Several' bodies found at Mandan, North Dakota business, 1 April 2019 *Arrest*

[castilloisno1]

Why is there so much secrecy surrounding how these people died?

 

[x_files]

I’m stuck on the “no danger to public” statement... seems like if it was a burglary, they wouldn’t confidently say no danger to public... seems so specific. I might be over analyzing.

Police have said this in the past so people won't panic, but the suspect may still be a danger to others.

 

[x_files]

Why is there so much secrecy surrounding how these people died?

great question. It must be odd or unusual so don't want info leaked.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

It’s interesting to me that the Facebook page for the company has donations being split between the Cobb and Fueher families but no mention of anything for Fakler.

I dont find that odd. Most likely Mrs. F probably told them to make sure any funds collected goes to her 3 employees.

Imo

 

[kaen]

It’s interesting to me that the Facebook page for the company has donations being split between the Cobb and Fueher families but no mention of anything for Fakler.

At first I was also surprised. But after reflection, I realize that Mr. Fakler was the owner of the company and probably in very good shape financially given that he was more highly compensated. His wife will still have the business income and in all likelihood he had life insurance. I imagine they have means. Usually in fundraisers for situations where loss of life has occurred, the leaders of management are not included as they have a financial safety net. I would think the Fakler family had the needs of their employees on their minds as well.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Why is there so much secrecy surrounding how these people died?

I dont think there is secrecy.

Didnt LE say they would release that information when the autopsy reports are completed? I dont think anyone else knows how they died. Only the police know, and have not told any of the family members.

Imo

 

[GordianKnot]

Robert Fakler
Adam Fuehrer
Bill Cobb, Lois Cobb

Obit blurbs from the Bismarck Tribune
FWIW, all obits state they died on April 1st.

Combined memorial service set for victims of Mandan homicide
SFAA:
Funeral director Bob Eastgate said the families decided to have a combined service because their loved ones were not only co-workers, but friends.

“They were very, very good friends as well,” said Eastgate, owner of Eastgate Funeral and Cremation Service. “They were all that close.”

 

[Jsizzle]

At first I was also surprised. But after reflection, I realize that Mr. Fakler was the owner of the company and probably in very good shape financially given that he was more highly compensated. His wife will still have the business income and in all likelihood he had life insurance. I imagine they have means. Usually in fundraisers for situations where loss of life has occurred, the leaders of management are not included as they have a financial safety net. I would think the Fakler family had the needs of their employees on their minds as well.

Ahhh. Ok yeah. I guess that makes sense.

 

[ilovechili]

As office hours are 8:30am-5pm (as per their website) then the presence of all deceased is imo, likely related to a meeting/gathering of staff with regard to maintenance.

https://www.rjrrentals.com/property-management/

I have worked at places that office staff comes in later than the rest of the employees. This very well may explain some of who were there (like Mr.) and who were not (like Mrs. and daughter). Most people do not expect to find a front door open nor to have a phone answered until at least 8 a.m. We have two maintenance workers and the male owner here--so it may be only maintenance that comes in early or who did that day at least. The one man drives to work with his wife who also worked there. Because of that, she may have always went early as one of the only office staff and maybe they allowed her to work hours to match his since they were husband and wife and rode together. Maybe she spent time catching up on work and readying the office for opening and the others came later.

Just speculation. If so, I would lean towards an employee or ex-employee who knew who would be there, knew the security cameras and entries, possibly even had a key and could have been laying in wait for each to come in. He also could have known perhaps they do not enter the main door upon coming to work, maybe they unlock a back or side door and which would be open.

Alternatively the issue may have been an upset tenant, etc. who was directing his anger at maintenance and the owner who may have overseen maintenance(?) and the wife may have been collateral damage. It is also quite possible the three men were elsewhere in the building and the wife was in the office. I do not see, however, any way that a tenant would easily know exactly who would be there nor where in the building as well unless he "cased" the place, etc., nor in fact how he knew anyone at all would be there necessarily.

Hardly my only theories though, and no theory has really been ruled out for me at least, because we basically know zilch.

 

[Via Marple]

I believe all four victims were murdered that morning.

If some had been killed overnight that means they wouldn't have returned home.

Imo, the alarm bells would have sounded much sooner when they didnt arrive back home as expected. A family member would have gone to check or called LE to do a wellness check.

So, imo, all of this was carefully planned, and each victim was murdered, most likely, shortly after each one entering the business on the 1st.

I think it happening on April 1st, was a twisted message the killer was sending.

Imo

RBBM

Not if one of them was supposed to be on Sunday night shift. The company website says they attend to 24 hours emergencies, right? Then there must be some staff on call for those.

So I suspect it was Adam the maintenance guy. He might have to be back at the office for tools etc.

Moo...

 

[zecats]

Why is there so much secrecy surrounding how these people died?

I get the impression (hopefully) that they are leaving it up to the medical examiner and those conducting the autopsies. Maybe COD is difficult to determine visually. I did read that the info would be released when autopsies were concluded.

 

[tlcya]

I suspect the secrecy is simply because they want to keep mum on COD in order to wade thru false tips, confessions or leads. Right now only authorities and the killer(s) knows what went down in that building. The families haven't even been told how their loved ones died. Terribly hard on the Cobb/Miller family but possibly necessary to get this thing solved faster.

 

[SaguaroSpirit]

Police have said this in the past so people won't panic, but the suspect may still be a danger to others.

Anyone who would kill four people is definitely a danger to anyone and everyone IMHO.

 

[NervousNellie]

This reminds me of Todd Kohlhepp. It's possible this was some random crazy with a grudge. Which we all know is harder to solve.

 

[NickoD]

Their tech’s are unable to access surveillance video so they are reaching out to local IT workers to interpret it? I thought LE had the best IT workers on their team already.

Snip on original post.

You'd be surprised at how small departments have to make due. Usually the high tech crimes task force deals with anything IT-related and only larger departments or counties have the budget to have a team on staff (with the idea that they also support surrounding local departments). In Sacramento CA, for example, the high tech crimes task force is on the county level with cooperation from the CHP. Same goes for many other specialized units that essentially pool budgets with other agencies to produce a team and address readiness. Being a city of only 22,000, Mandan PD strikes me as a department already limited in resources.

The same reasoning also applies for the tip line. It takes a lot of man hours to maintain the tip lines (hopefully you can use your community volunteers to avoid paying officers OT) and then you MUST follow on every tip since you don't want to be in the headlines for failing to solve a case because you ignored something.

This is the economic reality of law enforcement. I've been a shift supervisor and we had to account down to how much a jail cell costs for an inmate per night (we literally call around to different jails like shopping for a hotel room). There is budget planning and politics behind the budget and a lot of paperwork that the public never ever sees.

So hopefully this addresses the original comment. We don't all get to enjoy LAPD budgets (yeah, this is me being jealous).

 

[NickoD]

A few updates this morning.

The Latest: 911 call of 4 slain in North Dakota not released

Highly usual. Police departments like to operate in transparent mode as much as possible to avoid community scrutiny. This now begs the question why the call is not being released. I offer two possibilities:
a) The killer made the 911 call and explained it as a medical emergency so PD was never dispatched. Therefore the initial 911 call is evidence.
b) Someone else made that call but dispatch completely botched and sent the EMTs in an active scene.

The combined funeral also means that the coroner has completed their examination and has released the bodies.

Above all IMO.

 

[PrairieWind]

A few updates this morning.

The Latest: 911 call of 4 slain in North Dakota not released

Highly usual. Police departments like to operate in transparent mode as much as possible to avoid community scrutiny. This now begs the question why the call is not being released. I offer two possibilities:
a) The killer made the 911 call and explained it as a medical emergency so PD was never dispatched. Therefore the initial 911 call is evidence.
b) Someone else made that call but dispatch completely botched and sent the EMTs in an active scene.

The combined funeral also means that the coroner has completed their examination and has released the bodies.

Above all IMO.

My guess is that the 911 call reveals details of the crime scene (manner of death, etc) that the police do not yet want released.

 

[abstr]

A few updates this morning.

The Latest: 911 call of 4 slain in North Dakota not released

Highly usual. Police departments like to operate in transparent mode as much as possible to avoid community scrutiny. This now begs the question why the call is not being released. I offer two possibilities:
a) The killer made the 911 call and explained it as a medical emergency so PD was never dispatched. Therefore the initial 911 call is evidence.
b) Someone else made that call but dispatch completely botched and sent the EMTs in an active scene.

The combined funeral also means that the coroner has completed their examination and has released the bodies.

Above all IMO.

"A" is something I wouldn't have thought of but makes sense.
As to "B", just because the autopsy is complete and the bodies are released does not mean cause and manner of death reports will be complete anytime soon....it can take many months.

 

[x_files]

agr

BBM
Can we see a show of hands? I know I attribute very limited importance to such statements by law enforcement. Anyone else?

On just about every vile/violent crime thread here at WS, you'll find a "no danger to the public" statement from law enforcement. I think this would make a great topic for a true-crime author/afficianado to research and explore.
When did police begin using this statement, what do they really mean by it, and how many times have they announced that there IS danger to the general public?

I'm going to wildly guess that the tradition has its roots in a reporter's question: "Is there any danger to the public?" and then it just grew legs and became a "standard" at every press conference/media interview.

IMO, I don't use the "no danger/threat" statement to help me determine the nature/motive of any crime, or if there is a "suspect" or if the crime is "personal."

I can only remember one fairly recent instance of hearing: "corral your family, stay inside, lock your doors, keep an eye out" etc. (IMO, paraphrasing) It was the manhunt following the Boston Marathon bombing. And that made a lot of sense, and was appropriate.
Occasionally, there are similar statements in the event of a prison break/fugitive on the loose.

I don't think it would serve either law enforcement's or the public's interest to announce that there is a cold blooded murderer on the loose, lock your doors, keep a gun handy, keep the kids inside, curtail your normal activities, etc. Whether there is a particular murderer "on the loose" or not, becoming a victim of crime can happen anywhere, to anyone. Hearing that there's "no danger" to the public can never really be true. Anywhere.

There is a case that, IMO, was a perfect example of when a danger to the public was specific and imminent, but not in the manner you'd expect: Christopher Dorner. Law enforcement was targeted by Dorner, and it seems they devolved into a "shoot first, ask questions later" mindset, in a state of fear. In that case, I wish they had announced there was imminent danger to any citizen driving some version of a Japanese model pickup truck.

All MOO, IMO

agreed, would LOVE to know more about this.

 

[NickoD]

My guess is that the 911 call reveals details of the crime scene (manner of death, etc) that the police do not yet want released.

I hear ya. But again, I go back to the original call being a medical dispatch. If you call 911 and say "I found someone who's covered in blood" dispatch will send the entire calvary. If you call and say "my co-worker collapsed, he might be having a heart attack" they are sending EMT.

Obviously there's a huge gray area between those two extreme examples and dispatchers are trained specifically to ask simple questions to triage every call. They know that people might be upset usually when they call 911 and might give incomplete or incorrect details so they are trained to ask questions multiple times in order to understand what is going on, all the while dispatching the correct services to the location.

If the 911 contains details of the crime like "please help! i came in this morning, i saw Joe Suspect leaving and now my coworker is in a pool of blood, looks like shooting/stabbing!" and they sent EMTs only then that dispatcher is probably already pulled and suspended and shortly will be looking for new employment.

IMO