/TECH/02/15/spy.satellite/index.html

Attempt to shoot down spy satellite to cost $60 MILLION

"...the super-secret spy satellite malfunctioned immediately after launch in December 2006."

"The government started thinking about how to approach the satellite problem in December (2007). And on January 4, (2008), President Bush and various senior officials agreed to begin planning for the shoot-down."


Something tells me this is a big expensive stunt.

Neither Astronomy Magazine or NASA even mention it.

 

[dingo]

Update: Spaceweather is saying that the Pentagon may try to bring it down in a few days.

That said: if they can bust it up into small pieces, it will burn up in the atmosphere and look like an impromptu meteor shower... it is large pieces that are worrisome.

They sure are.

 

[STO4]

Update: Spaceweather is saying that the Pentagon may try to bring it down in a few days.

That said: if they can bust it up into small pieces, it will burn up in the atmosphere and look like an impromptu meteor shower... it is large pieces that are worrisome.

Should make for a great astronomy show

 

[Truly]

Gravity: It's not just a good idea...It's THE LAW!:crazy:

 

[Buzz Mills]

In respect to being a missile defense test, this should be like shooting a duck on the water.

However, having spent many years doing testing on early missile defense systems, many things can happen to cause failures.

The satellite they are attempting to intercept is the size of a school bus, whereas a re-entry body (REB), that the missile defense system is designed to intercept, is the size of a wastebasket.

They will position an Aegis cruiser, in the Pacific Ocean, along the orbit earth path of the satellite, and there are said to be three missiles availble to do the intercept.

There is plenty of time, they know the path of the satellite; there aren't any decoys, or attempts to fool the intercepting missile; it should be a simple task; however don't underestimate the problems that could occur.

If the intercept fails, Poland will be scratching its head, and Russia will certainly take note.

and if it is successful, we don't want any more space debris in earth orbit. It presents an ongoing danger to any craft in space.

 

[Elphaba]

Thanks for the information, Buzz... I was pondering the aspect of how the missile interception would go down.

About debris up there: even the smallest of space junk can be hazardous... STS 59 saw a small fleck of paint hit a port window at the front of shuttle Endeavor, causing a half-inch impact mark.

 

[Trino]

There is discussion elsewhere that the real problem with the satellite hitting Earth is not that it has hazardous materials, but that it has sensitive information, that the US Government is not telling all (big surprise).

Is this also a chance for the US to "show it's stuff" to China?

 

[panglossian]

Gravity: It's not just a good idea...It's THE LAW!:crazy:

I'll try to remember that! LOL!!

 

[panglossian]

Is this also a chance for the US to "show it's stuff" to China?

I think so.

 

[Elphaba]

Update: any missile launching will be held off until Atlantis (the space shuttle) is undocked from ISS and back on the ground... meaning no earlier than Feb 21st.

Thank you... we are already on pins and needles watching each mission... Servicing Mission 4 is long overdue to Hubble and we so do not need another shuttle mis-hap.

 

[Buzz Mills]

I'm sure Buzzm1 can explain this better than I, but this action won't really change the orbit - the smaller parts will be in essentially the same orbit as before. The drag of the upper atmosphere is what's causing the orbit to decay, there won't be any bits left up there.

The satellite the Chinese blew up was in much higher orbit, and the pieces of that present a real and continuing threat. What they did was a real bone-headed and pointless maneuver.

Let's hope that if the intercept is successful, and that all of the remaining pieces burn up in the atmosphere. If the attempted intercept fails, there is the danger of the 1000 lbs. of unused hydrazine, but the chance of exposing the technology to other countries, is probably driving the attempted intercept.

To satisfy my own curiosity I need to read about the kill vehicle (KV), to see if it is a kinetic KV, or a variation of it. At the combined closing speeds of the satellite, and the KV, no explosives are needed, to destroy the satellite; molecules, of each, are literally flying through each other. The energy, released as light, will be visible for 100's of miles, perhaps 1000's of miles, depending on the altitude of the intercept.

 

[Buzz Mills]

Update: any missile launching will be held off until Atlantis (the space shuttle) is undocked from ISS and back on the ground... meaning no earlier than Feb 21st.

Thank you... we are already on pins and needles watching each mission... Servicing Mission 4 is long overdue to Hubble and we so do not need another shuttle mis-hap.

Hubble is rapidly failing - I need to search for an update to that report of a few weeks ago.

 

[Buzz Mills]

U.S. Makes Case About Satellite To Foreign Envoys

The State Department sent cables to all embassies yesterday instructing diplomats to explain to foreign governments how the upcoming attempt to shoot down an out-of-control spy satellite is different from China's destruction of one of its orbiting satellites early last year. "This particular action is different than any actions that, for example, the Chinese may have taken in testing an anti-satellite weapon," State Department spokesman Sean McCormack told reporters. "The missions are quite different, and the technical aspects of the missions are quite different."

The administration is sensitive to international concerns that the United States might be moving toward beefing up its anti-satellite weapons or developing an offensive anti-satellite system, and the diplomatic message is an attempt to convince foreign countries that they need not worry. Unlike the Chinese anti-satellite test, the cable said, the U.S. attempt to destroy the potentially dangerous satellite is being done for peaceful reasons and in a transparent way. "Our role is to reassure nations around the world as to the nature of what we are trying to do," McCormack said. "It's an attempt to try to protect populations on the ground."

National security and military officials said Thursday that the Navy would try to shoot down the malfunctioning satellite as it begins to reenter Earth's atmosphere -- as early as next week. They said President Bush ordered the action because the satellite is carrying 1,000 pounds of frozen hydrazine fuel, which could be harmful if it falls to Earth and a person came into contact with it.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/02/15/AR2008021503249.html

 

[Elphaba]

Hubble is rapidly failing - I need to search for an update to that report of a few weeks ago.

Tell me about it... my SO works on Hubble... it's a stressful situation.

 

[Buzz Mills]

This is a good article to read for an understanding of the planned intercept:

There are two missile defense systems; one a long range system, meant to intercept the launched missile, a long way from its intended target, and before it releases its REBs (re-entry bodies), and the other a medium range system mean't to intercept the incoming REB's as they re-enter the earth's atmosphere. I worked on the medium range system. They will be using the long range system in this case. The signature of the satellite is a lot different than the signature of a missile - the logic of the KV will be modified accordingly.

Satellite Shootdown Plan Began in Jan.

WASHINGTON -- Long before the public learned in late January that a damaged U.S. spy satellite carrying toxic fuel was going to crash to Earth, the government secretly assembled a high-powered team of officials and scientists to study the feasibility of shooting it down with a missile. The order to launch the crash program came Jan. 4, according to defense officials who described Friday how it came to fruition for a final go-ahead decision by President Bush this week. The officials spoke to The Associated Press on condition they not be identified because of the sensitivity of the work.

The initial order was twofold: Assess whether shooting down the satellite with a missile was even possible, and at the same time urgently piece together the technological tools it would take to succeed. In a matter of weeks, three Navy warships _ the USS Lake Erie, USS Decatur and USS Russell _ were outfitted with modified Aegis anti-missile systems, the ships' crews were trained for an unprecedented mission, and three SM-3 missiles were pulled off an assembly line and given a new guidance system.

The decision to attempt a shootdown was disclosed by the Pentagon on Thursday. On Friday officials said it could happen next week, shortly after the space shuttle Atlantis returns from its current voyage at midweek. Officials want the Atlantis to be home to avoid the risk of being hit with satellite debris. Lt. Gen. Carter Ham, director of operations for the Joint Chiefs of Staff, told reporters at the Pentagon on Friday that it's difficult not only to hit the satellite but even to know the best time to shoot. "It's a bit of an imprecise science at this point," Ham said.

With an eye to the possibility that the missile effort will fail, the government has placed six rescue teams across the country to be prepared to act if the satellite hits the United States, according to a Federal Emergency Management Agency memo dated Feb. 14 and obtained by The Associated Press. The spacecraft contains 1,000 pounds of hydrazine in a tank that is expected to survive re-entry and a fuel tank liner made of beryllium.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/02/15/AR2008021502833.html

 

[Buzz Mills]

Tell me about it... my SO works on Hubble... it's a stressful situation.

Elphaba, I got to see the Hubble being built at Lockheed in Sunnyvale, CA. I also rented a room to a technician from Maryland, who was here working on it, and met any mumber of his co-workers who were also here on the project. We had at least one large party where everyone, except me, was working on the Hubble. A young engineer, that I trained, became one of the telemetry gurus on the Hubble; it makes me wonder if he is still with the program. I'm hoping that they can save it.

 

[Elphaba]

Elphaba, I got to see the Hubble being built at Lockheed in Sunnyvale, CA. I also rented a room to a technician from Maryland, who was here working on it, and met any mumber of his co-workers who were also here on the project. We had at least one large party where everyone, except me, was working on the Hubble. A young engineer, that I trained, became one of the telemetry gurus on the Hubble; it makes me wonder if he is still with the program. I'm hoping that they can save it.

How cool! Small world, ay?

 

[Buzz Mills]

How cool! Small world, ay?

Elphaba, what does your SO do on the Hubble?? Do you know of a recent article on the status of the Hubble; I'd like to find out more.